New BMW 1er tii

[r0tor]

http://www.caranddriver.com/roadtests/11733/2007-bmw-335i-coupe-specs-page4.html

http://www.automobilemag.com/am/2007/bmw/3_series/specifications.html

Weight varies from 3340-3570# for the 335i.

3570 is the BMW unladen weight, C&D 3366 was what they actually got when put on the scales with a full tank.  Interestingly, if you account for the EU unladen weight haveing a 165lb driver and 15 pounds of stuff inthe trunk, the weights become the same

[Raza]

Cars are getting heavier for a multitude of reasons, but my original point stands- The 135i is no heavier than most of its common contemporaries.  Thus, if you want to bitch about the 135i than you better bitch about almost every car on the market being too heavy as well. 

I do.

Not every car is a Lotus.  Your Boxster is only ~400 lbs less and it is a dedicated two-seat sports car with a starting price almost 20k more.  I would hardly consider that acceptable for a two seat dedicated sports car of that price range, judging by your seemingly idealistic standards.  Maybe I should consider you a sucker by your own standards for purchasing that Porsche? 

So very mature of you to go after my car.  Why is it as soon as someone gets something and he says something you don't like you go to criticizing what he has?  And yes, the Boxster is too heavy for what it is. 

[LonghornTX]

I do.

So very mature of you to go after my car.  Why is it as soon as someone gets something and he says something you don't like you go to criticizing what he has?  And yes, the Boxster is too heavy for what it is. 

It was not meant to insult your car, if thats what you meant.  Or even make some kind of jealous accusation.  That was hardly the point. Re-read my post (or read it more thoroughly) and that should become obvious to you.  Rather, it was meant for you to better understand the effects of the type of logic you were using earlier in the thread (the logic that my post was meant to question), and judging by that reaction, it seems to have worked.

[sandertheshark]

Relatively. 

Whatever, man.  If you guys are happy with all cars getting too heavy, then that's fine.  If you think 3400 pounds is an acceptable weight for a compact car, then I don't know what to do with you.

That really is true, then.

"Compact" car? It's the size of an E36 3-series.  3400 pounds for a 300hp rear-wheel-drive not-so-compact entry luxury car?  That's pretty acceptable, mate.

[Raza]

"Compact" car? It's the size of an E36 3-series.  3400 pounds for a 300hp rear-wheel-drive not-so-compact entry luxury car?  That's pretty acceptable, mate.

My automatic Passat weighs 3300 pounds.  3200 if it were a manual.  That's a midsize sedan that was on sale just a few years ago. 

It's a fucking compact car.  It has less rear seat space than my Boxster and there are basically no cars smaller than it for sale in the US that aren't two seaters. 

It's heavy. 

[LonghornTX]

My automatic Passat weighs 3300 pounds.  3200 if it were a manual.  That's a midsize sedan that was on sale just a few years ago. 

It's a fucking compact car.  It has less rear seat space than my Boxster and there are basically no cars smaller than it for sale in the US that aren't two seaters. 

It's heavy. 

Your Passat is also a 1.8t, right?  Even if it is the 2.8, it is still basically in a completely different performance category thus making that a rather apples to oranges comparison.  Do you remember how much the W8 model of your Passat weighed?

The rear seats, btw, are about the same size as those in the E46 coupe (i.e. able to sit a 6 footer for short trips), so I would say that is substantially larger than you seem to think. Off the cuff, I know for sure that the Rabbit/GTI/R32 are all smaller in physical dimensions (LxW).  It has a larger wheelbase than the new Lancer/EVO. The E46 is pretty similar in size as well and from most accounts offers about the same amount of interior space (the last M3 was a tad bit heavier than the 135i).  As well, the car still has a decent sized trunk.

Say what you say, but the 135i is light for the amount of power, feature content, and quality that it offers, at the price it starts at, in the market it is introduced into.  In fact, just about anything that it will compete with in the marketplace (Mustang, G37, EVO, R32, Camaro, 350z) is as heavy or heavier than it.  Only cars substantially different weigh a lot less, i.e S2000 (4 cylinder powered 2 seat sports car), RX8 (lower power, yet lighter rotary arrangement), Solstice GXP (not by much as you might think, but the differences are obvious).  The new Sti will probably be a bit lighter, but it may also be much more spartan as well.  Of all the cars I mentioned in this paragraph, only the EVO will have an appreciable amount of rear seat space MORE than the 135i.  The Mustang and G37 by comparison, are almost laugable in the amount of rear seat space that they offer, despite both being much larger (physically) cars.

Don't get me wrong, I wish it was under 3000 lbs too, but the business man and economist inside me knows that the notion of that is utterly retarded and illogical.  Maybe the Tii will solve some of your qualms with the weight issue (whenever that comes out)?

[LonghornTX]

3570 is the BMW unladen weight, C&D 3366 was what they actually got when put on the scales with a full tank.  Interestingly, if you account for the EU unladen weight haveing a 165lb driver and 15 pounds of stuff inthe trunk, the weights become the same

This makes me wonder if the same applies here.

[Raza]

The rear seats, btw, are about the same size as those in the E46 coupe (i.e. able to sit a 6 footer for short trips), so I would say that is substantially larger than you seem to think.

Tell that to everyone who has reviewed a 1 series hatch.  Every single one has said the rear seat space was inadequate, including Top Gear, both May and Clarkson and Evo.  From pictures, they look like they have as much legroom as a 911.

Oh, and you don't need to convince me.  All cars are too heavy nowadays. 

And if the businessman and the economist in you don't demand more from a car company you love, then you truly are a lost cause.

[LonghornTX]

Tell that to everyone who has reviewed a 1 series hatch.  Every single one has said the rear seat space was inadequate, including Top Gear, both May and Clarkson and Evo.  From pictures, they look like they have as much legroom as a 911.

Oh, and you don't need to convince me.  All cars are too heavy nowadays. 

And if the businessman and the economist in you don't demand more from a car company you love, then you truly are a lost cause.

Yet a hatchback is not the same as the coupe, now is it?  The same is not true of the coupe as mentioned by the various first-drive articles floating around, or this video, http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=28Iq60WuwEw, or this video http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qckF9I_gmys.  Hardly 911 like at all.....

The fact that I am a businessman and economist are the exact reasons I don't unneccesarily bitch like you do about this cars weight; I know it would be hopelessly idealistic (even naive) to think so, given the situation.

[sandertheshark]

It's a fucking compact car.  It has less rear seat space than my Boxster and there are basically no cars smaller than it for sale in the US that aren't two seaters. 

You can't tell the difference between a compact car and performance sports coupe?

[Raza]

The fact that I am a businessman and economist are the exact reasons I don't unneccesarily bitch like you do about this cars weight; I know it would be hopelessly idealistic (even naive) to think so, given the situation.

I'm a businessman and an economist (or I will be in a few months, officially), and I truly believe in the fundamentals of financial analysis.  But I also don't believe that the things that I love should be thought about completely rationally.  It's lamentable that all cars have gotten so fat, and because I love cars, I lament.  I don't rationalize because I'm a fanboy of a certain marque. 

The 1 series may very well be a fine car, but that doesn't mean it isn't overweight.  At least it's better looking than the 3 series.

[Raza]

You can't tell the difference between a compact car and performance sports coupe?

This seems to stand

[CALL_911]

I don't rationalize because I'm a fanboy of a certain marque. 

I think it's more because you do everything you can to make that certain marque look bad, even unjustly so.

[Raza]

I think it's more because you do everything you can to make that certain marque look bad, even unjustly so.

I criticize all overweight cars, regardless of marque.  Hell, I like the 1 series.  It's the only new BMW I'd spend money on.

[sandertheshark]

This seems to stand

I think you've just conditioned yourself to see nothing but dog shit behind a BMW badge.

[Raza]

I think you've just conditioned yourself to see nothing but dog shit behind a BMW badge.

Not true.  Like I said, I like the 128i.  I've been moving finances around with the idea of buying one in a few years.  I'm just saying that it's overweight.

[omicron]

Tell that to everyone who has reviewed a 1 series hatch.  Every single one has said the rear seat space was inadequate, including Top Gear, both May and Clarkson and Evo.  From pictures, they look like they have as much legroom as a 911.

I found it scarily small in the back of a 118i hatch. Still, no matter - passengers are annoying.

[LonghornTX]

I'm a businessman and an economist (or I will be in a few months, officially), and I truly believe in the fundamentals of financial analysis.  But I also don't believe that the things that I love should be thought about completely rationally.  It's lamentable that all cars have gotten so fat, and because I love cars, I lament.  I don't rationalize because I'm a fanboy of a certain marque. 

The 1 series may very well be a fine car, but that doesn't mean it isn't overweight.  At least it's better looking than the 3 series.

It is not rationalization because of fanboyism (I don't think you have refuted a single thing I have said), but rather a return to some kind of logical thinking.  Emotion based arguments make my head want to explode. 

I love cars just as much as anyone here, but that doesn't mean I have to act naive or proclaim some obvious truth in order to defend my love of cars.  I am sorry, but I am simply too logical to think or act that way and it tends to make me cringe whenever I hear someone mention such irrational thinking.

The same follows for this topic.  Everyone who has nothing of real substance to criticize about this car usually turn to the weight, miraculously taking the 2002 parallel WAY too literally in thinking that this car is going to be some sub 3000 lb car.

But, everyone has their opinions and so I will accept yours.  I do not agree, but that is life.

However, given your logic, I would expect you to criticize (and thus write off) 99% of new cars today.  That must get rather tiring for something you love so much, right?

[Raza]

However, given your logic, I would expect you to criticize (and thus write off) 99% of new cars today.  That must get rather tiring for something you love so much, right?

I do, and it does.