Tundra tailgate issues

[TheIntrepid]

When I said "out truck" I meant that it offers no innovative features over the rest.  The Tundra does, however, do what the other trucks to, just better.

It has one advantage, it looks BIG. I don't live in a very pickup-popular area so I haven't seen any side by side with any other trucks but whenever I HAVE seen the new Tundra, it looks absolutely MASSIVE.

[GoCougs]

When I said "out truck" I meant that it offers no innovative features over the rest.  The Tundra does, however, do what the other trucks to, just better.

How the heck is that not "out trucking" the competition?

And when was the last time a truck offered significant innovative features over the others, especially in the 1/2-ton market?

It's about more power, more gears, bigger breaks, more room, more towing, more load capacity, etc. You know - truck stuff.

[93JC]

It's about more power, more gears, bigger breaks, more room, more towing, more load capacity, etc. You know - truck stuff.

Yeah, Toyota sure outdid everyone with their 'breaks':



I haven't seen a 'break' so impressive in the 1/2-ton market.

[TheIntrepid]

[Submariner]

How the heck is that not "out trucking" the competition?

And when was the last time a truck offered significant innovative features over the others, especially in the 1/2-ton market?

It's about more power, more gears, bigger breaks, more room, more towing, more load capacity, etc. You know - truck stuff.

It's my interpretation.  I meant that it has no "truck like" innovations.  Not that it performed what it does have at a sub-par level. 

[GoCougs]

It's my interpretation.  I meant that it has no "truck like" innovations.  Not that it performed what it does have at a sub-par level. 

"Out truck" = innovation?

What are some recent innovations in the USA 1/2 ton market, by any automaker?

[S204STi]

Tough.

It's tuff, and I'll give you five reasons why. 

[S204STi]

"Out truck" = innovation?

What are some recent innovations in the USA 1/2 ton market, by any automaker?

DoD, E85 capability and 4wheel steering (yeah, it was a flop I know).

[SVT666]

When I said "out truck" I meant that it offers no innovative features over the rest.  The Tundra does, however, do what the other trucks to, just better.

When was the last time a pickup was "innovative"?  A pickup doesn't need to be innovative, it needs to do it's damn job without breaking.  It needs to be tough, powerful, and be comfortable.  If it does those better then the others, then it's done it's job.

[VetteZ06]

I feel like I should give some kudos to our good friend Mr. Cougs. He has successfully altered the focus of this thread.

I knew he had it in him, but I certainly didn't expect him to do it quite so deliberately.

[GoCougs]

DoD, E85 capability and 4wheel steering (yeah, it was a flop I know).

Good points, but I think DoD and E85 benefits are a bit sketchy.

All in all, trucks remain BoF, live axle, V8 monoliths. Innovation is very hard with such legacy motifs.

If we're talking innovation, then IMO we're talking Ridgeline (uh oh, mention of another "controverial" "truck").

[GoCougs]

I feel like I should give some kudos to our good friend Mr. Cougs. He has successfully altered the focus of this thread.

I knew he had it in him, but I certainly didn't expect him to do it quite so deliberately.

Do you really want, or more precisely what will you (or the forum) get from, two more pages of tit-for-tat on tailgates?

[S204STi]

Good points, but I think DoD and E85 benefits are a bit sketchy.

All in all, trucks remain BoF, live axle, V8 monoliths. Innovation is very hard with such legacy motifs.

If we're talking innovation, then IMO we're talking Ridgeline (uh oh, mention of another "controverial" "truck").

E85 yes, but DoD makes sense for any engine, to me anyway.  While it might not have a huge impact in and of itself, in conjunction with other technologies it can have a cummulative effect.

[S204STi]

Good points, but I think DoD and E85 benefits are a bit sketchy.

All in all, trucks remain BoF, live axle, V8 monoliths. Innovation is very hard with such legacy motifs.

If we're talking innovation, then IMO we're talking Ridgeline (uh oh, mention of another "controverial" "truck").

The thing is, there will always be a necessity for body of frame construction, until we can build a unibody strong enough without the added weight to haul over 10,000lbs and carry a significant payload.  Yeah, a Honda Ridgeline-like truck is great for most truck buyers, since very few ever approach the limits of what they can handle, but frankly a stout ladder frame is a boon to trailering folk everywhere.

[VetteZ06]

Do you really want, or more precisely what will you (or the forum) get from, two more pages of tit-for-tat on tailgates?

Does it really matter? Discussion is discussion, and this is a noteworthy issue. Perhaps I should write and submit a thread proposal, complete with goals and expectations, before I open a new topic? If you don't see the value of "two more pages of tit-for-tat on tailgates," you can feel free not to contribute.

It was more of an observation, though. I knew you'd pop in sooner or later.

[GoCougs]

E85 yes, but DoD makes sense for any engine, to me anyway.  While it might not have a huge impact in and of itself, in conjunction with other technologies it can have a cummulative effect.

Definitely in combination with a 6+sp AT (or even CVT), yes, that is notable.

And yes I think that the US truck market will be BoF for some time to come. However, I envision that "trucks" such as the Ridgeline will eventually become the norm, and the traditional BoF trucks will be relegated to fleet and/or work duty - similar in the way that minivans relegated traditional vans to fleet/work duty customers.

[SVT666]

Definitely in combination with a 6+sp AT (or even CVT), yes, that is notable.

And yes I think that the US truck market will be BoF for some time to come. However, I envision that "trucks" such as the Ridgeline will eventually become the norm, and the traditional BoF trucks will be relegated to fleet and/or work duty - similar in the way that minivans relegated traditional vans to fleet/work duty customers.

You're dreamin'.  Ridgeline has hardly made an impact in any way.

[Raghavan]

You're dreamin'.  Ridgeline has hardly made an impact in any way.

Dude, you're forgetting about the hidden storage compartment in the bed where the spare tire is located, so if you get a flat tire while hauling junk, you have to take everything out to access it!

Isn't that so innovative??

[GoCougs]

Does it really matter? Discussion is discussion, and this is a noteworthy issue. Perhaps I should write and submit a thread proposal, complete with goals and expectations, before I open a new topic? If you don't see the value of "two more pages of tit-for-tat on tailgates," you can feel free not to contribute.

It was more of an observation, though. I knew you'd pop in sooner or later.

What more can be said? Inasmuch as I take your judgement of my mad thread manipulation skillz, it wasn't by design. Usually when threads get "diverted" or otherwise wonder, it's at the hands of gassed original topic. Besides, I'm not the only one not talking tailates.

Perhaps you can run with the Toyota's flimsy sheet metal you mentioned previously. That's actually one I haven't heard - and a lot harder to "prove" (meaning, more pages) than a link to a thread about prone-to-damage-on-any-truck tailgates.

[SVT666]

Dude, you're forgetting about the hidden storage compartment in the bed where the spare tire is located, so if you get a flat tire while hauling junk, you have to take everything out to access it!

Isn't that so innovative??

Oh yeah, you're right.  That was a game changer.

[CALL_911]

Definitely in combination with a 6+sp AT (or even CVT), yes, that is notable.

And yes I think that the US truck market will be BoF for some time to come. However, I envision that "trucks" such as the Ridgeline will eventually become the norm, and the traditional BoF trucks will be relegated to fleet and/or work duty - similar in the way that minivans relegated traditional vans to fleet/work duty customers.

If that were so, there would've been another minivan-based pickup on the market by now.

[GoCougs]

You're dreamin'.  Ridgeline has hardly made an impact in any way.

I don't think I'm dreaming. I'm by no means a militant Ridgeline fan, nor am I stating that it has had a major effect on the market, but I'm looking purely at which vehicle fulfills the material needs of the majority of 1/2-ton buyers more efficiently.

Most 1/2-ton owners don't haul more than 1,500 lbs. Most 1/2-ton owners don't tow more than 5,000 lbs. Most 1/2-ton owners don't do hardcore off-roading. Most 1/2-ton owners however love buying one of the most prominent pieces of Americana ever devised.

[CALL_911]

Most 1/2 ton buyers want something that won't make them frown every time they look at their car.

[Submariner]

When was the last time a pickup was "innovative"?  A pickup doesn't need to be innovative, it needs to do it's damn job without breaking.  It needs to be tough, powerful, and be comfortable.  If it does those better then the others, then it's done it's job.

Well, according to that picture...it failed the durability test with flying colors.

(yes...I know, it's one picture)

[VetteZ06]

What more can be said?

I guess we'll find out. But if Cougs thinks the thread is done, maybe it should be locked.

Usually when threads get "diverted" or otherwise wonder, it's at the hands of gassed original topic.

Yes, this one is definitely gassed. Good observation.

Perhaps you can run with the Toyota's flimsy sheet metal you mentioned previously. That's actually one I haven't heard - and a lot harder to "prove" (meaning, more pages) than a link to a thread about prone-to-damage-on-any-truck tailgates.

I'll do my best to keep everybody abreast of the situation. No guarantees, though.

Nice quote usage, BTW. Your emphatic defiance is admirable.

[Soup DeVille]

Tough.

Thank you Cpt. Spells-a-lot.

[GoCougs]

I guess we'll find out. But if Cougs thinks the thread is done, maybe it should be locked.

I think you're being on your progenity. There's at least a complete page of non-tailgate posts - an indication that it may have a bit of life left.

Yes, this one is definitely gassed. Good observation.

I'd say self-evident - but hey, I'll take a compliment when I can get it.

I'll do my best to keep everybody abreast of the situation. No guarantees, though.

I'd keep an eye on it - flimsly sheet metal is the proverbial tasty icing upon the big fat cake of "controversy" that is 20 bad camshafts, bad AT programming, 4 star crash results, and the same-as-Ford-SuperDuty-and-Silverado-HD partially boxed frame.

Nice quote usage, BTW. Your emphatic defiance is admirable.

"Thank you."

[sandertheshark]

"Out truck" = innovation?

What are some recent innovations in the USA 1/2 ton market, by any automaker?

[SVT666]

The Avalanche is useless as a pickup.  Sure it can tow, but the box is so small you may as well have a Ridgeline that at least has a trunk-in-bed.

[GoCougs]

I don't think I'd call it useless, but I wouldn't call it innovative: it's simply a Suburban with a bed.

The last truly innovative truck was the '88 GM - prior to that the Big Three, especially GM and Dodge, were skating on platforms dating back to the early '70s.