Head, Shoulders, Knees, and Toes

[Raza]

Nice review, man.

Thanks!

One thing I forgot to mention.  When dry shifting, I had a little trouble finding the 5/6 gate.  This has got to be the first Japanese car I've ever driven without a push down lockout, and if you're not careful, you might shove the shifter into the reverse gate.  The shifter doesn't have that "snick-snick" lightness of other Hondas.  It's heavier and more deliberate.  The spring loading is especially tight, shooting the knob back to the 3/4 dead spot very quickly.  I think that might be part of the problem when shifting hard and fast.  You get used to the weight, so you push over and up, and shove it into the R dead spot. 

Honestly, I can't think of any other complaints. 

[Raghavan]

Thanks!

One thing I forgot to mention.  When dry shifting, I had a little trouble finding the 5/6 gate.  This has got to be the first Japanese car I've ever driven without a push down lockout, and if you're not careful, you might shove the shifter into the reverse gate.  The shifter doesn't have that "snick-snick" lightness of other Hondas.  It's heavier and more deliberate.  The spring loading is especially tight, shooting the knob back to the 3/4 dead spot very quickly.  I think that might be part of the problem when shifting hard and fast.  You get used to the weight, so you push over and up, and shove it into the R dead spot. 

Honestly, I can't think of any other complaints. 

The R gate is locked out, no matter if there is the push down/up lockout.

[Raza]

The R gate is locked out, no matter if there is the push down/up lockout.

I know that.  The Boxster has the same lockout mechanism (the PRH, or "Push Really Hard", lockout)

Perhaps it's just an issue when not moving.  It's not just about accidentally sticking the thing into the reverse gate.  It just shows that it's not the best shifter I've had.  I've never had that problem when dry shifting before.

[Raghavan]

Generally I've found that Honda shifters are great.
I want to drive this Si Mugen. Too bad only 1000 will be made. How'd you drive one?

[Raza]

Generally I've found that Honda shifters are great.
I want to drive this Si Mugen. Too bad only 1000 will be made. How'd you drive one?

I walked up and asked. 

Actually, he asked me if I wanted to take it out.

Honestly, I've driven only 3 manual transmissioned Hondas, and I don't think they're as venerable as the magazines say they are. 

[Raghavan]

I walked up and asked. 

Actually, he asked me if I wanted to take it out.

Honestly, I've driven only 3 manual transmissioned Hondas, and I don't think they're as venerable as the magazines say they are. 

I've only driven two, and I thought they were really easy and good to drive, except for the finicky and hard to operate clutch on the Civic.

[LonghornTX]

That is a good review Raza  .

I have driven the standard Si many a times (when I worked at Infiniti, it became my "errand" car) and I like it quite a bit.  Were I looking for something a bit cheaper than the Mustang, it would definitely be at the top of the list.  It is nice to know that the Mugen model does bring some added improvements, but to me, as someone who likes to modify their cars, I see this as a bit too expensive because I could do all the worthwhile improvements and save on the cosmetic stuff.  But, for someone who is averse to those type of things, I can see this as a very appealing package.

I find it interesting that you disliked the shifter.  Maybe it is different?  I remembered thinking that the standard car's box was the best of many that I driven lately (Porsche, BMW, etc)...

[Raza]

I've only driven two, and I thought they were really easy and good to drive, except for the finicky and hard to operate clutch on the Civic.

Thinking twice, I've also driven two Acuras with manual transmissions.  Of the TL, TSX, last gen Civic, Civic Si, and Mugen, only the TSX impressed.  The others weren't bad, they just weren't noteworthy.

[the Teuton]

Thinking twice, I've also driven two Acuras with manual transmissions.  Of the TL, TSX, last gen Civic, Civic Si, and Mugen, only the TSX impressed.  The others weren't bad, they just weren't noteworthy.

Our Civic's gate was really tight.  The shifts were very short, but the lever was kinda long, in an economy car kinda way.  It was easy to miss a shift, but once you got the hang of it, it worked like magic, IMO.

[TBR]

Thanks!

One thing I forgot to mention.  When dry shifting, I had a little trouble finding the 5/6 gate.  This has got to be the first Japanese car I've ever driven without a push down lockout, and if you're not careful, you might shove the shifter into the reverse gate.  The shifter doesn't have that "snick-snick" lightness of other Hondas.  It's heavier and more deliberate.  The spring loading is especially tight, shooting the knob back to the 3/4 dead spot very quickly.  I think that might be part of the problem when shifting hard and fast.  You get used to the weight, so you push over and up, and shove it into the R dead spot. 

Honestly, I can't think of any other complaints. 

I haven't been to impressed with Honda shifters either, and I have driven a variety of them (all older mind you). The only one I liked was in a '88 Accord DX. The first car I ever testdrove, I am sure it was as slow as hell (something like 87hp), but the shifter was an absolute delight. Comparatively the Prelude has long throws and feels very artificial, you can really tell it is cable operated.

[omicron]

Lovely writing, Raza.

And look! A good car you get, that we Colonials don't!

[Raza]

Lovely writing, Raza.

And look! A good car you get, that we Colonials don't!

Finally!

[JYODER240]

I walked up and asked. 

Actually, he asked me if I wanted to take it out.

Honestly, I've driven only 3 manual transmissioned Hondas, and I don't think they're as venerable as the magazines say they are. 

Drive an S2000.

[Eye of the Tiger]

I walked up and asked. 

Actually, he asked me if I wanted to take it out.

Honestly, I've driven only 3 manual transmissioned Hondas, and I don't think they're as venerable as the magazines say they are. 

The 2001 Civic had the worst Honda shifter that I'd have to say, yet was still better than many other cars. The 1990 Civic was excellent, as was the 1998 Accord. Those are the three manual Hondas I've driven. I think the magazines are fairly accurate, although most cars these days have probably caught up to Honda in shifter quality, so perhaps they aren't so special anymore.

Also, I don't know if Honda is still using rods as opposed to cables, but the rods are definately a big factor in Honda's good shifters, I think.

[the Teuton]

The 2001 Civic had the worst Honda shifter that I'd have to say, yet was still better than many other cars. The 1990 Civic was excellent, as was the 1998 Accord. Those are the three manual Hondas I've driven. I think the magazines are fairly accurate, although most cars these days have probably caught up to Honda in shifter quality, so perhaps they aren't so special anymore.

Also, I don't know if Honda is still using rods as opposed to cables, but the rods are definately a big factor in Honda's good shifters, I think.

That's why our '91 felt so cool?  It had a rod linkage?

[Raza]

Drive an S2000.

I've dry shifted an S2000 before, and just by doing that I could tell it was good.

[JYODER240]

I've dry shifted an S2000 before, and just by doing that I could tell it was good.

It's the best I've ever used, at any price.

[MrH]

Great review Raza.  You mentioned you've driven a standard Si before, but it's been awhile it seems.  When you test drive one again, do you mind comparing the two?  I think we're all pretty interested to hear whether the Mugen is worth it or not.

[Soup DeVille]

It's the best I've ever used, at any price.

There's no cables. There's no rods. The shifter enter the transmission directly.

[Raza]

Great review Raza.  You mentioned you've driven a standard Si before, but it's been awhile it seems.  When you test drive one again, do you mind comparing the two?  I think we're all pretty interested to hear whether the Mugen is worth it or not.

Thanks! 

I don't mind comparing the two at all.  I should be able to drive a standard Si by Christmas, I think. 

This is the review of the standard Si coupe:
http://www.carspin.net/forums/index.php?topic=8137.0

But that drive was short and quick.  I had a good long time in the Mugen, and I had some pretty sweet roads to drive on.  Compared to the roads I drove in the standard Si, this was the Nurburgring.  A real test of a proper car.

[Vinsanity]

I've dry shifted an S2000 before, and just by doing that I could tell it was good.

That's what this review reminds me of; a 4-door hardtop FWD S2000. With 40 less hp. If it matched the S2000's power output, then I may just be interested in paying the $30k asking price. I'd also ask for RWD, but I know that's pushing it

[Lazerous]

That's what this review reminds me of; a 4-door hardtop FWD S2000. With 40 less hp. If it matched the S2000's power output, then I may just be interested in paying the $30k asking price. I'd also ask for RWD, but I know that's pushing it

Would you like twin turbo with that?

Great review Raza. I agree you should go refresh your memory of a regular Si and give us a comparo.

I honestly hope they are vastly different, because if they aren't then I would forever hate myself for not getting the Si sedan they had on the lot. Even then, I still can't get the looks to grow on me. I really think it is plain ugly. I wouldn't even give it an "it looks okay." I think the civic coupes are much nicer but they didn't have one (an Si version that is) on the lot when I was getting the Accord, else I would have gotten it in a heartbeat. Yes I honestly do hate the looks of the sedan that much.

[Vinsanity]

Would you like twin turbo with that?

*lightbulb moment*

RDX engine in a Civic: the next Type-R

thanks for the idea!

[Lazerous]

*lightbulb moment*

RDX engine in a Civic: the next Type-R

thanks for the idea!

I already patented it before I made the post

[Raghavan]

I think the sedan looks much much better than the coupe.

[Lazerous]

I think the sedan looks much much better than the coupe.

Really? I feel like the design of the those thin headlights flows much better with the design of the coupe. I also prefer the rear-end of the coupe over the boxy punched in end of the sedan.

[Raghavan]

Really? I feel like the design of the those thin headlights flows much better with the design of the coupe. I also prefer the rear-end of the coupe over the boxy punched in end of the sedan.

I think that the Coupe looks like a bubble or something for some reason. The sedan IMO is so much nicer looking from the back.
I prefer the Euro front over the US front though.

[Lazerous]

I prefer the Euro front over the US front though.

At least we agree on one thing.

[SVT666]

I prefer the Euro front over the US front though.

The Civic with a Euro front is available in Canada as the Acura CSX.

[Submariner]

That was a professional job, on that review.  Hats off to you.