ZR1 vs. Viper ACR

[the Teuton]

Can someone find me 345 snow tires?

[280Z Turbo]

Can someone find me 345 snow tires?

I'd get 8" rims with 225 snow tires.

[Laconian]

Can someone find me 345 snow tires?

Check Zamboni's website.

[r0tor]

Can someone find me 345 snow tires?

close enough... http://www.tirerack.com/tires/Spec.jsp?make=BFGoodrich&model=All-Terrain+T%2FA+KO&vehicleSearch=true&fromCompare1=yes&partnum=17R7ATAKO&tirePageLocQty=%26partnum%3D17R7ATAKO

[Raza]

I voted ZR1.  Sure, the car doesn't have the panache of the original, but it has the name.  And after driving the Z06 (in GT5 Prologue... ), I'm pretty sure that the ZR1 will be plenty of fun. 

I'd rather have a base Corvette still, though.

[Soup DeVille]

Can someone find me 345 snow tires?

I'd size them down as much as practical- as far as 205 on 7 inch rims.

[the Teuton]

I'd size them down as much as practical- as far as 205 on 7 inch rims.

Does the Vette only have 7 inch rims?  I'm trying to fathom downsizing a tire from a 345 to a 205 on the same wheel...

[Soup DeVille]

Hello - 0.50:1 top gear, 3.07:1 rear axle and a 345/35-19 drive tire???

I could destroy a Viper clutch in minutes if I had the mind to.

I don't feel lijke arguing with you about this, but lets think for a second what's happening hear- it's not about peak torque or HP or any of the bullshit you keep coming up with- and what a dyno sheeet shows a motor as producing at 1000 RPM and wide open throttle has nothing to do with the power it produces at 1000 RPM and 5% throttle.

What it is about is about friction between the clutch plate and the friction plate- which doesn't even care what gear the transmission is in- it is concerned with the speed differential between the two. Starting out in first gear- that differential is about 100 RPM- the rear wheels aren't moving, but the engine is, and by the time the clutch is fully engaged that reduces to zero. The same exact thing happens in sixth- the only difference is that it takes a little longer to reach that full engagement- perhaps as long as 60 seconds instead of 1 or 2- but its nothing the clutch eveen balks at doing. Unless you're willing to say that a Viper clutch can't handle 60 starts from 0 in first before it burns out. To be sure, you do heat things up a little more- but nowhere near as much as a single slip-clutch drag racing start in first, or in an autocross course lasting no more than 60 seconds.

[Soup DeVille]

Does the Vette only have 7 inch rims?  I'm trying to fathom downsizing a tire from a 345 to a 205 on the same wheel...

Obviously, when I say change the rim size, I mean the exact same thing as changing the motherfuckling wheels.

[the Teuton]

Obviously, when I say change the rim size, I mean the exact same thing as changing the motherfuckling wheels.

Have you ever actually seen someone run a Vette in the winter?

[Raza]

Have you ever actually seen someone run a Vette in the winter?

Yes.

[Soup DeVille]

Have you ever actually seen someone run a Vette in the winter?

Yes. Of course, 95% of the tme in the winter, the roads are clear of snow in most places, so that's no surprise at all. By that same token, I've seen Harley riders and Lotus 7s in the winter too.

I did drive my old Nova through one winter- 400 HP, 2800 RPM stall converter and all, and that was on a chassis that would make even a C3 Vette's underpinnings look space-aged. It wouldn't call it an ideal situation, but it was and can be done; and in all honesty, I'd rather do that again than try the same thing in the bone-stock 2WD Ranger that replaced it. And can't imagine a Viper being any worse than either of them; at least it has a stick and a decent front/rear weight bias.

[Cookie Monster]

Obviously, when I say change the rim size, I mean the exact same thing as changing the motherfuckling wheels.

[GoCougs]

I don't feel lijke arguing with you about this, but lets think for a second what's happening hear- it's not about peak torque or HP or any of the bullshit you keep coming up with- and what a dyno sheeet shows a motor as producing at 1000 RPM and wide open throttle has nothing to do with the power it produces at 1000 RPM and 5% throttle.

Actually, I'm not arguing, and I never once mentioned neither peak torque nor peak HP in regards to this issue.

I have conclusively shown that you'd have to slip the clutch until the car reaches about 40 mph. That's not good for a clutch, even if done at it no throttle (I think this stunt would require more throttle, worsening wear and tear).

What it is about is about friction between the clutch plate and the friction plate- which doesn't even care what gear the transmission is in- it is concerned with the speed differential between the two. Starting out in first gear- that differential is about 100 RPM- the rear wheels aren't moving, but the engine is, and by the time the clutch is fully engaged that reduces to zero. The same exact thing happens in sixth- the only difference is that it takes a little longer to reach that full engagement- perhaps as long as 60 seconds instead of 1 or 2- but its nothing the clutch eveen balks at doing. Unless you're willing to say that a Viper clutch can't handle 60 starts from 0 in first before it burns out. To be sure, you do heat things up a little more- but nowhere near as much as a single slip-clutch drag racing start in first, or in an autocross course lasting no more than 60 seconds.

The car will have to get pretty close to 40 mph before the clutch can be fully engaged - until then it's slip-arony. Exactly how much wear and tear this creates versus other uses and abuses, I'm not sure - but it's most certainly a lot more than an "average" start in first (as if there's such a thing with a car like this).

[Soup DeVille]

Actually, I'm not arguing, and I never once mentioned neither peak torque nor peak HP in regards to this issue.

I have conclusively shown that you'd have to slip the clutch until the car reaches about 40 mph. That's not good for a clutch, even if done at it no throttle (I think this stunt would require more throttle, worsening wear and tear).

The car will have to get pretty close to 40 mph before the clutch can be fully engaged - until then it's slip-arony. Exactly how much wear and tear this creates versus other uses and abuses, I'm not sure - but it's most certainly a lot more than an "average" start in first (as if there's such a thing with a car like this).

To do the same thing on my car, I have to slip the clutch to about 30 MPH. Is it probably wearing it more than usual? Most likely. Is it any more extreme than a dragstrip launch? Not at all, and probably less.

Does my car show any signs of premature wear? Well, I replaced the clutch at 110,000 miles, after several autocross and slalom competitions, general spiritted driving quite a bit of the time and a few trips to the dragstrip- as well as doing the aforementioned a few times just to prove it to skeptics. It's interesting to note that the flywheel wasn't blued, and there was still quite a bit of material left on the friction disc- it was one of the diaphragm springs that had broken off that necissitated the replacement.

It takes only the slightest touch on the throttle.

Needless to say, this is a car that doesn't weigh much less than a Viper, and whose clutch is far less beefy.

[Onslaught]

ZR1 even if I think it's a little ugly compared to the Z06 or normal C6. I've never liked the Viper.

[r0tor]

ACR is officially the badest of the badasses at the 'Ring 

[68_427]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=08nxInpgTGc

[Rich]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=08nxInpgTGc

I noticed the Viper's shifter moving under accel/decel... looks like it's harnessing a ton of power

[Soup DeVille]

I noticed the Viper's shifter moving under accel/decel... looks like it's harnessing a ton of power

It's probably direct mounted to the transmission to simplify the linkage- so when the engine twists on its mount, everything else does too.

[Rich]

It's probably direct mounted to the transmission to simplify the linkage- so when the engine twists on its mount, everything else does too.

What kind of mounting is done normally to keep it from twisting?

When I test drove a Solstice, I noticed that the shifter moved/vibrated under load (not as bad as that Viper though)  I really like it, made me feel like the power was flowing through my arm (or something like that... I'm not a good writer..)

[Laconian]

My car does that too, because the transmission is located inside the center tunnel. It's fun to jab the throttle to make it jig.

[JYODER240]

I noticed the Viper's shifter moving under accel/decel... looks like it's harnessing a ton of power

My car does that too, just not nearly as much.

[Tave]

I voted for the ZR-1, but I'd rather have this than either:

[SVT666]

I voted for the ZR-1, but I'd rather have this than either:

[sandertheshark]

As a track toy, Viper, every single time.

As a car to live with, Vette, every single time.

[Raza]

My car does that too, just not nearly as much.

I was just reading about that actually.  Nissan was considering finding a way to damp that out a bit, but they decided not to, since they thought it would contribute to the feel of the car. 

[JYODER240]

I was just reading about that actually.  Nissan was considering finding a way to damp that out a bit, but they decided not to, since they thought it would contribute to the feel of the car. 

Yeah they said they could fix it but it would give the gearbox a rubbery feel. I actually kinda like it, it cool to be able to feel the engine rev through your hand.

[r0tor]

It's probably direct mounted to the transmission to simplify the linkage- so when the engine twists on its mount, everything else does too.

I'd guess so too.  I know in the RX8 you can actually unbolt the shifted and pour the tranny oil through the opening to do an oil change... when I put my short shifter on i looked down and was like "wow, look at the pretty gears!"

[sportyaccordy]

My Hondas don't have any vibration through the shifter. They also have some of the best shifters in the business.

My Maximas did. They felt cheap, and had really awful shift feel.