The 2009 TL... I'm starting to like...

[GoCougs]

99 Accord V6 wasn't available in a manual...

It was going to be a 4cyl Coupe IIRC.

Oh, how convenient this coupe.

[2o6]

Yeah, no.

The RL is a very good car. The pricetag and the relative quality isn't as high as it competitors.

[YO]

well yes... you can be a brand snob or drive both... no comparison... through in the 5 for good measure. Personally, only the M35/45 is as nice as the RL IMO...

Yeah, no.

[2o6]

Oh, how convenient this coupe.

Read my post.

Nowhere did I say that the V6 sedan he bought was a V6 MT Accord he tested.

[Submariner]

well yes... you can be a brand snob or drive both... no comparison... through in the 5 for good measure. Personally, only the M35/45 is as nice as the RL IMO...

Not the A6 or the 5 series?

Haha ha hahahahaha

[YO]

The 5 always dissapoints me... too cramped for that class of car. I-drive is still tedious and seating position feels disconnected compared to the last gen. Horribly underpowered til they added the turbo. Still would take the RL and M over this car.

the A6 is beautiful inside and out. Something happened to Audi. They just drive awful to me. Every ride and drive I go to, It feels the worst. The only vehicle in this class that drives worse is the 9x.  As a tourer its fantastic. But the steering feels Lexus like... quicker and better but strange

Not the A6 or the 5 series?

Haha ha hahahahaha

[CALL_911]

The 5 always dissapoints me... too cramped for that class of car. I-drive is still tedious and seating position feels disconnected compared to the last gen. Horribly underpowered til they added the turbo. Still would take the RL and M over this car.
That just means you haven't driven an N52 530i, or any of the V8 variants. The RL isn't exactly a rocket either.


the A6 is beautiful inside and out. Something happened to Audi. They just drive awful to me. Every ride and drive I go to, It feels the worst. The only vehicle in this class that drives worse is the 9x.  As a tourer its fantastic. But the steering feels Lexus like... quicker and better but strange
I don't know about the A6, but every time I drive my sister's TSX back to back with our A4, I can't help but think how much better the Audi's engine is, and how much better it handles.

[sportyaccordy]

German cars are a pain to maintain...

[CJ]

Audi has a 3 year/36,000 mile maintenance plan, I believe.

[YO]

apples to apples... no V8 in the RL and that would throw the price difference almost $20k

[CALL_911]

apples to apples... no V8 in the RL and that would throw the price difference almost $20k

The RL is a ~7-second car, and so is the N52 530i.

[Eye of the Tiger]

SHAWD!

[Submariner]

The 5 always dissapoints me... too cramped for that class of car. I-drive is still tedious and seating position feels disconnected compared to the last gen. Horribly underpowered til they added the turbo. Still would take the RL and M over this car.

Who cares how it was? What matters is how it is.  And it is a....wait the seating position feels disconnected?  THE FUCKING SEATING POSITION FEELS DISCONNECTED?      If that made sense I would argue it, so for the sake of argument, lets say you feel the BMW feels disconnected compared to the last model...even if it was, were talking about a BMW 5 vs. an Acura RL...please. 

the A6 is beautiful inside and out. Something happened to Audi. They just drive awful to me. Every ride and drive I go to, It feels the worst. The only vehicle in this class that drives worse is the 9x.  As a tourer its fantastic. But the steering feels Lexus like... quicker and better but strange

No

[2o6]

That's ignorant. He's driven both (ALL of them) cars and has formed his opinion of them based on how he felt. He likes the RL, the RL is not a bad car. There's no reason to mess with him because he doesn't like the same two cars you do. He's not putting the BMW or Audi down, he just likes the RL better.

[Submariner]

That's ignorant. He's driven both (ALL of them) cars and has formed his opinion of them based on how he felt. He likes the RL, the RL is not a bad car. There's no reason to mess with him because he doesn't like the same two cars you do. He's not putting the BMW or Audi down, he just likes the RL better.

Ive driven an RL and several different 5 series as well...

To say that the seating position in the BMW is disconnected...?

[2o6]

Ive driven an RL and several different 5 series as well...

And you're different people.

To say that the seating position in the BMW is disconnected...?

To him, the driver-steering relationship is wrong. This is true of cars such as the Toyota Corolla. Teuton Said the same thing about the VW Jetta. YO is saying this about the 5-series.


It does not suit his needs, and the RL does.

[YO]

the RL is a 6.5 car

The RL is a ~7-second car, and so is the N52 530i.

[MrH]

I agree with GoCougs completely.

You guys need to understand the concept of statistically significant sample sizes.

You're trying to argue with objective data with personal boo-who stories.  Takes a stats class and then come back to this thread.

[TBR]

I agree with GoCougs completely.

You guys need to understand the concept of statistically significant sample sizes.

You're trying to argue with objective data with personal boo-who stories.  Takes a stats class and then come back to this thread.

And yes Honda struggles with the 2nd gear AT design... which has since been fixed... I LOVE the RL, TL-S and current line up of transmission...

Data?

http://www.samarins.com/reviews/accord.html

"Some of the possible problem areas were automatic transmission on V6 models and the "check engine" light with EGR related codes on V6 models. "

http://www.carcomplaints.com/Honda/Accord/2003/transmission/transmission_failure.shtml

^^
#125 complaints of transmission failure.

http://www.honda-tech.com/showthread.php?t=2434676
"They have an alarmingly high failure rate for a Japanese vehicle. The failure rates were high enough that Honda offered a 7yr/100k extended warranty on the transmission only to maintain consumer confidence and resale values. The transmissions commonly fail at 50-70k miles."

It is relatively common knowledge that the Honda V6 AT combo isn't that good.

[YO]

that is a rediculous statement. It's like Dubya spouting off about WMDs. Yes Honda had some tranny problems but not nearly as bad as you make it out to be.

It's like saying Audi's were built specifically to redesign garages.  Study the facts before you Dubya up your opinions...

It is relatively common knowledge that the Honda V6 AT combo isn't that good.

[TBR]

that is a rediculous statement. It's like Dubya spouting off about WMDs. Yes Honda had some tranny problems but not nearly as bad as you make it out to be.

It's like saying Audi's were built specifically to redesign garages.  Study the facts before you Dubya up your opinions...

http://www.carcomplaints.com/Honda/Accord/2003/index.shtml
http://www.carcomplaints.com/Honda/Accord/2002/index.shtml
http://www.carcomplaints.com/Honda/Accord/2001/index.shtml

[TBR]

http://tl.acurazine.com/forums/showthread.php?t=573111
http://tl.acurazine.com/forums/showthread.php?t=566833

Oh, and the CL section of the board actually has an entire forum dedicated to the transmission problems:
http://cl.acurazine.com/forums/forumdisplay.php?f=55

[GoCougs]

I'd like to see a reliability list that places Audi above Acura. I think we all know that in the vast majority of lists Acura will be way, way ahead of Audi.

This isn't to state that I don't like Audi, or that Acura is perfect. The new A4 is an absolute stunner in person, and it is in general a more upscale marque, but no amount of adulation and anecdotes will upend reality.

[TBR]

I'd like to see a reliability list that places Audi above Acura. I think we all know that in the vast majority of lists Acura will be way, way ahead of Audi.

This isn't to state that I don't like Audi. The new A4 is an absolute stunner in person, and it is in general a more upscale marque, but no amount of adulation and anecdotes will upend reality.

With exception of the transmission problem an Acura is going to be more reliable (as I stated a couple pages back), but it is definitely a problem and it is substantial enough that I would hesitate to buy any 2003 or earlier Acura/Honda V6 with an AT. I wouldn't mind a CL-S 6-speed though.

[TBR]

http://www.carcomplaints.com/Audi/A4/2003/index.shtml
http://www.carcomplaints.com/Acura/TL/2003/index.shtml

While the sample size here is undoubtedly quite small, it at least appears that the A4 doesn't have anymore trouble areas than the TL.

[GoCougs]

Oh, TBR, oh, TBR. I thought you knew better.

Anecdotes (AKA fanboy forums and what my pappy drives) aren't it.

[TBR]

Oh, TBR, oh, TBR. I thought you knew better.

Anecdotes (AKA fanboy forums and what my pappy drives) aren't it.

Try reading:

http://www.carcomplaints.com/Honda/Accord/2003/index.shtml
http://www.carcomplaints.com/Honda/Accord/2002/index.shtml
http://www.carcomplaints.com/Honda/Accord/2001/index.shtml

And yes Honda struggles with the 2nd gear AT design... which has since been fixed... I LOVE the RL, TL-S and current line up of transmission...

[Tave]

With exception of the transmission problem an Acura is going to be more reliable

I don't think you're getting it.


Just because the transmission is a common trouble spot for the Accord, doesn't mean that it will have more transmission problems per vehicle than an Audi (or more problems in general, which we know it won't).


Let's pretend that Honda has 104 problems reported per 100 vehicles, and Audi has 170 per 100.

Now, it might be a good idea to watch the transmission on your Accord if it's identified as a trouble area, but it doesn't make it less reliable than an A4.

[YO]

That would be less that .001% of units sold.

http://www.carcomplaints.com/Honda/Accord/2003/index.shtml
http://www.carcomplaints.com/Honda/Accord/2002/index.shtml
http://www.carcomplaints.com/Honda/Accord/2001/index.shtml

[YO]

the report was on raw numbers not percentages

I don't think you're getting it.


Just because the transmission is a common trouble spot for the Accord, doesn't mean that it will have more transmission problems per vehicle than an Audi (or more problems in general, which we know it won't).


Let's pretend that Honda has 104 problems reported per 100 vehicles, and Audi has 170 per 100.

Now, it might be a good idea to watch the transmission on your Accord if it's identified as a trouble area, but it doesn't make it less reliable than an A4.