Comparison review: Five compact sporty sedans

[TBR]

Well I was right initially anyway.

[the Teuton]

So you mentioned the light steering on the Jetta.  What did you think about the pedals?

[ifcar]

So you mentioned the light steering on the Jetta.  What did you think about the pedals?

I cannot say they had jumped out at me for being overly light.

[the Teuton]

I cannot say they had jumped out at me for being overly light.

I was talking about the them being a little touchy, especially the brakes.

[ifcar]

I was talking about the them being a little touchy, especially the brakes.

Or touchy. I might have noticed it had I been looking for that trait, but nothing about them interfered with comfortably driving the car.

[Raza]

I disagree with your evaluations on the Jetta's driving dynamics, but I didn't get to drive the standard car long enough to really be sure of it.  At the same price as the Civic Si, however, I'd never take the 2.5. 

[ifcar]

First place: Mazda3

That the Mazda3 wins this comparison says at least as much about the slim pickings among sporty, relatively inexpensive sedans as it does about Mazda?s recently redesigned compact car.

This win says that Mazda checks both the boxes that a compact car ought to in this price range ? it should have a premium feel, and it should be fun to drive. The Mazda3 is agile and powerful, has a well-appointed interior, and isn?t too stiff-riding or noisy.

But while these boxes are both checked, Mazda certainly didn?t go above and beyond in comfort, luxury, or sportiness with this car...

Continued at link:
http://www.examiner.com/examiner/x-1017-DC-Car-Examiner~y2009m9d26-Comparison-review-five-compact-sporty-sedans-First-place

[sportyaccordy]

Meh.....

$20K????

These guys have been making these cars for years, and still can't get the basics right.

Laugh if you want, but I have driven Accords like mine with
- great, accurate steering feel (my first one especially)
- the perfect balance between ride comfort & confident handling (pretty much any car with Konis and the right springs fit the bill)
- awesome throttle response with no sacrifice in driveability (easily done with a quality 8# flywheel)
- incredibly accurate shifters, even after 15 years of use
- decent power (160-170HP is plenty when the low end is decent, throttle response is great in the midrange and the motor pulls all the way to the fuel cut out)

Now is a 93 Accord as refined as even a 97 Accord? No. The chassis is, in the context of new cars, downright flimsy, and noise insulation is weak. Wind noise on the highway makes conversations hard, and my modified exhaust, while definitely more quiet than most, is still pretty loud compared to even a stock 93.

So with that out of the way, with my first Accord as my primary example, I must say it's really not that difficult to make a car that's fun to drive. Handling-wise, obviously a double wishbone setup in front is tough, but geometry control is so critical during cornering. Stiff springs (like those in the CSi) are not at all necessary for a good handling car.... good shocks are. Manufacturers would do themselves a great favor enlisting the services of the likes of Bilstein or Koni to produce their shocks for them.

As far as engine performance and throttle response, obviously now with emissions and all that shit they're in a rut. But a lightweight flywheel goes so far in how a car feels, and it surprisingly doesn't really affect drivability. In lower gears a lightened flywheel makes the car feel about 3,000 times lighter and responsive, and also makes the tip in much less severe, saving a little gas.

For brakes, I dunno. Since I did my 5 lug swap, I had to ditch ABS... but I haven't had any problems. I had to upgrade to bigger rotors & stronger front calipers. Pedal feel is firm and generally good, and very progressive. I don't know if these cars have electronic brakes or what, but I really don't see how you can botch brakes. Oversize them a little bit and you're good to freaking go. As far as linearity I don't even understand how manufacturers can do that w/o some kind of electronic intervention.

As far as interiors and shit.... when in doubt... just keep it fucking simple. I'd rather a simple but decently designed cheap interior than an ugly nice material one.

I mean there are a lot of considerations to be made, but at this point in the game I really don't see how manufacturers are still botching things up. ESPECIALLY Volkswagen. This is FREAKING ridiculous lol.

[93JC]

El Tres in first place? I could have told you El Tres is the tits.

[2o6]

El Tres in first place? I could have told you El Tres is the tits.

How would you know? You got the two-pedal model! 

[93JC]

Tig o' bitties.

[ifcar]

Conclusion:

There's a lot that goes into what makes a good car. In this particular comparison, of compact sporty sedans, it came down to which car was the most enjoyable to drive.

However, practicality, comfort, refinement, price, and gas mileage do matter, too. Had the car that won here, the 2010 Mazda3 S, failed miserably in these areas, good acceleration and handling alone would not keep it in first place.

But beyond the overall ranking order, which particular cars shine in which particular areas? See the summaries at the link below, where the cars are ranked specifically for their comfort luxury, practicality, driving enjoyment, price, and overall blend of the above:

http://www.examiner.com/examiner/x-1017-DC-Car-Examiner~y2009m9d27-Comparison-review-five-compact-sporty-sedans-Conclusion

[Raza]

Despite your comments, I'd still walk away with the Civic Si of all these cars. 

[ifcar]

Despite your comments, I'd still walk away with the Civic Si of all these cars. 

It makes sense. As I tried to make clear in the review, the Civic Si is the best choice for certain types of drivers -- those who would be pushing a car to its limits anyway.

[Raza]

It makes sense. As I tried to make clear in the review, the Civic Si is the best choice for certain types of drivers -- those who would be pushing a car to its limits anyway.

It's good that you mention that stuff.  I didn't read the whole thing (obviously), but it's nice to see that, despite the rigid ranking system, you leave room for different kinds of drivers. 

[CALL_911]

The 3 is a very good looking car.

[Vinsanity]

But unlike either the winner of this comparison, or the Si?s more traditional pricey competitors, this Civic is only especially rewarding to drive if you?re really pushing it. The engine offers no more performance than the average econobox unless you keep it near the redline;

kinda sounds like the S2000...

[sportyaccordy]

kinda sounds like the S2000...

Meh the S is fast but I didn't find it to be that rewarding when flogged.

I saw a new MS3... decent looking, but that nose is so goofy

[Submariner]

Meh the S is fast but I didn't find it to be that rewarding when flogged.

I saw a new MS3... decent looking, but that nose is so goofy

If it had the old cars nose, it would be infinitely better.

[CALL_911]

If it had the old cars nose, it would be infinitely better.

Meh. The old car was kind of bland, and didn't look very different from a run-of-the-mill 3 hatch. I love the new nose, the new MZ3 really looks freaking cool.

However, I definitely prefer the old interior.

[WookieOnRitalin]

Meh. The old car was kind of bland, and didn't look very different from a run-of-the-mill 3 hatch. I love the new nose, the new MZ3 really looks freaking cool.

However, I definitely prefer the old interior.

Isn't the new interior supposed to be better than the old one? The quality is supposed to be anyway. Do you prefer the old interior design to the new design?

[CALL_911]

Isn't the new interior supposed to be better than the old one? The quality is supposed to be anyway. Do you prefer the old interior design to the new design?

I haven't been in the new one, I'm only talking about design.

But the old interior wasn't exactly a piece of shit.

[NomisR]

Wow, what happened to the discussion about how VWs brake pedal feels like shit??

Oh and I like how the 3 looks.

[93JC]

Fucking RIGHT you like the looks of the 3.

[Raza]

Fucking RIGHT you like the looks of the 3.

Your face is gay.

[93JC]

Gay as in happy?

[Vinsanity]

Meh the S is fast but I didn't find it to be that rewarding when flogged.

I'd wager that it's more rewarding than flogging a Civic Si...

[Raza]

I'd wager that it's more rewarding than flogging a Civic Si...

I'm not so sure.  The Civic Si (Mugen) is really fucking good. 

[Raza]

Gay as in happy?

Yes.