2011 Mustang GT 5.0

[Mustangfan2003]

The 2010 Mustang I rented in Vegas didn't have any noticeable road noise and I thought the ride was fine. 

[Tave]

Every review I've read has complimented the Mustang on its ride.

[SVT666]

That is what makes Cougs a Trolling Fanboi.  He invents stuff.

[Nethead]

The Camaro came back after hiatus, and not only did it immediately become the segment sales leader after almost always having been outsold by the Mustang in years past, it sold ~80,000 units of such a non-essential car in the worst economic conditions since the Great Depression.

Idiot.  Mulletheads had NOTHING for 2003, 2004, 2005, 2006, 2007, and 2008.  Mustang lovers were buying Mustangs in all those years.

The true comparison between Mustang sales and Camaro sales is the sum total of all Mustang sales and all Camaro sales since the day after the last 2002 Camaro rolled of the assembly line in 2002, since Ford had been selling Mustangs before Chevy rushed its imitation to market in '67 and Ford has been selling Mustangs since the original Camaros got their asses sent down the rusty road of automotive history back in '02.  These are just the facts, ma'am.

The tragedy is: with six full years to develop a new Camaro, Chevy finally brings out a Camaro no better than the one we have today --with quite a few warranty issues to add insult to injury .  Some things never change...

[Gotta-Qik-C7]

Idiot.  Mulletheads had NOTHING for 2003, 2004, 2005, 2006, 2007, and 2008.  Mustang lovers were buying Mustangs in all those years.  

The GTO kicked Mustang ass in all of those years dude. Just because it wasn't called a Camaro didn't mean GM didn't offer competition to the Mustang. 

Have you driven it yet?  The sightlines aren't something to get used to...they're downright shitty.  I think I would get panicky if I had to drive the thing in heavy traffic in a large city because you can't see the cars around you. 

Yes I have (A rental over XMas weekend) and the car does have very small windows. For me it was no big deal and actually the sightlines kinda reminded me of my moms CTS. And when compared to the sightlines in my '99 vert. the new Camaro didn't take much adjusting to.

[hotrodalex]

And when compared to the sightlines in my '99 vert. the new Camaro didn't take much adjusting to.

I'm assuming you mean with the top up. I would hope it has much better visibility with it down.

I don't think the new one is any worse than a '71 in regards to sight lines. Higher sills, but that's about it.

[Gotta-Qik-C7]

I'm assuming you mean with the top up. I would hope it has much better visibility with it down.

I don't think the new one is any worse than a '71 in regards to sight lines. Higher sills, but that's about it.

[GoCougs]

The GTO kicked Mustang ass in all of those years dude. Just because it wasn't called a Camaro didn't mean GM didn't offer competition to the Mustang. 

That's what Mustangists call "an Inconvenient History."

Yes I have (A rental over XMas weekend) and the car does have very small windows. For me it was no big deal and actually the sightlines kinda reminded me of my moms CTS. And when compared to the sightlines in my '99 vert. the new Camaro didn't take much adjusting to.

"Sight lines." Of all the things to hate on, er, get "panicky" on. 

[Gotta-Qik-C7]

That's what Mustangists call "an Inconvenient History."

[GoCougs]

Ha, ha! Now just wait for the flood of links to "expert" comparison tests that said the Mustang GT was the cooler/nicer/quietest/stickiest/brakiest/faster/bestest/whatever car!

[SVT666]

Nope.  GTO smoked the GT.  I have even considered a GTO.  The problem with the GTO was the styling.  Personally I liked the sleeper look, but a lot of people didn't.  Oh and the GTO was far more money than the GT too, so that was another problem the GTO had to overcome.

[Cobra93]

The GTO kicked Mustang ass in all of those years dude. Just because it wasn't called a Camaro didn't mean GM didn't offer competition to the Mustang.  :nutty:Yes I have (A rental over XMas weekend) and the car does have very small windows. For me it was no big deal and actually the sightlines kinda reminded me of my moms CTS. And when compared to the sightlines in my '99 vert. the new Camaro didn't take much adjusting to.

Based on the Holy Grail of sales numbers that some people believe constitute superiority, the GTO was a resounding failure. Nevertheless, I liked it. It was basically killed by poor dealership practices.

[Gotta-Qik-C7]

Based on the Holy Grail of sales numbers that some people believe constitute superiority, the GTO was a resounding failure. Nevertheless, I liked it. It was basically killed by poor dealership practices.

And a total lack of advertisment. Ditto for the G8!

[Gotta-Qik-C7]

Nope.  GTO smoked the GT.  I have even considered a GTO.  The problem with the GTO was the styling.  Personally I liked the sleeper look, but a lot of people didn't.  Oh and the GTO was far more money than the GT too, so that was another problem the GTO had to overcome.

And for the life of me I can't understand why called the car too bland. For years everyone had been whinning about the Trans Ams styling being too boy racer. 

[Mustangfan2003]

Pontiac was just one clusterfuck in their last 5 years or so. 

[GoCougs]

Based on the Holy Grail of sales numbers that some people believe constitute superiority, the GTO was a resounding failure. Nevertheless, I liked it. It was basically killed by poor dealership practices.

The UAW had in their contract to limit imports to 18,000 units/year. There was no secretary (V6) or 'vert versions. It didn't have 20-25% rental fleet sales (in Mustang terms in those years that's 20,000 - 30,000 units/year). It was only available loaded (i.e., leather).

[SVT666]

The UAW had in their contract to limit imports to 18,000 units/year. There was no secretary (V6) or 'vert versions. It didn't have 20-25% rental fleet sales (in Mustang terms in those years that's 20,000 - 30,000 units/year). It was only available loaded (i.e., leather).

So now you're a GTO apologist?  By the way Troll, there were GTO's languishing on dealer lots for up to a year after they stopped production.  I still want one though.  Too bad a 2006 will be 6 or 7 years old by the time I'm ready for a new car...though they will be dirt cheap.

[Mustangfan2003]

I know a lot of dealers did a pretty high mark up on the GTO, that likely turned a lot of people away from the brand. 

[SVT666]

I know a lot of dealers did a pretty high mark up on the GTO, that likely turned a lot of people away from the brand. 

Big time.  They did the same with the G8 GT and GXP. 

[GoCougs]

I know a lot of dealers did a pretty high mark up on the GTO, that likely turned a lot of people away from the brand. 

Only when first released in 2003; thereafter they routinely sold as pretty much any domestic - below MSRP. In the last model year (2006) they were being sold with deep discounts - without any haggling they could be driven off a dealer lot for less than $30k.

[Nethead]

The GTO suffered hugely from a lot of bad decisions:
It was a shameless rebadging of an import.  This was just soooo wrong...
It used the dreadful Catera IRS, a contender for the worst IRS of all time.  I believe the current Camaro also uses the Catera IRS, which would explain a lot...In a comparo against the Charger SRT8 and the Shelby GT500 (Motor Trend, July 2006, pgs 48--57) the 3777 lbs GTO got beat in the slalom and the figure-eight by the 3990 lbs GT500 and by the 4266 lbs Charger SRT8 (that's just 11 pounds less than a whoppin' 500 lbs handicap for the Charger vs. the GTO!!!).  BTW, the GT500 also beat the GTO in braking (as did the Charger), 0-60, 0-100, and the quarter-mile--by the time the GTO reached 100 MPH, the GT500 was ahead by more than the length of a football field.  
The gas tank was moved from underneath the car into an already small trunk.
There was no possibility of overlooking the resemblance to the Cavalier, a distinction that woulda been fatal even if the suspension hadda been OK.
GTOs were overpriced, too. That 2006 GTO in the Motor Trend comparo listed for $32,685--more than a standard 2011 Mustang GT 5.0 and many thousands more than the Mustang GT of 2006 (although you could option out a 2006 Mustang GT convertible to more than $32,685).
It was planned to sell 18,000/year, but it never got anywhere remotely close to that.  In the first 30 selling days of 2006, Mustangs outsold the entire 2006 sales of GTOs.

But this is a Mustang thread--if you scroll back 40-50 pages in "The Fast Lane" there are probably some GTO threads in which to discuss the resurrected GTO for those so inclined...

[Cobra93]

And a total lack of advertisment. Ditto for the G8!

I recall a fair amount of advertising being devoted to it but that may just be because it was a memorable car for me. I don't think I've ever seen or heard a Toyota Camry ad. 

As for the dealerships, every one around me stocked only automatics and tacked on $5K "limited availability" markups. It's poetic justice that they eventually had to resort to fire saling them at a loss.

[Gotta-Qik-C7]

Oldhead you compare the performance of the GT500 to the GTO but then quote the price of the GT.  Both the STR8 and the GT500 cost waaaay more than the GTO dude! And I could care less about how many sold. Like Hemi said in another thread "Higher sales numbers does not make it a better car!" If we only go by sales the Cobalt is a better car than the Enzo............................

[Cobra93]

Oldhead you compare the performance of the GT500 to the GTO but then quote the price of the GT.  Both the STR8 and the GT500 cost waaaay more than the GTO dude! And I could care less about how many sold. Like Hemi said in another thread "Higher sales numbers does not make it a better car!" If we only go by sales the Cobalt is a better car than the Enzo............................

Yeah. There's a few of us that have been saying exactly that. There were quite a few years where the Mustang was outperformed by the Camaro but still outsold it. It's the exact opposite now. Another factor affecting new sales may be that for years, Mustang shoppers have had a supply of used, late model Mustangs to buy. I suspect that what we'll see if the government doesn't totally phuck it up, is that the Mustang and Camaro will continue to sell in comparable numbers throughout their production.

[Gotta-Qik-C7]

Yeah. There's a few of us that have been saying exactly that. There were quite a few years where the Mustang was outperformed by the Camaro but still outsold it. It's the exact opposite now. Another factor affecting new sales may be that for years, Mustang shoppers have had a supply of used, late model Mustangs to buy. I suspect that what we'll see if the government doesn't totally phuck it up, is that the Mustang and Camaro will continue to sell in comparable numbers throughout their production.

I agree. I know guys that refuse to buy any car new. And with a little hunting you can find the Mustang optioned the way you want in the used market 9 outta 10 times. 

[Gotta-Qik-C7]

I recall a fair amount of advertising being devoted to it but that may just be because it was a memorable car for me. I don't think I've ever seen or heard a Toyota Camry ad. 

What planet do you live on? LOL!

[Nethead]

Oldhead you compare the performance of the GT500 to the GTO but then quote the price of the GT.   Both the STR8 and the GT500 cost waaaay more than the GTO dude! And I could care less about how many sold. Like Hemi said in another thread "Higher sales numbers does not make it a better car!" If we only go by sales the Cobalt is a better car than the Enzo............................

g-q-z:  Read with more attention to what the words mean--the spanking that the GT500 & Charger SRT8 gave to the much lighter '06 GTO was to illustrate just how awful GM's decision to stick with the mega-fail Catera IRS was in a performance car.  Can you not comprehend the dimension of GM's mistake when your performance car just got outhandled by a car weighing 500 pounds more than yours??  Sure, the two cost more than the GTO--performance ain't cheap and can't be accomplished with a little money spent on some badges, a stitched steering wheel cover, hood scoops, and a gas tank in the trunk.  Who did they think they were fooling?  Not many, as GTO sales starkly attest...

Now, the Mustang GT's price was never quoted--please read more carefully next time.  It was only mentioned that the 2006 GTO cost more than the current Mustang GT 5.0 and thousands more than the Mustang GT of 2006.  In other words, the GTO was hugely overpriced--a big part of the reason Pontiac dealerships had more than a six-month's supply of GTOs on their lots in the Spring of 2006.  Thousands felt the Mustang GT's performance was a bargain at the Mustang GT's price (it was).  The GTO's, not so much...

Mustangs aren't the best performance vehicles ever made--Ferrari makes vehicles that'll beat Mustangs soundly in every category of performance except fuel mileage.  Everyone knows that!

But Mustangs offer more performance for the buck than any other new vehicles sold in North America--plus they're really good vehicles as well.  Astonishingly, it was the current base V6 Mustang that was the first car ever tested by the EPA that has over 300 HP and gets over 30 MPG (and turns the quarter in under 14 at over 100--not to mention .86 G)--you woulda thunk it woulda been some Asian boosted four-cylinder fuglyshit that looks like Roseanne Barr with a hoodscoop on her nose and a wing on her ass.  The V8 Mustang offers M3 performance for half the price--they don't do comparos with Camaros (or GTOs back in the day) against BMW M3s, now do they?  
There are reasons for that...
     

[GoCougs]

Oldhead you compare the performance of the GT500 to the GTO but then quote the price of the GT.  Both the STR8 and the GT500 cost waaaay more than the GTO dude! And I could care less about how many sold. Like Hemi said in another thread "Higher sales numbers does not make it a better car!" If we only go by sales the Cobalt is a better car than the Enzo............................

Because all's fair in putting Mustang at the top of the heap; sales numbers, irrelevant or irrational comparisons, weight, MPG (LOL), or just plain ole crazy person screed.

[Cobra93]

What planet do you live on? LOL!

I'm sure there were plenty of Camry ads. Nothing that caught my attention like these though:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZEyR8dztAsE

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ddWBsf7yfvw

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yqY3iPJUsX4

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wo6vRafScqA

[the Teuton]

With ads like the third and fourth you posted, Cobra, is it any wonder the car didn't sell?

Unless you're an absolute gearhead, who cares? It was a terrible ad campaign.