MT Family sedan comparo

[Tave]

It's not that much more expensive and it's a vastly superior car to any of those in this joke of a test.  MT didn't have the balls to include the Passat because they knew it would wipe the floor with all the others.  I wonder how big of a cheque Toyota had to write to Motor Trend in order to make sure a steaming pile of mediocrity like the Camry won?


Madman of the People

Of course it is. Base MSRP on a Passat is a ~30% price jump over base MSRP on an Accord or Camry.

[the Teuton]

Passats are basing at $27k with vinyl seats and a turbo 4 with 200 hp. For reference, Hyundai's 200 hp Sonata starts at $19k or so.

[ifcar]

This is the reason Volkswagen sells virtually zero Passats in the U.S. They used to be marginally more expensive than the competition -- and they were very popular then -- but now they're just in another price class altogether.

[GoCougs]

Yeah, not present in the test because virtually no one buys Passats.

[nickdrinkwater]

It's not that much more expensive and it's a vastly superior car to any of those in this joke of a test.  MT didn't have the balls to include the Passat because they knew it would wipe the floor with all the others.  I wonder how big of a cheque Toyota had to write to Motor Trend in order to make sure a steaming pile of mediocrity like the Camry won?


Madman of the People

How is the Passat 'vastly superior' to the Accord?

[the Teuton]

What's the Mondeo like across the pond? There's a decent chance our 2012 or 2013 Fusion is going to be the same car as the Mondeo.

[Madman]

How is the Passat 'vastly superior' to the Accord?

The US-spec Accord is a fat, wallowing barge that neither handles or rides particularly well.  Compared to our marshmallow-suspended Accords, the Passat handles like it's on rails.  Sadly, Volkswagen of America is planning on replacing the Passat over here with yet another dumbed-down "Americanised" barge.  It promises to be everything the typical clueless American "driver" wants; Big, cheap, ugly, soft riding, poor handling and with zero sporting pretensions.  Unlike the Passat, this new travesty will not be built up to a standard.  It will be made down to a price.  Just like the US-Accord, Camry, Altima, Malibu, Fusion, etc.

It's these same "geniuses" at Volkswagen of America who decided to rebadge Chrysler minivans, saddle it's US-spec Golfs and Jettas with the worst engine the company has ever made (the 2.5 I-5) and not to import the Scriocco, Touran or Polo.

Thanks!


Madman of the People

[Submariner]

The US-spec Accord is a fat, wallowing barge that neither handles or rides particularly well.  Compared to our marshmallow-suspended Accords, the Passat handles like it's on rails.  Sadly, Volkswagen of America is planning on replacing the Passat over here with yet another dumbed-down "Americanised" barge.  It promises to be everything the typical clueless American "driver" wants; Big, cheap, ugly, soft riding, poor handling and with zero sporting pretensions.  Unlike the Passat, this new travesty will not be built up to a standard.  It will be made down to a price.  Just like the US-Accord, Camry, Altima, Malibu, Fusion, etc.

It's these same "geniuses" at Volkswagen of America who decided to rebadge Chrysler minivans, saddle it's US-spec Golfs and Jettas with the worst engine the company has ever made (the 2.5 I-5) and not to import the Scriocco, Touran or Polo.

Thanks!


Madman of the People

Did VW's president inform you as to how they are going to ruin their upcoming model?   

Despite what you say, the Routan is a good minivan, and the Jetta is still a good car - 2.5 or not. 

[the Teuton]

Based on what VDub has done historically, Chrysler should at least be willing to license Swivel 'n Go to them. I'm surprised they don't.

[GoCougs]

Interesing rant. No other auto market in the world can touch the depth and breadth of the US - from a $20k Camry to a $30k Camaro SS or F150, to a $40k 4Runner to a $50k Corvette nowhere else on the planet can a person have such access to such a wide range of vehicles at such relatively low prices.

Outside those cars not available elsewhere or at astronomically higher cost, 95% of the US market wants size, reliability, quiet and good ride and good value. The facts are VW fails on most of these, especially reliability and value; meaning there's a reason the world's largest auto maker is still but a bit player in the US.

[sportyaccordy]

I would say the Passat competes more with cars like the Acura TSX, Audi A4 etc.

The Passat was and would be an awesome car at a more reasonable price point. However, at 27K just to start, you're in dangerous waters. That is

- Accord V6ville
- TSXville
- Legacy GTville

Not to mention, with any kinds of options whatsoever, you're in G35 or Acura TLville. And for what? Fake leather, a good but outclassed 4 banger. Unless the extra 5 cu ft of interior volume make a huge difference the Jetta makes more sense. Just a shame they don't sell the GLI anymore... that was probably one of the Jetta's biggest draws.

I like the B5/B6 Passats (reliability issues aside). This B7 version just seems confused. VW needs to figure out what exactly they are trying to accomplish.

[the Teuton]

The Passat isn't on the B platform anymore. The last B was the "B5.5" update in 2001 before this model.

[the Teuton]

Even Wikipedia confuses the B platform with the PQ platform that the Passat uses. I think, at least with the prices the way they are, the Passat is irrelevant in the marketplace now. The CC is alright, but it also looks the part of a much more expensive sedan; the Passat looks like a Malibu with some extra chrome and a VW badge on it.

[sportyaccordy]

Well with the Jetta now being able to carry human sized rear passengers I think xing out the Passat makes sense. A base CC at 27K is a much more enticing deal

[the Teuton]

Well with the Jetta now being able to carry human sized rear passengers I think xing out the Passat makes sense. A base CC at 27K is a much more enticing deal

That's because the CC is really freakin' cool even if the Sonata looks like it.

[SVT666]

That's because the CC is really freakin' cool even if the Sonata looks like it.

The Sonata doesn't look like it.  Not even close.  If anything the CC looks like the CLS.

[Vinsanity]

Well with the Jetta now being able to carry human sized rear passengers I think xing out the Passat makes sense. A base CC at 27K is a much more enticing deal

I agree. And for whatever reason that the price of the Passat just randomly shot up, VW seems to have anticipated it, and come out with the CC, which more people are willing to buy at that price level.

[sportyaccordy]

Sorry AltinD.

[r0tor]

The US-spec Accord is a fat, wallowing barge that neither handles or rides particularly well.  Compared to our marshmallow-suspended Accords, the Passat handles like it's on rails.  Sadly, Volkswagen of America is planning on replacing the Passat over here with yet another dumbed-down "Americanised" barge.  It promises to be everything the typical clueless American "driver" wants; Big, cheap, ugly, soft riding, poor handling and with zero sporting pretensions.  Unlike the Passat, this new travesty will not be built up to a standard.  It will be made down to a price.  Just like the US-Accord, Camry, Altima, Malibu, Fusion, etc.

It's these same "geniuses" at Volkswagen of America who decided to rebadge Chrysler minivans, saddle it's US-spec Golfs and Jettas with the worst engine the company has ever made (the 2.5 I-5) and not to import the Scriocco, Touran or Polo.

Thanks!


Madman of the People

At least I take comfort that Mazda North America's version of the american-ized 6 is an epic fail and should set an example to other companies...

[the Teuton]

At least I take comfort that Mazda North America's version of the american-ized 6 is an epic fail and should set an example to other companies...

The Atenza and 6 are basically the same thing, yet ours sucks. I don't understand how this is possible.

[r0tor]

The Atenza and 6 are basically the same thing, yet ours sucks. I don't understand how this is possible.

The new gen north american 6 is nothing like the world version...

[the Teuton]

The new gen north american 6 is nothing like the world version...

Ours sucks. That's a given. But I thought it was built on a bigger version of the same platform as the international version.

[ifcar]

Yes, ours is a few inches longer. It therefore is total garbage.

[SVT666]

It hardly sucks guys. 

[nickdrinkwater]

The European Mazda6 is a bit smaller IIRC.

[the Teuton]

Yes, ours is a few inches longer. It therefore is total garbage.

Drive it back-to-back with the old 6. It sucks.

Well, it doesn't if you're a family man. But it's not nearly as engaging as the outgoing model.

[ifcar]

Drive it back-to-back with the old 6. It sucks.

Well, it doesn't if you're a family man. But it's not nearly as engaging as the outgoing model.

Want something more fun? Mazda still sells a car called the 3 that's nearly as roomy as the old 6.

[the Teuton]

Want something more fun? Mazda still sells a car called the 3 that's nearly as roomy as the old 6.

No, it really isn't. The 3 is just about the same size as the old 3, and for passengers, it's noticeably more cramped in the rear.

[ifcar]

No, it really isn't. The 3 is just about the same size as the old 3, and for passengers, it's noticeably more cramped in the rear.

The old 6 also has no extra stretch-out space.

[the Teuton]

The old 6 also has no extra stretch-out space.

But the 3 is about as bad as the C170 Focus, and that car is pretty bad.