headlight bulbs

[Byteme]

Just purchased a set of Silverstar Ultras for the Ram, high beams only for now.  Sale price of $42. 

Anyway, the salesman told me that I need to be sure to use a conductive grease with them to keep the bulbs cooler and to keep them from overheating the pigtail on the harness.

I would like them in before dark today, Tuesday.  Any opinions on that? 

Are these the kind of headlights that are so damn brigth and have such a poor pattern that the jerks who have them on their cars only wind up blinding and pissing off other drivers?  If so do us all a favor and take them back and get a refund. 

[Byteme]

x2

I use my high beams on empty rural highways, and that's it. I think many (most?) modern headlights are too bright and create a dangerous amount of glare for oncoming traffic. Frankly I think HID lights should be illegal. They're too bright.

I also despise the attitude that some drivers have toward others, saying "I don't care if my lights are [too] bright: they help me see and I feel much safer." Those sorts of people are super colossal assholes.

Fixed it for you. 

I couldn't agree more. 

Since I started driving the Miata to work (it's still dark when I leave the house) I notice every out of alignment headlight and every clown who feels they need their driving lights on while on a city street or a freeway.  They ought to make a headlight alignment test mandatory with the state inspection and fail those with misaligned headlights.

I very seldom ever use my high beams and then it's only on long road trips, late at night or early morning on virtually deserted roads.   

[CALL_911]

Yeah, I always curse those with HIDs when they're facing me on the road. Then I quickly remember I have HIDs.....

[Rupert]

Are these the kind of headlights that are so damn brigth and have such a poor pattern that the jerks who have them on their cars only wind up blinding and pissing off other drivers?  If so do us all a favor and take them back and get a refund. 

It was just the bulbs, which doesn't have any bearing on the beam pattern. Since they were apparently legal wattage, and they're Silverstars (i.e. no brighter than regular bulbs), no problems with glare over stock.

[850CSi]

I think I use Silverstar Ultras. IIRC they've tended to last me a little more than a year. Not a super white light but I like them. Like Rupert, I think my cutoff is pretty low so I don't think they tend to bother other drivers. I think I'd get people popping me with high beams at least once in a while if they did.

[Rupert]

They aren't any brighter than regular bulbs, so I wouldn't expect them to bother anyone.

[Byteme]

They aren't any brighter than regular bulbs, so I wouldn't expect them to bother anyone.

I though there was a problem with some bulbs being different which caused a problem, even in the stock housing.  

From:
DEPARTMENT OF TRANSPORTATION
National Highway Traffic Safety Administration

49 CFR Part 571

[Docket No. 01-8885; Notice 01]
RIN 2127-AH81
Glare from Headlamps and other Front Mounted Lamps
Federal Motor Vehicle Safety Standard No. 108;
Lamps, Reflective Devices, and Associated Equipment

Link:  http://www.nhtsa.gov/cars/rules/rulings/glare.html   I've put some of this below in bold.

It's an interesting paper, worth reading.  



2.3 - Glare from HID Look-alike Bulbs and Other Colored Headlamp Bulbs

The advent of HIDs on more expensive vehicles has spawned attempts at achieving halogen-based look-a-likes. These are achieved by using coated, tinted, filtered or otherwise altered glass capsules for the halogen headlamp bulbs that can be used in place of the OEM bulbs. Alternatively, aftermarket headlamp housings with similar coating, tinting and filtering are being sold as replacements for OEM headlamps. The goal of many of these bulbs is to emit light that is different than an OEM halogen headlamp bulb, while attempting to maintain a headlamp's legally complying performance. The whiter light is offered as being closer in color to natural daylight, thus the claim is that drivers see better with the same amount of emitted light. This is not unique in motor vehicle lighting history; in fact, it is the same claim and intent as accompanied the 1929 Tung-Sol Blue-Wite TM headlamp bulb. The yellow variants of colored bulbs are intended to be more useful in wet weather where the color, still measured to be white, is more yellow than OEM halogen bulbs. The intent is to offer a color of light less likely to be reflected back from precipitation and fog. At the other extreme of colored aftermarket bulbs, are those that are very blue or multicolored. The multicolored bulbs are the result of many different colors being emitted by the bulb in various directions, instead of white light being emitted in all directions as occurs in normal halogen bulbs.

Generically categorized as "blue" bulbs, all of these aftermarket bulbs have become popular among auto enthusiasts and some other drivers, either because the bulbs produce the look of a more expensive vehicle at a fraction of the cost, or claims of improved visibility. Many of the bulbs are from well known bulb manufacturers, others are from less familiar companies and importers. Depending on the make and model of bulb desired, some are sold by auto parts stores and mass merchandisers, others are sold by specialty auto accessory stores and through the Internet. While there are no reasons to believe that all such bulbs cause headlamps to perform badly, many such bulbs do just that, as explained below.

The designing original equipment headlamp bulbs is a precise science, fraught with many design compromises in order to achieve the desired balance of energy usage, service life, emitted light and robust optical images of the filament. In general, headlamp bulb designs take years of thoughtful work in consultation with the designers of headlamp optics. The OEM bulb design is standardized and codified by industry consensus in SAE and International Electrotechnical Committee (IEC) standards so that all bulb manufacturers can build and sell bulbs with the expectation that they will perform in a safe and satisfactory manner in all headlamps in service. This standardization is incorporated into Federal Motor Vehicle Safety Standard No. 108, Lamps, reflective devices and associated equipment (FMVSS 108) by referencing information about each bulb. This information is in Docket Number: NHTSA-98-3397.

When changing the basic design of a headlamp bulb the way that placing a coating, filter or tinting can, the results can range from just color changes to reducing the emitted volume of light from a headlamp by almost half. For example, certain kinds of filters and coatings, while having the effect of reducing yellow light emission, are sometimes also very reflective. The result is that, instead of most of the light coming from the filament directly through the glass capsule and being used by the headlamp's optical design to have a focused beam down the road, the light bounces once or twice off the inner wall of the bulb. This causes strong images of the filament to be emitted from the capsule in directions and intensities never possible in the standardized OEM design. Because headlamps are designed to use standardized bulbs, the lighting performance of the headlamp could be markedly different, both impairing seeing down the road and causing others to have undue glare, when a modified, non-standardized bulb is substituted. Such poorly designed bulbs may also be a reason for the public's glare complaints.

In contrast, if the bulb designer uses a more benign filter element, the inner bulb reflectivity may be substantially reduced or virtually eliminated. For a bulb that is intended to be whiter, less yellow light may be emitted, giving the light a whiter, even bluish light, but still white light as defined in various industrial and legal standards. To assure that this bulb emits the equivalent and correct volume of light compared to an OEM version, the filament design must be subtly changed, but not so much so that wattage increases above the acceptable limits required of a standard bulb. These careful changes may continue to make the bulb interchangeable with an OEM design without noticeable consequence other than whiter light.

Besides replacing the OEM bulbs with bulbs with the characteristics described above, it is possible to purchase whole headlamps and replacement lenses for those that are replaceable, that are tinted. Under our standards, these must comply, with our lighting standard but again, the blue, or other color, tinting may have similar adverse disturbing and disabling glare effects .

Another disturbing trend in this look-a-like phenomenon is the substitution of OEM filament headlamp bulbs with aftermarket HID conversion bulbs. The desire is to achieve the look and achieve the more robust performance of HIDs. While not designed to be interchangeable, some aftermarket companies are substantially altering the HID bulb bases or providing adapters so that the HID bulbs can be inserted in headlamps designed for filament bulbs. The consequence of making these substitutions is to adversely affect safety. Filament headlamps are optically designed for the volume of light and filament placement and other critical dimensions and performance that OEM filament bulbs have. The HID conversions result in two to three times the volume of light and potentially imprecise arc placement. Such conversions often result in beam patterns that behave nothing like the original filament beam pattern, cannot be reliably aimed, and have many times the permitted glare intensity. In informal conversations with persons who have tested such conversions, the light intensity on one at a point aimed toward oncoming drivers was 22 times the allowable intensity limit. Another lamp was more than 7 times too intense. With poor HID bulb and arc placement, the glare intensity could be significantly worse. Thus, the use of these conversions could be yet another source of the glare problems about which many drivers have complained.

Regarding bluer light achieved by these filament bulbs, recent research (Sullivan, J.M. and Flannagan, M.J.: AVisual Effects of Blue-Tinted Tungsten-Halogen Headlamp Bulbs", Report No. UMTRI-2001-9, available in Docket: NHTSA-2001-8885-2) shows consistency with prior research, that discomfort glare ratings increase as the chromaticity moves toward the blue color range of the visible light spectrum. The authors also state that there is no evidence to show that target detection is enhanced with such blue colored headlamps, either in direct viewing or peripheral viewing of illuminated targets. This, essentially, shows that there likely is an inherent disbenefit from the use of such blue bulbs and headlamps that are intended to change the color of light emitted from headlamps. While one might assume that this also applies to the bluer HID powered OEM headlamps, the authors did not study this, nor speculate about it.

[S204STi]

You're preaching to the choir, for the most part.  Though this is still useful information, most people who determine that they would like to have this look simply disregard legality and do it anyway.  Depending on the situation, I may or may not approve.  For example, if the vehicle already has projectors for halogen lamps, frequently they can be modified to use HIDs without major effort and will in turn produce a nice, sharp cutoff along with drastically improved visibility for the driver.  In other cases, such as standard reflectors found on the majority of vehicles, I would completely disapprove.

It's also a known fact that blue-tinted bulbs yield fewer actual lumens than non-coated bulbs, in addition to being a spectrum of light that is extremely difficult for your own eyes to process as it returns to the driver, making them doubly useless.  Also, there are HID bulbs available which approach purple in color, which is again less useful to the eyes, in the mistaken belief that the light output of luxury cars is that color by default.  The reality is that HIDs in the 3700k range or so produce a nearly-white light, and that only when viewed from an angle rather than straight-on do they appear blue or purple.

[Rupert]

I though there was a problem with some bulbs being different which caused a problem, even in the stock housing.  

From:
DEPARTMENT OF TRANSPORTATION
National Highway Traffic Safety Administration

49 CFR Part 571

[Docket No. 01-8885; Notice 01]
RIN 2127-AH81
Glare from Headlamps and other Front Mounted Lamps
Federal Motor Vehicle Safety Standard No. 108;
Lamps, Reflective Devices, and Associated Equipment

Link:  http://www.nhtsa.gov/cars/rules/rulings/glare.html   I've put some of this below in bold.

It's an interesting paper, worth reading.  


[Text wall]

Care to paraphrase?

I was talking about 850's post where he was talking about his presumably legal halogen bulbs, which can't be brighter than a certain threshold. Unless his lamps are aimed wrong, so no glare problems worse than stock.

See STi's post for my thoughts on HIDs and shit.

[Byteme]

Care to paraphrase?

You mean summarize?  It simply pointed out that many of the aftermarket replacement bulbs are poorly designed and cause more glare for other drivers and less road lighting for the guy buying them.  I bolded the important stuff in the text I attached.

[Rupert]

Alright, that's the jist I got from the two sentences I read. I spent all day thinking about technical problems, and really don't feel like continuing that trend by reading a bunch of technical stuff.

Looks like it was talking about HIDs mostly?

[TurboDan]

Really dumb question: My new LR2 is the first car I've had with Xenon HIDs. Out of curiosity, I put the year/make/model into a search and two bulbs, vastly different in price, came up. Can anyone tell me why one is $96 and one is $440?

http://www.autopartswarehouse.com/sku/Land_Rover/LR2/PIAA/Headlight_Bulb/2008/P2719995.html

http://www.autopartswarehouse.com/sku/Land_Rover/LR2/Hella/Headlight_Bulb/2008/H57H83074001.html

[Laconian]

The more expensive one's physical dimensions are different; it is longer than the others. Does your car have a cluster of HIDs? My car has a projector HID for the primary headlights and incandescent high beams.

[Rupert]

I'm not an HID guy, so I'm not sure, but the expensive one looks like it has the ballast or whatever it's called integrated with the bulb. I would think you wouldn't need that, because the ballast thingies should be part of the car somewhere else. The other two are two different types of plugs, and are just the bulb. One looks like a 9000-series bulb and the other looks like an H-series.

None of them look like they would fit the same thing. I think I would get them from somewhere else that isn't so vague.

[Rupert]

Wow. I just glanced around the 'nets, and I still don't even know what kind of bulb the LR2 takes. All the sites that let you spec the car offer five or more bulb types for the headlights, some of them HID, some of them halogen, and none of them the same. 0_o

Good luck, Dan!

[TurboDan]

The more expensive one's physical dimensions are different; it is longer than the others. Does your car have a cluster of HIDs? My car has a projector HID for the primary headlights and incandescent high beams.

Same here. Low beams are HIDs, high beams are regular halogens/incandescents.

[TurboDan]

Wow. I just glanced around the 'nets, and I still don't even know what kind of bulb the LR2 takes. All the sites that let you spec the car offer five or more bulb types for the headlights, some of them HID, some of them halogen, and none of them the same. 0_o

Good luck, Dan!

LOL. Leave it to the British. Hope they don't blow out for a while!

[Rupert]

I think I would ask the dealership, personally. Each type of bulb has a designation number, like 9006, or H2. If you figure out what kind you need, you can skip the B.S. and get the right kind of bulb. Don't fall for gimmicks.

[Byteme]

I think I would ask the dealership, personally. Each type of bulb has a designation number, like 9006, or H2. If you figure out what kind you need, you can skip the B.S. and get the right kind of bulb. Don't fall for gimmicks.

Bulbs are not listed in the owner's manual?

[Rupert]

I don't think either of mine list the bulbs, but I'm note sure.

[93JC]

Sometimes cars come with a separate lighting manual that lists the bulbs. My old Spirit for example had a generic Chrysler lighting manual (and a separate radio manual) that listed all of the bulbs for every Chrysler product made at the time (save perhaps the Chrysler TC by Maserati).

[Northlands]

Bulb burned out. $18 later, I have two new boring, but operational lights. I'm officially opting out of the "cool light bulb " club now. 

[Galaxy]

The German magazine Auto Motor und Sport did a test of H4 bulbs. Of course your actual performance depends on your reflector, however they stated that a good bulb will always get the maximum out of what the reflector will allow, and a poor bulb will always be bad no matter how good the reflector is. They used a Ford Fiesta for the test.



The difference between an excellent and a poor bulb:


Bosch Plus 90



Elektronicx Superwhite 4000K

[Rupert]

Can you translate the header on that table? Danke!

[Galaxy]

Can you translate the header on that table? Danke!

Leistung is the power consumption in W.

Lichtstrom is the luminous power of the bulb itself in Lumen.

Maximale Helligkeit is the near area brightness in Lux.

Messwert 75R, 50R, 50L gives the brightness in Lux 75 meters away to the right, 50m to the right , and 50m on the left.

Mittelwert is the average of the previous three with 75R being multiplied by 2.

Blendung is how much light  oncoming drivers are are subjected to.

[S204STi]

With the drive to Cheyoming occurring 100% at night, I'm finding that even the 65watt H7s and 100watt fogs aren't quite hacking it anymore for me.  Going to go with an H7-rebased 4300k xenon kit.  Yeah I know, hypocrite.  I've seen how WRX optics work with these, which is to say quite well.  If I need to I can get more intensive with a full-retrofit, but I'm going to give this kit a shot and see how it goes. If I need to, I can follow up with OE projectors and retrofit them into the stock housings without too much effort.

FWIW I bought this one:  http://www.theretrofitsource.com/product_info.php?products_id=3893

I'm really impressed with the quality of the components.  Need to take time Sunday afternoon to actually do the install; either than or next Tuesday.  Today I just did some prep work in terms of clarifying the clear outer lamp housings which were starting to haze and yellow after 4.5 years in the sun.  Plastic does that.  Some polish and sealer and they're looking pretty clear again, other than pitting from years of winter driving.  Down the road I may wet-sand them and seal them again.  I'll take before/after pics so you guys can see at least the lens patterns and whatnot.

[S204STi]

Well, no before pics forthcoming, but I'll post some after pics.  I couldn't (and still can't) find my camera.  But the install took about 2.5hrs altogether.  Doing an actual retrofit will likely be more of a day-long operation since I need to remove the front bumper cover, both lamps, disassemble the lamps, etc.  That'll be later in the year I think with Acura TSX projectors. (s2k projectors are slightly better, but very hard to find).

Next up will be the fogs, since they come from the factory with projector fogs, with 3000k (very yellow) HIDs.  I may retrofit those from the get-go with new guts since the factory design runs hot enough to ruin 100watt H1 halogens in apparently 20 hours or less of use, no kidding.

[Gotta-Qik-C7]

With the drive to Cheyoming occurring 100% at night, I'm finding that even the 65watt H7s and 100watt fogs aren't quite hacking it anymore for me.  Going to go with an H7-rebased 4300k xenon kit.  Yeah I know, hypocrite.  I've seen how WRX optics work with these, which is to say quite well.  If I need to I can get more intensive with a full-retrofit, but I'm going to give this kit a shot and see how it goes. If I need to, I can follow up with OE projectors and retrofit them into the stock housings without too much effort.

[S204STi]

Fuck you.

(Hey, at least I have projectors to begin with!)

Overall impressed with the results.  Needs retrofitted projectors to make the most of the roadside visibility capabilities of Xenon, but downrange visibility is notably improved.  Now it's time to see how it does in the rain/fog.

[Gotta-Qik-C7]

ME TOO!