Full Pic Added: A Very Different Upscale 2013 Ford Fusion

[SVT666]

I think we?ve been here many times ? gas turbo motors aren?t more efficient. Mag racing EPA figures doesn?t cut it ? and again also discussed countless times, that the test exists to be gamed. The Sonata is but one of many examples of gas turbo motors not outperforming their N/A competition in either efficiency or performance.

As to the Fusion, meh, the judgment stands. Ford is taking too many risks on styling and it?s not boding well ? the new Fusion is bound to go the way of the new Focus. The reliance on turbo motors ad naseum is also not a good idea ? enter the disastrous Ecoboost Explorer.

And 565 is 100% right about the Camaro. It is a well-executed (er, best executed) car for the segment and otherwise a smash success. There is no counter argument here, unless of course you just hate the Camaro and suffering from PTSD. Chevy played it right ? it saved the risky styling for when it counts (Camaro) and went more mainstream when it counts less (Impala, Malibu, Cruze).

Ford is now only reaping Mulally?s leadership efforts in full force, and based on new and recent efforts, it?s showing that Ford needs a tried-n-true product guy at the helm, or at least in charge of product development. Mullay?s a business/sales guy, and they tend to make the worst long term CEOs/business leaders for retail product companies, when left unchecked.

You really don't know shit. And I say that in the nicest possible way.

New Focus is a hit.  New Explorer is a hit.  EcoBoost F-150 is a hit.  Troll.  I won't even comment on the Camaro because you haven't driven it and everyone who has disagrees with you.  Ford is kicking ass right now with the exception of the Flex.  Personally, I don't like much of the new Ford lineup but I can't deny their success.

[Vinsanity]

As to the Fusion, meh, the judgment stands. Ford is taking too many risks on styling and it’s not boding well – the new Fusion is bound to go the way of the new Focus. The reliance on turbo motors ad naseum is also not a good idea – enter the disastrous Ecoboost Explorer.

And 565 is 100% right about the Camaro. It is a well-executed (er, best executed) car for the segment and otherwise a smash success. There is no counter argument here, unless of course you just hate the Camaro and suffering from PTSD. Chevy played it right – it saved the risky styling for when it counts (Camaro) and went more mainstream when it counts less (Impala, Malibu, Cruze).

Huh? Even if the new Fusion turns out to be a piece of crap, at least it will be an attractive piece of crap. The new Malibu looks nice, but the Fusion's styling will catch a lot of eyes from people who need a practical sedan, but want something that looks fresh. The Cruze seems like a nice car, but styling isn't its strong suit, IMO. And I'm going to pretend that you didn't introduce the Impala into the discussion.

As for the Camaro, as much as I love that car, it IS in fact a compromised design. Its underpinnings were taken from a full-size sedan, for crying out loud.

[2o6]

The Ford fan boyism on this site is overwhelming.  Everyone is exclaiming how amazing this "new" Fusion is, when it's just a refreshed MK4 Mondeo.

No, it's not. No panels are shared between the two. The new car is also bigger than the old one. Stylisitcally, it's close to the Mondeo, but that's about it.

And I've got nothing against Ford selling a world car, it's just that they didn't execute the Focus very well.

Drive one then say that.

And the Ford circle jerk continues.  Instead of me having to justify why I don't go gah gah over these new under engineered, over styled Fords,  why don't you all tell me why you like them so much.

I suspect a lot of it (nearly all of it) has to do with how they look.  Everyone on this board talks about how utterly awful the 2012 Civic is.  What they don't realize is that the Ford Focus and Civic pretty much go back and forth in terms of comparison tests, with the Ford winning some and the Civic others.

http://www.motortrend.com/roadtests/sedans/1107_best_selling_compact_sedan_comparison/viewall.html

I think this statement below from the review sums up pretty much everything about the new Fords.

"The Ford's polarizing style won back a few fans, like Kiino, who lauded the in-your-face design and Vader-esque front end, but also decried the interior, which ranks dimensionally smallest. "It feels tight to me-not sure the packaging is that stellar," he opined. "A gimmicky car, at least in terms of design."

You could apply this statement to the Ford Taurus, Ford Explorer and probably this new Fusion considering how sloped that rear roof line is.  I think Ford learned this lesson from Chevy's success with the Camaro.  Consumers care about styling more than they care about usable space and sensible packaging.  It's a good way to generate sales upfront.  It's seriously hypocritical when Ford fan boys rip on the style over function of the Camaro when it has become Ford's mission objective for all their mainstream cars (high belt line, small windows, small interior space).

Why do you use Motortrend, a magazine who is notorious for schizophrenic reviews? They reviewed a 2.0T Explorer, and slammed it for having quality issues, when it was a pre-production mule. They did a comparo and named the CX9 the best CUV, but only talked about driving dynamics.


Besides, although the Focus is smaller inside than some of it's competitors, it's not as small as you make it to be. It also picks up in other areas (interior quality, and design as well as driving dynamics) where other competitors fall off.

As to the Fusion, meh, the judgment stands. Ford is taking too many risks on styling and it?s not boding well ? the new Fusion is bound to go the way of the new Focus.

How can you say this when literally not a single member of the boards has been inside or driven the car?

[2o6]

Huh? Even if the new Fusion turns out to be a piece of crap, at least it will be an attractive piece of crap. The new Malibu looks nice, but the Fusion's styling will catch a lot of eyes from people who need a practical sedan, but want something that looks fresh. The Cruze seems like a nice car, but styling isn't its strong suit, IMO. And I'm going to pretend that you didn't introduce the Impala into the discussion.

As for the Camaro, as much as I love that car, it IS in fact a compromised design. Its underpinnings were taken from a full-size sedan, for crying out loud.

Remember, we're talking to someone who thinks this is the bees knees in regards to styling and performance.

[GoCougs]

Huh? Even if the new Fusion turns out to be a piece of crap, at least it will be an attractive piece of crap. The new Malibu looks nice, but the Fusion's styling will catch a lot of eyes from people who need a practical sedan, but want something that looks fresh. The Cruze seems like a nice car, but styling isn't its strong suit, IMO. And I'm going to pretend that you didn't introduce the Impala into the discussion.

As for the Camaro, as much as I love that car, it IS in fact a compromised design. Its underpinnings were taken from a full-size sedan, for crying out loud.

It doesn't really look attractive IMO. Too much hanging below the belt line in Taurus-like fashion, especially the front end, and small looking wheels/tires. Also, the "4-door coupe" fad has passed for the most part - that is so 2008. The Sonata already milked this I think. Ford.com home screen:



Also look at the interior - the disastrous MyTouch and some sort of MMI interface, which has also not been received well in other vehicles (admittedly that may be an upscale option though).





Of course the Camaro is a compromised design, and lo and behold, it's a runaway success and best seller in class. But that's what that highly unique class needs - daring and risk. To compete with Camries and Accords? Nah, not so much. Risk taking has its advantages, but it also has its limits.

[2o6]

By the same token, the Malibu looks pretty bad in comparison to the Fusion, or even the old Malibu.




The design of the Fusion is not risky in the slightest. Looks like the old Mondeo but updated.

[68_427]

Remember, we're talking to someone who thinks this is the bees knees in regards to styling and performance.

I honestly like that more than the Fusion.  In regards to styling.

[GoCougs]

Remember, we're talking to someone who thinks this is the bees knees in regards to styling and performance.

Ha, ha. There is irony in your ignorance. Do you recognize that at least?

[2o6]

I honestly like that more than the Fusion.  In regards to styling.

It looks pretty boring, and the proportions are whack. Stance is fairly tippy, and the profile is pretty boring.



It looks decent enough, and in person it's OK. The Camry isn't an ugly car, but there's nothing about it that makes anyone smile.

Ha, ha. There is irony in your ignorance. Do you recognize that at least?

You really think the Camry is better looking?

[SVT666]

It doesn't really look attractive IMO. Too much hanging below the belt line in Taurus-like fashion, especially the front end, and small looking wheels/tires. Also, the "4-door coupe" fad has passed for the most part - that is so 2008. The Sonata already milked this I think. Ford.com home screen:


Also look at the interior - the disastrous MyTouch and some sort of MMI interface, which has also not been received well in other vehicles (admittedly that may be an upscale option though).


Of course the Camaro is a compromised design, and lo and behold, it's a runaway success and best seller in class. But that's what that highly unique class needs - daring and risk. To compete with Camries and Accords? Nah, not so much. Risk taking has its advantages, but it also has its limits.

You should stop typing because you're doing nothing but make yourself look stupid.

[68_427]

Ill agree the Camry is boring, but I think the fusion is ugly.

[FoMoJo]

Ill agree the Camry is boring, but I think the fusion is ugly.

In what respect?  I'm curious because it has found favour with those who judge the industry.

[Raza]

Ill agree the Camry is boring, but I think the fusion is ugly.

The current Fusion?  It looks so good!

[ifcar]

Drive one then say that.

Ford didn't execute the new Focus very well. (Drove two.)

Interior space and user-friendliness and the automatic transmission are at the bottom of the class, and it's expensive. It's neither consistently competent nor outstanding at a particular niche.

[FoMoJo]

Up 'til now, I've found Fusion styling to be a little on the brash side but, as things go, they may have been making a statement..."look, I'm here".  The style has now matured into a look that says..."I'm grown up a bit now, and I'm looking sexy".

[68_427]

The current Fusion?  It looks so good!

No, the new one.  I like the current one as well.

[SVT666]

Those who have seen the 2013 Fusion in person say it's sexy as all hell.  It won the design award for gawd's sake.

[565]

Drive one then say that.

Why do you use Motortrend, a magazine who is notorious for schizophrenic reviews? They reviewed a 2.0T Explorer, and slammed it for having quality issues, when it was a pre-production mule.

I have driven a Focus.  One of the med students I did an away rotation with had one as a rental for an entire month.  Everyone involved with the dual clutch gearbox should be lined up against a wall and shot.  Actually I was eager to try it when he got it because I heard great things about how they drove.  The first thing he said to me as he handed me the keys was that he already started to hate the car after 1 week.

Also you have it wrong, the pre-production Explorer wasn't for the ecoboost, but rather the V6 model they tested before. 

http://www.motortrend.com/roadtests/suvs/1108_ford_explorer_ecoboost_test/

The ecoboost failed on sheer badness even without quality issues.   Also it's not like Motortrend could have gone out to buy a pre-production Explorer,  it's the one that Ford provided for them.  One expects automakers to put their best foot forward in a review, and Motortrend has to make do with what Ford sends them.

[SVT666]

I have driven a Focus.  One of the med students I did an away rotation with had one as a rental for an entire month.  Everyone involved with the dual clutch gearbox should be lined up against a wall and shot.  Actually I was eager to try it when he got it because I heard great things about how they drove.  The first thing he said to me as he handed me the keys was that he already started to hate the car after 1 week.

The transmission issues are all in the programming and Ford has installed/installing a new program on all new Focuses and anyone who has already bought one can go into any Ford dealer and they will provide the new programming free of charge.

Also you have it wrong, the pre-production Explorer wasn't for the ecoboost, but rather the V6 model they tested before.  

http://www.motortrend.com/roadtests/suvs/1108_ford_explorer_ecoboost_test/

The ecoboost failed on sheer badness even without quality issues.   Also it's not like Motortrend could have gone out to buy a pre-production Explorer,  it's the one that Ford provided for them.  One expects automakers to put their best foot forward in a review, and Motortrend has to make do with what Ford sends them.

Having driven a new Explorer, their complaints are almost completely unfounded.  It might not be as roomy as it should be considering the exterior dimensions, but it is a very good car.  I don't know why this guy has such a hate-on for it, but it is very good.  There's a reason it's the best selling car in it's class once again.  Remember that I hate the fact that it's a crossover, I don't like the styling, and I'm horrified at the sheer size of the thing compared to my Explorer.

[MexicoCityM3]

The wagon is gorgeous. The sedan looks very good, 100x better than the Jetta/Passat.

[GoCougs]

You really think the Camry is better looking?

Yes.

[SVT666]

Yes.

You're blind.

[SVT666]

Teuton has told me the Fusion is every bit as good looking in the metal as it is in pictures...and then some.  He's not exactly what I would call a Ford fanboi either.

[2o6]

Teuton has told me the Fusion is every bit as good looking in the metal as it is in pictures...and then some.  He's not exactly what I would call a Ford fanboi either.

Did he urge you to subsribe to MT?

[SVT666]

Did he urge you to subsribe to MT?

Never has.  Sounds like you're jealous though.

[CJ]

I got a quick tour of the MT El Segundo facilities last week.  It's just like any other office with regular people.  These people just happen to write for and edit one of the world's biggest car magazines.  It's not just MT that's based there, either.  It's Truck Trend, Hot Rod, Automotive.com, and one or two others.  Very cool place. 

[2o6]

Never has.  Sounds like you're jealous though.

Nah, I'm just funnin.

[hounddog]

That's true.  But the rear plastic on the Mustang still annoys me, especially in brighter colors where it's more evident. 

I feel the same way with the rear plastic on the Challenger.  Just looks like a hasitly applied Walmart Auto Parts accessory.

[S204STi]

I dig.

[Atomic]

one minute i think the 2013 fusion is hot, the next not. at times, it looks kinda boring depending on color, angle, pic, etc. this is one of those cars that i will reserve final judgement until i see one (or more) in person.

i think i am schizophrenic