Refreshed 2013 Mercedes-Benz E-Class Gets New Look, More Tech

[Colonel Cadillac]

Instead of buying an E500, a simple E220 CDI will do. You're limited to the same speeds as everyone else and an E500 won't get you faster to your destination than an E220 CDI.

It could be a matter of simple economics. If Europeans are paying roughly the same amount for an E220 CDI as we are for a loaded E550, then yeah it makes sense that there are a helluva lot more V8 E-class's here than there. For what it's worth, I don't see too many E550's these days (but a substantial number of 350's).

[Colonel Cadillac]

How much is the E220CDI that most livery/taxi drivers have?

[hotrodalex]

Yeah, I doubt that.

So why do they buy the 528, then?

A base 528 starts at $46k. A 550 starts at $62k. There are plenty of people out there that like BMWs and can afford a 528, but not the more expensive versions. (Again, by "afford" I mean both being physically able to buy it and also wanting to spend that much. My parents would cringe at the thought of a $60k car)

[cawimmer430]

People are realizing that bigger isn't always better, even if by the force of economic realities. In my opinion, Americans will eventually have to learn to curb their addiction to credit and buying things they can't afford. Will they still want a Mercedes or BMW? Of course! But then the lower-end luxury cars will become more attractive.

It will be interesting to see what the future holds in store and if the European premium marques will bring over some entry-level models.

I think that as long as they're well-equipped, the engine under the hood won't really matter to most people. Even an entry-level luxury car and engine have good performance, at least from our European point of view.

In limited capacities, lower end luxury cars were success stories here. The BMW 318i sold well when they offered it here. I sense these companies didn't offer these cars often because people preferred to spend more money on a bigger engine and more "stuff," but when interest rates rise eventually one wonders if this will be sustainable.

I think a modern-day 318i might not appeal to the traditional American BMW buyer who might have grown up with the '70s and '80s Cadillacs and their big engines and expects at least a 6-cylinder minimum. But the newer generation of young Americans, especially the guys who know better, might find an entry-level BMW 3er appealing. As the saying goes (at least from what I am reading on the net these days), "We don't need 200-hp to have fun!"

[cawimmer430]

It could be a matter of simple economics. If Europeans are paying roughly the same amount for an E220 CDI as we are for a loaded E550, then yeah it makes sense that there are a helluva lot more V8 E-class's here than there. For what it's worth, I don't see too many E550's these days (but a substantial number of 350's).

The financial aspect is definitely a factor, but not in the sense that most people going for an E220 CDI couldn't afford an E550 - they just want a nice luxury car with features of their choice but with great gas mileage. The trade-off between an E220 CDI and E500 is that an E500 will come equipped with more standard features than an E220 CDI. But when an E220 CDI is loaded up, the price can approach E500 base price+ territory.

Most people I know who own luxury cars with smaller engines generally explain that they went for the smaller engine because they saw no advantage to owning a bigger and more powerful model. The more powerful models might be quicker to 100 km/h but that's irrelevant to them. They're happy with the performance of the car they bought. Performance in this case means everyday driving and merging unto roads and fuel economy.

Also, most people who buy an E500 generally don't drive a lot, so they're not to worried about gas prices. Somebody who buys a diesel E-Class will usually (usually) do so because they're using the car for business and family which means they're driving a lot and want/need good gas mileage. But many people still buy a diesel E-Class (etc.) even though they don't drive a lot.

How much is the E220CDI that most livery/taxi drivers have?

A standard E-Class taxi is usually an E200 CDI. They're far more common than the E220 CDI, which already has 170-hp. The E200 CDI has the same engine as the E220 CDI, but it's tuned to produce 136-horsepower.


Here are the base prices for the civilian versions:

E200 CDI: 33,625 Euros base price (40,013 with 19% VAT)

E220 CDI: 36,025 Euros base price (42,869 with 19% VAT)


I couldn't find the specific taxi prices, but taxi drivers get a huge discount and great leasing deals. I found this though:

E 220 CDI ?Das Taxi? Taxi-Preis von 29.900 Euro

So a taxi driver can buy an E220 CDI Taxi-spec limousine for 29,900 (19% VAT included). Great deal.  

Taxis come well-equipped with anything from an A/T transmission to a sunroof, MB-Tex or optional leather etc.



Here's the E-Class price list. Download the PDF.

http://www.mercedes-benz.de/content/germany/mpc/mpc_germany_website/de/home_mpc/passengercars/home/new_cars/models/e-class/_w212/advice_sales/pricelist.html

[Laconian]

I'm pretty sure their priorities would be vastly different if the displacement, CO2, and fuel tax regimens were different.

[cawimmer430]

I'm pretty sure their priorities would be vastly different if the displacement, CO2, and fuel tax regimens were different.

Well those things have shaped our mindset. We're happy with our smaller engines. There is no written rule that states that a luxury car can't have a smaller, more efficient engine.

Besides, owning a car is expensive in Europe. ANY CAR. To own a luxury car is expensive in Europe, even an entry-level luxury car. If people were really worried about costs, they wouldn't buy a luxury car. But thankfully we can own luxury cars with good performance and acceptable running costs (E220 CDI vs E500 for example). At the end of the day most people are happy with their purchase and find the performance acceptable. Performance is also subjective. Our cars perform well to us, but Americans think 0-100 km/h in 7 seconds is slow, we don't.

Oh, check this out. Spotted today! This taxi driver has AMG rims on this E-Class! 






Part 1: http://www.carspin.net/forums/index.php?topic=27027.0

Part 2: http://www.carspin.net/forums/index.php?topic=27026.new#new

[hounddog]

Looks the same..twin foglamps still look stupid.

Are those twins, or are they infrared projector/receivers like BMW has? 

[Raza]

You're forgetting that Europeans also have a different view on luxury.

What is considered luxury here might not be considered luxury in the US. Most Europeans (emphasis on "MOST") tend to be conservative with their luxury purchase. Instead of buying an E500, a simple E220 CDI will do. You're limited to the same speeds as everyone else and an E500 won't get you faster to your destination than an E220 CDI. You're still driving a Mercedes but you're being more socially conscious and getting better fuel economy at the same time. Luxury to most people here is about being inconspicuous and also somewhat socially responsible. I actually know a few people, friend of my dad, who in the '70s and '80s drove the most powerful BMWs or Mercedes' models around - and now they're driving some diesel-powered 1-Series or C or E-Class (or even an A/B-Class) because they've come to a point where they ask themselves "What more do I need? / Do I really need more?"

Even my dad is reaching that point. He likes his E350 CGI but he "sort off regrets going for it when a B-Class offers virtually the same amount of interior space but is more fuel-efficient and easier to manage in the crowded city environment".

From what I gather, luxury in the US is about buying the biggest and the most powerful car possible, even if you don't need the performance, and showing it off to your neighbors. I'll buy an E63 AMG because I can, even if I only will drive from my home to the Golf club down the block. Correct me if I am wrong.

I think you're unconsciously making excuses for behavior that's dictated by government intervention and a lack of physical space.

[Raza]

Well those things have shaped our mindset. We're happy with our smaller engines. There is no written rule that states that a luxury car can't have a smaller, more efficient engine.

There is, actually.  A luxury is something beyond what is necessary. 

[850CSi]

Apparently that 4 banger is very impressive.

Apparently it sounds like a diesel at idle and lacks the same throttle response. Not to mention the inherent reliability issues.

It's an objectively good engine, just not the one I'd want.

[AltinD]

I think you're unconsciously making excuses for behavior that's dictated by government intervention and a lack of physical space.

Yet those same factors are the reasons they engineer the cars you like to own. Why don't you buy your own cars that are build with the prospect of ample physical place?

[cawimmer430]

I think you're unconsciously making excuses for behavior that's dictated by government intervention and a lack of physical space.

People are free to buy what they want here provided they can afford it. If you're not capable of financing and maintaining your dream car, then don't buy it. It's that simple. We all have dream cars and we most likely can't afford them anyway, taxes or no taxes.

Owning a more powerful car here simply means more taxation and more stops at the gas station. The people who buy something like an E500 here can clearly afford to pay these bills and it's not an issue. It's just something we put up with because life in Europe is expensive and the taxes are high. It's a fact. And most likely they don't drive huge distances so gas mileage isn't an issue.

People who buy an E220 CDI can most likely also afford an E500, they just don't want to pay the taxation or they don't care for the E500 and it's performance at all (and they want good fuel economy) and deem the E220 CDI as sufficient in terms of performance. There are many reasons.

Performance is subjective. To the average European an E220 CDI is a fast car and it's fuel efficient to. So why buy an E500?

Even if we didn't have these taxations in place, I wouldn't pick an E500 over an E220 CDI. What's the point of an E500 anyway? That you get to 60 mph in under 6 seconds and can brag about it on an Internet forum? You'll still have to stop more often for gas than in an E220 CDI and I find that annoying. I like low fuel consumption and maximum range in my cars - any car (except in a sports car of course).

[Raza]

I want to believe you, but I don't.

[93JC]

Of course not. One need only look at the car-buying behaviour of recent European ?migr?s. They don't buy "the more fuel-efficient" option. In my experience they're quick to buy a big, gas-guzzling SUV because for the first time in their lives they can.

[Laconian]

Yup... "The way things are" != the ideal.

You could say that people in rural India might find cars to be tremendously wasteful, and they are just happy with their scooters will still fit their entire families on them, and they don't cost them a month's paycheck to fill them up.

OK, that might be true for them. But make cars cheaper, lower the price of gas, and give the buyers more spending money, and the whole equation changes...

[Laconian]

Anyways, Christian, I'm not disagreeing with European buyer's priorities. I am just dubious about the provenance of those priorities.

[cawimmer430]

I want to believe you, but I don't.

You sound like Scully!

[cawimmer430]

Of course not. One need only look at the car-buying behaviour of recent European ?migr?s. They don't buy "the more fuel-efficient" option. In my experience they're quick to buy a big, gas-guzzling SUV because for the first time in their lives they can.

Do they even have a choice in America?

The only economical SUVs in America that I can think of are the Lexus RX450h, MB ML350 Bluetec, MB GL350 Bluetec, BMW X5 3.0d and probably a handful more. I'm sure that when someone who lives in Europe moves to America, they want to try a gas guzzler, especially when gas is cheap. Is it a sensible choice? No, especially if they're not using say their pickup for work-related reasons.

Other people I know return from an American vacation and bemoan the lack of choice in your market regarding efficient cars (like we have in Europe).

[cawimmer430]

Anyways, Christian, I'm not disagreeing with European buyer's priorities. I am just dubious about the provenance of those priorities.

It's all a question of finances.

The people who own super luxury cars here can afford it. Money isn't an issue. If you can't afford such cars, don't buy them.

Other people, who could afford such cars, have different priorities (fuel economy etc.) and therefor buy something else. My dad could have easily bought an E500 or an E63 AMG. The taxation that comes with these cars is totally irrelevant to him (it's irrelevant to him on his current E350 CGI!!!). He just didn't want an E500+ when an E350 CGI offers better gas mileage. Who cares about 0-100 km/h? An E350 CGI is a quick car and it's a premium car. And yet, he still tells me that he wouldn't have minded an E220 CDI (or a B-Class!).

You'd be surprised as to how many people in top positions own a sensible luxury car here. Some big shot manager of some firm drives a normal Audi A4 Avant TDI Quattro for example.

[Hachee]

Of course not. One need only look at the car-buying behaviour of recent European ?migr?s. They don't buy "the more fuel-efficient" option. In my experience they're quick to buy a big, gas-guzzling SUV because for the first time in their lives they can.

Bingo.  We all, meaning the whole fucking world, like the same shit.  As soon as anyone can buy -because they can afford it and it's available - fancy stuff, they DO.  Look at any nation in the world.  People are the same all over the world.

The only difference in Europe, and perhaps some other places, is that the taxation and fuel prices are just so high that they just don't want to go for the E550s, etc.  I don't blame them.  Look at the sales of E550s vs E350s in the US.  I don't know, but I'm guessing it's 10 to 1, in favor of the E350.

And people in Europe are just as, if not more, image concious as those in the US.  They want the Benz, but they prefer smaller ones because of your cities, and smaller engines because of taxes and fuel prices.  People are more willing to spend the money on the car, but they balk at running costs.  I've got an X5 diesel.  It was no cheaper than the 35i, and fuel is usually more expensive, but I simply wanted to USE less fuel each year. 

And Wimmer, as for people like your dad and his friends saying, "Well, I don't need the big car or big engine any more, the smaller ones are just fine" - well, that's called ageing.   I see it with my dad and his group of friends.  A few years ago they'd be buying 7 Series, and then they're in their 70s and even 80s, and now a lot of them are totally happy with Lexus E350s and Hyundais. 

[TurboDan]

But how's all that taxation working out? Seems to me that the middle class gets punished with outrageously high fuel taxes (and even dumber... engine displacement sales taxes) in Europe yet European countries' financial houses are in arguably less order than the U.S.

Now, personally, I wouldn't buy the E550 over the E350. But the fact that government actively "punishes" people as part of some kind of enviro-lunacy social statement is mind blowing, to say the least – especially when all of the tax money collected seems to be flushed down the toilet. Believe me, the same type of shit is starting to happen here at the hands of Obama's ultra-left-wing cabinet appointees, but at least people are in an uproar about it.

It's hard to believe that the people of the continent that ruled the world for so many centuries just roll over and take it from a bunch of whimpy politicians who want to control every aspect of their existence through gouging taxation. "Thank you sir, may I have another?"

[Vinsanity]

It's hard to believe that the people of the continent that ruled the world for so many centuries just roll over and take it from a bunch of whimpy politicians who want to control every aspect of their existence through gouging taxation. "Thank you sir, may I have another?"

OTOH, Europeans have a deeper history of living in a feudal society under lords and monarchs and shit, who tell their 99%er subjects how to live their lives.

[Laconian]

Their roads are 100x better than ours, thanks to those taxes, though.

Except in Belgium, I hear those roads look like Edward James Olmos' face.

[Xer0]

It's hard to believe that the people of the continent that ruled the world for so many centuries just roll over and take it from a bunch of whimpy politicians who want to control every aspect of their existence through gouging taxation. "Thank you sir, may I have another?"

I don?t think it?s that unbelievable.  Like Vinsanity mentioned, you have a history of people being ruled by a select few (monarch, bishop, priest, etc) and never really questioning it.  The government is just an extension of that.  Looking at even more modern history, you have a European people ravaged by two industrial wars and they probably welcome their governments? attempts at peace and order.  Honestly, Europeans probably more value peace/order than they do freedom.

European-like choices will be coming more readily to the states as owning a car here becomes European expensive.  Gas is going up, the dollar is going down, and people seemingly have less money than they used to.  All of these things will force people into an E220 rather than the E350/550.  And as much as Wimmer likes to think we have a choice, the government does make it more and more narrow.  The more expensive they make owning a car, the less of a choice you have.  But it seems that a lot of Europeans are happy with the trade off that the higher prices give them.  But, to say that people don?t buy a bigger engine in their car because they don?t need one is disingenuous.  People will usually buy the largest/biggest/badest thing they can afford, and Europeans are no different.  The difference is that the largest/biggest/badest thing they can afford happens to be a lot smaller than the things here.  Besides, if Europeans really were the sensible, buy what they need types, luxury cars wouldn?t exist in the first place since they are about excess in the first place.  The fact that Mercedes has been able to find success selling a down market luxury is proof positive that people value opulence and will buy as much of it as they can afford.

[TurboDan]

But it seems that a lot of Europeans are happy with the trade off that the higher prices give them. 

Which are...?

Last I checked, Europe wasn't exactly financially stable despite the outrgaeous tax burdens. What good has it done? Seems the gas taxes, VAT, and everything else hasn't helped to delay austerity measures that are knocking the continent over on its head in terms of the reality that, as Regan said, "eventually, you run out of other people's money."

The scary thing is that half of this country wants to force us into the same boat. Sorry, but $7 gas will never do anything to help our economy. We're 300 million people stretched between two oceans – not tens of millions who all live in a few cities. Of course, NYC liberals think everyone should just take dirty subways everywhere like they do. Ugh.

[cawimmer430]

Well these arguments will always go in circles. 

[AltinD]

Stupid rants ... Europe has E200, USA has ES300

[Xer0]

Which are...?

A more socialized healthcare, better roads, more environmentally conscious cars, etc.  These are all things that Europeans consider a ?fair? trade off to their tax burden. 

Last I checked, Europe wasn't exactly financially stable despite the outrgaeous tax burdens. What good has it done? Seems the gas taxes, VAT, and everything else hasn't helped to delay austerity measures that are knocking the continent over on its head in terms of the reality that, as Regan said, "eventually, you run out of other people's money."

The scary thing is that half of this country wants to force us into the same boat. Sorry, but $7 gas will never do anything to help our economy. We're 300 million people stretched between two oceans ? not tens of millions who all live in a few cities. Of course, NYC liberals think everyone should just take dirty subways everywhere like they do. Ugh.

I don?t disagree with you.  But at the end of the day, its up to the people to elect better representatives (on both sides) or else we?re going to be in the same mess.  Although, I doubt the American people will be near as passive as the Europeans are.

[Laconian]

O_o I think Americans are way more passive. We're fucking coasting on our predecessors' greatness, bro. As a country, we haven't the stomach to confront and discuss the hard issues in an intellectually honest way.