Best-selling cars of June 2012

[2o6]

I dunno. Around here, lots of people like having a small SUV that's actually capable of towing a boat up a slipper and steep ramp, riding on the beach, etc. Will these people buy the new model? Will males buy the much-more-feminine looking new Escape?

LR is in a transition period right now. They want Range Rover to be its own premium brand, and Land Rover to go somewhat downmarket and be more offroad-oriented. I suspect the next Freelander (LR2) will remain in the U.S. market, but as a more refined option rather than the entry level Defender, which will be slated to compete against the Wrangler.

The Escape is as good or bad as other CUV's when it comes to doing those things. Commenting on the "masculinity" of the design is also stupid (the original was never really "masculine" and the new one looks really sharp in person). The Escape is the same thing it has always been....a FWD, car-based CUV.

[TurboDan]

The Escape is as good or bad as other CUV's when it comes to doing those things. Commenting on the "masculinity" of the design is also stupid (the original was never really "masculine" and the new one looks really sharp in person). The Escape is the same thing it has always been....a FWD, car-based CUV.

Huh? Nobody had ever heard of a "CUV" when the Escape was introduced. It was a small SUV. And I never said the original was particularly masculine or feminine, it was neutral. The new one seems very feminine in comparison, however.

[68_427]

Volt outsold the Leaf 3:1.  5 months in a row the Volt wins.

[2o6]

Huh? Nobody had ever heard of a "CUV" when the Escape was introduced. It was a small SUV. And I never said the original was particularly masculine or feminine, it was neutral. The new one seems very feminine in comparison, however.

Rav4, CRV, Outlander (shortly later), Highlander, Pilot (shortly later), and a plethora of "Cute-utes" that came around that time.


The Escape was as "useless" as them.

[TurboDan]

Rav4, CRV, Outlander (shortly later), Highlander, Pilot (shortly later), and a plethora of "Cute-utes" that came around that time.


The Escape was as "useless" as them.

How is the Pilot a "cute ute?"

And again, nobody used the phrase "crossover" before like 2008.

[Northlands]

And no one is saying they're bad cars or that people shouldn't buy them.  Just that they're made for and marketed to people whose car decision making process is dictated far more by need than want.  Which is fine.  Just don't expect enthusiasts to like them. 

Oh I wouldn't.  I do respect them for what they are... but they don't keep me awake at night in anticipation of driving them. 

[2o6]

How is the Pilot a "cute ute?"

And again, nobody used the phrase "crossover" before like 2008.

The Pilot is a raised Accord, essentially.




It's also the reason why no one respects the Ridgeline (which is essentially the same; a FWD Crossover with a bed.)

[TurboDan]

It's also the reason why no one respects the Ridgeline (which is essentially the same; a FWD Crossover with a bed.)

Riiiiiight. 

[2o6]

Riiiiiight. 

What? It's a Pilot with a bed. It has the same useless "Real-time AWD" as other Honda models. It's unitbody, and when the rear wheels aren't on, it's usually in FWD mode. The engine is transverse mounted. It's easier to drive than a Full-size truck, but it loses almost all capability; fuel economy is about the same as most full-size pickups but it can't tow or haul like they can.

[Raza]

Oh I wouldn't.  I do respect them for what they are... but they don't keep me awake at night in anticipation of driving them.  

Yeah, they're basic and reliable transportation.  I understand why people buy them.  I just never would personally.  And their sales success is pure bell curve.  It's right in the fat part, so people who are in the fat part buy them in droves.  It's simple, really.  Why hate on them?  As enthusiasts, the Camry is the opposite of the things we value.  But that doesn't mean that people shouldn't buy them.  Most people aren't car enthusiasts and don't care about cars--and that's just fine. 

[2o6]

Yeah, they're basic and reliable transportation.  I understand why people buy them.  I just never would personally. 

I think they're more of a good idea than a midsized sedan. Compact CUV's often have legroom similar to them, but being basically a hatchback, they're more practical.

[Raza]

I think they're more of a good idea than a midsized sedan. Compact CUV's often have legroom similar to them, but being basically a hatchback, they're more practical.

Having just spent a lot of time in something the size of a Buick Enclave (it was a Buick Enclave), I beg to differ.  Practicality comes at the cost of the third row of seats and security of your cargo, and the second row was not exactly comfortable. 

[2o6]

Having just spent a lot of time in something the size of a Buick Enclave (it was a Buick Enclave), I beg to differ.  Practicality comes at the cost of the third row of seats and security of your cargo, and the second row was not exactly comfortable. 

The GM LAMBDA triplets aren't known for being all that space efficient, and the 2nd row is a complaint among that particular model line.

[TurboDan]

What? It's a Pilot with a bed. It has the same useless "Real-time AWD" as other Honda models. It's unitbody, and when the rear wheels aren't on, it's usually in FWD mode. The engine is transverse mounted. It's easier to drive than a Full-size truck, but it loses almost all capability; fuel economy is about the same as most full-size pickups but it can't tow or haul like they can.

They're perfectly capable in most off-road applications - I've seen them personally on soft sand and in the mud, and they run just as well as the Fords and Chevys. They can tow a 5,000 pound boat. They can haul shit. What more does one need to be "respected?" A truck more apt to have a Confederate flag draped over the rear cab window?

[2o6]

They're perfectly capable in most off-road applications - I've seen them personally on soft sand and in the mud, and they run just as well as the Fords and Chevys. They can tow a 5,000 pound boat. They can haul shit. What more does one need to be "respected?" A truck more apt to have a Confederate flag draped over the rear cab window?

It's as capable as pretty much every CUV out there.....



A Ram, Silverado, and F150 will out tow, out haul, and be better off road. For reference, a base 2WD 3.7L V6 F150 is rated to tow more than the Ridgeline.....then when you get into the bigger engines, they can tow around double what the Ridgeline can.

[TurboDan]

A Ram, Silverado, and F150 will out tow, out haul, and be better off road. For reference, a base 2WD 3.7L V6 F150 is rated to tow more than the Ridgeline.....then when you get into the bigger engines, they can tow around double what the Ridgeline can.

Yeah, and U.S. Army deuce and a half is even better. Just because another vehicle exists that is more capable of doing something doesn't mean another shouldn't be respected? Why would one sacrifice ride quality and fit and finish to buy a vehicle capable of doing things they'll never do unless they have to? Why wouldn't someone "respect" a Ridgeline? Perhaps because they have some kind of hillbilly-ish romanticism towards domestic pickups combined with little man syndrome, but I digress...

The Ridgeline is perfectly capable in 90% of offroad situations, including beach/soft sand driving, green lanes and a reasonable level of mud situations. And its fit and finish, driveability and overall quality is head over heels better than most other pickups.

[2o6]

Because it sacrifices most things pickups do well, but doesn't even have that many benefits. Those large trucks are actually very good on road. The Ridgeline is a little better on road, but for the most part the trade offs are quite large.



For example, Fuel economy is around the same as the big guys, but it doesn't really have the capability of them.

[GoCougs]

It's a mediocre car that does everything adequately, but nothing excellently.

The point being that the allegation that the Camry is a best-seller in part because wives scream at their husbands is just crazy.

On a midsize sedan, the only type of space that counts is legroom. The front seats on the A4 are just fine for adults, and the rear seats are just fine for children or a car seat. Actually, as long as you're not obese, the rear seats are just fine for an adult as well. Trunk space is average. If you need a significant amount of additional space, the Camry isn't going to help you. You need and SUV or minivan.

Also, FWIW, I see the ever-increasing proportions of midsize cars as just as much of a compromise when it comes to pulling into parking spaces, maneuvers on the highway and a number of other situations. Again, why does a midsize car have to be so large? Is the few extra inches of space really usable space, or is it just superfluous excess that translates into a car that is unnecessarily large?

Counts to you maybe but you're in the minority obviously; the market wants more interior space, and automakers are doing that WITHOUT making the cars bigger. The Camry is the same length as the G sedan for example. 

[GoCougs]

When will you ever understand that performance is more than straight line performance? 

Performance is what I want it to be.

[2o6]

Performance is what I want it to be.

If that is the case, you can't argue what performance is to someone else.



My Yaris is a better performer than your G37 because it gets vastly better fuel economy. (See how dumb that sounds?)

[GoCougs]

If that is the case, you can't argue what performance is to someone else.



My Yaris is a better performer than your G37 because it gets vastly better fuel economy. (See how dumb that sounds?)

Do ever feel awkward engaging? (Enter also the lecture on the Pilot/Ridgeline.)

[2o6]

Do ever feel awkward engaging? (Enter, the lecture on the Pilot/Ridgeline.)

Do you ever really read your posts and ask why do you ever engage? (See the G vs 328i thread)

[Madman]

The point being that the allegation that the Camry is a best-seller in part because wives scream at their husbands is just crazy.

Not as crazy as you would think.

There's a young lady at my work.  For a bit of background information, she's in her mid-20s, married with no kids yet.  A coupe of years ago, her car died.  (I can't remember what it was but it was something dreary and awful!)  Anyway, her husband is a real estate agent and was already shopping for a new SUV to carry clients.  He drove an E46 3 Series sedan and his plan was to simply give it to his wife.  The BMW was paid for and this seemed to make the most practical and financial sense.  However, there was just one little problem........she HATED the BMW!!!

She complained the seats were "too hard" and the car's handling was "too darty" (cue rolling eyes from me) and it just wasn't comfortable to drive.  She made it clear to her husband that she DIDN'T WANT the BMW!  Can you believe that?  How can anyone not want a BMW?  Especially one that was already paid for!

So, under much duress, this poor bastard was forced to sell his BMW.  What did the wife choose to replace it with, you ask.  A fecking Nissan Altima!  Yep, the Altima.   A car many critics regard as a second-rate alternative to a Camry and Accord won out over a 3 series.  Need I remind all of you the 3 Series is benchmark sedan in it's class?  It's the car all it's competitors aspire to be like.  Yet, she wanted an Altima instead.  When she told me this, something inside my head exploded.  I'm pretty sure it was the part of the brain that controls logic because this made absolutely no sense to me.

Never underestimate the power of a ditzy female to make men do some incredibly stupid things!

[GoCougs]

Actually, IMO the "logic" is the irony that girls tend to be more logical on automotive choices than men. For her, a new Altima is definitely a better choice than a used E46.

[Madman]

Actually, IMO the "logic" is the irony that girls tend to be more logical on automotive choices than men. For her, a new Altima is definitely a better choice than a used E46.

The Altima she bought was used.

[Lebowski]

When she told me this, something inside my head exploded.  I'm pretty sure it was the part of the brain that controls logic ...

This explains a lot.  I have long thought that the part of your brain that controls logic must have exploded at some point in your past.

[Atomic]

Old Escape owners will buy new Escapes or similar. The new Escape is a vastly better vehicle (or at least should be) than the old one which has roots from 2001. Liberty has that "SUV" look, but both it and Xterra are terrible on-road (which is honestly what most SUV buyers are looking for).

Besides, I think the Evoque has made sales of the LR2 fall in the toilet...

Think you are right. Change is not easy for loyalists, but those not willing to give the new model a try might also be ready to move up to something bigger, a bit sportier or more luxurious. If so inclined, I can see many graduating to an Explorer or another Ford product. No telling, but I am certain the new Escape will be a perennial best selling cute 'ute and even top selling all around vehicle to make the top ten (even top five!) routinely - monthly I bet.

Also, Mercury Mariner owners - and I know plenty - will likely be in the market soon - thinking most will likely gravitate towards the all new Escape or even going for a 2012. How do I know "many" Mariner drivers (chuckle)? ...because of a great (former) family owned Lincoln-Mercury dealership nearby that sold countless Mercury's - especially SUV's before becoming a Ford only store. Car and truck owners around here are fiercelyloyal to their dealerships and a lot do not look elsewhere. Things are changing (sadly, IMO) as the "ma and pa" stores are being driven out or bought out by mega dealers.

On a personal note, the family owned Volvo dealership I ordered from is stellar! The know their product. They only sell Volvo's and have two dealerships in NYS.

Another point re: increased Escape sales, I just saw this morning on a local weather channel great regional deals on 2012 Ford Escape leases - thinking the deal could be state, tri state or even national. Regardless of fleet sales or retail, FMC deserves its spot in the top 10  !

[ifcar]

Not as crazy as you would think.

There's a young lady at my work.  For a bit of background information, she's in her mid-20s, married with no kids yet.  A coupe of years ago, her car died.  (I can't remember what it was but it was something dreary and awful!)  Anyway, her husband is a real estate agent and was already shopping for a new SUV to carry clients.  He drove an E46 3 Series sedan and his plan was to simply give it to his wife.  The BMW was paid for and this seemed to make the most practical and financial sense.  However, there was just one little problem........she HATED the BMW!!!

She complained the seats were "too hard" and the car's handling was "too darty" (cue rolling eyes from me) and it just wasn't comfortable to drive.  She made it clear to her husband that she DIDN'T WANT the BMW!  Can you believe that?  How can anyone not want a BMW?  Especially one that was already paid for!

So, under much duress, this poor bastard was forced to sell his BMW.  What did the wife choose to replace it with, you ask.  A fecking Nissan Altima!  Yep, the Altima.   A car many critics regard as a second-rate alternative to a Camry and Accord won out over a 3 series.  Need I remind all of you the 3 Series is benchmark sedan in it's class?  It's the car all it's competitors aspire to be like.  Yet, she wanted an Altima instead.  When she told me this, something inside my head exploded.  I'm pretty sure it was the part of the brain that controls logic because this made absolutely no sense to me.

Never underestimate the power of a ditzy female to make men do some incredibly stupid things!

Isn't that outrageous that someone wouldn't want a car they don't like?

[Atomic]

Isn't that outrageous that someone wouldn't want a car they don't like?

Another plug for gay marriage: A two man household and cars they love  ! Some great benefit. Chuckle...

A long week, fellow 'spinners. Hot, tired and punchy. TGIF!

[sportyaccordy]

Yup, it's what the kids do to make themselves think they're cool; also, with 84.4% confidence of irony show me a Camry hater and I'll show you someone who owns a car that would get lunched in all performance metrics by a new(er) Camry (SE V6).

Once again, straight line performance is not the be all end all of driving enjoyment.

Why can't you buy a comparably-sized vehicle that has better overall driving dynamics, style, and cachet?

Maybe because some people just want a device to get them from point A to point B, and don't give a shit about anything else.

Its like asking why people don't buy Epaulet instead of Dockers. They don't give a shit, and are not at fault for doing so.