C7 Corvette

[GoCougs]

I didn't say that shorter gearing would make it necessarily trickier to drive, but that it would make it obnoxious.  Unlike a small 4-cylinder (S2000), winding a V8 out to 3000-3500 RPM between shifts in normal driving tends to attract attention, especially in something as boisterous as a GT350.  Not to mention you burn considerably more fuel (in theory, over 2X as much as an S2000 at the same RPM).  As it is geared today, shifting out of first at 2000 in a GT350 would have you traveling at 13-14 mph, which is about where you'd be at 2900 RPM in an S2000.  Both are reasonable shift points for their respective sized engines in normal driving in traffic.  Since it was brought up, a G37 would be at around 2500 RPM at that speed in 1st, which is, again, not unreasonable for a motor of that size and configuration.  That's about where I shifted my old V6 Mustang.  Nobody is going to glance over and say "look at the yahoo wringing his motor out to impress people" when you are in fact just tooling along with traffic.

What are we using to classify the gearing as "tall"?  MPH/RPM or redline limited max speed for the gear?

In terms of the former, the GT350 has the following:
1st gear:  6.7 mph/1000 rpm
2nd gear:  9.8 mph/1000 rpm
3rd gear:  13.6 mph/1000 rpm

That's about what a regular Mustang GT with 3.55 gears runs (slightly taller first and second, same for 3rd).  Shorter gearing in terms of mph/RPM than a Z/28.

The car probably could have gone with a slightly shorter final drive without pushing into the realm of obnoxiously short for street use, perhaps even as short as a G37 in terms of mph/RPM, but that still would have had it topping out at nearly 75 mph in 2nd gear, which sounds pretty tall.

^ Attract attention? I think you're over thinking it. The GT350 has tall gearing esp. for a non-VVL motor, and as a result it's relatively somewhat slow in the lower registers.

[CaminoRacer]

He's right about attracting attention. My shift point is 2700-3000 in normal driving. Above 3k and it gets loud and starts to really take off. Very aggressive for driving in any sort of traffic.

Who knows why they decided to go with taller gearing, but in everyday driving (and track/autox) I do prefer taller gears with my gobs of HP.

[GoCougs]

Uh, not "attracting attention" in a GT350 is a concern of Ford's? (NO.)

[SVT666]

Z06 got it's ass handed to it by the Viper ACR at Laguna Seca with Randy Pobst at the wheels.  The Z06 broke the production car record for cars under $1 Million, and then the Viper ACR went out and destroyed it by 3 seconds.  Since then Randy Pobst has broken that record by a further 2 seconds in the ACR which is the fastest ever by a production car, beating both the P1 and the 918.

[MrH]

Yeah, the ACR is the real deal.  The aero is on a totally different level than any other street car that's come before it.

[CaminoRacer]

"Street car"

[FlatBlackCaddy]

"Street car"

Viper ACR is a street car to me.

Don't belittle it's achievement just because you're too big of a pussy to daily one.

[Cookie Monster]

"Street car"

It passes emissions, safety and all other DOT regulations. It can be driven anywhere you can drive a Corolla. Why is it not a street car?

[12,000 RPM]

Passing DOT regulations doesn't mean a car is good for the street

[Cookie Monster]

Passing DOT regulations doesn't mean a car is good for the street

Well yeah, you sold your Z for a Civic because your Z was too much of a race car for the street. I can see why you wouldn't like the Viper.

[MrH]

Well yeah, you sold your Z for a Civic because your Z was too much of a race car for the street. I can see why you wouldn't like the Viper.

[SJ_GTI]

Well yeah, you sold your Z for a Civic because your Z was too much of a race car for the street. I can see why you wouldn't like the Viper.

[CaminoRacer]

It passes emissions, safety and all other DOT regulations. It can be driven anywhere you can drive a Corolla. Why is it not a street car?

It's pushing the limits. I mean, I'd still drive it, but most people never would.

[SVT666]

It's pushing the limits. I mean, I'd still drive it, but most people never would.

Most people would never DD a Miata either.

[CaminoRacer]

Most people would never DD a Miata either.

For completely different reasons though.

[Cookie Monster]

It's pushing the limits. I mean, I'd still drive it, but most people never would.

What are these arbitrary "limits"? Why would most people never drive it if they bought one?

The term "street car" seems pretty simple - if it can be bought at a dealership and driven anywhere any other car can, why is it not a street car?

(I'd also DD one if I could afford the gas mileage, maintenance and upkeep, but I'm guessing if I were in a position to DD a Viper I wouldn't care about those things).

[MX793]

For completely different reasons though.

Some of the reasons are the same...

[CaminoRacer]

Lol I'm not gonna argue a pretty obvious position - the ACR was not built for the street. It's a track car that meets DOT regs. If you disagree, that's cool.

[SVT666]

Lol I'm not gonna argue a pretty obvious position - the ACR was not built for the street. It's a track car that meets DOT regs. If you disagree, that's cool.

You're right, but it's still a street legal production car.

[SVT666]

[CaminoRacer]

You're right, but it's still a street legal production car.

This is also street legal.

[Eye of the Tiger]

thefuuuuuuuuk

[GoCougs]

Z06 got it's ass handed to it by the Viper ACR at Laguna Seca with Randy Pobst at the wheels.  The Z06 broke the production car record for cars under $1 Million, and then the Viper ACR went out and destroyed it by 3 seconds.  Since then Randy Pobst has broken that record by a further 2 seconds in the ACR which is the fastest ever by a production car, beating both the P1 and the 918.

It's a good vid. Note however how M/T absolutely hated the Viper as a car - the exhaust sound, the smell, the ergo, the seats - everything, which has been the Viper's Achilles heal since its inception - it's bad in ways that don't count and don't have to be. It's a shame really. The Viper could have been so much more and of course it should be noted the Viper ACR is a track car with plates and the Z06/Z07 is not. Either way, as long as the Corvette sticks with leaf springs it won't realize its full potential. Nonetheless, the Corvette is a far better car overall.

[SVT666]

This is also street legal.

That is not a production car. It doesn't have to meet crash regs, noise regs, emissions regs, or any other reg.

[SVT666]

It's a good vid. Note however how M/T absolutely hated the Viper as a car - the exhaust sound, the smell, the ergo, the seats - everything, which has been the Viper's Achilles heal since its inception - it's bad in ways that don't count and don't have to be. It's a shame really. The Viper could have been so much more and of course it should be noted the Viper ACR is a track car with plates and the Z06/Z07 is not. Either way, as long as the Corvette sticks with leaf springs it won't realize its full potential. Nonetheless, the Corvette is a far better car overall.

Neither of these cars are daily drivers, so I don't care which is the better overall car.  The Viper is an astounding track car.  It costs $130K and absolutely annihilates the 918 and P1.

[CaminoRacer]

I see lots of Z06s on the street. No Vipers.

[SVT666]

I see lots of Z06s on the street. No Vipers.

I see Vipers, Z06s, Ferraris, and McLarens too, but it doesn't mean they're being DD'd. 

[Gotta-Qik-C7]

Neither of these cars are daily drivers, so I don't care which is the better overall car.  The Viper is an astounding track car.  It costs $130K and absolutely annihilates the 918 and P1.

Go over to the Vette Forums. I've read post where Z06 owners say it's MORE livable as a DD than the base model. If you had to pick between the two as a DD I pretty sure GM would get your money (and you'd pocket about 30K) 9 times outta 10!

Well yeah, you sold your Z for a Civic because your Z was too much of a race car for the street. I can see why you wouldn't like the Viper.

Nonetheless, the Corvette is a far better car overall.

+1000 The same people on here defending the Viper (which is clearly a track special) are the same ones that SHIT on the Camaro (Vs. Stang) it for not being "Livable!"   

[SVT666]

Go over to the Vette Forums. I've read post where Z06 owners say it's MORE livable as a DD than the base model. If you had to pick between the two as a DD I pretty sure GM would get your money (and you'd pocket about 30K) 9 times outta 10!

You're right, but I wouldn't DD either of them.

+1000 The same people on here defending the Viper (which is clearly a track special) are the same ones that SHIT on the Camaro (Vs. Stang) it for not being "Livable!"   

Mustang/Camaro are a completely different class of car from the Vette/Viper and should be livable.

[Lebowski]

Neither of these cars are daily drivers, so I don't care which is the better overall car.  The Viper is an astounding track car.  It costs $130K and absolutely annihilates the 918 and P1.

Eh, I think a good number of people dd the z06.