Next Honda Ridgeline & Fit Based Urban SUV Crossover Destined for North America

[Soup DeVille]

I think bitching about the trunk in the bed is stupid anyways: as none of the competitor trucks have a trunk at all.

[Byteme]

I think the main advantage to the Ridgeline is supposed to be the driving dynamics, not the trunk. Honda clearly figured "people love cars that look like SUVs, so why not cars that look like pickups?" Especially considering that the Ridgeline's specs aren't that bad.

I'm thinking Honda thought people would buy it "BECAUSE IT"S A HONDA, SO IT"S GOT TO BE GOOD" (not shouting at you).  Regardless of their reasoning they pretty much missed the mark.

A lot of people buy cars like my sister did.  I asked her why she traded her Mustang for a civic.  her response:   "It's not fast or sporty, but it's reliable".

[Byteme]

I think bitching about the trunk in the bed is stupid anyways: as none of the competitor trucks have a trunk at all.

Which shows you how important that feature is to truck buyers in the first place.  The fact that Honda considered it a biggie for truck buyers might be evidence of how they didn 't really understand their market as well as they thought they did.     Wait a minute.  Didn't Dodge offer storage in the bed sides at one time?

Bitching?  No, just pointing out it wasn't as useful as it was made out to be.   You usually carry different things in a wagon than you would in a pickup.  Carry your emergency tools, jumper cables, fix a flat or whatever, in you station wagon you move your groceries or whatever to the side and get them out when you need them.  It's a different story in a Ridgeline if you have a bed full of garden mulch.

[ifcar]

I'm thinking Honda thought people would buy it "BECAUSE IT"S A HONDA, SO IT"S GOT TO BE GOOD" (not shouting at you).  Regardless of their reasoning they pretty much missed the mark.

A lot of people buy cars like my sister did.  I asked her why she traded her Mustang for a civic.  her response:   "It's not fast or sporty, but it's reliable".

Failure of a particular product doesn't necessarily equate to failure of an entire concept or market segment. That's General Motors thinking right there: "Well, we rolled out a flawed product and no one bought it. I guess no one wants anything like it!"

[FoMoJo]

Failure of a particular product doesn't necessarily equate to failure of an entire concept or market segment. That's General Motors thinking right there: "Well, we rolled out a flawed product and no one bought it. I guess no one wants anything like it!"

Ridgeline, Aztek...same thing.  Ungainly, pretentious. 

[ifcar]

Ridgeline, Aztek...same thing.  Ungainly, pretentious. 

And we know how the market rejected the midsize crossover!

[FoMoJo]

And we know how the market rejected the midsize crossover!

Only those seen as gimmicky and ungainly.  Did anyone ever use the 'tent'?

[Soup DeVille]

Which shows you how important that feature is to truck buyers in the first place.  The fact that Honda considered it a biggie for truck buyers might be evidence of how they didn 't really understand their market as well as they thought they did.     Wait a minute.  Didn't Dodge offer storage in the bed sides at one time?

Bitching?  No, just pointing out it wasn't as useful as it was made out to be.   You usually carry different things in a wagon than you would in a pickup.  Carry your emergency tools, jumper cables, fix a flat or whatever, in you station wagon you move your groceries or whatever to the side and get them out when you need them.  It's a different story in a Ridgeline if you have a bed full of garden mulch.

Ford and Dodge both offered built in boxes on the side at different times. My point is that although the box in the bed has drawbacks, it's still more than nothing, which is what most pickups offer in that way. 

[Byteme]

Failure of a particular product doesn't necessarily equate to failure of an entire concept or market segment. That's General Motors thinking right there: "Well, we rolled out a flawed product and no one bought it. I guess no one wants anything like it!"

I never said the entire segment wasn't wanted. I was specifically discussing the ridgeline. 

But since you brought it up let's discuss it.  Ranchero, El Camino; no longer made becasue demand wasn't there.  Chrysler Corp made a variation of the K car as a small ranchero like pickup.  Not made today because there is insufficent demand .  Ford, Toyota, Nissan, Chevy, all made small pickups, again not made today because of insufficient demand.   Mid size pickups?  Two or three survivors, none or which is selling like gang busters.    I think the majority of buyers are looking at pickups and thinking why buy a smaller one when I can get a full size one for about the same money or a few dollars more and have greater capability.  And don't rule out the image end of it either.  I think most buyers want a full size truck because it's a full size truck.  Trucks, like cars, are largely just simi-rational purchases.   People buy what they want or want to be seen in, not what they need or others think they need. 

[Byteme]

Ford and Dodge both offered built in boxes on the side at different times. My point is that although the box in the bed has drawbacks, it's still more than nothing, which is what most pickups offer in that way.

Right.  I'm just pointing out that it wasn't that useful.  In fact, I'd argue that it wasn't really well thought out.

[MrH]

Right.  I'm just pointing out that it wasn't that useful.  In fact, I'd argue that it wasn't really well thought out.

No one knows what you're arguing anymore.  You change your premise every post in this thread.

[Soup DeVille]

Right.  I'm just pointing out that it wasn't that useful.  In fact, I'd argue that it wasn't really well thought out.

It's useful, unless the bed is full, which it usually isn't. 

It would be dead space otherwise, so it's not like it takes anything away. 

[3.0L V6]

I like the idea of the Ridgeline, but the cost is a deterrent. A quick glance shows the Ridgeline starting at $35k (Cdn$), whereas a F-150 4X4 SuperCrew with the 5.0L V8 runs about the same. Sure, the F-150 will drink more gas, but relative to the payments not a lot more with much more capability (needed or unneeded).

If the Ridgeline was in the high-$20s, it would be a much more palatable option.

[Mustangfan2003]

I like the idea of the Ridgeline, but the cost is a deterrent. A quick glance shows the Ridgeline starting at $35k (Cdn$), whereas a F-150 4X4 SuperCrew with the 5.0L V8 runs about the same. Sure, the F-150 will drink more gas, but relative to the payments not a lot more with much more capability (needed or unneeded).

If the Ridgeline was in the high-$20s, it would be a much more palatable option.

Actually the Ridgeline is rated 15 city and 21 highway, pretty much the same as a V8 F150 and the V6 engines beat it. 

[Byteme]

No one knows what you're arguing anymore.  You change your premise every post in this thread.

Proof?

[MrH]

Proof?

All Cougs said was Honda built the truck people need, not what they want.  You then argued with yourself on all sorts of points, saying that the market is sending signals that the Ridgeline isn't what they want (clearly.  That's kind of the point Cougs was making to begin with...).  Then you talked about no one using a vehicle's max abilities, then you want on some tangent about how the trunk is a stupid idea.  I have a hard time following what point you're trying to make.

[Soup DeVille]

This obsessive idea that if you're not fully using your truck's payload and tow rating often enough that you're some sort of fool or poseur is laughable in a world of 600 HP 200 MPH sports cars.

Far, far many more trucks will occasionally serve as workhorses than sports cars will ever do anything resembling motorsports   

[giant_mtb]

Never seen a Ridgeline with a plow. But there're probably only like 12 Ridgelines in the county, so.

[2o6]

I've tooled around in a Ridgeline a bit, and IMO it's not dynamically more isolated or superior than a regular Full-sized truck.

[MrH]

This obsessive idea that if you're not fully using your truck's payload and tow rating often enough that you're some sort of fool or poseur is laughable in a world of 600 HP 200 MPH sports cars.

Far, far many more trucks will occasionally serve as workhorses than sports cars will ever do anything resembling motorsports   

No one is saying that though.  Cougs just said that they built the Ridgeline for what people actually need, not what they want, which I think is pretty true.  But since Cougs said it, this forum had a hissy fit

[Soup DeVille]

No one is saying that though.  Cougs just said that they built the Ridgeline for what people actually need, not what they want, which I think is pretty true.  But since Cougs said it, this forum had a hissy fit

Its a continual gripe, which I may have overstated slightly.

[ifcar]

I've tooled around in a Ridgeline a bit, and IMO it's not dynamically more isolated or superior than a regular Full-sized truck.

But it presumably is compared to 2006 full-size pickups. It just hasn't been updated in all these years. That's also a large part of the fuel economy problem, I'm sure.

[GoCougs]

So what?  The average car owner never sees the top speed of their car nor do they corner at the limitsthe car is capable of.  Does that mean they bought the wrong car?

The things that enable 120 mph+ top speed and reasonably good handling are byproducts of what benefit the driver (efficiency, performance, safety, etc.) with how the car is usually driven.

The things that enable a full-size truck's hauling, towing and off road capability are impediments to a driver (size, cost, decreased handling/braking/mpg, etc.) with how the truck is usually driven.

[GoCougs]

This obsessive idea that if you're not fully using your truck's payload and tow rating often enough that you're some sort of fool or poseur is laughable in a world of 600 HP 200 MPH sports cars.

Far, far many more trucks will occasionally serve as workhorses than sports cars will ever do anything resembling motorsports   

I don't think anyone's obsessive about it, but I do generally think that way, esp. considering most that buy (expensive) full-size trucks can't really afford them.

My favorite are "hard core" types that put a bunch of money into bigger wheels and suspension lifts yet the trucks will never seen any sort of off road action save for some snow.

[GoCougs]

I've tooled around in a Ridgeline a bit, and IMO it's not dynamically more isolated or superior than a regular Full-sized truck.

I couldn't agree more. Friend of mine has one, which we use here and there for mountain biking. I find it smoother and quieter than the average full-size truck, plus it's also easier to get into and out of (both people and stuff).

[2o6]

I couldn't agree more. Friend of mine has one, which we use here and there for mountain biking. I find it smoother and quieter than the average full-size truck, plus it's also easier to get into and out of (both people and stuff).

You mean disagree?


At least with the new crop of full-sizers, the Ridgeline's benefits IMO aren't all that big.

[Catman]

I have to agree with Cougs here.  The Ridgeline makes far more sense for the average buyer.  Perhaps it would have sold better if it looked nicer.

[3.0L V6]

I have to agree with Cougs here.  The Ridgeline makes far more sense for the average buyer.  Perhaps it would have sold better if it looked nicer.

I think the price is the deal-breaker. It isn't good looking, mind you, but when you can buy a fairly well equipped pickup truck for the price, it's a hard sell.

[Catman]

I think the price is the deal-breaker. It isn't good looking, mind you, but when you can buy a fairly well equipped pickup truck for the price, it's a hard sell.

No doubt. 

[Byteme]

All Cougs said was Honda built the truck people need, not what they want.  You then argued with yourself on all sorts of points, saying that the market is sending signals that the Ridgeline isn't what they want (clearly.  That's kind of the point Cougs was making to begin with...).  Then you talked about no one using a vehicle's max abilities, then you want on some tangent about how the trunk is a stupid idea.  I have a hard time following what point you're trying to make.

All of them.