Tesla

[Galaxy]

So, Tesla is building the next Gigafactory near Berlin apparently. It will be an eye opener for them compared to the build time they just had in China.

[MrH]

!!!

They don't have the demand at all.  They don't even have the demand for the factory in China.  Fremont still isn't hitting anywhere near the volume they claimed it would, they have inventory everywhere and are shutting lines down.

This is more just useless pumping of the stock.

[Soup DeVille]

So, Tesla is building the next Gigafactory near Berlin apparently. It will be an eye opener for them compared to they build time they just had in China.

They had issues in California too. But building in Germany is another level of regulations and union rules.

[GoCougs]

Theranos Cometh.

[AutobahnSHO]

Theranos Cometh.

Hahaha awesome!

[Morris Minor]

They had issues in California too. But building in Germany is another level of regulations and union rules.

Let's hope the project goes better than the new Brandenburg Airport.

[12,000 RPM]

!!!

They don't have the demand at all.  They don't even have the demand for the factory in China.  Fremont still isn't hitting anywhere near the volume they claimed it would, they have inventory everywhere and are shutting lines down.

This is more just useless pumping of the stock.

Where are you seeing this? I can't find any of these claims online.

[MrH]

The demand vs supply claims?

Look at their quarter over quarter claims of output.  They are consistently lowered every time.  They still haven't reached the daily output rate they were trying to reach years ago.

Look at year over year revenue.  Demand has totally catered in the US.  They continue to expand to additional markets as fast as they can in hopes of keeping the top line afloat.  There's a lot of analysis going on in China about the elasticity of electric car demand.  They are dramatically more expensive than everything else there.  Even something dramatic like a 20% reduction in cost doesn't come close to moving the needle enough on the demand side to justify a plant.

[Galaxy]

Let's hope the project goes better than the new Brandenburg Airport.

They are building right next to Brandenburg airport. 

[Submariner]

Theranos Cometh.

Yeah, but Tesla has a viable product line.  Theranos had...?

[Soup DeVille]

Yeah, but Tesla has a viable product line.  Theranos had...?

A viable product line as long as people were buying it.

[MrH]

Yeah, but Tesla has a viable product line.  Theranos had...?

Viable?

"Without any financing or VIE entities, Tesla would have lost $6.2 billion in cash since 2016.  Without using stock as comp that goes to $8.4 billion"

This thing is not remotely viable.

[CaminoRacer]

Viable?

"Without any financing or VIE entities, Tesla would have lost $6.2 billion in cash since 2016.  Without using stock as comp that goes to $8.4 billion"

This thing is not remotely viable.

I believe Sub's point is that the product is real and legit, vs. Theranos's false claims and lack of any substance. Tesla's financials don't mean that the cars aren't decent.

[GoCougs]

Yeah, but Tesla has a viable product line.  Theranos had...?

True, unlike Theraos, Tesla actually produces a thing that sells, but "viable" is exceedingly debatable, as virtually anyone can make a product that people will buy if profitability is not a concern (and there is no realistic path to profitability for Tesla).

The common thread between Theranos and Tesla is a sham happening in plain sight, driven by a maniacal, unaccountable, snake-oil salesman (er, person), who in some form or fashion is likely mentally ill.

[12,000 RPM]

The demand vs supply claims?

Look at their quarter over quarter claims of output.  They are consistently lowered every time.  They still haven't reached the daily output rate they were trying to reach years ago.

Look at year over year revenue.  Demand has totally catered in the US.  They continue to expand to additional markets as fast as they can in hopes of keeping the top line afloat.  There's a lot of analysis going on in China about the elasticity of electric car demand.  They are dramatically more expensive than everything else there.  Even something dramatic like a 20% reduction in cost doesn't come close to moving the needle enough on the demand side to justify a plant.

I'll have to take your word on output but as far as demand goes their US sales are up 22% through September

http://carsalesbase.com/us-car-sales-data/tesla/

And by expanding to other markets their top line probably will grow significantly. I can't speak to the credibility of these analysts but it looks like China demand is strong:

https://www.cnbc.com/2019/09/26/tesla-in-china-insurance-registration-data-shows-sales-surging.html

And we already know how the EU feels about EVs. I'd wager Germany and the Scandinavian countries will continue to spur real growth.

The real questions to me are when they will finally contribute something to the bottom line in a sustainable way, and what happens to them if EVs become viable for non-Dieselgate atoning incumbents to jump in the mix. But I think you are being a bit "Tesla bear Twitter troll" alarmist It's a tenuous situation but some of your info seems a little.... off.

[Galaxy]

There are certainly a lot of ? marks surrounding Tesla, and more will be added as the competition ramps up their electric game. They do deserve credit for many things though, they kick started the electric car market, and they keep improving customers cars after they have taken delivery. With regards to Infotainment Tesla keeps adding features, but beyond that they actually increase the performance of the car. The Model S recently got a software upgrade that pushed the 0-60 time under 3 seconds. How many other manufacturers improve cars after the customer has taken delivery? Beyond repairing defects zero.

[MrH]

I'll have to take your word on output but as far as demand goes their US sales are up 22% through September

http://carsalesbase.com/us-car-sales-data/tesla/

And by expanding to other markets their top line probably will grow significantly. I can't speak to the credibility of these analysts but it looks like China demand is strong:

https://www.cnbc.com/2019/09/26/tesla-in-china-insurance-registration-data-shows-sales-surging.html

And we already know how the EU feels about EVs. I'd wager Germany and the Scandinavian countries will continue to spur real growth.

The real questions to me are when they will finally contribute something to the bottom line in a sustainable way, and what happens to them if EVs become viable for non-Dieselgate atoning incumbents to jump in the mix. But I think you are being a bit "Tesla bear Twitter troll" alarmist It's a tenuous situation but some of your info seems a little.... off.

Volume is up, revenue is down.  They're slashing prices to move metal to try to cover their fixed costs.  The growth narrative is dead.  Nothing about my info is off.  This is all coming straight from their SEC filings.

All that article says is sales in China are up 175% for that quarter compared to the previous year.  They sold minuscule volume there the previous year.

[12,000 RPM]

Oof, just read about Musk's deposition about Solar City. The shorts were right about that one

[2o6]

Y'all see that Tesla Truck bullshit??????


I'm dead.

[GoCougs]

Y'all see that Tesla Truck bullshit??????


I'm dead.

TESLA ATV

[2o6]

It looks literally homemade. Like they took sheetmetal from Lowe's and made a car.

[Galaxy]

Y'all see that Tesla Truck bullshit??????


I'm dead.

Read your post and was thinking 'what ever Tesla showed, it cant't be that bad.' Looked up what it is. It is that bad. 

[GoCougs]

Fake audience was cringey.

Twitter has not been kind; not to the "truck" or the stunt.

Another example of Tesla walking into a pile PR backlash. I guess it could be some sort of troll too.

[Galaxy]

I can use one of my favorite GIFs twice a day, and I am actually a Tesla/SpaceX fan.

 

[2o6]

My actual reaction when I saw the pictures

https://youtu.be/ZJS9mEyIORA

[2o6]

Y'all...this is a JOKE.

That interior looks like actual granite and the whole thing looks like an actual prison.



There's no provisions for windshield wipers!!! That would be fine for a concept car, but Elon really is saying this is what the actual production model will look like!!!


That whole tailgate is illegal!! You can't have brake/signal/reverse lamps on a panel that moves without redundancies!!!


What about panel and bed flex!?? Even in old cars that have flat panels like the old Citroen HY vans or the VW thing, the panels have reliefs and grooves to add rigidity and strength!

Also it's weirdly small??? And what is that roofline??? It's nonsensical; it peaks in front of the driver's head! No one has any headroom! Including the driver!!


What is the POINT of this weird paranoid "bulletproof" shit??? Stop spending money on this crackpot bullshit!

[2o6]

Also the fact it was introduced into Mad Max music makes me realize that some of y'all Silicon Valley fucks need to Log off and interact with real people. Bastardizing pop culture references to design a car to your own personal whim is *fucking strange*.

[MrH]

Hahahaha I'm still laughing. "Where were the signs?!"

Somebody get r0tor's ass in here to defend this dumpster fire.

[Morris Minor]

It would have some merit if it had been penned by low-IQ eight-year-old.

[MrH]

Can we list out everything Tesla has promised, with no date yet, that has zero CapEx allotted to it?

- Tesla semi truck
- Model Y
- Cybertruck
- Roadster (with rocket boosters!)
- Solar tiles
- A plant in Germany


It's almost as if more and more needs to be shown to the public in hopes of collecting deposits and raising capital with no game plan on actually meeting these promises...