Tesla

[MX793]

At the end of the day, the mechanical release is present.  There is NO mechanical release on the rear doors of a Mod3.  Only way out if there's a power failure is to shatter windows and squeeze out or, if they cannot be extricated that way, cut/tear off the door.  That's a shitty design.

[12,000 RPM]

Actually I put my kid in the back of an RX8 with no exterior rear door handles

There is still a mechanical release in this and the Corvette. With the 3, AT BEST, first responders would have to break a window. I don't think the average American would fit through that.

[MX793]

I will also say that the Vette's door mechanism design isn't great if you need to extricated someone in a hurry (e.g. car is on fire or sinking in a pond) because the manual releases aren't intuitively placed.  But you can get the door open without the jaws of life, which is a step better than the complete lack of a manual override on the Mod3.

[Raza]

Is it really surprising a person who makes their money from the big 3 would trash Tesla (who is the biggest threat to them)

NothingBurgerCentral

Just like doctors would say their vaccinations are safe.

And the government would say their chemtrails aren't poisoning the people.

And Coca Cola would say they didn't deliberately make New Coke inferior to Coke to drive up demand.

And the Freemasons would say they didn't orchestrate the sinking of the Titanic.

[r0tor]

At the end of the day, the mechanical release is present.  There is NO mechanical release on the rear doors of a Mod3.  Only way out if there's a power failure is to shatter windows and squeeze out or, if they cannot be extricated that way, cut/tear off the door.  That's a shitty design.

How do you get to the emergency release in a Vette - shatter the rear hatch window or cut the hatch off... In which case they are just zipping the roof off rather than messing with that

[MX793]

How do you get to the emergency release in a Vette - shatter the rear hatch window

If emergency personnel need to get occupants out, that's a faster method than getting the jaws of life and removing the doors.

[r0tor]

Face it, it's just another paid hit piece

[MX793]

That a paid "hit piece" uncovered it doesn't make it any less a shitty design.

[r0tor]

That a paid "hit piece" uncovered it doesn't make it any less a shitty design.

So where is this experts article attacking the same problem in the Vette?  Mechanical latch or not, if you can't find the thing it's useless.

[CaminoRacer]

No one has claimed the Vette is a good design.

Your WhatAboutism is off the charts.

[r0tor]

Also, what happens in 2 door coupes where there is no door at all to get rear seat occupants out of.

[SJ_GTI]

Also, what happens in 2 door coupes where there is no door at all to get rear seat occupants out of.

[MX793]

Fairly certain there were multiple reports about the poor design in the Vette a couple of years ago.  IIRC, someone got trapped in their car, didn't know about the manual release handle, and died.  I believe GM was sued.

Also, automakers release guides for emergency personnel to inform them of things like manual release mechanisms, fuel line or high voltage line locations, etc.  Tesla's, for the Mod3, clearly states there is no manual release handle for the rear doors (while explaining how it works for the fronts).

[Soup DeVille]

Actually I put my kid in the back of an RX8 with no exterior rear door handles

Weird how you added that word "exterior" in there, as if that's what anybody else was talking about.

[Soup DeVille]

How do you get to the emergency release in a Vette - shatter the rear hatch window or cut the hatch off... In which case they are just zipping the roof off rather than messing with that

Breaking the glass is one of the first things they do in all cars; and every first responder carries a nifty little spring loaded glass breaker for that purpose. Its slightly heavier than a hefty pen, or small pocket knife.

Not many are carrying a chop saw or a jaws of life in their pants pockets.

[r0tor]

Weird how you added that word "exterior" in there, as if that's what anybody else was talking about.

No interior handle either unless the front door is open

[Soup DeVille]

Fairly certain there were multiple reports about the poor design in the Vette a couple of years ago.  IIRC, someone got trapped in their car, didn't know about the manual release handle, and died.  I believe GM was sued.

Also, automakers release guides for emergency personnel to inform them of things like manual release mechanisms, fuel line or high voltage line locations, etc.  Tesla's, for the Mod3, clearly states there is no manual release handle for the rear doors (while explaining how it works for the fronts).

Which in this case requires being equipped with extra tools which they may not have handy, and approaching a small production car uniquely, which they may not be trained for, or have actually seen.

[Soup DeVille]

No interior handle either unless the front door is open

"unless."

[MX793]

No interior handle either unless the front door is open

What are the odds, in a crash, that someone will be in the rear seat and not the front (for scenarios when occupants extricated themselves)?  For scenarios when first responders are pulling people from the car, can they not easily open all doors from the outside?  Yes, this may mean you have to open the front door first.

[r0tor]

Breaking the glass is one of the first things they do in all cars; and every first responder carries a nifty little spring loaded glass breaker for that purpose. Its slightly heavier than a hefty pen, or small pocket knife.

Not many are carrying a chop saw or a jaws of life in their pants pockets.

So how many first responders will be trained to remember that to open a door in a certain model of Vette you need to break into the hatch area?  Better yet, if you see a Vette in an accident and start on fire and want to yank out the passengers - how the fudge will a common person know that if the door handle doesn't work to smash into the hatch.

In any non complete "the car is about to catch on fire and explode" emergency, first responders are going to take their time and zip off the roof in any car to safely extract an individual in conjunction with paramedics (assuming it's a severe accident).  Actually, it doesn't even take that long for them to do it.

Does the design suck.  Absolutely.  Have existing established automakers already paved the way with equally bad designs - absolutely... So excuse me on the lack of drinking the haterade on this. 

It's clearly a motivated paid for hit piece.

[r0tor]

What are the odds, in a crash, that someone will be in the rear seat and not the front (for scenarios when occupants extricated themselves)?  For scenarios when first responders are pulling people from the car, can they not easily open all doors from the outside?  Yes, this may mean you have to open the front door first.

Fairly high odds actually... Most people put a kid in the passenger rear seat of a car.  Opening any doors from the outside depends on the nature of the crash.

If it makes you feel any better, the gas tank is also under the rear seat.

[Soup DeVille]

You keep coming up with the same example; the Vette- a design which has already killed people, the automaker has already been sued for, and which has not been widely copied by anybody else.

This isn't a very good argument, and you know it.  Its also but one of a host of problems.

[MX793]

The Vette's a bad design.  The Tesla is a step worse.

[r0tor]

Also take into consideration if we are talking from an interior point of view, most parents enable the child proof locks on their rear doors with prevents them from opening from the inside.

The model 3 has mechanical locks on the front.  Pulling someone in the rear out the front seats is not significantly more difficult then extracting rear occupants from a Mustang... especially depending on where the accident damaged occurred.

...anyway, the guide was published last September or earlier.  Didn't make a huge wave then, but now an "expert" was paid to make it a big deal I guess.

[CaminoRacer]

It's absolutely more difficult to pull someone in the backseat out of the front of a sedan than out of a coupe. Coupes are designed for easier access to the rear seat, because that's the main method of entry.

[MX793]

There are posts on Tesla forums about the lack of a manual override on the rear doors dated last fall.  It just didn't catch the public eye until now.

[12,000 RPM]

Also, what happens in 2 door coupes where there is no door at all to get rear seat occupants out of.

In a 2 door coupe, the doors are long enough that you just slide the front seats forward to get them out. No such luck in a Model 3, which is a sedan.

The more important question is why you have taken such a personal stake in Tesla's honor. Even if you are invested, panicked whataboutism on a message board with about 20 active members doesn't seem like a time efficient way of protecting stock prices.

[r0tor]

In a 2 door coupe, the doors are long enough that you just slide the front seats forward to get them out. No such luck in a Model 3, which is a sedan.

The more important question is why you have taken such a personal stake in Tesla's honor. Even if you are invested, panicked whataboutism on a message board with about 20 active members doesn't seem like a time efficient way of protecting stock prices.

Getting in/out of most coupes is a tough task when your not injured.  More often then not, injured rear seat occupants are going to be cut out.  Trying to extricate anyone from a space like that is going to be way too difficult and dangerous to the victim.

Tesla is halarious.  On either side of Tesla you have fanatical worship and fanatical hatred.  Any other manufacturer, nobody in large would give two shits about this.

There have been a fair number of paid for hit pieces on Tesla.  You have to consider that before jumping on a bandwagon on either side.  Hell, a couple months ago it was "Tesla is building model 3s without any automation" that hit national news and was in fact bullshit.  This is just more of the same IMO.

[giant_mtb]

Coupes?  The 3 is a sedan.  Yet without power, it becomes a coupe with shitty options for exiting.

[r0tor]

Coupes?  The 3 is a sedan.  Yet without power, it becomes a coupe with shitty options for exiting.

Like with all car purchases - you don't like it, don't buy it

...or in the case of Tesla wave your first and tweets frantically...


You by the way have a truck with a rear seat with no exterior door handle for the rear doors