Why are shops incapable of proper PSI?

[JWC]

That was funny. I think they need to hire good technicians who are drug free and reasonably intelligent but being a mechanics is not everybody's cup of tea.

Really a shame that people still think working on cars is a non-skilled job. It is a job for the very technically minded.  The problem is when you are at a your wife's Christmas party and you tell people what you do, they dismiss your job and something anyone can do.   Automotive repair is becoming very specialized.  These people don't seem to realize that the tech they are talking to probably makes twice or three times what they make.

As a result, the best people for a tech position is working on computers for 50k/year when working on a car can be a 80-90k/ year job.

[Raza]

That was funny. I think they need to hire good technicians who are drug free and reasonably intelligent but being a mechanics is not everybody's cup of tea.

Really a shame that people still think working on cars is a non-skilled job. It is a job for the very technically minded.  The problem is when you are at a your wife's Christmas party and you tell people what you do, they dismiss your job and something anyone can do.   Automotive repair is becoming very specialized.  These people don't seem to realize that the tech they are talking to probably makes twice or three times what they make.

As a result, the best people for a tech position is working on computers for 50k/year when working on a car can be a 80-90k/ year job.

It is very specialized.  I remember when I took my VW to a Jiffy Lube to get the oil changed (before you bemoan this, I lived in an apartment without a garage to change my own oil--and they had Mobil 1) they ran me down a checklist of things they couldn't do that they normally did because they didn't know how to do it on a Volkswagen, because, apparently, they've never had one before.  I was the only imported car there at the time as well.

[Run Away]

I get that too sometimes.

Gimme a break, imports have been popular for over 20 years now, you should carry parts for them...
I went to get a clutch hardline bent, apparently it needed "special" 6mm line (yeah OK, it's the same line used on pretty much every import for the past 15+ years on not only the clutch system, but the whole brake system) and "special" fittings.
I was quoted for $20 when I dropped it off, when I picked it up and paid they told me it should have been a $30 job, due to the "special" parts.

[L. ed foote]

It is very specialized.  I remember when I took my VW to a Jiffy Lube to get the oil changed (before you bemoan this, I lived in an apartment without a garage to change my own oil

So?

Change it on the street, like I do    

[L. ed foote]

As a result, the best people for a tech position is working on computers for 50k/year when working on a car can be a 80-90k/ year job.

Word?

Hmmm, I should look into that.

All I need is ASE certification, right?

[Tom]

Took my dad's taurus to Jiffy Lube today.  It's funny sitting in the waiting room with four or five other guys(all either Ford or Chevy owners).  There's an awkward silence because everyone's embarrased at being there instead of changing the oil themselves.

[JWC]

Embarrassing was what happened to me back in the 1990's when I worked for a GM dealer.  

One of the owners read some industry rag about how a certain quick lube chain's dollar per RO amount was somewhere like $90.00. Ours only averaged around 70-ish.  So, the conclusion was we were not up selling as well as those quick lube places. The remedy was to send each service advisor "undercover" with a car and observe the selling techniques of the local quick lube places.

When it was my turn, I was given a 1994 Grand Am that had just been traded in. We (illegally) used a turn-in plate from another trade. This car hadn't seen the service department yet for its used car inspection, so no one had even looked under the hood.

The dealership gave me 25.00 and sent me down the street to "observe and learn".  I got in line and was checked in, then sent to the waiting area while "my" car was serviced.  In the customer lounge was probably eight other people.  Eventually, my car got into the building and the service rep brought the air filter from the Grand Am into the lounge to show me that it needed to be replaced.

And, he wasn't exaggerating. It was probably the worse air filter I had ever seen. Not only was it black with crud, but it practically broke apart when he showed it to me...pieces of it fell on the floor. Problem was, I don't carry cash at work and they only gave me enough money for the oil change. I had to tell him no thanks. That guy looked at me like I was a lunatic. I nervously glanced around at the others, hoping no one was paying any attention to this exchange, but of course all the other customers were staring at me, apparently in shock.

Sir, the guy continues, I don't think I can really get this back in the car. I can sell you an air filter for only twelve dollars.   I took a deep breath and said, just stick it back in there any way you can. Hell, leave it out, I don't care. (I just wanted to get out of there).  

The customer rep and all eight people in that room were staring at me with expressions that plainly said, "what cheap bastard".

After I paid for the oil change I think I crawled out to the car.


Later that day, at the weekly service meeting , I had to do a presentation about my experience. I related the whole tale to the owners, the service manager, the lead techs, and my fellow service advisors, who had already heard it once, but still laughed.

After the presentation, the owner asked what I had learned. I said, I learned that the next time you guys send my out to do this, check the fucking car out first.

[JWC]

As a result, the best people for a tech position is working on computers for 50k/year when working on a car can be a 80-90k/ year job.

Word?

Hmmm, I should look into that.

All I need is ASE certification, right?

Not that simple. The guys making between 25.00 and 30.00 have been doing this for about ten years average. My highest paid tech specializes in Ford diesel.  The pay is based on flat rate times and it is your ability to beat the time that allows such yearly income. My diesel tech makes about 55 hrs in a 45 hour week. Actually, that is his personal limit. Anymore than that and Uncle Sam takes a large enough cut that he actually takes home less.

ASE certification is fine for independent shops, but to get that money you have to be in a dealership or a import shop.  In the dealerships, you have to be certified by that manufacturer.

[JWC]

BTW, I took this phone call today:



You sell tires?
Yes, sir.
Could you get me a price on a set for my Explorer? I have BF Goodrich now. I'd like a price on a set of Goodrichs and Goodyears.
We also sell Michelin.
Well, you can price Michelin, but I probably won't buy them. They're made in France and I hate the French.

[Tom]

Funny stuff  

A similar thing happend with the cabin air filter a while ago.  He pulled it out filthy(50k of use) and I said "eh, just stick it back."  I bought one at Napa for less than half the price.  Infact, I didn't even know what a cabin air filter was, or that the taurus had one, untill this happened.

Oh, and it was a serious bitch to locate the damn thing.

[Lebowski]

Actually, that is his personal limit. Anymore than that and Uncle Sam takes a large enough cut that he actually takes home less.

How is that possible?

[Lebowski]

Another story of tire pressure incompetence:

My mom took her car to the local gas station (w/ a service garage) to have her tire pressure checked (she's unable to do that herself, apparently) before a long highway trip yesterday.  The tech said her tires were way too low, as they had only 40psi, it should be 50, that's what the sidewall says.  My mom, who is the least mechanically inclined slash automotively knowledgable person on the face of the earth, mind you, said "that can't be right, are you sure", and the tech insisted that he was certain he was correct.  My mom pointed out the sticker in the door jam (which said 32 or something like that, as we'd all expect) and said why not go by that.  The guy asked "are these the tires that originally came with the car" and my mom said no as they weren't the original tires (but they were the same size as the originals and were on the OEM wheels), and he said "well then, you go by what's on the tire, and it says 50".  My mom let the idiot fill it to 50, but fortunately she had enough sense to immediately drive to another garage to double check, where they reduced the pressure to 32ish and laughed at her story.

Unbelievable, this guy was around 30 and services cars for a living.  How on earth can anyone be so clueless?

[JWC]

Actually, that is his personal limit. Anymore than that and Uncle Sam takes a large enough cut that he actually takes home less.

How is that possible?

Moves to a higher tax bracket.  

[Lebowski]

Actually, that is his personal limit. Anymore than that and Uncle Sam takes a large enough cut that he actually takes home less.

How is that possible?

Moves to a higher tax bracket.

Unless there is something weird going on the way you guys pay hourly workers, tax brackets don't work that way.

Tax brackets are marginal.  Let's say (for purpose of demonstration, this isn't exactly where the bracket changes) the tax bracket moves from 20% to 25% at $80k.  If you get a raise from $79k to $85k, the 25% only applies to the $5k you earn above that $80k mark.

For some reason, a LOT of people don't understand this, and interpret it the way you just described.  Unless there is something unusual going on with a person's individual situation, it generally is not possible to get a raise and walk away with less after tax dollars than before you got the raise.

It sounds to me like the guy you cited in your example needs to talk to a CPA, he may be leaving money on a table by determining his work hours based on an apparently incorrect interpretation of the tax code.

[JWC]

Actually, that is his personal limit. Anymore than that and Uncle Sam takes a large enough cut that he actually takes home less.

How is that possible?

Moves to a higher tax bracket.

Unless there is something weird going on the way you guys pay hourly workers, tax brackets don't work that way.

Tax brackets are marginal.  Let's say (for purpose of demonstration, this isn't exactly where the bracket changes) the tax bracket moves from 20% to 25% at $80k.  If you get a raise from $79k to $85k, the 25% only applies to the $5k you earn above that $80k mark.

For some reason, a LOT of people don't understand this, and interpret it the way you just described.  Unless there is something unusual going on with a person's individual situation, it generally is not possible to get a raise and walk away with less after tax dollars than before you got the raise.

It sounds to me like the guy you cited in your example needs to talk to a CPA, he may be leaving money on a table by determining his work hours based on an apparently incorrect interpretation of the tax code.

Beats me, I'm salary.

I know that when I worked hourly, if I made over a certain number of hours in a two week period, I actually took home less money than if I had worked about five less than that total.  Really sucked.

[Lebowski]

Actually, that is his personal limit. Anymore than that and Uncle Sam takes a large enough cut that he actually takes home less.

How is that possible?

Moves to a higher tax bracket.

Unless there is something weird going on the way you guys pay hourly workers, tax brackets don't work that way.

Tax brackets are marginal.  Let's say (for purpose of demonstration, this isn't exactly where the bracket changes) the tax bracket moves from 20% to 25% at $80k.  If you get a raise from $79k to $85k, the 25% only applies to the $5k you earn above that $80k mark.

For some reason, a LOT of people don't understand this, and interpret it the way you just described.  Unless there is something unusual going on with a person's individual situation, it generally is not possible to get a raise and walk away with less after tax dollars than before you got the raise.

It sounds to me like the guy you cited in your example needs to talk to a CPA, he may be leaving money on a table by determining his work hours based on an apparently incorrect interpretation of the tax code.

Beats me, I'm salary.

I know that when I worked hourly, if I made over a certain number of hours in a two week period, I actually took home less money than if I had worked about five less than that total.  Really sucked.

I'm salary too, so I'm not too familiar with how hourly workers' taxes are computed  ... must have something to do with how overtime is taxed or something like that.

[JWC]

Actually, that is his personal limit. Anymore than that and Uncle Sam takes a large enough cut that he actually takes home less.

How is that possible?

Moves to a higher tax bracket.

Unless there is something weird going on the way you guys pay hourly workers, tax brackets don't work that way.

Tax brackets are marginal.  Let's say (for purpose of demonstration, this isn't exactly where the bracket changes) the tax bracket moves from 20% to 25% at $80k.  If you get a raise from $79k to $85k, the 25% only applies to the $5k you earn above that $80k mark.

For some reason, a LOT of people don't understand this, and interpret it the way you just described.  Unless there is something unusual going on with a person's individual situation, it generally is not possible to get a raise and walk away with less after tax dollars than before you got the raise.

It sounds to me like the guy you cited in your example needs to talk to a CPA, he may be leaving money on a table by determining his work hours based on an apparently incorrect interpretation of the tax code.

Beats me, I'm salary.

I know that when I worked hourly, if I made over a certain number of hours in a two week period, I actually took home less money than if I had worked about five less than that total.  Really sucked.

I'm salary too, so I'm not too familiar with how hourly workers' taxes are computed  ... must have something to do with how overtime is taxed or something like that.

I know my wife is hourly (nurse) and she loses a chunk of money if she works extra, and they are always asking for her to work extra.  At times it hardly seems worth it.

[Lebowski]

What pisses me off even more is when the technician uses the air wrench to tighten the lug nuts. They torque them to like 500 ft-lbs!!

One time, I was almost unable to undo my lug nuts with a lugwrench and 5 foot breaker bar. I was jumping on the bar, and it was actually bending it. That pissed me off.

My normal mechanic uses an actual torque wrench to tighten the lugs, which is one reason why I repeatedly bring my car to him.

A bit off topic to this thread (which is arleady off topic, LOL) .... I'm planning on buying a torque wrench tomorrow or monday, any suggestions anyone?  How much should I plan on spending?

[JWC]

What pisses me off even more is when the technician uses the air wrench to tighten the lug nuts. They torque them to like 500 ft-lbs!!

One time, I was almost unable to undo my lug nuts with a lugwrench and 5 foot breaker bar. I was jumping on the bar, and it was actually bending it. That pissed me off.

My normal mechanic uses an actual torque wrench to tighten the lugs, which is one reason why I repeatedly bring my car to him.

A bit off topic to this thread (which is arleady off topic, LOL) .... I'm planning on buying a torque wrench tomorrow or monday, any suggestions anyone?  How much should I plan on spending?

I went to Sears and picked one up last year for less than $100. "Clicker" and goes to about 150ft/lbs.  Very handy when I had to work on the Saab.

I think it is this one.

[Lebowski]

What pisses me off even more is when the technician uses the air wrench to tighten the lug nuts. They torque them to like 500 ft-lbs!!

One time, I was almost unable to undo my lug nuts with a lugwrench and 5 foot breaker bar. I was jumping on the bar, and it was actually bending it. That pissed me off.

My normal mechanic uses an actual torque wrench to tighten the lugs, which is one reason why I repeatedly bring my car to him.

A bit off topic to this thread (which is arleady off topic, LOL) .... I'm planning on buying a torque wrench tomorrow or monday, any suggestions anyone?  How much should I plan on spending?

I went to Sears and picked one up last year for less than $100. "Clicker" and goes to about 150ft/lbs.  Very handy when I had to work on the Saab.

I think it is this one.

Thanks ... I just went to Sears and bought that exact one.  Seems to be pretty good quality, although I haven't used it yet.