EVs

[AutobahnSHO]

Wyoming looks pretty sparse on the public charger map. Especially compared to Utah and Colorado next door

It's sparse on everything but awesomeness.

[Morris Minor]

https://oilprice.com/Latest-Energy-News/World-News/The-US-Coal-Industry-Is-Declining-Irreversibly.html

Coal's share in the US energy mix is going down, fast.

This is good. One of my favorite YouTube channels is Fully Charged. I'm becoming a convert to not burning stuff, maybe because of where I grew up and the era I grew up in.

Although one of my former colleagues heats his Pennsylvania home with radiators and a boiler augur-fed with rice anthracite. He gets a huge truckload of the stuff delivered once a year. The stuff is cheap. Interesting throwback for me because that's how the house I grew up in was heated. 

[Laconian]

Burning coal when there are myriad cleaner solutions is kind of an asshole thing to do. It's like burning your trash in your backyard because it saves a few bucks on garbage service. Sure, it rains charred bits on your neighbors' houses, but that's their houses and not yours. Coal is fine when you're in rural China with zero money and zero utilities. But this is the first world!

(I had one of those neighbors growing up... so triggered)

[Morris Minor]

This is a real looker:
Press release: https://www.businesswire.com/news/home/20200427005378/en/Xpeng-P7-Launches-China

[FoMoJo]

So...Electrify America can now take your EV all the way from LA to DC

[Soup DeVille]

but not to see UP Chris, or Wyoming

[CaminoRacer]

I could roadtrip home to Cincinnati.

[Eye of the Tiger]

I could roadtrip home to Cincinnati.

What is Bolt's range IRL?

[CaminoRacer]

On the highway, 190-200 miles I think.

Going up mountains destroys the range but then you get tons of free miles/range on the way back down

[AutobahnSHO]

On the highway, 190-200 miles I think.

Going up mountains destroys the range but then you get tons of free miles/range on the way back down

Even better if you don't brake?! 

[NomisR]

Even better if you don't brake?! 

Just engine brake regen all the way down.

[Eye of the Tiger]

On the highway, 190-200 miles I think.

Going up mountains destroys the range but then you get tons of free miles/range on the way back down

That's almost the same as the Cherokee

[CaminoRacer]

Even better if you don't brake?! 

Just engine brake regen all the way down.

I never use the actual brakes. Just regen braking. It makes going down mountains much more enjoyable - no worries about brake fade and my mileage goes through the roof 

[NomisR]

I never use the actual brakes. Just regen braking. It makes going down mountains much more enjoyable - no worries about brake fade and my mileage goes through the roof 

One pedal EV driving seriously makes life so much easier especially in stop and go traffic.  I can't stand it now when I have to drive my wife's car.. and the fact that Honda's brakes are typically undersized annoys me even more..

[Morris Minor]

I never use the actual brakes. Just regen braking. It makes going down mountains much more enjoyable - no worries about brake fade and my mileage goes through the roof 

This is encouraging. I live in hilly terrain, to put it mildly.

[CaminoRacer]

This is encouraging. I live in hilly terrain, to put it mildly.

EVs are great for that. Lots of torque going up, regen going down

[NomisR]

The effortless torque is great.  I can speed past everyone going up hill without the engine roars making it feel like I was driving on flat land.

[afty]

Another underrated benefit is no power loss at altitude.  :D

[ChrisV]

What is Bolt's range IRL?

Mine is at almost 300 miles mixed if I don't drive too aggressively. Over 250 highway.

[Eye of the Tiger]

Mine is at almost 300 miles mixed if I don't drive too aggressively. Over 250 highway.

What if you draft a tractor-trailer doing 55?

[CaminoRacer]

Mine is at almost 300 miles mixed if I don't drive too aggressively. Over 250 highway.

2020 model?

I get worse highway mileage that lots of other owners, probably because Utah highways are 70-80 mph instead of 65.

[NomisR]

2020 model?

I get worse highway mileage that lots of other owners, probably because Utah highways are 70-80 mph instead of 65.

What's your Mi/Kw?  i'm at 3.8 and average around 200 per full charge.. but when I drive, i'm usually 80+ and oftentime at the limiter

[Laconian]

I want an EV now. Too bad we never drive anywhere these days.

[CaminoRacer]

What's your Mi/Kw?  i'm at 3.8 and average around 200 per full charge.. but when I drive, i'm usually 80+ and oftentime at the limiter

3.8-4.1 with highway driving

[afty]

I'm averaging 253 Wh/mi = 3.95 mi/kWh = 133 MPGe.  Mostly short trips, city driving.

[Morris Minor]

Robert Llewellyn made a good point the other day: We understand automotive hardware - with a century of refining it to what we have now. We've figured out suspension and brakes and tires and interiors and all the other bits. .. and EV hardware is far simpler than ICE hardware. Yes we'll be refining traction motors and batteries but they've been around for decades too.

What we don't understand is the bit that is new, the bit that it's more important to understand: software.

And that's where Tesla has crucially stolen the march on the established ICE players. It's much easier for Tesla to learn how to fix paint & get panel gaps right than it is for the others to learn how to do the software right.

Rumors are flying around VW:
Volkswagen ID.3 Software Problem: 'It's No Longer A Laughing Matter'
https://insideevs.com/news/406375/vw-id3-software-problem-update/


VW's first mass-market EV suffers delay thanks to software struggles
Versions of the ID 3 will now ship in September with unfinished software
https://www.theverge.com/2020/6/11/21288572/volkswagen-id3-ev-delay-software-vw-herbert-diess

[afty]

One of my software engineer coworkers came to us from a large German auto company.  He said the same thing -- that the large German auto company didn't understand software, and that Tesla was eating their lunch with software.

Back to the Bolt.  I found this article fascinating: https://electrek.co/2020/06/25/chevy-bolt-retrospective/ .  The quick version is: Bolt great, GM and dealers terrible.

[MrH]

Robert Llewellyn made a good point the other day: We understand automotive hardware - with a century of refining it to what we have now. We've figured out suspension and brakes and tires and interiors and all the other bits. .. and EV hardware is far simpler than ICE hardware. Yes we'll be refining traction motors and batteries but they've been around for decades too.

What we don't understand is the bit that is new, the bit that it's more important to understand: software.

And that's where Tesla has crucially stolen the march on the established ICE players. It's much easier for Tesla to learn how to fix paint & get panel gaps right than it is for the others to learn how to do the software right.

I couldn't disagree more. Sure, Tesla does some things right with software, but they do a ton wrong.  There's a reason legacy OEMs are slow to bring bleeding edge tech to cars.  They'll catch up, and they'll do it without the issues Tesla has.

Tesla may push the boundaries, but it's not without issues.  The giant Model S and X screen isn't automotive grade.  The heat cycling causes it to delaminate, and the screen yellows and fails.  Huge issues here with no solution.  Class action lawsuit of course.

They also didn't consider the read/write cycle on their SSD, and vehicles are failing now.  Class action lawsuit here too.

Again, it's not like legacy OEMs didn't consider putting big screens in cars before tesla, they just didn't have the technology at automotive grade for the right price point yet.  We're starting to see it now, and it's actually done correctly.

[Morris Minor]

I couldn't disagree more. Sure, Tesla does some things right with software, but they do a ton wrong.  There's a reason legacy OEMs are slow to bring bleeding edge tech to cars.  They'll catch up, and they'll do it without the issues Tesla has.

Tesla may push the boundaries, but it's not without issues.  The giant Model S and X screen isn't automotive grade.  The heat cycling causes it to delaminate, and the screen yellows and fails.  Huge issues here with no solution.  Class action lawsuit of course.

They also didn't consider the read/write cycle on their SSD, and vehicles are failing now.  Class action lawsuit here too.

Again, it's not like legacy OEMs didn't consider putting big screens in cars before tesla, they just didn't have the technology at automotive grade for the right price point yet.  We're starting to see it now, and it's actually done correctly.

You are focusing on hardware - iPad display - just like the metal benders who run GM, VW, PSA et al.
The point is that the major challenge of EVs is that of software. Tesla understood that before anyone else.
Their code is probably really messy, but the crucial point is that the light bulb illuminated with them first. Understand that and you'll understand why their market cap is greater than Toyota, VW, Honda etc.

[MrH]

Who cares who illuminates the light bulb first, if they can't profitably make light bulbs?

I will help the Tesla cult build an Elon statue for lighting the first light bulb, when he's bankrupt and in jail for running a perpetual fraud of a business.