Only In A Jeep

[TurboDan]

So, after years of blasting SUV drivers, I find myself on the verge of becoming one.  Not any SUV, but a Jeep nonetheless.  Taking Iffy's advice on not buying a new vehicle with a depreciation hit (since I'm not sure if I'll keep this one THAT long), I found an '04 Jeep Liberty with 34K on the clock for a good price.  I believe it's a "Renegade" edition, whatever that means (salesman couldn't really tell me - he said it was "sportier").  I test drove it today and really liked it!  I know it had a cool "military green" color to it, which made it look tougher, at least. 

It looks like I'm getting serious on this one, so I'm just throwing it out there to see if anyone has any opinions.  I'm also a bit confused on the 4WD system.  There is a shifter with the regular RWD setting, "high" 4WD, and "low" 4WD.  One you have to put the vehicle in neutral and one can be shifted on the fly, apparently.  Which 4WD setting should be used for what?

It's not like I'll be driving through the jungles of the Amazon in this thing, but it'll see some action on the beach for sure and at the boat ramp.  Maybe I'll take it into the woods or something sometime too.  I never really had the desire to do that before - but hey, if I get the damn thing, I may as well use it!

[Catman]

If you really like it, get it.  Have fun.

[SVT666]

So, after years of blasting SUV drivers, I find myself on the verge of becoming one.? Not any SUV, but a Jeep nonetheless.? Taking Iffy's advice on not buying a new vehicle with a depreciation hit (since I'm not sure if I'll keep this one THAT long), I found an '04 Jeep Liberty with 34K on the clock for a good price.? I believe it's a "Renegade" edition, whatever that means (salesman couldn't really tell me - he said it was "sportier").? I test drove it today and really liked it!? I know it had a cool "military green" color to it, which made it look tougher, at least.?

It looks like I'm getting serious on this one, so I'm just throwing it out there to see if anyone has any opinions.? I'm also a bit confused on the 4WD system.? There is a shifter with the regular RWD setting, "high" 4WD, and "low" 4WD.? One you have to put the vehicle in neutral and one can be shifted on the fly, apparently.? Which 4WD setting should be used for what?

It's not like I'll be driving through the jungles of the Amazon in this thing, but it'll see some action on the beach for sure and at the boat ramp.? Maybe I'll take it into the woods or something sometime too.? I never really had the desire to do that before - but hey, if I get the damn thing, I may as well use it!

Yay!  A truck virgin.  4x4 Low is to be used in only the most extreme offroading and is also the one to be engaged at a slow crawl in Neutral.  4x4 High is whenever you need 4WD such as snow or any offroading that does not include rockcrawling.  It can be engaged on the fly.  Check the owner's manual for the maximum speed at which you can engage 4x4 High.  On my Ram it is 50mph, but honestly if you need 4x4 at 50mph, you shouldn't be going 50mph.  Any other questions, just ask away.

BTW, why did you always rag on SUV drivers anyway?

[S204STi]

The Renegade I think included the offroad lights on top, a big cargo area up there as well, different exterior trim, and maybe some extra skid plates or something...I drove one with a 5spd a little while ago, I liked it.

[GoCougs]

It looks like I'm getting serious on this one, so I'm just throwing it out there to see if anyone has any opinions.? I'm also a bit confused on the 4WD system.? There is a shifter with the regular RWD setting, "high" 4WD, and "low" 4WD.? One you have to put the vehicle in neutral and one can be shifted on the fly, apparently.? Which 4WD setting should be used for what?

4WD high/low is made possible by way of a transfer case; essentially a two speed transmission that bolts up behind a regular transmission. "4WD high" is a 1:1 ratio and used for normal, everyday speeds. "4WD low" uses the low ratio, depending on the t-case, and is anywhere from 2:1 to 4:1. You shift into this lower gear when you select "4WD low" (either with a manual lever or a push button - which does the shifting with an electric actuator or motor). It's for when you need to put a lot of power down at a crawl; deep snow, mud, etc., as it gives substantially lower gearing (kinda like granny gear in old-school 4sp trucks and Jeeps).

[GoCougs]

Yay!? A truck virgin.? 4x4 Low is to be used in only the most extreme offroading and is also the one to be engaged at a slow crawl in Neutral.? 4x4 High is whenever you need 4WD such as snow or any offroading that does not include rockcrawling.? It can be engaged on the fly.? Check the owner's manual for the maximum speed at which you can engage 4x4 High.? On my Ram it is 50mph, but honestly if you need 4x4 at 50mph, you shouldn't be going 50mph.? Any other questions, just ask away.

BTW, why did you always rag on SUV drivers anyway?

My last rough-and-ready 4wd was an '82 Ramcharger with a mildly built 318, 727TF and NP208 (I think). When stuck in a mud hole or otherwise getting on it hard, I easily exceeded 50 mph indicated speed when in 4WD low. Many, many times. On occassion, when racing or playing around, I easily got that thing up to 60mph road speed in 4wd low. For all the abuse I put it through, plus the 180k miles that it had when I sold it, it still had the original engine, tranny and t-case.

[saxonyron]

Congrats!? Last I checked, Jeep has 2 systems - one, on my parents' 2 Grand Cherokees, is a permanent AWD with a viscous coupling.? To lock into traditional 4wd high, you pull the lever into high.? To get into 4wd low, you put the car in neutral and pull the lever into position.? Can't go much more than 15 or 20 mph in that range, but you should be able to pull a deep sea trawler up a boat ramp.? The other system has no AWD/viscous coupling, and is simply RWD by default.? You have 4WD Hi and Low, chosen by the lever on the floor.? These are both mechanical, for slippery surfaces only.? Otherwise you'll bind up your axles and your Jeep will make some unhappy noises if you turn at slow speeds.  The basic difference between the two types is that the basic one is RWD, and the other one is permanent AWD with viscous coupling.

Sounds like your Liberty is the traditional RWD that my 94 Cherokee Sport had.? Worked flawlessly for almost 200,000 miles.

[thewizard16]

The Renegade edition makes the Liberty look pretty nice, which is good considering how much of a stereotypical "chick" car it has become around here otherwise. I'm not wild about the Liberty (I expressed my interior objections in the RIP Saab thread, but other than that I have no problems with it), but it's reasonably capable, and as long as you don't want a luxury interior, it's pretty fun.

[ifcar]

If you like it, go for it. But be sure to see what deal you can get on an 05 and up Xterra and Grand Vitara first, and make sure you drive each.

[omicron]

OH! I just image-searched 'Jeep Liberty' for the first time! I had always assumed it was a model we didn't get over here.

[FoMoJo]

The Liberty is categorized as an "small" SUV.

Sounds like a nice package.  Auto or manual?...I understand that the manual is a 6spd.  Maybe if you get bogged down on the beach you can switch it into 4WD "low".

Good luck with it if you decide to buy.

[Ron From Regina]

Congrats!? Last I checked, Jeep has 2 systems - one, on my parents' 2 Grand Cherokees, is a permanent AWD with a viscous coupling.? To lock into traditional 4wd high, you pull the lever into high.? To get into 4wd low, you put the car in neutral and pull the lever into position.? Can't go much more than 15 or 20 mph in that range, but you should be able to pull a deep sea trawler up a boat ramp.? The other system has no AWD/viscous coupling, and is simply RWD by default.? You have 4WD Hi and Low, chosen by the lever on the floor.? These are both mechanical, for slippery surfaces only.? Otherwise you'll bind up your axles and your Jeep will make some unhappy noises if you turn at slow speeds.? The basic difference between the two types is that the basic one is RWD, and the other one is permanent AWD with viscous coupling.

Sounds like your Liberty is the traditional RWD that my 94 Cherokee Sport had.? Worked flawlessly for almost 200,000 miles.

My wife has on 03 Liberty limited. They are pretty solid vechicles. As of yet, we've had no problems, however there has been 2 ball joint recalls, so make sure you have the work performed before you purchase.

As mentioned above, there are 2 four wheel drive systems available on the liberty. One is called "Command-Trac" which has a locked center diff. Your 4WD lever has the options 2-Hi, 4-Hi N, and 4L. As mentioned you can shift on the fly below 50mph from 2hi to 4 hi, but to go in lo range, it works best if you are rolling at about 5 mph in N, move the transfer case to N, then to 4-Lo, finally putting the transmission back into gear.? When you have 4-Hi engaged, a light in the dash comes on that says "Part Time". This means you can use 4wd on roads that are slippery (ie, snow/ice, but NOT wet pavement). If you drive on a surface that has traction, you will wear out your tires, and damage your drivetrain though something called windup.

The other system jeep offers is called Select-Trac. It is exactly like the system above, but has an additional option for 4-Hi-Full Time. THis option use allows the front and rear axels to rotate at different speeds, essencially allowing you to use the 4wd system on any surface. When you use this, a dash light called "Full Time" comes on. Note, that this system also has a streight 2wd mode. (Meaning, both options on the liberty allow for RWD only)  However, in my experience, when we whe were looking at buying, very few jeeps had this option.

[93JC]

Congrats!? Last I checked, Jeep has 2 systems

Six, actually. Eight if you count "Freedom Drive I" and "Freedom Drive II", which are really AWD systems.

They are:

Command-Trac (2H, 4H, 4L (2.72:1))
Selec-Trac (2H, 4H full-time, 4H part-time, 4L)
Quadra-Trac I (4 all-time (1:1))
Quadra-Trac II (4 all-time, 4L)
Quadra-Drive II (4 all-time, 4L, electronic limited slip diffs)
Rock-Trac (2H, 4H, 4L (4:1))

[Ron From Regina]

And only Selec-Trac and Command-Trac are available on the Liberty, with the Selec-Trac being a somewhat rare option.

[93JC]

Yes.

I can't quite remember, but I think the Grand Cherokee is available with Selec-Trac, Quadra-Trac and Quadra-Drive, Commander available with Quadra-Trac and Quadra-Drive, and Wrangler with Command-Trac and Rock-Trac (in the Rubicon).

[Madman]

OH! I just image-searched 'Jeep Liberty' for the first time! I had always assumed it was a model we didn't get over here.

Yep, it's called Liberty in the States but everywhere else it's called Cherokee.

Jeep killed the Cherokee name in the US when the last of the old, square-box Cherokees went out of production.  I've never understood why Jeep changed the name for America but kept Cherokee everywhere else?  The Cherokee had a pretty good reputation and, of course, we still have the Grand Cherokee.  Anyone know why the name change?

Madman of the People

[SaltyDog]

Well you can breathe a sigh of relief; you escaped being "one of them." :P

[93JC]

Because they didn't want to sully the Cherokee name.

[ro51092]

Because they didn't want to sully the Cherokee name.

As of now, my A4 has more offroading potential than your Jeep.

Unless a dead engine and some cinder blocks where wheels are supposed to be can do a decent job :P

[cawimmer430]

See you at the gas station, Dan. 

Is that Jeep Liberty you found a V6 or a diesel?

[SVT_Power]

See you at the gas station, Dan. 

Is that Jeep Liberty you found a V6 or a diesel?

He ended up buying a Passat didn't he?

[cawimmer430]

He ended up buying a Passat didn't he?

I have not been following that thread. Did he?

[SVT_Power]

I have not been following that thread. Did he?

Yes he did

[cawimmer430]

Yes he did

Thanks for helping the German economy, Dan!

[SVT_Power]

Remember that quote from C&D that was along the lines of "Everytime an American buys a VW, somebody rings a bell in Germany"? Anyone remember that?

[cawimmer430]

Remember that quote from C&D that was along the lines of "Everytime an American buys a VW, somebody rings a bell in Germany"? Anyone remember that?

Well, the church bells here ring all the time. Annoying. 

[ifcar]

Thanks for helping the German economy, Dan!

He bought used, so he isn't helping you.

[SaltyDog]

By showing there's a demand for used VWs people are more likely to buy new VWs.  But not really...

Thank you for helping the American economy, Dan

[sandertheshark]

Remember that quote from C&D that was along the lines of "Everytime an American buys a VW, somebody rings a bell in Germany"? Anyone remember that?

"I've said it before, when a VW is purchased.. Some guy in Germany hits a bell and says "dumb Americans"..." ~ y2ks2k

[JYODER240]

"I've said it before, when a VW is purchased.. Some guy in Germany hits a bell and says "dumb Americans"..." ~ y2ks2k

y2ks2k is one of the most ridiculous trolls from C/D. Read This thread he completely embarrased himself.

http://www.caranddriver.com/idealbb/view.asp?mode=viewtopic&topicID=75059&num=20&pageNo=1