If you do preventative maintainence consistlenty, how long will a car last?

[bkgs]

Hello,

Assuming you do preventative maintainence consistently, what is the upper limit of mileage and age for a vehicle so you would "run it into the ground".

How long are vehicle designed to last as per the examples given here? (This being your regular vehicle)

What are the most common problems bringing the vehicles demise?

Not taking into consideration a well maintained upper mileage vehicle, what are the common problems that bring a vehicles demise?

[TheIntrepid]

Hi ... welcome

It fully depends on the individual vehicle.

A Japanese car (Civic, Camry, Corolla, Accord, Altima, etc) would usually run for 200,000+ kilometres on regular maintenance...

A Korean car is similar in reliability (newer models) to Japanese cars.

American cars are generally worse in terms of reliability... I'd start to lose trust after 150,000km. I currently drive a 2004 domestic with close to 140,000 on it and I'm going to be getting rid of it soon.

European cars (except pre-1995-ish Mercedes S-Class) are notorious for horrible reliability. I would never buy a used one with more than 100,000km on it, and I would not trust my own past 120,000km.

That being said, it fully depends on the type of vehcle and how it's driven.


The most common problems that a car would have at that age can be anything... from transmission failure to engines seizing... to electricals dying...

[TBR]

Ignore the above.

Domestic v. German v. Japanese doesn't matter all that much. Any car is going to have problems after 100k miles or so, stuff just starts to wear out. But, most engines will need to be rebuilt between 200-250k miles, that is also when you should start worrying about an automatic transmission going out (note- I will admit that domestics, particularly ones from the '80s and '90s, had big AT problems). Parts for German cars are a lot more expensive than those for Japanese cars which are a little bit more expensive than those for dometics.

Personally if I wouldn't want to rely on an engine with over 200k+ miles on it (my car has 312,000, but the engine only has 82,000), but that is just me.

[S204STi]

You can't really know for sure.  I know of a former Dodge Omni owner who never actually changed his oil, asserting that all you had to do was keep adding more as it burned off (keep in mind older Chryslers used a lot of oil from the factory).  He owned it for well over 100,000mi IIRC.  After that he is lost to history, but then some cars that are maintained habitually in a reasonable manner can still have random parts failures.  Many Nissan Altimas built in the 02-04 range had issues with oil rings breaking for no apparent reason, causing excessive oil consumption and catastrophic engine failure due to low oil/spun bearings.  The cars had no other problems other than that.  However I have also seen neglected cars suffer engine failure as well.  It seems that obsessive maintenance does not guarantee long life but it certainly increases the chances.

[S204STi]

Hi ... welcome

It fully depends on the individual vehicle.

A Japanese car (Civic, Camry, Corolla, Accord, Altima, etc) would usually run for 200,000+ kilometres on regular maintenance...

A Korean car is similar in reliability (newer models) to Japanese cars.

American cars are generally worse in terms of reliability... I'd start to lose trust after 150,000km. I currently drive a 2004 domestic with close to 140,000 on it and I'm going to be getting rid of it soon.

European cars (except pre-1995-ish Mercedes S-Class) are notorious for horrible reliability. I would never buy a used one with more than 100,000km on it, and I would not trust my own past 120,000km.

That being said, it fully depends on the type of vehcle and how it's driven.


The most common problems that a car would have at that age can be anything... from transmission failure to engines seizing... to electricals dying...

You're one of those guys who reads Consumer Reports, sees the solid black circle in the reliabilitry ratings, and concludes that the vehicle must begin falling to bits as you drive it off the lot.

[TheIntrepid]

You're one of those guys who reads Consumer Reports, sees the solid black circle in the reliabilitry ratings, and concludes that the vehicle must begin falling to bits as you drive it off the lot.

I've never opened a Consumer Reports in my life.

edit: Though, I AM one of those guys who doesn't trust used cars at all.

[S204STi]

I've never opened a Consumer Reports in my life.

edit: Though, I AM one of those guys who doesn't trust used cars at all.

I'll give you that!

[TheIntrepid]

I'll give you that!

[J86]

Hello,

Assuming you do preventative maintainence consistently, what is the upper limit of mileage and age for a vehicle so you would "run it into the ground".

How long are vehicle designed to last as per the examples given here? (This being your regular vehicle)

What are the most common problems bringing the vehicles demise?

Not taking into consideration a well maintained upper mileage vehicle, what are the common problems that bring a vehicles demise?

My family typically buys vehicles (assorted mainstreamers) used (assorted mileage) and keeps them until around 200k.  At that point, they are usually sold off to sketchy shade-tree dealers or kids looking for a first car.  We do as much maintenance and work on our vehicles as we can, and very rarely send them out to mechanics.  For example, we have a '96 Honda Accord still in service with an estimated 230-250k on it (miles, not kilometers).  Thing gets it's oil changed on a regular basis, and other than that we simply replace things when they need fixing, ie. brakes.  The car has had a new radiator, jointwork, and exhaust system within the last three years, and I also replaced the speedometer after driving around with it busted for a coupla years.  Other than that, we haven't done much. 

[AutobahnSHO]

I'd say around 200k the engine and tranny will need a rebuild, no matter what.  All makes, all models.
Just an opinion, though- I've never driven a car that long. (I've only owned since 1997.)

I too have always bought used- the '99 I have is the newest but had 112k miles when we bought it (March06.)

I've bought other cars from 85k miles to 156k miles (1991 Taurus SHO in 2003,) and all of them have had minor problems.  As long as you fix them right away, and ask mechanics that have dealt with the vehicle in question, you can drive them a long time.  Some cars have particular weaknesses but by 5-8 years old people know of them, and you can get educated about them and catch them before they happen.

I'd say the WORSE thing to do to a used car is drive it with a known problem.  This creates much more hassle than it saves in the short run. -"I just need to get to work for 3 weeks until I can afford to fix it" will cause a major catastrophe..

[Rupert]

What's preventative maintenance? Pretty much any car can go forever if it's taken care of and if engines, transmissions, and everything else are replaced or rebuilt enough. There's a Volvo 1800 out there with over two million miles, but most everything has been replaced over the years (a few times).

I'd say that most cars will go until 190-250k miles before they become totally impractical to own (repairs needed very frequently and start to cost more than new car payments/used car). Exceptions to the rule abound, of course.

[The Bartender]

One of the customers at the dealership I used to work for a 1995 Buick Roadmaster he used as a taxi cab.  He worked for an airport cab company that required the driver's to buy the car new and keep them in good condition.  He sold the car in 2000, at which time it had 500,000 miles on the ORIGINAL LT1 350 V8.  The transmission burned out at 298,000 miles, and the rbuild unit was still going strong with just over 200,000 miles on it.  The exhaust was original (stainless steel).  He replaced 5 or 6 driver's side power window motors, however.

More to the point, the man was regular with his maintenance, oil changes with synthetic oil every 20,000 miles (4-5 changes a year), transmission service every 50,000 miles, coolant flush at the same time and complete tune up with platinum tipped spark plugs every 100,000 miles.  The engine was still running strong, no misfires, and only burned about a quart of oil every 5,000 miles or so.

I currently have a 1993 Jeep Cherokee with 208,000 miles, and the engine still runs like a top.  It's a manual transmission, which helps, as manuals are more reliable in the long run than automatics (other than the clutch)

I've seen 250,000 miles plus ona number of vehicle, but many were in rough shape.  Truly regular maintenance is pretty rare, even from mechanically oriented types.

[AutobahnSHO]

I'd say that most cars will go until 190-250k miles before they become totally impractical to own (repairs needed very frequently and start to cost more than new car payments/used car). Exceptions to the rule abound, of course.

I would tend to agree with that-
But if you do preventive maintenance the impracticality thing can be lessened.  ie Change the fuel pump, water pump, other wear items  before they wear out, in steps.

There's a SHO owner in Texas that pulls his boat with the 91.  It had 300k+ miles on it last I'd heard, he had rebuilt the engine/tranny a little after 200k, as preventive maintenance.

My in-laws had had a 86 Grand Am they had for 10 years and 400k miles with no major issues besides the computer burnt out one time. (On a long drive my wife (passenger) fell asleep with their foot pushing the cigarette lighter in and it fried the computer !?!??!!)   They bought another (2002?) but that piece had issues since day 2.

[TheIntrepid]

I currently have a 1993 Jeep Cherokee with 208,000 miles, and the engine still runs like a top. It's a manual transmission, which helps, as manuals are more reliable in the long run than automatics (other than the clutch)

MARK?

[The Pirate]

MARK?

Nah, it can't be.  Mark's doesn't run!

[TheIntrepid]

oh true

[Danish]

I disagree with touraeg, to say the very least

Nowadays, if you do maintenance regularly, the bare minimum a car will go is 100k miles, and 200k is easily attained. In the 80s and early 90s, it is true that Japanese makes were a little better with reliability but nowadays that advantage has largely eroded away.

My dad has a 1990 Camry, and he is very strict about maintenance- to the point where he will often drive me nuts! The car gets oil changes every 3k miles, a coolant flush every spring, etc. He puts 25k miles on the car every year.

The car has 260k miles on it and it running strong. The only issue has been when it ate its tranny at 190k miles.

[Onslaught]

It's kind of impossible to say exactly how long a car will last without giving problems. They can give you a problem after one week of driving them off the lot. But with most modern day cars I think they will last we'll over 200K if you take care of them. They probably won't look that great and have rattles and little things like window regulators that wont run up and down in them but will still get you from point A to B.
My car is almost 17 years old and has about 200K on her now. Other than the standard maintenance like oil, belts and filters and I've had to replace a catalytic converter, 3 clutch slave cylinders, one cam angle sensor gasket, a radiator and a brake master cylinder. And I would drive her across country right now without fear of anything going wrong.

[S204STi]

One of the customers at the dealership I used to work for a 1995 Buick Roadmaster he used as a taxi cab.  He worked for an airport cab company that required the driver's to buy the car new and keep them in good condition.  He sold the car in 2000, at which time it had 500,000 miles on the ORIGINAL LT1 350 V8.  The transmission burned out at 298,000 miles, and the rbuild unit was still going strong with just over 200,000 miles on it.  The exhaust was original (stainless steel).  He replaced 5 or 6 driver's side power window motors, however.

More to the point, the man was regular with his maintenance, oil changes with synthetic oil every 20,000 miles (4-5 changes a year), transmission service every 50,000 miles, coolant flush at the same time and complete tune up with platinum tipped spark plugs every 100,000 miles.  The engine was still running strong, no misfires, and only burned about a quart of oil every 5,000 miles or so.

I currently have a 1993 Jeep Cherokee with 208,000 miles, and the engine still runs like a top.  It's a manual transmission, which helps, as manuals are more reliable in the long run than automatics (other than the clutch)

I've seen 250,000 miles plus ona number of vehicle, but many were in rough shape.  Truly regular maintenance is pretty rare, even from mechanically oriented types.

Excellent examples, and welcome Bartender!

[Champ]

My roomate has a 1990 Celica with 275k miles on it, and my old Saab with 230k miles on it.  He drives both and never really has any problems with either.

I am also biased:
http://www.saabnet.com/tsn/faq/miles/miles900.html

[TheIntrepid]

I disagree with touraeg, to say the very least

Nowadays, if you do maintenance regularly, the bare minimum a car will go is 100k miles, and 200k is easily attained. In the 80s and early 90s, it is true that Japanese makes were a little better with reliability but nowadays that advantage has largely eroded away.

My dad has a 1990 Camry, and he is very strict about maintenance- to the point where he will often drive me nuts! The car gets oil changes every 3k miles, a coolant flush every spring, etc. He puts 25k miles on the car every year.

The car has 260k miles on it and it running strong. The only issue has been when it ate its tranny at 190k miles.

We had an '89 and a '90 Camry... both went well past 300k. The '89 Alltrac 4WD is still running...with a friend right now and at 523,000

[S204STi]

We had an '89 and a '90 Camry... both went well past 300k. The '89 Alltrac 4WD is still running...with a friend right now and at 523,000

But you are trying to say that certain makes don't do so hot when your experience is limited entirely to Toyota...of course you will have a good impression of them.

[TBR]

That is 325,000 miles, nothing too astonishing.

[TBR]

I'd say around 200k the engine and tranny will need a rebuild, no matter what.? All makes, all models.
Just an opinion, though- I've never driven a car that long. (I've only owned since 1997.)

I too have always bought used- the '99 I have is the newest but had 112k miles when we bought it (March06.)

I've bought other cars from 85k miles to 156k miles (1991 Taurus SHO in 2003,) and all of them have had minor problems.? As long as you fix them right away, and ask mechanics that have dealt with the vehicle in question, you can drive them a long time.? Some cars have particular weaknesses but by 5-8 years old people know of them, and you can get educated about them and catch them before they happen.

I'd say the WORSE thing to do to a used car is drive it with a known problem.? This creates much more hassle than it saves in the short run. -"I just need to get to work for 3 weeks until I can afford to fix it" will cause a major catastrophe..

Shut-up...

Actually, my car has no major problems, just a small coolant leak somewhere (it has never even come close to overheating) and something is wrong with the ABS. I am going to call a mechanic Tuesday to set-up an appointment for sometime the week after.

[TheIntrepid]

But you are trying to say that certain makes don't do so hot when your experience is limited entirely to Toyota...of course you will have a good impression of them.

My parents have been through leases of many cars in the last 15 years or so... so we're not limited to just Toyota. We've been through Subaru Legacy, Nissan Altima, Ford Explorer, Mercedes ML320, Volvo 850 GLT, VW Passat, Nissan Quest, Honda Civic, Nissan Sentra... the only ones that were PURCHASED as opposed to leased were Camrys.

[S204STi]

My parents have been through leases of many cars in the last 15 years or so... so we're not limited to just Toyota. We've been through Subaru Legacy, Nissan Altima, Ford Explorer, Mercedes ML320, Volvo 850 GLT, VW Passat, Nissan Quest, Honda Civic, Nissan Sentra... the only ones that were PURCHASED as opposed to leased were Camrys.

Ok, let me clarify...the only car company you have long-term reliability experience with is Toyota...

[TheIntrepid]

Ok, let me clarify...the only car company you have long-term reliability experience with is Toyota...

and Nissan...and Volvo.

edit: And with 140,000 on my Chrysler I'd say that's long-term too

[TBR]

That isn't even 90,000 miles, I wouldn't necessarily consider that long term.

[Danish]

140000 km is less than 100000 miles, that is practically nothing for a car these days

EDIT: TBR beat me to it

[MX793]

With proper maintenance and minimal abuse, I know of no reason why any modern car shouldn't be able to hold up at least 100K miles without a single "major" mechanical failure.  That's not to say it doesn't happen from time to time, as there are some lemons out there that slip through the cracks, but in general.  And when I say "major", I'm talking about things that aren't simple bolt-on parts failing.  Sure, it's possible your alternator or starter or wheel bearing might fail inside of 100K, but those are relatively straightforward fixes and I'd consider them minor.  When I say major, I'm talking mainly about blown engines and transmissions.  The kinds of problems that will have your car sitting in a shop for several days.