Mid-size Lux Sedans

[Raghavan]

Audis are plenty reliable, a couple of members have (or had) them, and the 2.0l Turbo engines are great.
You're just a Maxima troll.

[the Teuton]

I'm Serious. The Audi's have to be some of the biggest failures I have seen. It?s scary that they sell, with the reliability of Mercedes, but lack of name Benz recognition > I personally feel they are ugly cars, with sub par styling and Dynamics. It?s hard to imagine any real enthusiast liking any car they make.

If the RS4 wasn't $70k, I'd really like it.  I also like the A8 a ton.  It's a great car.

[the Teuton]

Oh yeah, Audi would have been a bigger company than Lexus or BMW most likely had they not had bad PR from pedals too close together in the 1980s.  Do some research.  Read "Six Men Who Built the Modern Auto Industry" and read about Ferdinanf Piech.  It's all in there. 

I don't particularly like the A4 because of all the past CV axle and electrical problems and it happens to be the same price as a 3er.  But that doesn't make that bad cars now.

[omicron]

I'm Serious. The Audi's have to be some of the biggest failures I have seen. It?s scary that they sell, with the reliability of Mercedes, but lack of name Benz recognition > I personally feel they are ugly cars, with sub par styling and Dynamics. It?s hard to imagine any real enthusiast liking any car they make.

Ahoy, Archibald.

Some of Audi's styling decisions of late aren't necessarily the best - the giant grille thing works on the performance models (S and RS), but it falls apart a bit for me when a a humble A4 2.0 on steel wheels has a gaping mouth like it's packing some serious aggression under the hood. Which it isn't.

Having said that, every aspect of Audi interiors is brilliantly built, logically designed, and smartly styled, and the A8 is exquisite.

[ArchBishop]

Ahoy, Archibald.

Some of Audi's styling decisions of late aren't necessarily the best - the giant grille thing works on the performance models (S and RS), but it falls apart a bit for me when a a humble A4 2.0 on steel wheels has a gaping mouth like it's packing some serious aggression under the hood. Which it isn't.

Having said that, every aspect of Audi interiors is brilliantly built, logically designed, and smartly styled, and the A8 is exquisite.

The Interiors are Top notch, and the A8 is an Awesome looking car. But Again, I say the styling and reliabity are lacking, and there are better choices for true enthusist cars.

[omicron]

The Interiors are Top notch, and the A8 is an Awesome looking car. But Again, I say the styling and reliabity are lacking, and there are better choices for true enthusist cars.

Styling and reliability are probably down to personal experience more than anything else, (and I like the styling but have not a clue as to their reliability), but from what I've read, a 3-series or G35 are likely to be more enjoyable at the limit than an A4. Then again, fun can be had in a 1973 Skoda with no power and wretched handling, and enjoyment can be very hard to define.

That doesn't include the RS4, of course.

[omicron]

I'll take this here A4 3.0 TDI in red, thanks.

[omicron]

I still haven't voted, because I haven't a clue as to what to vote for.

[850CSi]

The Interiors are Top notch, and the A8 is an Awesome looking car. But Again, I say the styling and reliabity are lacking, and there are better choices for true enthusist cars.

Styling is subjective.

And I would absolutely love to see you try and prove that reliability is a problem in new Audis. (Hint: you can't)

[ArchBishop]

Styling is subjective.

And I would absolutely love to see you try and prove that reliability is a problem in new Audis. (Hint: you can't)

The same way you can't prove it isn't.

But actually, I can prove that the reliablity it questionable becuase history is on my side.

According to CR
The Current generation A8 is has Been below average or worse since its introduction in 2004.

+1 for me.

The rest are rated at average for the 2006 model year, and every before had, pretty much poor.

The A6 was came out in 05, and earned just average in 05, and 06, though, one could argue with age, the can get worse (which will happen)

[Galaxy]

It?s hard to imagine any real enthusiast liking any car they make.

It is even harder to imagine that any real enthusiast would be so lacking in tolerance.

[850CSi]

According to CR
The Current generation A8 is has Been below average or worse since its introduction in 2004.

+1 for me.

The rest are rated at average for the 2006 model year, and every before had, pretty much poor.

The A6 was came out in 05, and earned just average in 05, and 06, though, one could argue with age, the can get worse (which will happen)

That's not proof because Consumer Reports has been proven to have suspect means of analyzing and collecting data over and over and over again. They're one of the most deceptive automotive publications out there (when they're not reviewing toasters).

[850CSi]

It is even harder to imagine that any real enthusiast would so lacking in tolerance.

Owned.

[Galaxy]

The same way you can't prove it isn't.

But actually, I can prove that the reliablity it questionable becuase history is on my side.

According to CR
The Current generation A8 is has Been below average or worse since its introduction in 2004.

+1 for me.

The rest are rated at average for the 2006 model year, and every before had, pretty much poor.

The A6 was came out in 05, and earned just average in 05, and 06, though, one could argue with age, the can get worse (which will happen)

Here is another statistik from the autoclub ADAC.? The ranking is based on the average number of defects/1000 vehicles from the model years 2000-2005. The numbers are in chronological order starting with the year 2000.

Note: Instead of displaying the info side by side the software choose to put it all in one row. One can not tell which model year was left out, due to the car not being produced in that year or not included in the statistik, due to the number of cars registered falling below 10000.? The link provides that info, should anyone be interested.


1?
Mercedes C??
25,8?
13,4?
8,7?
5,4?
2,5?
2,6
?
2?
BMW 3er??
21,7?
13,7?
11,7?
7,9?
3,4?
2,0?

3?
Audi A4/S4??
25,9?
14,4?
9,2?
4,9?
3,5?
3,4?

4?
Mazda 6??
9,1?
6,4?
5,4?
6,4?

5?
VW Passat??
21,2?
15,0?
12,1?
7,9?
5,8?
4,2?

6
Toyota Avensis/

Avensis Verso??
17,2?
15,7?
11,9?
7,7?
8,7?
5,9

7?
Skoda Octavia??
25,1?
16,3?
15,1?
9,5?
6,3?
6,8?

8?
Ford Mondeo??
23,7?
17,1?
20,9?
15,4?
10,3?
8,8?

9?
Nissan Primera??
20,0?
23,4?
21,1?
20,8?
16,5?
? ?
10?
Opel Vectra??
36,4?
30,7?
25,1?
15,4?
8,7?
6,6?

11?
Volvo S40/V40/V50??
26,2?
19,1?
17,6?
15,8?
12,4?
10,7?

12?
Renault Laguna??
39,9?
52,0?
50,4?
27,4?
11,0?
5,7?


http://www.adac.de/Auto_Motorrad/pannenstatistik_maengelforum/pannenstatistik_2005/Mittelklasse/default.asp?ComponentID=143922&SourcePageID=144103&MSCSProfile=589F5C6DB83ADBA41DAD47C9EEF9786D2831CEE971C544DA4C9E7A8C2ACE30A06A4C38312B214483088C7D7A3EF74C338DA087756CAB86704B64E6A3D822698974A5AD13F2E9B1A110A71AAE9F10EDEC0AD8AFE6BF975BE6AB4AE056885A13D3705D125D4A0B8D466DFC319B9C50DB710C87DE36F6EE30D5A59CD4A3ECD74834A00C7F410E9A7EB5


1
Audi A6/S6?
42,3
27,8
18,3
10,4
5,8
4,9

2
Mercedes S?
43,5
40,6
24,5
8,7
4,8
?

3
Mercedes E?
55,5
44,5
26,6
10,6
5,7
6,8

4
BMW 5er?
51,6
41,3
32,2
16,1
7,1
6,1

5
Volvo S60/S70/S80/V70?
58,8
46,6
33,3
18,0
12,2
12,2

6
Opel Signum?
25,1
15,7
7,0

7
Opel Omega?
65,2
66,2
55,2
?

http://www.adac.de/Auto_Motorrad/pannenstatistik_maengelforum/pannenstatistik_2005/Obere_Mittelklasse/default.asp?ComponentID=143923&SourcePageID=144103&MSCSProfile=589F5C6DB83ADBA41DAD47C9EEF9786D2831CEE971C544DA4C9E7A8C2ACE30A06A4C38312B214483088C7D7A3EF74C338DA087756CAB86704B64E6A3D822698974A5AD13F2E9B1A110A71AAE9F10EDEC0AD8AFE6BF975BE6AB4AE056885A13D3705D125D4A0B8D466DFC319B9C50DB710C87DE36F6EE30D5A59CD4A3ECD74834A00C7F410E9A7EB5

[FlatBlackCaddy]

What's FWHP?

I'll take heads.

Flywheel or Crank HP, just indicating that i wasn't quoting wheel horsepower figures.

[Raza]

I'm Serious. The Audi's have to be some of the biggest failures I have seen. It?s scary that they sell, with the reliability of Mercedes, but lack of name Benz recognition > I personally feel they are ugly cars, with sub par styling and Dynamics. It?s hard to imagine any real enthusiast liking any car they make.

[TheIntrepid]

I'm Serious. The Audi's have to be some of the biggest failures I have seen. It?s scary that they sell, with the reliability of Mercedes, but lack of name Benz recognition > I personally feel they are ugly cars, with sub par styling and Dynamics. It?s hard to imagine any real enthusiast liking any car they make.

Post is quoted for its sheer stupidity, and sigged.

[ChrisV]

Post is quoted for its sheer stupidity, and sigged.

And I get told I'm arrogant and censoring if I call an opinion anything close to stupid.

Once again, ArchBishop uses hyperbole, exaggeration, and half-formed opinion, and states it as incontrovertable fact.

Notice he states his opinion and how many people tell him he's wrong? or at least, a troll? Opinion isn't always right, nor is it even welcome. Especially when stated so insultingly confrontational, as his was.

[omicron]

Trep and ChrisV smell.

[ChrisV]

Trep and ChrisV smell.

Yes, my nose works and I can smell pretty good with it.

[omicron]

Yes, my nose works and I can smell pretty good with it.

You may have some ice-cream, then.

[ChrisV]

You may have some ice-cream, then.

Thank you. I do believe I will.

[Raghavan]

Thank you. I do believe I will.

I think you're too old for ice cream.

[ChrisV]

I think you're too old for ice cream.

It's easier to eat with my gums.

[Raghavan]

[chevyguy06]

[omicron]

Thank you. I do believe I will.

Sprinkles?

[Champ]

Front wheel HP

Sure but the car in question is RWD!

Flywheel or Crank HP, just indicating that i wasn't quoting wheel horsepower figures.

Gotcha, I believe the more normal term is BHP (break horsepower).  Or at least I would have understood what you were saying if you said that :D

[565]

Sure but the car in question is RWD!Gotcha, I believe the more normal term is BHP (break horsepower).? Or at least I would have understood what you were saying if you said that :D

We usually don't use the term BHP (brake horsepower) in America because our SAE net testing system is slightly different. 

[Champ]

We usually don't use the term BHP (brake horsepower) in America because our SAE net testing system is slightly different. 

Ahh too much top gear!