Audi S5 Lineup Could Gain 342HP V6 Diesel From SQ5
Despite the Dieselgate saga, oil burners are still being taken very seriously by the Volkswagen Group. In fact, they're so serious about them that they might launch new diesel-powered sporty cars, through the Audi brand.
The information comes via Automobile Magazine, which claims that the automaker is interested in launching diesel versions of the S5 Coupe, S5 Cabriolet and S5 Sportback. The French publication states that this is part of Audi's plans of lowering CO2 emissions across the range.
(https://images.carscoops.com/2019/03/39d8b6cc-2018-audi-s5-coupe-1.jpg)
So, what's the engine of choice here? If we were to give credit to the report, then that would be the 3.0-liter V6 TDI with mild-hybrid tech that powers the new SQ5 TDI. The mill is capable of pushing out 347 PS (342 hp / 255 kW) and 700 Nm (516 lb-ft) of torque. It comes with an eight-speed tiptronic transmission, permanent Quattro all-wheel drive and an electric powered compressor that debuted in the SQ7 TDI, which promises to get rid of the turbo lag completely.
As we already know, the 3.0-liter petrol engine of the outgoing S5 family is good for 354 PS (349 hp / 260 kW) and 500 Nm (369 lb-ft) of torque, and is connected to an eight-speed tiptronic gearbox.
Now, the report doesn't say when the alleged TDI-powered S5 models will hit the market, but Audi's already working on the facelifted A5, which is thought to debut in late 2019 or early 2020. This could mean the revamped S5 is perhaps 1-2 years away.
Link: https://www.carscoops.com/2019/03/audi-s5-lineup-could-gain-diesel-option-from-the-sq5/
Shoulda been a hybrid
Quote from: 12,000 RPM on March 15, 2019, 09:40:27 AM
Shoulda been a hybrid
From the article. :ohyeah:
So, what's the engine of choice here? If we were to give credit to the report, then that would be the 3.0-liter V6 TDI with mild-hybrid tech that powers the new SQ5 TDI.
A diesel is a complete waste of a sporty car
Quote from: r0tor on March 15, 2019, 12:42:18 PM
A diesel is a complete waste of a sporty car
www.youtube.com/watch?v=0M8O7RAM2aM
Not even r0tor is that brand loyal. Diesel performance cars are dumb
I remember when everyone got all excited about the "sporty" 335d like 10 years ago. And then no one actually bought one.
The internet is like Second Life for car enthusiasts.
Lol
Quote from: cawimmer430 on March 15, 2019, 01:33:11 PM
www.youtube.com/watch?v=0M8O7RAM2aM
I stand by my comment... Anyone buying a diesel Giulia should have their head examined
The only "performance diesel" ever sold in the US was the BMW 335d. And that was tame compared to the newer performance diesels we get here from Audi and newer BMWs. The BMW 550d for example was a beast.
But if anyone knows how to make a performance diesel it's Audi. Here's why... :ohyeah:
(https://i.pinimg.com/originals/05/71/9c/05719c1e4413014521df49ccfce8970d.jpg)
Why buy a diesel performance car when you can just get a regular performance car
If you say "so I can cruise at 350km/h for 5000km between fill ups" I will toss your computer out of a window
I just like the smell of diesel.
Quote from: 12,000 RPM on March 15, 2019, 09:31:23 PM
Why buy a diesel performance car when you can just get a regular performance car
If you say "so I can cruise at 350km/h for 5000km between fill ups" I will toss your computer out of a window
Different strokes for different folks, basically; there's something for everyone. But this is purely a European, if not German, phenomenon. Even rich people look at cost and for someone who drives many miles a year and wants both performance and fuel economy there really is no substitute for a diesel.
I was amazed at the fuel economy when I had that Audi Q2 30 TDI for the weekend, and I wasn't exactly driving it economically. I tended to stay in a gear below the recommended one and drove it very spirited. And still this thing returned roughly 5.1 L / 100 km (46 mpg). And that figure combined city, country road and spirited Autobahn driving (where I attempted to get it up to its max speed).
And yeah, the high-speed cruising while still achieving decent fuel economy and long range is part of the appeal. I'm typing this from my iPad - you will need to snatch it away from me if you wanna toss it out the window. :lol:
No thanks - lag + stink + noise + expensive, and diesel that powerful will be hell on ownership (i.e., Google the repair $$$ nightmares of American diesel pickups, esp. Fords).
Quote from: BimmerM3 on March 15, 2019, 03:37:48 PM
I remember when everyone got all excited about the "sporty" 335d like 10 years ago. And then no one actually bought one.
Or even worse, the V10 TDI Touareg.
Diesels in passenger vehicles in the US are just a terrible idea.
Quote from: GoCougs on March 16, 2019, 04:59:47 AM
No thanks - lag + stink + noise + expensive, and diesel that powerful will be hell on ownership (i.e., Google the repair $$$ nightmares of American diesel pickups, esp. Fords).
Are you living in the 1970s? :devil:
There really is no more noticeable lag on these modern Turbodiesels. They also don't smell. Maintenance costs are more expensive than a gasoline engine, but that has always been the case with diesels.
Also, if diesels were so "unreliable", they wouldn't be used by the trucking industry or taxi fleets. The only people who seem to have issues with their diesels, specifically their anti-pollution systems, are those who daily drive their diesels for short distances. A diesel is meant for long journeys, especially the modern ones that are packed full of emission control systems, which could end up clogging if they can never get hot and clean themselves. The same also applies to modern gasoline cars with particulate filters.
I'd love a diesel Giulia.
Actually, I'd probably choose a slightly used 2.2d. Unbeatable torque and mpgs.
I'd love the new Porsche Panamera 4S Diesel. Ridiculously good fuel economy (easily over 40 mpg) and range per fill up (something like 800 or 900 mpg). 0-60 mph in 4.5 sec. Not sold in the US though. I liked the diesel clatter of my Beetle. And the diesel fuel stink was whatever. Hardly noticed it. I carry Purell in my car anyways.
Quote from: cawimmer430 on March 16, 2019, 07:58:46 AM
Are you living in the 1970s? :devil:
There really is no more noticeable lag on these modern Turbodiesels. They also don't smell. Maintenance costs are more expensive than a gasoline engine, but that has always been the case with diesels.
Also, if diesels were so "unreliable", they wouldn't be used by the trucking industry or taxi fleets. The only people who seem to have issues with their diesels, specifically their anti-pollution systems, are those who daily drive their diesels for short distances. A diesel is meant for long journeys, especially the modern ones that are packed full of emission control systems, which could end up clogging if they can never get hot and clean themselves. The same also applies to modern gasoline cars with particulate filters.
Hybrids get the same range and can make the same torque with similar purchase costs, no clatter/stink, and much lower maintenance.
If diesels were so great, they wouldn't be dying.
Quote from: 12,000 RPM on March 16, 2019, 11:28:43 AM
Hybrids get the same range and can make the same torque with similar purchase costs, no clatter/stink, and much lower maintenance.
Have you driven on the German Autobahn? A hybrid, with the extra weight, would definitely get worse fuel economy than a comparable diesel given the driving conditions on it. The electric motor of a hybrid is useless and inactive on a highway. A hybrid is really only effective in the city over a standards ICE-car.
Quote from: 12,000 RPM on March 16, 2019, 11:28:43 AMIf diesels were so great, they wouldn't be dying.
If the internal combustion engine were so great it wouldn't be dying.
Oh my god, you guys and the "clatter and stink" argument. These aren't fucking school busses. These are small diesel engines in the year 2019. They don't clatter, they don't stink.
Quote from: cawimmer430 on March 16, 2019, 12:11:11 PM
Have you driven on the German Autobahn? A hybrid, with the extra weight, would definitely get worse fuel economy than a comparable diesel given the driving conditions on it. The electric motor of a hybrid is useless and inactive on a highway. A hybrid is really only effective in the city over a standards ICE-car.
Show me high speed fuel economy figures for comparable diesels and hybrids.
And the concept of caring about fuel economy at 200km/h plus makes no sense to me. If you want to save fuel slow down :huh:
Quote from: cawimmer430 on March 16, 2019, 12:11:11 PM
If the internal combustion engine were so great it wouldn't be dying.
Diesel is dying at a much faster rate than gasoline. It's debatable whether or not gasoline is even dying at all. Look at real life and not what the news wants to get you upset about.
Pretty much everywhere else in the world most people are not driving faster than 140km/h and even Germany has cities. So overall hybrids make more sense than diesels for saving fuel.
Germany is like a third bigger than the state of Michigan with nearly 10x the population. Where the fuck you drivin' 100+mph for more than 93 seconds.
Quote from: cawimmer430 on March 16, 2019, 07:58:46 AM
Are you living in the 1970s? :devil:
There really is no more noticeable lag on these modern Turbodiesels. They also don't smell. Maintenance costs are more expensive than a gasoline engine, but that has always been the case with diesels.
Also, if diesels were so "unreliable", they wouldn't be used by the trucking industry or taxi fleets. The only people who seem to have issues with their diesels, specifically their anti-pollution systems, are those who daily drive their diesels for short distances. A diesel is meant for long journeys, especially the modern ones that are packed full of emission control systems, which could end up clogging if they can never get hot and clean themselves. The same also applies to modern gasoline cars with particulate filters.
They still stink, and are still loud and expensive. And even if not, diesel fuel itself is 10x worse than gasoline in that it isn't nearly as volatile - diesel pumps are always a greasy, smelly mess.
Commercial diesels are quite reliable because they're built that way, particularly the hp/liter is half to a third that of retail diesels, plus they are not subject to nearly as stringent emissions regs (at least in the USA).
Quote from: 12,000 RPM on March 16, 2019, 11:28:43 AM
Hybrids get the same range and can make the same torque with similar purchase costs, no clatter/stink, and much lower maintenance.
If diesels were so great, they wouldn't be dying.
I'm not defending performance diesels, but how do hybrids, that a much more complicated system, have lower maintenance? I genuinely want to know.
Quote from: 12,000 RPM on March 16, 2019, 12:39:33 PM
Show me high speed fuel economy figures for comparable diesels and hybrids.
I couldn't find anything related to high-speed driving, but this was the closest review I could find. The BMW 730d vs the BMW ActiveHybrid7. The diesel-powered 730d got better fuel economy on the Autobahn (and surprisingly also in the city). Review is in German, no English subtitles.
www.youtube.com/watch?v=qWXjGIKKeM0
Quote from: 12,000 RPM on March 16, 2019, 12:39:33 PMAnd the concept of caring about fuel economy at 200km/h plus makes no sense to me. If you want to save fuel slow down :huh:
I totally agree. The best fuel economy is achieved by cruising and avoiding acceleration, braking etc.
But a Hybrid is not going to get you good gas mileage on Germany's Autobahns where the electric motor is inactive and ICE has to lug around the extra weight of the batteries/electric motor.
I know that Toyota/Lexus hybrids use the Atkinson cycle, which favors efficiency over performance. That might help at cruising speed.
Quote from: 12,000 RPM on March 16, 2019, 12:39:33 PMDiesel is dying at a much faster rate than gasoline. It's debatable whether or not gasoline is even dying at all. Look at real life and not what the news wants to get you upset about.
Diesel sales have gone up again in Europe, and the Diesel engine, at least here, is not going anywhere for a long time. Europe is shooting itself in the foot with their desire to reduce CO2 emissions but wage a ridiculous war on clean EURO6 diesels. The hysteria over here is borderline pathetic.
Ban diesels (and soon gasoline cars) from the cities to promote clean air, but allow millions of smokers to harm the health of those around them. Idiotic.
Quote from: 12,000 RPM on March 16, 2019, 12:39:33 PMPretty much everywhere else in the world most people are not driving faster than 140km/h and even Germany has cities. So overall hybrids make more sense than diesels for saving fuel.
EVs make the most sense for city driving. I wouldn't mind an EV (Renault Zoe) for city driving, but the short range and long charging times are a turn off and make an EV unsuited for my driving needs.
Quote from: GoCougs on March 16, 2019, 11:30:59 PM
They still stink, and are still loud and expensive. And even if not, diesel fuel itself is 10x worse than gasoline in that it isn't nearly as volatile - diesel pumps are always a greasy, smelly mess.
That's not the case here. Diesel pumps are integrated into standard gasoline pumps here and they're clean as can be.
Does the US still use high sulphur diesel?
Modern diesels do not smell. I had an Audi Q2 30 TDI for a weekend - didn't smell when the engine was cold. Left the engine idling during photos I took of it to keep the instruments on - no smell.
I have daily shoots with a company that sells high-end luxury SUVs, predominantly the new Mercedes G-Class and Range Rovers. Most of the Range Rovers they sell are powered by Diesel engines, and we keep the engine idling during the shoot; no black smoke, no smell. The same is true for the latest Mercedes G350d I shot a few weeks ago; no black smoke, no smell. In fact you could hardly hear the engine idling on the outside.
Quote from: GoCougs on March 16, 2019, 11:30:59 PMCommercial diesels are quite reliable because they're built that way, particularly the hp/liter is half to a third that of retail diesels, plus they are not subject to nearly as stringent emissions regs (at least in the USA).
In Europe trucks had more stringent emissions requirements than cars, which is why the use of Urea/SCR was widespread in Western European trucks.
Quote from: Raza on March 18, 2019, 06:22:40 AM
I'm not defending performance diesels, but how do hybrids, that a much more complicated system, have lower maintenance? I genuinely want to know.
The electric side of the hybrid system picks up the slack. It allows the engine to run less, enabling longer stretches between oil changes. And it takes a good bit of load off the brakes. I've heard stories of hybrid owners getting rusty brake rotors because they did so much regenerative braking.
Hybrids sound complicated but IMO they are simpler than the lengths manufacturers are having to go to make standalone ICEs viable for future emissions regs. The gas engines in Honda/Toyota hybrids are so simple compared to their standalone gas engines and the electric side stuff isn't anything crazy.
Diesel fuel itself is smelly, and the smell lingers far longer than gasoline because diesel doesn't evaporate as readily as gasoline.
Quote from: cawimmer430 on March 18, 2019, 07:32:45 AM
Modern diesels do not smell. I had an Audi Q2 30 TDI for a weekend - didn't smell when the engine was cold. Left the engine idling during photos I took of it to keep the instruments on - no smell.
I dunno, it depends on how stringent your definition of "modern" is, but in France there are plenty of new-ish (5yo) diesels which leave a lingering diesel smell when they drive by.
I hate the smell of diesel on my hands when I fill the car up, too. Blechhh
Yep, now that I've been riding my new bike near/in more traffic, modern diesel passenger vehicles absolutely do smell.
Yeah, 'cause now they have to dump deer piss in the exhaust. :lol:
Quote from: MX793 on March 18, 2019, 08:51:50 AM
Diesel fuel itself is smelly, and the smell lingers far longer than gasoline because diesel doesn't evaporate as readily as gasoline.
You can get diesel that no longer smells, however these are around 8 cents per liter more expensive.
For what it's worth I love the way diesel exhaust smells. If I could let an engine run in my garage without any ill side effects, I would do it.
Quote from: GoCougs on March 18, 2019, 03:29:49 PM
Yep, now that I've been riding my new bike near/in more traffic, modern diesel passenger vehicles absolutely do smell.
Cummins Rams are the worst by far. You can really feel the fly ash get into your lungs, and they're often modded to be ridiculously loud when they pass. I rode past one yesterday (or rather, he rode past me) which had some kind of ridiculous turbo wastegate mod that nearly made my ears bleed.
Mothers/fathers, love your sons, lest they drive brodozers for the attention you never gave them.
Quote from: Laconian on March 18, 2019, 10:07:58 PM
Cummins Rams are the worst by far. You can really feel the fly ash get into your lungs, and they're often modded to be ridiculously loud when they pass. I rode past one yesterday (or rather, he rode past me) which had some kind of ridiculous turbo wastegate mod that nearly made my ears bleed.
Diesels don't even have an engine note. Just a single tone that sounds like "loud".
Quote from: CaminoRacer on March 19, 2019, 09:19:11 AM
Diesels don't even have an engine note. Just a single tone that sounds like "loud".
Sure they have a tone. It's like
BLASSAAAA Kk K BannnnAAAAAA ASGk
BrrrRRAAS SSDSSSHHH .. J J JPTTTTSSAAA AAAAPP PP P P ..... BRRROA WNNNNNNNNNN ...
Quote from: HurricaneSteve on March 18, 2019, 07:53:27 PM
For what it's worth I love the way diesel exhaust smells. If I could let an engine run in my garage without any ill side effects, I would do it.
Same. Also, asphalt. If I could drive behind a hot asphalt truck all day, dammit I would.
Quote from: giant_mtb on March 19, 2019, 09:50:34 AM
Same. Also, asphalt. If I could drive behind a hot asphalt truck all day, dammit I would.
Gasoline is my weakness. Loved the smell of gasoline ever since I was a kid. One day when I was 8 or 10, i decided to unscrew the gas cap on the tractor, which was on top of the cowling just in front of the steering wheel, and just stand there with my nose to the open tank and breath in the fumes. Damned near turned green and almost fell off of the platform. Didn't put me off of loving the smell though.
Quote from: FoMoJo on March 19, 2019, 09:55:28 AM
Gasoline is my weakness. Loved the smell of gasoline ever since I was a kid. One day when I was 8 or 10, i decided to unscrew the gas cap on the tractor, which was on top of the cowling just in front of the steering wheel, and just stand there with my nose to the open tank and breath in the fumes. Damned near turned green and almost fell off of the platform. Didn't put me off of loving the smell though.
Yes, gas smells good. Though I smell it frequently enough nowadays that it doesn't get me like it used to. Asphalt or a school bus are rarer smells. :lol:
Quote from: FoMoJo on March 19, 2019, 09:55:28 AM
Gasoline is my weakness. Loved the smell of gasoline ever since I was a kid. One day when I was 8 or 10, i decided to unscrew the gas cap on the tractor, which was on top of the cowling just in front of the steering wheel, and just stand there with my nose to the open tank and breath in the fumes. Damned near turned green and almost fell off of the platform. Didn't put me off of loving the smell though.
Leaded, 108+ octane race gas... Almost smells sweet. The newer, unleaded stuff has a much harsher smell.
Unburned hydrocarbons and tire shops. Mmm, delicious cancer.
Quote from: Laconian on March 18, 2019, 02:47:13 PM
I dunno, it depends on how stringent your definition of "modern" is, but in France there are plenty of new-ish (5yo) diesels which leave a lingering diesel smell when they drive by.
I hate the smell of diesel on my hands when I fill the car up, too. Blechhh
Older diesels may smell depending on their level of exhaust cleaning, and France is way more relaxed about emissions than Germany. And I am stating that the
NEWER diesels do not smell, especially once they've reached their optimal operating temperature.
I can only reiterate my experience with the new Range Rover diesels and Mercedes G350d, the Audi Q2 30 TDI and the new Mercedes E-Class Taxis (there's a taxi stand near my place in a quiet area, if a taxi idles I can't smell anything offensive when passing it).
Of course some older diesels will smell, especially many of the Eastern European diesels, which are probably entering this country without a catalytic converter and/or have their pollution control systems removed to save money. That's quite a common practice over there.
Quote from: Laconian on March 19, 2019, 07:55:43 PM
Unburned hydrocarbons and tire shops. Mmm, delicious cancer.
I have my RE-71Rs sitting in our second bedroom. I can smell tire shop anytime I want!