Time to replace the aging battery in my 740. It's been several years since I've had to replace a battery, so I'm due for one. Naturally, I ring up all the usual places (Sears, AutoZone, Pep Boys, etc.) looking for the best deal and....... WOW! Was I in for a shock!
I can remember when you could pick up a battery almost anywhere for $29.95. The last battery I bought was about $40.00. But almost everywhere I checked today quoted me prices just under $100.00! WTF!?!
The cheapest was CarQuest (usually the most expensive place for everything else) who wanted $81.99 for a battery. Sears wanted $124.99! A couple of places had batteries going for $150.00! But, for the most part, prices ranged between $90.00 and $100.00.
Why?
I asked the girl who answered the phone at one place why batteries are so much more expensive now than they were the last time I bought one. She said something about the price of lead going up three-fold in the last couple of years. Is this true? And, if so, why has lead gone up so high? You'd think these fucking things were made of gold, instead of lead, considering the prices they're charging!
So, does anybody know what the hell is going on? Better yet, does anyone know where I can buy a new battery that doesn't cost an arm and a leg?
Cheers,
Madman of the People
Around $80 sounds right to me, I spent about $85 for a battery on a Corolla a few years back.
I didn't know batteries were that expensive.
Suck it up and go to Walmart. And you can always cheap out more by getting a smaller one.
Quote from: NACar on January 04, 2010, 06:34:44 PM
Suck it up and go to Walmart. And you can always cheap out more by getting a smaller one.
Does the size of battery really matter?
Quote from: 2o6 on January 04, 2010, 06:40:51 PM
Does the size of battery really matter?
It's nice when the battery drops nicely into the tray and hooks right up to the cables, but all it really needs to do is crank the engine over.
Quote from: 2o6 on January 04, 2010, 06:30:36 PM
I didn't know batteries were that expensive.
Not surprising...
:lol:
Quote from: 2o6 on January 04, 2010, 06:30:36 PM
I didn't know batteries were that expensive.
Someone has to pay for that eight year warranty with the 18 month free replacement.
It's hard for me to understand the price of batteries skyrocketing, but the answer really lies in the warranty.
When I worked at the parts store/s in SF, 36 month, 48 month, and 60 month....$29.95, 39.95, 49.95. The warranty increased with the price along with the CCA. I've had batteries brought in for warranty and the pro-rated price was more than that week's sale price.
Quote from: 2o6 on January 04, 2010, 06:40:51 PM
Does the size of battery really matter?
Physical size is physical size. Get something that FITS into the car.
Then Quality comes into play. You can cheap out and get a weaker battery with a shorter warranty, or get a better one. Just depends on you.
The kids left a single interior light on in the van overnight last month and it wouldn't even try to crank the next day. Not even enough juice to take it out of park so I could roll it out of the garage!!!!?!?!??!!!!!
--I just bought the van 6months ago, no idea how old the battery was (except it wasn't OEM.)
-I figured might as well get the best they had, which was $90, cheapie (of the same physical size) could be had for around $60. (After core return!)
In the nearly 5 years I've been repairing cars I can't remember a time when they were any less than $100 for a quality battery. I would assume that so many factors have changed since the last time you bought a battery, everything from inflation to materials cost to plain gouging, which makes it seem like such a dramatic jump in such a short period, whereas it probably started over 10 years ago.
They were $125 for the batteries used in Mercedes Benzes as long as I've been driving.
I bought a used Duralast battery when mine went kaput in my Subaru a few years back. That thing was $20, I believe, and it never failed on me.
Sure, batteries have gone up in price, but when you think about it, they're not terribly expensive. You get 3-4 years worth of thousands of engine starts and power for $100. :huh:
Quote from: AutobahnSHO on January 05, 2010, 05:21:46 AM
Physical size is physical size. Get something that FITS into the car.
Then Quality comes into play. You can cheap out and get a weaker battery with a shorter warranty, or get a better one. Just depends on you.
The kids left a single interior light on in the van overnight last month and it wouldn't even try to crank the next day. Not even enough juice to take it out of park so I could roll it out of the garage!!!!?!?!??!!!!!
--I just bought the van 6months ago, no idea how old the battery was (except it wasn't OEM.)
-I figured might as well get the best they had, which was $90, cheapie (of the same physical size) could be had for around $60. (After core return!)
Will you didn't try to charge the battery and then sticking it back in the van?
BTW, batteries have a date code on the side. Usually a small round sticker with a letter and a number...like "A8". The letter is the month, the number the year. For "A8" it would be Jan 2008.
Quote from: Danish on January 05, 2010, 03:54:49 PM
Will you didn't try to charge the battery and then sticking it back in the van?
No, if leaving one little light on for 8hrs killed it, I was pretty sure it was toast.
I didn't want to leave the wife stranded that day while I took the battery to charge, and it is a used van, I wasn't sure how old the original battery was. It wasn't really that worth my time to go charge and hope it was still good. (I've played that game before- of getting jumps several times in a week.)
Plus now I'm making enough $$ to not be such a cheapskate. ;)
Come to think of it, I have actually never had to buy a car battery. :praise:
I don't know how true this is but I was once told that it's best to buy the mid priced battery for a car. They typically last as long as the top of the line batteries and you are largely paying the extra for the added warranty.
I've always bought batteries using that rule and get 5-6 years out of them. The last 3 I've bought at Walmart and paid around $50. I haven't bought one in over 2 years though so I don't know what current prricing is.
Well, I finally bit the bullet and bought a battery. A mechanic friend got me a wholesale deal on a Bosch battery. It was $82.00, the same price CarQuest wanted for their generic no-name battery.
I guess the days of $29.95 batteries are long over. I got nearly a decade's worth of service out of the old one, so I'd better get at least as much (if not more) from this one!
Cheers,
Madman of the People
Quote from: giant_mtb on January 05, 2010, 12:33:39 PM
Sure, batteries have gone up in price, but when you think about it, they're not terribly expensive. You get 3-4 years worth of thousands of engine starts and power for $100. :huh:
I get more than that on $40 el-cheapos from Wallyworld.
Quote from: Byteme on January 06, 2010, 11:12:22 AM
I've always bought batteries using that rule and get 5-6 years out of them. The last 3 I've bought at Walmart and paid around $50. I haven't bought one in over 2 years though so I don't know what current prricing is.
:hesaid:
Meh, I just had to fork over $130 for a new battery here in Socialist Europe.
Don't whine :rage: :lol:
Quote from: mzziaz on January 07, 2010, 12:13:22 AM
Meh, I just had to fork over $130 for a new battery here in Socialist Europe.
Don't whine :rage: :lol:
Ouch. What kind? lots of CCA?
I spent $68 on mine. It's gotta be able to turn the engine over in -1 billion weather. Warranted for 6 years, but I expect 3 or 4 out of it if the winters keep up like this.
Do batteries typically have higher CCA compared to regular CA?
Quote from: giant_mtb on January 29, 2010, 11:03:03 AM
Do batteries typically have higher CCA compared to regular CA?
Cranking Amps will be higher than Cold Cranking Amps. For those of us that deal with winter, CCA is a more important number, though. My battery (when new) delivered 660 CCA. Cranking amps were somewhere around 830, IIRC.
http://www.absolutebattery.com/help.htm#cca
QuoteCranking amps are the numbers of amperes a lead-acid battery at 32 degrees F (0 degrees C) can deliver for 30 seconds and maintain at least 1.2 volts per cell (7.2 volts for a 12 volt battery). In other words, CA/cranking amps determine how much power you have to start your car in most climates. The basic job of a battery is to start an engine; it must crank, or rotate the crankshaft while at the same time maintain sufficient voltage to activate the ignition system until the engine fires and maintains rotation. This requirement involves a high discharge rate in amperes for a short period of time. Since it is more difficult for a battery to deliver power when it is cold, and since the engine requires more power to turn over when it is cold, the Cold Cranking rating is defined as: The number of amperes a lead-acid battery at 0 degrees F (-17.8 degrees C) can deliver for 30 seconds and maintain at least 1.2 volts per cell (7.2 volts for a 12-volt battery). In other words, CCA/cold cranking amps determine how much power you have to start your car on cold winter mornings.
I know what winter is lolz. I was asking more from a physics standpoint. At colder temperatures, shouldn't a battery be able to deliver more amps because the atoms are moving slower and there is thus less resistance for the electrons that are moving through the system? Apparently that's not the case, but why?
Quote from: giant_mtb on January 29, 2010, 12:10:04 PM
I know what winter is lolz. I was asking more from a physics standpoint. At colder temperatures, shouldn't a battery be able to deliver more amps because the atoms are moving slower and there is thus less resistance for the electrons that are moving through the system? Apparently that's not the case, but why?
The car battery is a chemical reaction which causes the electrons to start moving. The acid vs. lead reaction doesn't do so well when it's cold.
...isn't electron speed constant?
I just steal them out of totaled cars. Haven't had a Miata in a long time. God, I'll have to buy my next one!
I replaced my pootly little "I'm pretending to be an AGM battery" with an Optima. It cost me $150 and doesn't quite fit right, but it spins the starter like He-Man in 10 degree weather compared to my old thing.
Red tops are le crap.
Quote from: giant_mtb on January 29, 2010, 12:49:52 PM
...isn't electron speed constant?
YES. But almost all chemical reactions depend on temperature. Imagine trying to mix hot cocoa powder into Cold Water. You get lots of lumps.
-Do it with (almost) boiling water and the cocoa disappears into pure yuminess.
A battery is acid and lead, (plus other stuff?) Chemically they don't like each other- so a bunch of electrons get all anxious to get out of there. As soon as you hook up the cables and make a circuit they go racing out.
When it's cold it's not that the electrons go any slower, it's that the acid vs. lead hate-thing isn't as strong.
Some guys have them fail therefore everything is shit, apparently.
Quote from: AutobahnSHO on January 31, 2010, 06:12:44 AM
YES. But almost all chemical reactions depend on temperature. Imagine trying to mix hot cocoa powder into Cold Water. You get lots of lumps.
-Do it with (almost) boiling water and the cocoa disappears into pure yuminess.
A battery is acid and lead, (plus other stuff?) Chemically they don't like each other- so a bunch of electrons get all anxious to get out of there. As soon as you hook up the cables and make a circuit they go racing out.
When it's cold it's not that the electrons go any slower, it's that the acid vs. lead hate-thing isn't as strong.
Gotcha! :ohyeah:
Optima batteries became popular because they can be mounted in any position and not have to worry about them leaking.... somewhere along the line, that fact got lost and everyone just pays the premium for them and mounts them like a normal battery and expects them to outperform a regular battery (because they paid more)which they dont...
Quote from: r0tor on February 01, 2010, 09:53:47 AM
Optima batteries became popular because they can be mounted in any position and not have to worry about them leaking.... somewhere along the line, that fact got lost and everyone just pays the premium for them and mounts them like a normal battery and expects them to outperform a regular battery (because they paid more)which they dont...
I seem to recall an issue with Optimas being more sensitive to deep discharges that regular lead acid batteries. Something like that anyway
Quote from: r0tor on February 01, 2010, 09:53:47 AM
Optima batteries became popular because they can be mounted in any position and not have to worry about them leaking.... somewhere along the line, that fact got lost and everyone just pays the premium for them and mounts them like a normal battery and expects them to outperform a regular battery (because they paid more)which they dont...
they also work great in race cars and offroaders as they don't have a problem with internal plates vibrating or coming into contact with eatch other. I've had cheaper batteries die during autocrossing when the internal plates came in contact with each other under lateral G loading. Optimas didn't have that problem.
Both the BMW and Rangie needed batteries. In both cases, I was replacing the original ones that were about 8 years old at the time of replacement and simply wouldnt' hold a charge again. the rangies is a $120 deep cycle heavy duty one rated for offroad use, while the BMW's is just a honking big battery. $190 from BMW ( :rolleyes: ) or about $100 for a Duralast version that fits.
(http://www.bimmerboard.com/members/rolanddv/IMGP2601.jpg)
I'm just glad that I didn't have to replace the batteries in a 750, as there are two of them of that size.
The 750 has two batteries?!
I asked a guy in a (2002?) 3er if I could get a jump one time, but had to ask someone else. He was trying to put the cables on the battery IN THE TRUNK when there was a little sign saying to use some contact points under the hood to jump..
Quote from: Northlands on January 29, 2010, 10:21:31 AM
Ouch. What kind? lots of CCA?
I spent $68 on mine. It's gotta be able to turn the engine over in -1 billion weather. Warranted for 6 years, but I expect 3 or 4 out of it if the winters keep up like this.
Me not know what CCA is.
It was a 63amp cheapo. :facepalm:
Quote from: mzziaz on February 03, 2010, 11:27:53 AM
Me not know what CCA is.
It was a 63amp cheapo. :facepalm:
Cold Cranking Amps.
Vs. the regular amps.
Don't let your battery fully discharge during the winter. The electrolyte can freeze and damage the plates.
Quote from: sparkplug on February 04, 2010, 11:10:39 PM
Don't let your battery fully discharge during the winter. The electrolyte can freeze and damage the plates.
I've never heard that, but I know that repeated discharges and charging causes sulfation damage which eventually shorts the battery.
I've heard of it happening. In fact, my SnapOn jumper box has a warning on it about trying to jump start frozen batteries.