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Auto Talk => The Garage => Topic started by: Submariner on June 01, 2021, 04:12:42 PM

Title: Rust removal and prevention
Post by: Submariner on June 01, 2021, 04:12:42 PM
I'm trying to figure out how to deal with the rust on my truck.  I'd like to do remove the scale on the chassis, deal with the few points of oxidation on the body, paint the underside and treat the entire body with some kind of oil-preventative. 

The chassis has a fair bit of rust, though it's all surface (rather than structural) in nature.  I'd like to sand it down (along with the axles, etc) and apply something like POR-15 followed by some satin black rust-o-leum (as I understand, POR-15 is extremely durable but will rapidly deteriorate with exposure to UV light).  I'd also like to treat the inside of the fully boxed frame (Eastwood Internal frame coating?) but I can't quite figure out how to get all the debris/dirt out of there. 

This isn't a frame off job.  I'm not sure how to sand or paint in between the floorpan and the top of the chassis or any other important components.  I've watched hours and hours of videos and none seem to really get into the weeds so to speak.  I'm also not sure as to what parts I should and should not paint.  The other big issue is how I go about getting the truck up in the air in the first place?  There aren't places locally where I can rent a lift, and even with jack stands, getting all 6'3" of me under a truck is thrown-out-back in the making.  It sounds like I am talking myself out of doing this, doesn't it?  :lol:

After I get the underside cleaned and painted, I'm going to tackle the surface rust.  There are five or six spots on the body.  Every one has been spot treated with a blast of WD-40 Corrosion Preventative.  It seems to work quite well, as none of the spots have progressed since application.  I also applied a test spot to the front bumper and after almost a year, it's still there.  As of now, the rust hasn't broken through the paint. 

Once the surface rust is fixed, I'm going to have some kind of oil applied to the underside of all body panels.  I've read up on a hundred different oils (WD40, NHOIL, LPS, Fluid Film, Linseed Oil, bar and chain oil (I like this because it is so damn sticky and doesn't drip even under high heat), waxes, tars, etc.  I'm not sure which one to go with but I'm almost positive this will be a professional job rather than a DIY.

Depending on price, proximity to me and quality, I may have the chassis cleaned/painted by a professional.  If I can't find a lift to rent or use near me, this will definitely be the case.  I'm going to post this now and add pictures/updates as they occur.  In the meantime, if anyone has any tips/tricks/or ideas to share, I'd be much obliged.
Title: Re: Rust removal and prevention
Post by: CaminoRacer on June 01, 2021, 05:00:03 PM
The nice thing about POR-15 is that it likes an abrasive surface, so you don't have to sand much. Just knock any loose crap off and you should be good to go, from what I understand. Maybe a once-over with a wire brush attachment. But POR-15 actually needs a coat of metal prep for new/smooth metal, in order to etch it enough for the paint to get a good hold.

If all parts of the chassis are under the car, a top coat to hide it from UV might be unnecessary.

My favorite rust prevention is to just let my engine leak enough that the underbody always has a decent coat of fresh oil. :lol:
Title: Re: Rust removal and prevention
Post by: shp4man on June 01, 2021, 05:37:53 PM
Need pic of this vehicle!  :ohyeah:
Title: Re: Rust removal and prevention
Post by: Submariner on June 01, 2021, 08:21:38 PM
Quote from: CaminoRacer on June 01, 2021, 05:00:03 PM
The nice thing about POR-15 is that it likes an abrasive surface, so you don't have to sand much. Just knock any loose crap off and you should be good to go, from what I understand. Maybe a once-over with a wire brush attachment. But POR-15 actually needs a coat of metal prep for new/smooth metal, in order to etch it enough for the paint to get a good hold.

If all parts of the chassis are under the car, a top coat to hide it from UV might be unnecessary.

My favorite rust prevention is to just let my engine leak enough that the underbody always has a decent coat of fresh oil. :lol:

I think a wire wheel plus a sander ought to do the trick.  I don't think I'll even need a needle scaler.  But we will see.

The annoying thing about this is that every coating subtype has its own brand of followers.  I've read tons of good stuff about POR only to stumble across a hot rod restoration forum where every guy worships epoxy and thinks POR is garbage lol.  I really don't know what route to go!!!
Title: Re: Rust removal and prevention
Post by: Submariner on June 02, 2021, 10:03:55 AM
Quote from: shp4man on June 01, 2021, 05:37:53 PM
Need pic of this vehicle!  :ohyeah:

I'm going to try to figure out how to take pictures of the chassis.  Not sure how to take good ones.

There is a place about 45 minutes away that rents out lifts for reasonable prices, but this is easily going to be a multi day job, and I can't really prep on one day, drive home, then return the next, etc.  The vehicle needs to stay in place. 

Now I'm looking at coal tar epoxy, which is apparently the stuff used on deep sea oil rigs.  If it can protect derricks against salt water, it should be good on my truck, but then again it sounds like it's very difficult to apply.  Is a zinc-heavy primer plus a few coats of rust-o-leum my best bet?
Title: Re: Rust removal and prevention
Post by: Submariner on June 02, 2021, 10:05:09 AM
Seems like rust reformer is kind of a problem too - I'm reading that it can actually promote rust on clean surfaces?  What if the rust is diffuse enough that it's not really possible to paint only the rusted areas?

I did a hack job paint job on the front skid guard about five months ago.  I sanded it down with a wire cup and some medium grit sandpaper and hit it with three coats of rustoleum satin enamel.  I don't think I even primed it.  It was a test case really - something that can be easily removed and redone if necessary.  It's held up nicely thus far and is subject more more spray and rock damage than most parts of the chassis.  I might just to some Eastwood interior frame encapsulator, a few layers of zinc-primer plus a few satin-black top coats.  Is there any adverse interaction between the zinc-rich primer and oil paints?  Satin epoxies look nice but it seems to be a bit more challenging than using regular old oil-based spray paint.
Title: Re: Rust removal and prevention
Post by: Submariner on June 02, 2021, 10:06:06 AM
I literally dreamt about different types of coatings all last night.
Title: Re: Rust removal and prevention
Post by: CaminoRacer on June 02, 2021, 10:13:53 AM
Quote from: Submariner on June 02, 2021, 10:06:06 AM
I literally dreamt about different types of coatings all last night.

:winkguy:
Title: Re: Rust removal and prevention
Post by: Submariner on June 02, 2021, 12:36:42 PM
Some terrible before/after photos of the skid plate:

(https://i.imgur.com/JqEo1Zp.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/EMfUfvp.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/Ya9SEWI.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/RZHEuJf.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/5leYr1D.jpg)
Title: Re: Rust removal and prevention
Post by: Submariner on June 02, 2021, 01:10:34 PM
I don't know WTF the gunk in the third picture was...all I know is it took an hour of hammering and chiseling it away before it was removed.  It smelled faintly of tar, though how it got there was a mystery.  It was however perfectly rust free underneath, so...succsss?

If you look closely you can still see some bubbling underneath the paint.  The wire cup+cordless drill combo isn't the most aggressive sanding option available, but all of the loose stuff was removed.  Hopefully the rust oleum will keep it from spreading.  If it does, I'll just take it off, get it sandblasted, fill in the dents, and give it a proper paint job.
Title: Re: Rust removal and prevention
Post by: Submariner on June 02, 2021, 02:12:08 PM
Learned a few important things:
-no matter how warm and dry it is in your garage, assume the paint takes way longer to dry than advertised.
-use wax paper to rest the pieces on.  Even if they are dry, newspaper will stick and potentially foul the paint.
-this is way harder than it looks.
Title: Re: Rust removal and prevention
Post by: MX793 on June 02, 2021, 02:16:58 PM
Wire coat hanger, suspend from ceiling.
Title: Re: Rust removal and prevention
Post by: Submariner on June 02, 2021, 03:21:48 PM
Right, that too.
Title: Re: Rust removal and prevention
Post by: Submariner on June 03, 2021, 07:53:15 PM
Just got some decent underbody shots - much better than initially feared:

(https://i.imgur.com/gvkvidH.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/mzPrEOz.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/RCsApAS.jpg)
Title: Re: Rust removal and prevention
Post by: Submariner on June 03, 2021, 08:18:05 PM
I think this is the plan:

-Powerwash the undercarriage to remove any loose dirt.

-Treat the inside of the frame with https://www.eastwood.com/eastwood-internal-frame-coating-14oz-aerosol.html (https://www.eastwood.com/eastwood-internal-frame-coating-14oz-aerosol.html)

-Sand using a light grit attachment for my drill.  If anyone knows what attachments I should use for flat areas and tighter to reach areas I'd be much obliged.  Naturally I'm going to get paper too.

-Degrese/clean.

-Prime with https://www.grainger.com/product/5U705?ef_id=Cj0KCQjw--GFBhDeARIsACH_kdYQlGhvrPkpW8bFvxw9UkN487wk_kf9tnoBeB0ay6wJq209WlRgGKwaAu7aEALw_wcB:G:s&s_kwcid=AL!2966!3!496359973138!!!g!525259996287!&gucid=N:N:PS:Paid:GGL:CSM-2295:4P7A1P:20501231&gclid=Cj0KCQjw--GFBhDeARIsACH_kdYQlGhvrPkpW8bFvxw9UkN487wk_kf9tnoBeB0ay6wJq209WlRgGKwaAu7aEALw_wcB&gclsrc=aw.ds (https://www.grainger.com/product/5U705?ef_id=Cj0KCQjw--GFBhDeARIsACH_kdYQlGhvrPkpW8bFvxw9UkN487wk_kf9tnoBeB0ay6wJq209WlRgGKwaAu7aEALw_wcB:G:s&s_kwcid=AL!2966!3!496359973138!!!g!525259996287!&gucid=N:N:PS:Paid:GGL:CSM-2295:4P7A1P:20501231&gclid=Cj0KCQjw--GFBhDeARIsACH_kdYQlGhvrPkpW8bFvxw9UkN487wk_kf9tnoBeB0ay6wJq209WlRgGKwaAu7aEALw_wcB&gclsrc=aw.ds)

-Paint with https://www.grainger.com/product/4CH75?ef_id=Cj0KCQjw--GFBhDeARIsACH_kday67TOmmsYjLcSQwTB_G2Nf003pUHYBP-vgrzmb71SRSNLZxBX5wYaAkRpEALw_wcB:G:s&s_kwcid=AL!2966!3!281698275756!!!g!494841291794!&gucid=N:N:PS:Paid:GGL:CSM-2295:4P7A1P:20501231&gclid=Cj0KCQjw--GFBhDeARIsACH_kday67TOmmsYjLcSQwTB_G2Nf003pUHYBP-vgrzmb71SRSNLZxBX5wYaAkRpEALw_wcB&gclsrc=aw.ds
(https://www.grainger.com/product/4CH75?ef_id=Cj0KCQjw--GFBhDeARIsACH_kday67TOmmsYjLcSQwTB_G2Nf003pUHYBP-vgrzmb71SRSNLZxBX5wYaAkRpEALw_wcB:G:s&s_kwcid=AL!2966!3!281698275756!!!g!494841291794!&gucid=N:N:PS:Paid:GGL:CSM-2295:4P7A1P:20501231&gclid=Cj0KCQjw--GFBhDeARIsACH_kday67TOmmsYjLcSQwTB_G2Nf003pUHYBP-vgrzmb71SRSNLZxBX5wYaAkRpEALw_wcB&gclsrc=aw.ds)

-Paint the exhaust with high-temp paint.

Some problems I am anticipating:

-How do I paint the top of the frame, or any parts that are close to the floorpan?
-How do I...uh...lift it?
Title: Re: Rust removal and prevention
Post by: shp4man on June 03, 2021, 09:19:40 PM
Dude, that's not that bad. Leave it. Is it the East coast salt fear or something? The vehicle is Japanese, right? No frigging leaks at all.  ;)
Title: Re: Rust removal and prevention
Post by: Submariner on June 05, 2021, 07:15:23 AM
Are these any good? https://www.harborfreight.com/solid-steel-auto-ramp-set-63250.html?cid=paid_google%7C%7C%7C63250&utm_source=google&utm_medium=cpc&utm_campaign=&utm_content=&gclid=Cj0KCQjwweyFBhDvARIsAA67M71NcNw6Opqq85kTQ2lGbk1-MTv3AP10oT8Ud62JdBjuh5NIZHpNSXoaAoYPEALw_wcB

Im thinking about getting four and getting under the car this way.  Safer or less safe than jack stands?  I won't be able to take off the wheels so I'll tape them off to paint the axle.
Title: Re: Rust removal and prevention
Post by: CaminoRacer on June 05, 2021, 07:06:08 PM
I had my El Camino on plastic rhino ramps for 2 months, no issues. Felt better about than jack stands
Title: Re: Rust removal and prevention
Post by: Submariner on June 05, 2021, 08:30:59 PM
I'm thinking about going full steel.  A couple reviews on Amazon show cracks in the Rhino ramps.  I think 8" of lift should be enough.

Title: Re: Rust removal and prevention
Post by: Laconian on June 05, 2021, 08:37:13 PM
Why not both? You could probably have the car on ramps and have jack stands underneath. The odds of both solutions failing are very low.

I used to cram 2x4's under my Miata's "pumpkin" as a last last resort.
Title: Re: Rust removal and prevention
Post by: Submariner on June 05, 2021, 08:42:11 PM
Quote from: Laconian on June 05, 2021, 08:37:13 PM
Why not both? You could probably have the car on ramps and have jack stands underneath. The odds of both solutions failing are very low.

I used to cram 2x4's under my Miata's "pumpkin" as a last last resort.

2x4's are great because a Miata weighs like 15lbs.  You could probably just hunch your back and use your legs to keep it up  :lol:

I was actually thinking about using stands + ramps.  A guy on on mbworld had a friend who got crushed to death under his s2k when one of the stands gave out.  Apparently "it took a while".  No thanks.
Title: Re: Rust removal and prevention
Post by: Soup DeVille on June 06, 2021, 06:42:56 AM
Always have a setup that can have one thing fail safely.

Wood blocks are great backups if they're tall enough. At the very least use jackstands and then keep the jack under something too.
Title: Re: Rust removal and prevention
Post by: Submariner on June 06, 2021, 08:15:05 AM
I have a crawler and I'm going to spend some time underneath to familiarize myself with everything.  I'll probably start by removing the running boards so I can refinish them and de-rust/paint the brackets.  I don't think I'll need to lift the truck to get underneath for that.  Then I'll start figuring out how I can get at all of these pieces.
Title: Re: Rust removal and prevention
Post by: Submariner on June 06, 2021, 07:05:32 PM
Is there a good/better/best way to rust proof/prevent at home?  There are a million different options in terms of paint and preventative.  I'm looking to start things of my sanding/painting the running boards and brackets.  I'm thinking about soaking the hardware in Krud Kutter, priming with this https://www.amazon.com/Rust-Oleum-7582838-Professional-Primer-Spray/dp/B00106IZLO/ref=asc_df_B00106IZLO/?tag=hyprod-20&linkCode=df0&hvadid=216767879473&hvpos=&hvnetw=g&hvrand=14766030219545109281&hvpone=&hvptwo=&hvqmt=&hvdev=c&hvdvcmdl=&hvlocint=&hvlocphy=9067609&hvtargid=pla-350937058953&psc=1 (https://www.amazon.com/Rust-Oleum-7582838-Professional-Primer-Spray/dp/B00106IZLO/ref=asc_df_B00106IZLO/?tag=hyprod-20&linkCode=df0&hvadid=216767879473&hvpos=&hvnetw=g&hvrand=14766030219545109281&hvpone=&hvptwo=&hvqmt=&hvdev=c&hvdvcmdl=&hvlocint=&hvlocphy=9067609&hvtargid=pla-350937058953&psc=1) and painting with this https://www.homedepot.com/s/rust%2520oleum%2520satin%2520black%2520spraypaint?NCNI-5
(https://www.homedepot.com/s/rust%2520oleum%2520satin%2520black%2520spraypaint?NCNI-5)...probably two coats of each.  I may even coat with WD40 corrosion inhibitor as a sort of undercoating.  Are there better paints I should be looking at?
Title: Re: Rust removal and prevention
Post by: JWC on June 07, 2021, 08:18:58 AM
Quote from: shp4man on June 03, 2021, 09:19:40 PM
Dude, that's not that bad. Leave it. Is it the East coast salt fear or something? The vehicle is Japanese, right? No frigging leaks at all.  ;)

I was thinking the same. That looks normal for around here.
Title: Re: Rust removal and prevention
Post by: Submariner on June 07, 2021, 08:54:17 AM
Quote from: JWC on June 07, 2021, 08:18:58 AM
I was thinking the same. That looks normal for around here.

The truck is 11 years old, so yes it's in pretty good shape.  This is equal measures a vanity project as it is an effort to keep the vehicle in good working order.

In any event, I do have to correct some body-panel oxidation then have the vehicle oil-coated.
Title: Re: Rust removal and prevention
Post by: Submariner on June 07, 2021, 08:27:10 PM
I can't get the bolts off.  At all.  I soaked them with as much WD40 "penetrant specialist" as I could and after 20 minutes the damn things won't budge.  And the clearances are so tight that I don't think I can get a larger/longer spanner in there for more leverage. 
Title: Re: Rust removal and prevention
Post by: Submariner on June 07, 2021, 08:34:08 PM
Good news is the rust on the cat and exhaust is coming off nicely, but because the heat shield bolt nuts are on the OTHER side of the shield getting to them is going to be a nightmare.  Without the shield off I don't know how I will clean the exhaust/prep it for painting.
Title: Re: Rust removal and prevention
Post by: Submariner on June 07, 2021, 08:36:50 PM
Also the bolts are...soft?  I get the wrench as tight as I can and it keeps slipping.  Looks like the bolts are 11mm and my 11mm spanner keeps slipping no matter what.  The damn bolts are seized. And of course, my ratchet doesn't have an adapter for the 11mm socket so I can't use that.
Title: Re: Rust removal and prevention
Post by: CaminoRacer on June 07, 2021, 09:25:55 PM
In my experience, exhaust paint burns off quickly unless it's a few feet past the manifolds/headers, or probably the cats in your case.
Title: Re: Rust removal and prevention
Post by: Submariner on June 07, 2021, 09:31:17 PM
Quote from: CaminoRacer on June 07, 2021, 09:25:55 PM
In my experience, exhaust paint burns off quickly unless it's a few feet past the manifolds/headers, or probably the cats in your case.

I've heard that 2k F paint works well.  Or well enough.
Title: Re: Rust removal and prevention
Post by: Submariner on June 08, 2021, 09:50:52 AM
Went back to the bolts today.  I gave them another WD40 soaking but they won't budge.  Like I said the clearances are so damn dight that getting a longer wrench in there is going to be close to impossible.
Title: Re: Rust removal and prevention
Post by: CaminoRacer on June 08, 2021, 09:58:42 AM
Are they stainless steel bolts/nuts? Those like to seize, especially with the heat from the exhaust and exposed to the elements under the car.
Title: Re: Rust removal and prevention
Post by: Submariner on June 08, 2021, 11:08:29 AM
Quote from: CaminoRacer on June 08, 2021, 09:58:42 AM
Are they stainless steel bolts/nuts? Those like to seize, especially with the heat from the exhaust and exposed to the elements under the car.

Stainless orngalvanized as they are very clean, unlike the brackets they're holding.
Title: Re: Rust removal and prevention
Post by: Submariner on June 08, 2021, 05:58:49 PM
So i'll get a spanner around the nut.  The fit is pretty tight, and after enough pulling, it feels as if the nut is loosening but its actually slipping around the nut.  I can't really get the nuts loose on the side of the bracket that is connected to the running board, but my guess is that they are just as seized as the other ones.  Copious amounts of WD40 "specialist penetrant" hasn't done much to help.  Im encountering the same problem with the bumper.
Title: Re: Rust removal and prevention
Post by: CaminoRacer on June 08, 2021, 06:02:49 PM
Do you have 6 sided closed wrenches or 12 sided? 6 sided should help prevent rounding off the bolt
Title: Re: Rust removal and prevention
Post by: Submariner on June 08, 2021, 06:37:00 PM
Six sided.  I'm going to buy a 24" breaker bar, but that still doesn't help me with the bolts on the running board because there is no clearance for the bar.  I need a 24" spanner which I can't seem to find lol.
Title: Re: Rust removal and prevention
Post by: Submariner on June 08, 2021, 06:46:23 PM
Managed to pump a lot of WD40 corrosion inhibitor up into the body cavities while I was under there.  Also took the wire brush to the exhaust...it's all surface rust, but its still going to be hard to get a lot of the rust off due to the angles and tight clearances I have to deal with.
Title: Re: Rust removal and prevention
Post by: JWC on June 09, 2021, 11:29:05 AM
When I was rebuilding VW Beetles, I had a four-foot steel pipe that slipped over my breaker bar. That and lightly hammering the head of the rusted bolt took'em out every time.

Title: Re: Rust removal and prevention
Post by: Submariner on June 09, 2021, 01:47:22 PM
Quote from: JWC on June 09, 2021, 11:29:05 AM
When I was rebuilding VW Beetles, I had a four-foot steel pipe that slipped over my breaker bar. That and lightly hammering the head of the rusted bolt took'em out every time.



I tried hammering to no avail.  The pipe idea isn't bad but I need something for tight clearances so I'm not sure a pipe would work.
Title: Re: Rust removal and prevention
Post by: Laconian on June 09, 2021, 02:08:55 PM
Quote from: Submariner on June 09, 2021, 01:47:22 PM
I tried hammering to no avail.  The pipe idea isn't bad but I need something for tight clearances so I'm not sure a pipe would work.

How about an impact driver?
Title: Re: Rust removal and prevention
Post by: Submariner on June 09, 2021, 02:10:54 PM
Quote from: Laconian on June 09, 2021, 02:08:55 PM
How about an impact driver?

That might work for the bolts I can get with a breaker bar, but some bolts can only be accessed with a spanner.
Title: Re: Rust removal and prevention
Post by: JWC on June 09, 2021, 03:54:05 PM
Quote from: Submariner on June 09, 2021, 01:47:22 PM
I tried hammering to no avail.  The pipe idea isn't bad but I need something for tight clearances so I'm not sure a pipe would work.

The mechanics I worked with from "Yankeeland" automatically went to the torch. Heat will help. Hammering was really just tapping it as you put pressure on it. My impact driver twisted many a fender bolt head off on a rusty VW before I learned patience----and using a hammer to tap the bolt as you try to turn the bolt.
Title: Re: Rust removal and prevention
Post by: Submariner on June 09, 2021, 03:59:23 PM
I'd love a torch but the chances of me burning the house down are worryingly high.

Hopefully I'll have better luck with the breaker bar.
Title: Re: Rust removal and prevention
Post by: CaminoRacer on June 09, 2021, 07:59:43 PM
Sawzall can work too
Title: Re: Rust removal and prevention
Post by: shp4man on June 09, 2021, 08:12:10 PM
Spanner is British, like tyre and petrol. Sub, are you British?
Title: Re: Rust removal and prevention
Post by: Submariner on June 09, 2021, 08:29:10 PM
Does watching lots of top gear count?
Title: Re: Rust removal and prevention
Post by: shp4man on June 09, 2021, 08:34:25 PM
Quote from: Submariner on June 09, 2021, 08:29:10 PM
Does watching lots of top gear count?

:lol:
Title: Re: Rust removal and prevention
Post by: Submariner on June 11, 2021, 02:35:04 PM
I put the pipe into a 12" wrench so I could apply more t0rks to the bolt.  I pull a lot, I get a large snapping sound, and the bolt still hasn't come loose.  It's as if the bolts are made of soft metal and the wrench bends around it.
Title: Re: Rust removal and prevention
Post by: Submariner on June 11, 2021, 02:37:59 PM
I just spent actual dollars on pipe that has proven to be useless.  Now I have 24" of useless pipe laying around.
Title: Re: Rust removal and prevention
Post by: Laconian on June 11, 2021, 02:44:04 PM
Have you tried PB Blaster?
Title: Re: Rust removal and prevention
Post by: Submariner on June 11, 2021, 02:49:57 PM
No but I am about to try semtex.
Title: Re: Rust removal and prevention
Post by: shp4man on June 11, 2021, 02:58:15 PM
Sounds like it's time for some Alabama hot wrench magic!

That's a cutting torch for you yankees.  ;)
Title: Re: Rust removal and prevention
Post by: Submariner on June 11, 2021, 03:40:54 PM
I think I managed to get the bolt to turn, but just barely.  I bend the wrench ever so slightly (at the neck).  Genuinely baffled.
Title: Re: Rust removal and prevention
Post by: Submariner on June 11, 2021, 04:31:04 PM
OMG I GOT TWO OF THEM OFF
Title: Re: Rust removal and prevention
Post by: Submariner on June 11, 2021, 04:32:46 PM
Interestingly enough, they were completely free of corrosion.
Title: Re: Rust removal and prevention
Post by: Soup DeVille on June 11, 2021, 05:31:55 PM
This is entertaining as all hell.

"Every four hour job is one bolt away from being a three day ordeal."
Title: Re: Rust removal and prevention
Post by: Submariner on June 11, 2021, 05:33:58 PM
I'm getting so goddamn good at this I'm thinking about opening my own shop.
Title: Re: Rust removal and prevention
Post by: Submariner on June 12, 2021, 09:33:21 AM
Any tips on polishing the metal here?

I used some "#0, extra fine" steel wool and metal polish.  It removed some superficial haze (which soap and scrubbing did not) but the metal is still visibly scratched and a bit dull.  Unfortunately, I've been told that it really isn't possible to remove the rubber so I can't take a DA polisher to the metal.



Title: Re: Rust removal and prevention
Post by: Submariner on June 12, 2021, 11:06:03 AM
(https://i.imgur.com/BtVUCTb.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/12kp30K.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/DiYM9FV.jpg)
Title: Re: Rust removal and prevention
Post by: AutobahnSHO on June 13, 2021, 02:44:49 PM
Quote from: Submariner on June 11, 2021, 02:37:59 PM
Now I have 24" of useless pipe laying around.

I bought a pipe to use as a cheater a decade ago, and still need it every once in a while.

It didn't fit on my bigger socket bar, so I got a bigger pipe. Use it every once in a while too!
Title: Re: Rust removal and prevention
Post by: Submariner on June 13, 2021, 03:09:18 PM
The pipe actually came in hand for the ratchet.  Totally useless for the spanner though.
Title: Re: Rust removal and prevention
Post by: CaminoRacer on June 13, 2021, 07:28:52 PM
Did the bolts have crimp nuts? I hate those.

Could just have been seized stainless bolts too. Put antiseize on them when reassembling
Title: Re: Rust removal and prevention
Post by: Submariner on June 13, 2021, 09:51:37 PM
Quote from: CaminoRacer on June 13, 2021, 07:28:52 PM
Did the bolts have crimp nuts? I hate those.

Could just have been seized stainless bolts too. Put antiseize on them when reassembling

I have white lithium grease.  Will that work?
Title: Re: Rust removal and prevention
Post by: Submariner on June 13, 2021, 09:52:33 PM
Come to think of it, would Red n' Tacky grease be a good rust preventative?  Obviously I can't spray it but it has a very high drip point and has (in theory) great rust preventative properties.
Title: Re: Rust removal and prevention
Post by: r0tor on June 14, 2021, 06:09:41 AM
Quote from: JWC on June 07, 2021, 08:18:58 AM
I was thinking the same. That looks normal for around here.

I wish my Jeep looked that good
Title: Re: Rust removal and prevention
Post by: Submariner on June 14, 2021, 11:26:53 PM
Got one of the running boards off:

(https://i.imgur.com/8yFEkon.jpg)

Three of the bolts sheared right off.  Badly corroded.  I'll get replacements tomorrow.  I sanded down the underside of the board with paper and my wire wheels, knocked off any visible rust and painted with some light-rust primer + a few coats of satin black enamel.  I'll sand it tomorrow and apply a few more coats.

(https://i.imgur.com/nL1YBvt.jpg)

The brackets are sitting in a rust remover bath.  Once done, I'll give them the same treatment as above.

(https://i.imgur.com/BEPGE3x.jpg)

The holes for the bolts.  I blasted all of them with WD40 corrosion inhibitor to ensure all the metal inside of these cavities is coated.

Title: Re: Rust removal and prevention
Post by: Submariner on June 15, 2021, 09:56:27 AM
(https://i.imgur.com/59xAYSN.jpg)

These are the end caps.  Two coats of plastic primer then sanded with 400 grit and followed up with a coat of gloss black.  I'm going to sand them again, put two more coats of gloss black and clear coat it.  Overall, they look much better than before.
Title: Re: Rust removal and prevention
Post by: Submariner on June 16, 2021, 10:20:19 PM
Any idea how I should deal with the pitting?  I've used the wire brush and cup extensively.  I think I am going to soak it in rust remover.  Should I use a filling primer before I paint?  Does it work as well at corrosion protection as regular primer?

(https://i.imgur.com/lNmhZdf.jpg)
Title: Re: Rust removal and prevention
Post by: Submariner on June 16, 2021, 11:13:41 PM
How should I remove bolts from screws that turn, but do not actually come off?  The bolts and screws are badly rusted.  The nuts turn pretty freely (after liberal application of WD40) but they just turn without actually coming off.  I tried hitting them with a hammer but they won't break. 

BTW the bolts are not moving, just the nuts.
Title: Re: Rust removal and prevention
Post by: shp4man on June 17, 2021, 07:45:35 AM
A cutoff tool is my go to for stuff like that.

https://www.amazon.com/Bare-Tool-Milwaukee-2460-20-12-Volt-Rotary/dp/B004WBFERM/ref=asc_df_B004WBFERM/?tag=hyprod-20&linkCode=df0&hvadid=198070022856&hvpos=&hvnetw=g&hvrand=4227479902070812842&hvpone=&hvptwo=&hvqmt=&hvdev=t&hvdvcmdl=&hvlocint=&hvlocphy=9031259&hvtargid=pla-382428557667&psc=1 (https://www.amazon.com/Bare-Tool-Milwaukee-2460-20-12-Volt-Rotary/dp/B004WBFERM/ref=asc_df_B004WBFERM/?tag=hyprod-20&linkCode=df0&hvadid=198070022856&hvpos=&hvnetw=g&hvrand=4227479902070812842&hvpone=&hvptwo=&hvqmt=&hvdev=t&hvdvcmdl=&hvlocint=&hvlocphy=9031259&hvtargid=pla-382428557667&psc=1)
Title: Re: Rust removal and prevention
Post by: Submariner on June 17, 2021, 09:38:07 AM
Ended up getting them off by sliding them down and out of the channel they were in.  Completely rusted/stripped.  I'll replace with galvanized hardware and pack with hot n' tacky grease.
Title: Re: Rust removal and prevention
Post by: JWC on June 17, 2021, 02:50:48 PM
This thread really makes me miss working on, and bringing back to life, old VWs. 
Title: Re: Rust removal and prevention
Post by: Submariner on June 17, 2021, 03:49:05 PM
Ha!  The funny thing is what I am doing is absolutely amateur work by comparison.  It's very frustrating at times (especially because I am really learning this as I go along) but also rewarding too.
Title: Re: Rust removal and prevention
Post by: Submariner on June 20, 2021, 06:58:45 AM
Made the mistake of using the wire wheel on the second running board.  Despite finishing it with 320 then 400 grit paper and inspecting the surface before painting, the paint now looks brushed on rather than sprayed.  Not a big deal as it is the underside of the board.  At least now I know for next time.
Title: Re: Rust removal and prevention
Post by: Submariner on June 25, 2021, 11:23:17 PM
So the running boards are (almost) done.  I've got to do a bit of touch up work here and there but they're 90% complete.  I'm going to fill the cavities with WD40 corrosion inhibitor and pack with Lucas Red n' Tacky grease.  I purchased all new galvanized hardware and that too is going to be slathered with red n' tacky before assembly. 

The stainless steel came out looking good - most of the tarnish is gone and it looks brighter than before but I was unable to take a DA polisher to it so deeper scratches still remain. 

The plastic end caps look good - I sanded with 180, 320 then 400 grit paper, applied two coats of primer and three coats of gloss black.  They look almost brand new.  I should have used filler primer as some areas were very hard to sand and were hard to smooth properly with the 400 grit paper.  Still, I'm pleased with the result.

I'm going to pack the mount points on the truck with red n tacky then hopefully have them mounted this weekend.
Title: Re: Rust removal and prevention
Post by: Submariner on July 11, 2021, 07:50:03 PM
Any suggestions to remove paint in impossible to reach areas?  I've been at this for what seems to be hours with sand paper and drill bit attachments and still can't remove the paint in the corners:

(https://i.imgur.com/01x793r.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/yCA5rMX.jpg)

Title: Re: Rust removal and prevention
Post by: Soup DeVille on July 11, 2021, 08:06:20 PM
Its clearly stuck on good: leave it.
Title: Re: Rust removal and prevention
Post by: Submariner on July 11, 2021, 08:10:57 PM
The thing is, much of the paint came off with corrosion underneath.  The problem here is that the angles + clearance makes it hard to remove.  The flat + open surfaces were very easy to clean up.
Title: Re: Rust removal and prevention
Post by: shp4man on July 11, 2021, 08:17:27 PM
Paint remover or sandblasting, but it may be a bit obsessive. Why do you want perfection?
Title: Re: Rust removal and prevention
Post by: Submariner on July 11, 2021, 08:19:37 PM
Not perfection...I just don't want to paint over existing/bubbling rust. 
Title: Re: Rust removal and prevention
Post by: Soup DeVille on July 11, 2021, 08:35:22 PM
Quote from: Submariner on July 11, 2021, 08:10:57 PM
The thing is, much of the paint came off with corrosion underneath.  The problem here is that the angles + clearance makes it hard to remove.  The flat + open surfaces were very easy to clean up.

Sandblaster. Use walnut shells.
Title: Re: Rust removal and prevention
Post by: Submariner on July 11, 2021, 09:05:56 PM
Is muriatic acid an option? 
Title: Re: Rust removal and prevention
Post by: Submariner on July 13, 2021, 05:03:04 PM
I ended up painting them.  The pitting is evident, but at least the rust is removed and they're coated with a few fresh coats of rustoleum.

(https://i.imgur.com/u9a0MUt.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/EUXndlN.jpeg)
Title: Re: Rust removal and prevention
Post by: JWC on July 13, 2021, 06:03:12 PM
I've seen new cars come off the trucks with less pitting.

I wouldn't fret too much about it. I've noticed that on those "resurrection" shows like on Motor Trend TV, there are cars "restomodded" that are not perfect. The newer cameras are adversely showing off sanding marks under that custom paint, pitting on frame work, etc.

Title: Re: Rust removal and prevention
Post by: Submariner on July 13, 2021, 06:31:34 PM
The pitting isn't too bad, especially because these parts will be under the car and out of sight.  As long as the metal is protected, I am happy.
Title: Re: Rust removal and prevention
Post by: CALL_911 on July 13, 2021, 07:15:45 PM
So what kind of truck is this?
Title: Re: Rust removal and prevention
Post by: MrH on July 14, 2021, 09:40:46 AM
The amount of effort you're going to on this is wild.  I can't say I understand?  Must be the best truck ever :lol:
Title: Re: Rust removal and prevention
Post by: FoMoJo on July 14, 2021, 09:46:38 AM
Quote from: CALL_911 on July 13, 2021, 07:15:45 PM
So what kind of truck is this?
With the coils on the back...

(https://i.imgur.com/gvkvidH.jpg)

I guessed a RAM.

Don't really know though.
Title: Re: Rust removal and prevention
Post by: Submariner on August 01, 2021, 11:17:50 AM
Finally got the boards back on.  The brackets came out nicely.  I bought new galvanized hardware and coated it in grease before reapplication. 

One question; 11 of the 12 bolts went in and tightened properly.  The 12th bolt just spins in the hole.  They are 3/8" bolts.  Any idea why/what I can do?
Title: Re: Rust removal and prevention
Post by: Soup DeVille on August 01, 2021, 06:59:27 PM
Quote from: Submariner on August 01, 2021, 11:17:50 AM
Finally got the boards back on.  The brackets came out nicely.  I bought new galvanized hardware and coated it in grease before reapplication. 

One question; 11 of the 12 bolts went in and tightened properly.  The 12th bolt just spins in the hole.  They are 3/8" bolts.  Any idea why/what I can do?

Are you screwing into a captured nut, or is it a welded on boss?
Title: Re: Rust removal and prevention
Post by: Submariner on August 01, 2021, 07:43:32 PM
I believe it's just a screw hole.  I can't see it due to clearance issues, but two people who extensively work on these trucks have mentioned in the past that there is no nut inside, nor does it feel like there is one.
Title: Re: Rust removal and prevention
Post by: Soup DeVille on August 02, 2021, 06:11:14 AM
If its just slightly stripped out, you may try putting a couple wraps of teflon tape on the bolt to see if you can grab any of the remaining thread.

I'm assuming this hole isn't in a good place to get a tap into?