C&D I'm not buying a minivan test

Started by 68_427, June 29, 2017, 09:51:34 PM

68_427























Them saying that a two child family may be too large for the Mazda is laughable, but w/e it still won
Quotewhere were you when automotive dream died
i was sat at home drinking brake fluid when wife ring
'racecar is die'
no


giant_mtb

How the fuck is Ann Arbor northern Michigan?  C&D is based in AA.  :wtf:

Cute, you took a freeway exit to a campground. :rolleyes:

68_427

Quote from: giant_mtb on June 29, 2017, 09:54:31 PM
How the fuck is Ann Arbor northern Michigan?  C&D is based in AA.  :wtf:

Cute, you took a freeway exit to a campground. :rolleyes:

They were making fun of people who rationalize "needing" a "crossover" for family excursions like this.  They tested them exactly how a typical owner would.  :huh:
Quotewhere were you when automotive dream died
i was sat at home drinking brake fluid when wife ring
'racecar is die'
no


GoCougs

Jesus, the Acadia and Pilot are hot rods.

Still can't imagine paying $46k for a 250hp turbo 4 however.

I want to like the Pilot the best out of these, but the lack of shifter and awful AT would probably be a deal breaker. I'd probably just go for a 4Runner if I had to buy in the mid-size SUV/CUV class.

Raza

These prices are crazy. A bunch of mainstream SUVs around the 50K mark? If you told VW fifteen years ago that they'd be able to sell SUVs for that much, they never would have made the Phaeton.

Quis custodiet ipsos custodes?
If you can read this, you're too close


2006 BMW Z4 3.0i
http://accelerationtherapy.squarespace.com/   @accelerationdoc
Quote from: the Teuton on October 05, 2009, 03:53:18 PM
It's impossible to argue with Raza. He wins. Period. End of discussion.

SJ_GTI

I don't understand why people don't just get minivans. They drive better and are way more functional. My brother's Sienna is great...best tailgating vehicle we have ever used IMHO. Tons of space plus is drives so smooth, yet handles better than any SUV or pickup I have ever driven (including my other brother's recently purchased Explorer).

2o6

They gave to the CX-9, although they said it sucked at being a 7 seater crossover  :wtf:

12,000 RPM

Quote from: GoCougs on June 29, 2017, 10:35:47 PM
Jesus, the Acadia and Pilot are hot rods.
I was going to say, "well you could at least get away from them on an on/off ramp"

But 0.85g for the Acadia... 350Z on OEM tires did 0.87 :facepalm: A competent + determined driver in one of these, empty, could give "legit" performance cars a hassle
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AutobahnSHO

Quote from: SJ_GTI on June 30, 2017, 06:15:06 AM
I don't understand why people don't just get minivans. They drive better and are way more functional. My brother's Sienna is great...best tailgating vehicle we have ever used IMHO. Tons of space plus is drives so smooth, yet handles better than any SUV or pickup I have ever driven (including my other brother's recently purchased Explorer).

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Will

AutobahnSHO

Quote from: 12,000 RPM on June 30, 2017, 07:19:18 AM
I was going to say, "well you could at least get away from them on an on/off ramp"

But 0.85g for the Acadia... 350Z on OEM tires did 0.87 :facepalm: A competent + determined driver in one of these, empty, could give "legit" performance cars a hassle

Most drivers would not get the thing to sway that much.   But I regularly catch/dust people on the on/off ramp. It cracks me up as they blow by me on the straights because I "only" do 5-7mph over- and I don't even push the curves that much.
Will

ifcar

Quote from: 2o6 on June 30, 2017, 06:49:22 AM
They gave to the CX-9, although they said it sucked at being a 7 seater crossover  :wtf:

As they wrote: "Yes, we awarded the win to the three-row SUV with the least amount of cargo space and the best handling. But for buyers who might use the third row only occasionally, the CX-9's moderate size is no demerit." You don't have to agree with the decision, but the logic is valid and clearly explained.

veeman

Quote from: SJ_GTI on June 30, 2017, 06:15:06 AM
I don't understand why people don't just get minivans. They drive better and are way more functional. My brother's Sienna is great...best tailgating vehicle we have ever used IMHO. Tons of space plus is drives so smooth, yet handles better than any SUV or pickup I have ever driven (including my other brother's recently purchased Explorer).

The same reason people buy cramped sports sedans with coupe like styling, large diameter wheels with low profile tires which are very prone to damage from pot holes, and high performance engines requiring high octane expensive gas - all to commute 20 miles in congested traffic barely breaking 55 mph on ruler straight highways. 

2o6

Quote from: ifcar on June 30, 2017, 07:40:09 AM
As they wrote: "Yes, we awarded the win to the three-row SUV with the least amount of cargo space and the best handling. But for buyers who might use the third row only occasionally, the CX-9's moderate size is no demerit." You don't have to agree with the decision, but the logic is valid and clearly explained.


It's shitty logic.


MX793

Quote from: 12,000 RPM on June 30, 2017, 07:19:18 AM
I was going to say, "well you could at least get away from them on an on/off ramp"

But 0.85g for the Acadia... 350Z on OEM tires did 0.87 :facepalm: A competent + determined driver in one of these, empty, could give "legit" performance cars a hassle

Tire tech has come a long way in ~15 years.  C&D got .87g out of a regular Fusion sedan on all-seasons, and that was limited by undefeatable stability control.  Everyone is shifting upwards in the scale.  Regular cars that used to get .78-.82g are moving up to the .82-.87g range.  Performance cars that used to get mid to high .8s on the skidpad are now in the .9s.
Needs more Jiggawatts

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MexicoCityM3

Mazda is on a roll. It is for driving dynamics in its segment what BMW used to be in theirs years ago.

Having said that, if I went 7 seater I'd probably value the space more and get something else.
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2o6

Quote from: BimmerM3 on June 30, 2017, 08:21:14 AM
No, it isn't.


I guess in the context of C&D's sports oriented testing, but I don't understand the concept of buying a big vehicle that's tight inside. The Pilot and others have far more room inside than the Mazda. It's basically the same size outside as the others in the test, but has far less interior room. What's the point, especially when this type of vehicle is meant to haul families and their things?

Raza

Quote from: SJ_GTI on June 30, 2017, 06:15:06 AM
I don't understand why people don't just get minivans. They drive better and are way more functional. My brother's Sienna is great...best tailgating vehicle we have ever used IMHO. Tons of space plus is drives so smooth, yet handles better than any SUV or pickup I have ever driven (including my other brother's recently purchased Explorer).

They're just so....pathetic looking.  I've never seen a man driving a minivan who didn't look defeated by it.  Hell, not even women seem so thrilled about them.  It's a complete capitulation to practicality; it's a car that signifies the surrender of your entire life to the lives of your soulsucking children.  It's a car that alerts people that yeah, you're probably sticky, you don't know why, and it wasn't for a fun reason.  It says that the person you were for the first ~25-30 years of your life is dead now, and all you're doing now is waiting for your new life to come to a drooling, diaper-wearing end in some retirement home while the kids you killed your 30 year old self for go live their lives and continue the cycle of life, death, new life, and waiting to die. 

Quis custodiet ipsos custodes?
If you can read this, you're too close


2006 BMW Z4 3.0i
http://accelerationtherapy.squarespace.com/   @accelerationdoc
Quote from: the Teuton on October 05, 2009, 03:53:18 PM
It's impossible to argue with Raza. He wins. Period. End of discussion.

MexicoCityM3

Quote from: Raza  on June 30, 2017, 09:32:19 AM
They're just so....pathetic looking.  I've never seen a man driving a minivan who didn't look defeated by it.  Hell, not even women seem so thrilled about them.  It's a complete capitulation to practicality; it's a car that signifies the surrender of your entire life to the lives of your soulsucking children.  It's a car that alerts people that yeah, you're probably sticky, you don't know why, and it wasn't for a fun reason.  It says that the person you were for the first ~25-30 years of your life is dead now, and all you're doing now is waiting for your new life to come to a drooling, diaper-wearing end in some retirement home while the kids you killed your 30 year old self for go live their lives and continue the cycle of life, death, new life, and waiting to die. 



Never leave the Spin. Please.
Founder, BMW Car Club de México
http://bmwclub.org.mx
'05 M3 E46 6SPD Mystic Blue
'08 M5 E60 SMG  Space Grey
'11 1M E82 6SPD Sapphire Black
'16 GT4 (1/3rd Share lol)
'18 M3 CS
'16 X5 5.0i (Wife)
'14 MINI Cooper Countryman S Automatic (For Sale)

Raza

Quis custodiet ipsos custodes?
If you can read this, you're too close


2006 BMW Z4 3.0i
http://accelerationtherapy.squarespace.com/   @accelerationdoc
Quote from: the Teuton on October 05, 2009, 03:53:18 PM
It's impossible to argue with Raza. He wins. Period. End of discussion.

BimmerM3

Quote from: 2o6 on June 30, 2017, 09:30:43 AM
I guess in the context of C&D's sports oriented testing, but I don't understand the concept of buying a big vehicle that's tight inside. The Pilot and others have far more room inside than the Mazda. It's basically the same size outside as the others in the test, but has far less interior room. What's the point, especially when this type of vehicle is meant to haul families and their things?

I don't necessarily disagree with you, but I haven't driven any of these cars, much less all of them for comparison. C&D preferred the Mazda and clearly explained why, so I don't really have a problem with that.

Anyone who's using these comparisons to actually shop for a vehicle should be reading the full article to get the nuanced opinions anyway, and reevaluate based on that.

If someone actually bought a CX-9 based solely on C&D's rankings without actually reading the article and comparison shopping themselves, and goes on to complain that the CX-9 isn't big enough, then I don't have much sympathy for them.

BimmerM3

Quote from: Raza  on June 30, 2017, 09:32:19 AM
They're just so....pathetic looking.  I've never seen a man driving a minivan who didn't look defeated by it.  Hell, not even women seem so thrilled about them.  It's a complete capitulation to practicality; it's a car that signifies the surrender of your entire life to the lives of your soulsucking children.  It's a car that alerts people that yeah, you're probably sticky, you don't know why, and it wasn't for a fun reason.  It says that the person you were for the first ~25-30 years of your life is dead now, and all you're doing now is waiting for your new life to come to a drooling, diaper-wearing end in some retirement home while the kids you killed your 30 year old self for go live their lives and continue the cycle of life, death, new life, and waiting to die. 

:lol:

Although that entire post is really just projecting your own opinions about family life onto people who may or may not actually like that life.

giant_mtb

Quote from: Raza  on June 30, 2017, 09:32:19 AM
They're just so....pathetic looking.  I've never seen a man driving a minivan who didn't look defeated by it.  Hell, not even women seem so thrilled about them.  It's a complete capitulation to practicality; it's a car that signifies the surrender of your entire life to the lives of your soulsucking children.  It's a car that alerts people that yeah, you're probably sticky, you don't know why, and it wasn't for a fun reason.  It says that the person you were for the first ~25-30 years of your life is dead now, and all you're doing now is waiting for your new life to come to a drooling, diaper-wearing end in some retirement home while the kids you killed your 30 year old self for go live their lives and continue the cycle of life, death, new life, and waiting to die. 



I detail for a guy who loves his Town & Country.  He uses it like a utility vehicle.

MrH

Quote from: Raza  on June 30, 2017, 09:32:19 AM
They're just so....pathetic looking.  I've never seen a man driving a minivan who didn't look defeated by it.  Hell, not even women seem so thrilled about them.  It's a complete capitulation to practicality; it's a car that signifies the surrender of your entire life to the lives of your soulsucking children.  It's a car that alerts people that yeah, you're probably sticky, you don't know why, and it wasn't for a fun reason.  It says that the person you were for the first ~25-30 years of your life is dead now, and all you're doing now is waiting for your new life to come to a drooling, diaper-wearing end in some retirement home while the kids you killed your 30 year old self for go live their lives and continue the cycle of life, death, new life, and waiting to die. 



:lol:  :golfclap:

I laugh, but when a middle age rolls up to work in a beat to hell Town and Country, my impressions aren't too far off from what you just said.
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Lebowski

I actually if anything have a little extra respect for someone who can totally throw giving a shit about image to the wind and rock the minivan. I don't think I could do it, though.

MrH

I think I could do it, but it would have to be a newer Odyssey or Sienna or something.  An old, beat to hell Town and Country is just like waving the white flag of life.
2023 Ford Lightning Lariat ER
2019 Acura RDX SH-AWD
2023 BRZ Limited

Previous: '02 Mazda Protege5, '08 Mazda Miata, '05 Toyota Tacoma, '09 Honda Element, '13 Subaru BRZ, '14 Hyundai Genesis R-Spec 5.0, '15 Toyota 4Runner SR5, '18 Honda Accord EX-L 2.0t, '01 Honda S2000, '20 Subaru Outback XT, '23 Chevy Bolt EUV

BimmerM3

Quote from: Lebowski on June 30, 2017, 12:11:39 PM
I actually if anything have a little extra respect for someone who can totally throw giving a shit about image to the wind and rock the minivan. I don't think I could do it, though.

I'd absolutely do it if I really needed the space and could get away with low ground clearance.

MexicoCityM3

Founder, BMW Car Club de México
http://bmwclub.org.mx
'05 M3 E46 6SPD Mystic Blue
'08 M5 E60 SMG  Space Grey
'11 1M E82 6SPD Sapphire Black
'16 GT4 (1/3rd Share lol)
'18 M3 CS
'16 X5 5.0i (Wife)
'14 MINI Cooper Countryman S Automatic (For Sale)

68_427

FWIW I really like minivans

#coilovernation it


Quotewhere were you when automotive dream died
i was sat at home drinking brake fluid when wife ring
'racecar is die'
no


12,000 RPM

Quote from: MX793 on June 30, 2017, 09:11:17 AM
Tire tech has come a long way in ~15 years.  C&D got .87g out of a regular Fusion sedan on all-seasons, and that was limited by undefeatable stability control.  Everyone is shifting upwards in the scale.  Regular cars that used to get .78-.82g are moving up to the .82-.87g range.  Performance cars that used to get mid to high .8s on the skidpad are now in the .9s.
This is true. I wonder what old cars could do on the Ring on new tires. Times from 10-20 years ago don't really mean anything anymore.
Protecctor of the Atmospheric Engine #TheyLiedToUs