We're down to just one car, due to the recent departure of the much-beloved Miata. We need to bring that number back up to two. Our bus system is just too crappy.
Since my back's not quite up to the point where I can drive fun cars again, I'm thinking that it might be wise to add a comfortable, useful car to the stable. Once I am ready to get a fun car, we can sell the Accord and replace it with something with two seats and no roof.
I am looking at small SUVs. Our requirements:
- Comfortable front seats
- Large enough back seats to fit a pair of larger adults (in-laws need chauffeuring when they visit)
- Good fuel economy, relatively speaking of course
- Fun to drive, again, relatively speaking
- Automatic transmissions OK
- No sliding doors. My original Mazda5 idea was vetoed. And it looks like the upcoming C-Max will also look like a toddler-hauler :cry:
- Used OK, as long as it is low-mileage and still covered by a warranty
- Budget: $30k, stretch to $35k if the car absolutely warrants it. Of course I love a good value, there's no reason why we have to spend this much.
Juke.
Love the specs, but that front end makes me reach for the eye bleach.
Quote from: Laconian on January 07, 2011, 09:51:04 PM
Love the specs, but that front end makes me reach for the eye bleach.
It looks awesome in person, a very striking vehicle. I've also heard the back seat is a bit tight.
I would say Kia Soul, but the ride is like being kicked in the back.
My brother really liked the Venza before he settled on his Camry. Mazda CX-7 seems to be nice, as does the Ford Edge Sport.
The new Outlander Sport may be up your alley.
CX7 or RDX?
Maybe a Forester if you'd like a manual.
Countryman? Maybe it's too small?
I don't have much experience with SUVs
oooo RDX
The outside is ugly, but I loved the interior, and the sight lines felt pretty sporty
CX7, Fit (too small?), Edge, Flex
Quote from: hotrodalex on January 07, 2011, 10:03:44 PM
CX7, Fit (too small?), Edge, Flex
Fit isn't even best in class, or really that fun to drive.
You may not be a lesbian, but what about a WRX-powered 2007 Forester 2.5XT with a manual transmission?
Re: Juke, tight back seats are a total nonstarter. I said the in-laws are "larger", and I meant it! :lol:
Quote from: HotRodPilot on January 07, 2011, 09:58:47 PM
oooo RDX
The outside is ugly, but I loved the interior, and the sight lines felt pretty sporty
Soul: I like it but it's too downmarket, wouldn't stand a chance replacing the Accord.
RDX: Too expensive and don't like the looks, but hey! The previous generation RDX... hmm, that's an interesting thought! NomisR has one, I think.
CX7: Already test drove it, didn't like the dash or windshield rake, too much like driving a tank.
Countryman: I think that it would be too expensive when the option boxes are ticked. And, larger in-laws.
Outlander Sport: I'm afraid that Mitsubishi might not be around much longer to honor the warranty.
Ford Edge: Haven't considered these, might be worth a look. They're not selling well, which could mean favorable pricing.
Oh, duh!
VW Tiguan? Forgot those existed.
CPO Q5 2.0T? Or if you are willing to find a station wagon, a CPO 328iT/A4 avant?
Quote from: CALL_911 on January 07, 2011, 10:13:10 PM
CPO Q5 2.0T? Or if you are willing to find a station wagon, a CPO 328iT/A4 avant?
I dunno, lower H-point of a sedan or wagon may not work versus an SUV or a tall hatch.
How many miles is too many miles for a used car?
Quote from: 2o6 on January 07, 2011, 10:13:04 PM
Oh, duh!
VW Tiguan? Forgot those existed.
Too many negative VW anecdotes with my immediate friends to even consider it (MkIV Jetta and MkV GTI horror stories.) Not encouraged by VW's short warranties, either.
Quote from: thecarnut on January 07, 2011, 10:15:30 PM
How many miles is too many miles for a used car?
Needs to be CPO-eligible.
Quote from: Laconian on January 07, 2011, 10:09:14 PM
Re: Juke, tight back seats are a total nonstarter. I said the in-laws are "larger", and I meant it! :lol:
Soul: I like it but it's too downmarket, wouldn't stand a chance replacing the Accord.
RDX: Too expensive and don't like the looks, but hey! The previous generation RDX... hmm, that's an interesting thought! NomisR has one, I think.
CX7: Already test drove it, didn't like the dash or windshield rake, too much like driving a tank.
Countryman: I think that it would be too expensive when the option boxes are ticked. And, larger in-laws.
Outlander Sport: I'm afraid that Mitsubishi might not be around much longer to honor the warranty.
Ford Edge: Haven't considered these, might be worth a look. They're not selling well, which could mean favorable pricing.
MyFordTouch would keep your Googleness entertained.
I didn't know the RDX had more than 1 generation....the SH AWD can be had for 34k...
Was on Acura's website... ZDX is 45k LOL
used Escape with a stick?
2011 Impreza.. with how tall cars are getting, maybe it's high enough?
Small SUVs only, or that happens to be your primary thought at this point?
Mazda3 or Mazda6 if SUVs aren't required.
If they are, have you looked at the Hyundai Santa Fe? Wife of a guy I work with has one, and he loves it. He's a spirited driver who has owned a DSM turbo, VW Passat, Audi A4 etc., so the Santa Fe likely isn't a total dog.
Quote from: Laconian on January 07, 2011, 10:18:08 PM
Needs to be CPO-eligible.
Some used MDX's fall into your range...
Sportage?
Because everyone ignored me the first time...
(http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/1/17/06-08_Subaru_Forester_2.5XT_Sports.jpg)
Courtesy of Ifcar...Wikipedia's savior.
http://www.autotrader.com/fyc/vdp.jsp?ct=c&car_id=292314450&dealer_id=619191&car_year=2009&doors=&systime=&position=top&model=Q5&search_lang=en&start_year=2007&keywordsrep=&keywordsfyc=&highlightFirstMakeModel=&search_type=certified&distance=200&min_price=&drive=&rdm=1294464612431&marketZipError=false&advanced=&fuel=&keywords_display=&lastBeginningStartYear=2007&end_year=2011&make3=INFIN&showZipError=y&make2=ACURA&certified=y&engine=&page_location=findacar%3A%3Aispsearchform&body_code=0&transmission=&default_sort=newsortbyprice_DESC&max_mileage=&model3=EX35&address=98006&color=&sort_type=priceASC&model2=RDX&max_price=&awsp=false&make=AUDI&seller_type=b&num_records=25&cardist=146&standard=false
RDX FTW?
Do what my friend did when in a similar situation. He bought a used Forester 2.5XT 5MT.
Quote from: the Teuton on January 07, 2011, 10:30:04 PM
Because everyone ignored me the first time...
(http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/1/17/06-08_Subaru_Forester_2.5XT_Sports.jpg)
Courtesy of Ifcar...Wikipedia's savior.
Heh...even a stopped clock.
The RDX is lively little SUV but it drinks gas like none other so be careful. Although you should be able to get them decently cheap.
Land Rover LR2?
(http://www.stationwagon.com/gallery/pictures/1986_AMC_Eagle.jpg)
Quote from: Mustangfan2003 on January 07, 2011, 11:48:47 PM
(http://www.stationwagon.com/gallery/pictures/1986_AMC_Eagle.jpg)
Truly a vehicle before its time...
Yep the AMC Eagle has to be the very first crossover created.
This sounds like a couple of vehicles.
The Outback for one though I have no experience driving the most recent version though it reviews relatively well. Pretty fuel efficient with the V6 (18/25).
Kia Sorento comes to mind. Comfortable. Fuel efficient albeit bland. But looks nice.
My Picks:
Saab 9-4x (available this spring)
Used 2010-11 Caddy SRX
Used Mercedes GLK
Used 2010 Volvo XC60
Outback
Sorento
Equinox
Quote from: Mustangfan2003 on January 07, 2011, 11:55:26 PM
Yep the AMC Eagle has to be the very first crossover created.
Here's the circa-WWII VW Type 87
(http://images.thesamba.com/vw/gallery/pix/526892.jpg)
There might be earlier cars, too. Ferdinand Porsche made some early 4x4s for Daimler.
Quote from: WookieOnRitalin on January 08, 2011, 12:03:13 AM
Kia Sorento comes to mind. Comfortable. Fuel efficient albeit bland. But looks nice.
The new(ish) Sorento is surprisingly nice and doesn't drive too badly, in my opinion. I'll also add a +1 for a look at the Venza. I don't consider it a real SUV, but a friend had one and they're in the price range, relatively nice/upmarket looking, and it was very comfortable. I'd say the Highlander might be worth a look for comfort and relatively decent mileage, but I doubt it handles well and they look a bit strange these days. I'd definitely take a look at the new Edge too.
The new Sportage has had good reviews, and must be worth a look.
I'd be tempted by that used Forester, as long as it has a wild engine. I drove a bog standard rental spec 2.5X version of the last gen car and was deeply disappointed.
I guess a previous gen Legacy/Outback is not quite SUV-ish enough for you? That was a really nice car, unlike the hideous thing that Subaru are now trying to sell (and Americas are buying, but Europeans are treating with the proverbial barge pole!).
Volvo XC60 too costly? Otherwise nice, esp in R-Design format.
I don't know about the Sportage....I was at the KIA dealer a few weeks ago, and sat in both the SOUL and Sportage (no dice on a test drive) and the Sportage felt like it had less room inside.
The elephant in the room that no one wants to mention to replace an Accord sedan and get a crossover simultaneously...
(http://www.blogcdn.com/www.autoblog.com/media/2009/09/crosstour_lead.jpg)
I'd go with the Tucson/Sportage. They're among the smallest small SUVs, which helps their handling and fuel efficiency. No huge cargo space, but still decent, and plenty of passenger room.
The Sorento and RAV4 are other strong picks in the segment, though more money.
Rav4 . Get a V6 if you want some punch to it. Mileage is still ok to, considering it's almost 270hp. It has some serious kick to it. Fairly roomy.
A friend of mine bought a new Hyundai Tuscon. Only had a bit of a drive in it. So far I like it. Nicely appointed inside ( reminds me of the Santa Fe's interior, but a little nicer ).
I prefer the RAV though.
Quote from: the Teuton on January 08, 2011, 10:35:29 AM
The elephant in the room that no one wants to mention to replace an Accord sedan and get a crossover simultaneously...
(http://www.blogcdn.com/www.autoblog.com/media/2009/09/crosstour_lead.jpg)
You should be banned for suggesting that.
My boyfriend is biased against Korean cars for some reason, but we have a Hyundai dealer closeby so I think we will check the Tucson out regardless. Any clue as to when the Tucson will get the DI Theta engine, if ever?
Cars to test drive today:
* Current Subie Forester
* Current Subie Outback
* Hyundai Tucson
If we have time:
* Ford Edge
* Previous-generation Infiniti FX35
Quote from: the Teuton on January 08, 2011, 10:35:29 AM
The elephant in the room that no one wants to mention to replace an Accord sedan and get a crossover simultaneously...
(http://www.blogcdn.com/www.autoblog.com/media/2009/09/crosstour_lead.jpg)
:lol:
IF this is the case, then I suggest a Venza. At least it looks nice and does the same thing this does. ( except blind people with its styling! )
Quote from: Laconian on January 08, 2011, 02:13:04 PM
My boyfriend is biased against Korean cars for some reason, but we have a Hyundai dealer closeby so I think we will check the Tucson out regardless. Any clue as to when the Tucson will get the DI Theta engine, if ever?
Cars to test drive today:
* Current Subie Forester
* Current Subie Outback
* Hyundai Tucson
If we have time:
* Ford Edge
* Previous-generation Infiniti FX35
I wanna know how the Edge test drive goes. It's on my list of vehicles of interest.
(http://www.egmcartech.com/wp-content/uploads/2008/01/saab_94_x_bio_power_press_image002.jpg)
(http://static.cargurus.com/images/site/2010/03/08/08/24/2007_subaru_forester_2_5_xt_limited-pic-252656860360407422.jpeg)
(http://static.howstuffworks.com/gif/vehicle-pictures/2009/subaru/outback/5467-037-driver-side-door-open-480.jpg)
(http://www.roadandtrack.com/var/ezflow_site/storage_RT_NEW/storage/images/media/images/fd_2010-volvo-xc60-t6-awd_flead1/1475927-1-eng-US/fd_2010-volvo-xc60-t6-awd_flead1.jpg)
Good call on the XC60, I overlooked it.
Previous generation XC60 wasn't any great shakes, was it? Because buying that or the Saab 9-4X new will DEFINITELY break the budget.
If we are going to splurge on a car, it's going to be on the fun car, not the family truckster. My hopes and dreams for owning an awesome car are not invested in this purchase.
OK, gotta call the parents, then it's time to go for some test drivin'.
The XC60 is new for this gen.
I say go for an Outback XT. Fun to drive compared to the others and has as much utility.
Quote from: the Teuton on January 08, 2011, 10:35:29 AM
The elephant in the room that no one wants to mention to replace an Accord sedan and get a crossover simultaneously...
(http://www.blogcdn.com/www.autoblog.com/media/2009/09/crosstour_lead.jpg)
That vehicle is the automobile equivalent of those ugly Croc's
Gotta agree there. Not much more useful than an Accord, either, since that rear roofline just kills the utility.
Dumb aftermarket rims but this is what I'm talking about.
http://autos.yahoo.com/used-cars/subaru-outback-cars371659808;_ylt=AgfqQUnzHfb.OPc1pApepnPaXY54;_ylv=3?keywords=XT&sortcol=price&sortdir=up&modelyearlb=2008&askpriceub=any&askpricelb=any&deliverymileageub=25000&deliverymileagelb=any&location=Atherton,+CA+94027&listingtype=used&model=outback&make=subaru&distance=200
Quote from: Laconian on January 08, 2011, 02:37:35 PM
Previous generation XC60 wasn't any great shakes, was it? Because buying that or the Saab 9-4X new will DEFINITELY break the budget.
If we are going to splurge on a car, it's going to be on the fun car, not the family truckster. My hopes and dreams for owning an awesome car are not invested in this purchase.
OK, gotta call the parents, then it's time to go for some test drivin'.
A used XC60 is in your budget. http://tinyurl.com/27la35f
So is a used Caddy SRX: http://tinyurl.com/2446lxq
The 9-4x should start right around 35k. You could buy a new base 9-4x V6. You'll get a ton of standard features to go along with it.
I'm not sold on the Sportage. Visibility is bad. Stupid Huge rear doors and I think the Tuscon is ugly.
I'll throw out another Darkhose candidate and the most recent incarnation of the Saturn Vue. Low miles, top of the line Red Line or V6 should be a good buy.
(http://static.cargurus.com/images/forsale/2011/01/06/13/53/2009_saturn_vue-pic-7777904965256656920.jpeg)
(http://static.cargurus.com/images/forsale/2011/01/06/13/48/2009_saturn_vue-pic-1679265292321369271.jpeg)
(http://static.cargurus.com/images/forsale/2011/01/04/16/28/2008_saturn_vue-pic-2797033108313295976.jpeg)
(http://static.cargurus.com/images/forsale/2011/01/04/16/27/2008_saturn_vue-pic-1911203588485125965.jpeg)
Quote from: Laconian on January 07, 2011, 10:09:14 PM
CX7: Already test drove it, didn't like the dash or windshield rake, too much like driving a tank.
You're not really going to find a small SUV that drives less like a tank than that.
Quote from: 93JC on January 08, 2011, 03:14:18 PM
You're not really going to find a small SUV that drives less like a tank than that.
The CX-7 drives the most like a midsize SUV of perhaps any of the compacts. Its very strength is the feeling of a class above.
Laconian: any reason you're not looking at the RAV4?
Quote from: ifcar on January 08, 2011, 03:18:11 PM
The CX-7 drives the most like a midsize SUV of perhaps any of the compacts. Its very strength is the feeling of a class above.
Laconian: any reason you're not looking at the RAV4?
Lack of desire to drive a Toyota nameplate.
Quote from: 2o6 on January 07, 2011, 10:05:32 PM
Fit isn't even best in class, or really that fun to drive.
depends on the source. the fit is awesome if you are interested in a car that small. it's pretty roomy actually.
I think a CPO RDX would fit the bill pretty nicely, even if it looks kind of weird. Too bad BMW 5-series wagons are so expensive.
Do you want an auto or a stick? What about a 9-3 wagon?
Holding out hope for an auto is a lost cause with these cars.
Taking a pit stop, but so far we have driven the Edge and a FX35. Will try the CX7 soon.
And holy shit the FX is THIRSTY!
Quote from: Laconian on January 08, 2011, 05:27:17 PM
And holy shit the FX is THIRSTY!
Yes. And they're not particularly big inside.
Quote from: Laconian on January 08, 2011, 05:25:58 PM
Holding out hope for an auto is a lost cause with these cars.
Taking a pit stop, but so far we have driven the Edge and a FX35. Will try the CX7 soon.
You could ship a $26K Outback XT 5spd from Texas. Limited trim in a nice brown metallic color.
Quote from: Laconian on January 08, 2011, 05:25:58 PM
Holding out hope for an auto is a lost cause with these cars.
Taking a pit stop, but so far we have driven the Edge and a FX35. Will try the CX7 soon.
Automatics are silly. You're a man, get a manual. Find a stickshift 9-3 or 9-5 wagon. Enjoy the bath in stereotypes.
What has Subaru done??!?!?! This is so goddamn confusing!
Forester: you only get the stick shift if you go with the lowest tier model. Otherwise you're stuck with that awful 4 speed auto. EVEN WITH A TURBO. A four speed auto plus turbo equals bad times.
Outback: you only get the stick shift if you go with the HIGHEST tier model. And where did the turbo motors go?
This brand has lost the plot. Ugh.
Quote from: Laconian on January 09, 2011, 12:08:45 AM
What has Subaru done??!?!?! This is so goddamn confusing!
Forester: you only get the stick shift if you go with the lowest tier model. Otherwise you're stuck with that awful 4 speed auto. EVEN WITH A TURBO. A four speed auto plus turbo equals bad times.
Outback: you only get the stick shift if you go with the HIGHEST tier model. And where did the turbo motors go?
This brand has lost the plot. Ugh.
Obviously this means that you should get an STI.
Quick thoughts on the cars we've driven:
'11 Edge Limited: Surprisingly good!! Solidly built, tracked nicely, good steering radius and comfy seats. Computerized dashboard not as obnoxious as I feared. I get an X-plan discount on it. It seems like pretty substantial car for $32k.
'08 FX35: Best part about it was the steering. Loved the heavy meaty feel around town, and it lightened up and became incredibly agile and tight at speed. It drove like a smaller car. But, alas, it drank gas like a truck! The interior was clearly mid-oughts vintage, feeling much like our Accord in many respects. Certain details were a big improvement, like the quality of the leather and the adjustability of the driver's seat, but in general it didn't feel like a major upgrade over our existing car like the Edge did. Glad I got the chance to drive it, but not going to buy it.
'11 CX7 Grand Touring: Much better than I remember. Sure, the rake of the windshield makes it feel a little like looking through a mailbox slit, but the truth is that you can still see the parts of the road that matter. Dashboard is spare but well designed. Seats are comfortable but the lack of side bolsters makes taking corners unpleasant. Lots of power from the turbo motor, not off the line, but on the highway - it surges to high speeds effortlessly. Brakes modulation was utterly fantastic, not grabby, not spongy, just right. Rear seat comfort isn't great, thanks to the high floor and a weird bulge in the cushion right in the middle where passengers' asses would be. Nav lacked voice recognition capability. Hmm.
Boyfriend's reaction to the Juke: O_O WTF THAT LOOKS AWESOME
OK, we're going to test drive it, then.
Quote from: Laconian on January 09, 2011, 12:32:30 AM
Boyfriend's reaction to the Juke: O_O WTF THAT LOOKS AWESOME
OK, we're going to test drive it, then.
:lol:
At least if you get the Juke, you can get a manual and it'll be far under your $30k budget!
You're a fan of the Puke, Laconian?
My sister and her husband love their Edge.
Quote from: CALL_911 on January 09, 2011, 12:52:00 AM
You're a fan of the Puke, Laconian?
I think could warm up to the styling. It depends on the functional compromise that it strikes and how well it drives. You have to admit that the specs are intriguing.
Quote from: Laconian on January 09, 2011, 01:01:07 AM
I think could warm up to the styling. It depends on the functional compromise that it strikes and how well it drives. You have to admit that the specs are intriguing.
That they are. It is a cool little car, I won't deny that.
But man, it is hideous.
This might be so hideous that it goes full circle and becomes awesome. The first generation Scion xB did that to me. Need to see it in the metal first, probably tomorrow morning.
We might check out the Rogue at the same time, but that's the same car that my blatantly racist neighbor drives...
Quote from: Laconian on January 09, 2011, 01:09:17 AM
This might be so hideous that it goes full circle and becomes awesome. The first generation Scion xB did that to me. Need to see it in the metal first, probably tomorrow morning.
We might check out the Rogue at the same time, but that's the same car that my blatantly racist neighbor drives...
It's at that point of ugly where it just can't grow on me. It just looks too outlandish.
I fucking HATE the Rogue. I have no idea why, either. Probably the same reason I hate the Altima.
Quote from: SVT666 on January 09, 2011, 12:52:18 AM
My sister and her husband love their Edge.
There's a lot to like. It changed my boyfriend's mind on Ford. He won a Mustang GT in an office raffle about 6 years ago and he thought it was a piece of shit (coming from a guy that grew up on Peugeot 505s and Twingos, OUCH!!) He was converted after spending some time in that Edge and seeing what Fords can be like when they aren't based on 30 year old chassis :lol: or constrained by rental car fleet budgets.
If you're checking out Nissan, would you consider the Xterra?
Quote from: Laconian on January 09, 2011, 01:17:33 AM
There's a lot to like. It changed my boyfriend's mind on Ford. He won a Mustang GT in an office raffle about 6 years ago and he thought it was a piece of shit (coming from a guy that grew up on Peugeot 505s and Twingos, OUCH!!) He was converted after spending some time in that Edge and seeing what Fords can be like when they aren't based on 30 year old chassis :lol: or constrained by rental car fleet budgets.
Wait, your significant other is straight up Frenchy? And he lost the point of the Mustang? WTF.
Quote from: SVT666 on January 09, 2011, 12:52:18 AM
Me LOVES Ford. Om nom nom nom!
:ohyeah:
Fixed.
Quote from: CALL_911 on January 09, 2011, 01:19:41 AM
If you're checking out Nissan, would you consider the Xterra?
What the hell for? Too big, too shitty gas mileage, drives like a truck... :confused:
Bah, I'd get a used XC60. I really like them, both inside and out.
Bimmers and Benzes too expensive?
Quote from: Laconian on January 09, 2011, 01:01:07 AM
I think could warm up to the styling. It depends on the functional compromise that it strikes and how well it drives. You have to admit that the specs are intriguing.
It's so fucking ugly that everyone on the design team should be blinded and everyone who likes it should be piled high and set on fire.
Quote from: Raza on January 09, 2011, 07:07:59 AM
It's so fucking ugly that everyone on the design team should be blinded and everyone who likes it should be piled high and set on fire.
Yes, and to top it off, it's boring inside.
Laconian have you checked last Gen Outbacks? Your local Subaru dealer might have and outback XT with a manual. I'm really glad you guys are trying sweet Juke its sweet.
Nobody has mentioned the Mitsubishi Outlander Sport? (looks sort of like the outlander, only smaller) I haven't seen one up close yet but it looks like a nice little package. I know there's not a lot of Mitsu-love out there but I'm sure the dealers will be ecstatic just to see somebody walking in the door! You could probably swing one helluva deal, too.
Honda CR-V is also a good, safe bet.
Quote from: Rupert on January 09, 2011, 02:41:42 AM
What the hell for? Too big, too shitty gas mileage, drives like a truck... :confused:
I guess you're right. I fucking love those things though, they're just so cool.
I'd still buy one. :lol:
Quote from: 68_427 on January 09, 2011, 09:06:31 AM
Laconian have you checked last Gen Outbacks? Your local Subaru dealer might have and outback XT with a manual. I'm really glad you guys are trying sweet Juke its sweet.
Dude, you've mentioned the last gen Outback like 123908219038029138 times. I think it's safe to assume he doesn't want one.
Why would he consider the new one but not the old one? The only thing the new one has over the 08/9 is a little extra space. I also priced a Countryman S to $31K, so while it could be doable I don't think it has anything over the Juke. Although both the Juke and Countryman should be satisfying to drive I'm not sure the space will be enough if you guys are used to an Accord.
Quote from: Laconian on January 09, 2011, 01:09:17 AM
This might be so hideous that it goes full circle and becomes awesome. The first generation Scion xB did that to me. Need to see it in the metal first, probably tomorrow morning.
We might check out the Rogue at the same time, but that's the same car that my blatantly racist neighbor drives...
To me, it's a butterface. It has an athletic body, but an odd face.
Quote from: 68_427 on January 09, 2011, 09:06:31 AM
Laconian have you checked last Gen Outbacks? Your local Subaru dealer might have and outback XT with a manual. I'm really glad you guys are trying sweet Juke its sweet.
[/quote
They're boring.
Quote from: Raza on January 08, 2011, 04:33:00 PM
Do you want an auto or a stick? What about a 9-3 wagon?
The backseat would not be that accommodating for driving old people in the backseat. Rear entry/exit is reasonable for most people under the age of 60 and those under 6'2".
Quote from: WookieOnRitalin on January 09, 2011, 11:10:36 AM
The backseat would not be that accommodating for driving old people in the backseat. Rear entry/exit is reasonable for most people under the age of 60 and those under 6'2".
His in-laws (?) are French it would seem. They're used to cramped, uncomfortable small cars.
Quote from: Madman on January 09, 2011, 09:21:59 AM
Nobody has mentioned the Mitsubishi Outlander Sport? (looks sort of like the outlander, only smaller) I haven't seen one up close yet but it looks like a nice little package. I know there's not a lot of Mitsu-love out there but I'm sure the dealers will be ecstatic just to see somebody walking in the door! You could probably swing one helluva deal, too.
Honda CR-V is also a good, safe bet.
He already mentioned it earlier. He likes it, but has no confidence in Mitsubishi staying in the market. I really do like it, but why not just go up market and get the more comfortable Outlander GT other than not having a stick?
Won a Mustang GT in a raffle? I need to get in on those raffles.
We'll try to check out low mileage versions of last-gen Outbacks while we're at the dealer.
Oh noes, we just got on the computers and he's looking at Juke commercials now. Shit!
Quote from: Laconian on January 09, 2011, 11:49:01 AM
We'll try to check out low mileage versions of last-gen Outbacks while we're at the dealer.
Oh noes, we just got on the computers and he's looking at Juke commercials now. Shit!
Which of you will be the primary driver of this car? I imagine he'd take this one and you'd have the eventual fun one?
Did you know that you can no longer get a CR-V with a manual transmission? What kind of bullshit is that?
Quote from: Laconian on January 09, 2011, 11:49:01 AM
We'll try to check out low mileage versions of last-gen Outbacks while we're at the dealer.
Oh noes, we just got on the computers and he's looking at Juke commercials now. Shit!
Theybdo look awesome in white and fully loaded are about 25k
I love the exterior look of the Juke. Either you hate it or you love it. The interior, however, is not nearly as polar. It just sucks. It's a ricer nightmare with stupid colors and very cheap plastics. Laconian is going to come out of that vehicle understanding how cool it is to drive, but how downmarket it really is in terms of quality. It's all kinds of blah on the inside and that's why I am massively disaapointed in it as a vehicle.
Quote from: WookieOnRitalin on January 09, 2011, 12:34:00 PM
I love the exterior look of the Juke. Either you hate it or you love it. The interior, however, is not nearly as polar. It just sucks. It's a ricer nightmare with stupid colors and very cheap plastics. Laconoian is going to come out of that vehicle understanding how cool it is to drive, but how downmarket it really is in terms of quality. It's all kinds of blah on the inside and that's why I am massively disaapointed in it as a vehicle.
They don't all have the goofy colors inside.
Quote from: ifcar on January 09, 2011, 12:36:47 PM
They don't all have the goofy colors inside.
True, but that interior is still a joke. The door inserts do not change color. It looks like a bleeding hemorrhoid (though I may be exaggerating slightly). It lacks style and class. Its too ricer and appeals to 16 yr old boys. Plus combine the fact that you can go upmarket to almost 30k, why in the world would you subject yourself to an interior as crappy as that? It's chinzy and lacks real comfort.
Day to day, week to week, month to month, the weaknesses of the Juke will wear on the driver. When you're pumping out that much cash, you're going to want something that delivers a certain level of comfort and refinement. How this is the Juke I have no idea. Once you get passed the, "Oh shit, wow. That's freaking cool," aspect of the Juke, you realize that it's not meant for those who truly want a vehicle that you can live with day in and day out.
Sure Laconian could have wild, sexy, dark stranger, but if he's not competent in other areas, I doubt he's going to date him long term. The Juke really depends on whether or not you see this as an eventual long term situation. In the end, my bet is that he'll realize that it lacks the real refinement he's looking for out of a vehicle.
If it weren't for the liftgate desire, I'd say look at a Kizashi. It really covers every basis here minus the fact that it lacks cargo capabilities.
Quote from: the Teuton on January 09, 2011, 01:31:15 AM
Wait, your significant other is straight up Frenchy? And he lost the point of the Mustang? WTF.
:ohyeah:
It's not hard for a non-Stanger to not like the pre-2005 Mustangs, and if it was a V6 then it's even worse. I love Mustangs so I like the pre-2005 Stangs....except the V6.
Quote
Fixed.
Actually, my brother-in-law is a diehard bow-tie man, but my sister really wanted the Edgo, so they bought it and he now admits that he really really likes it.
Quote from: SVT666 on January 09, 2011, 05:42:23 PM
It's not hard for a non-Stanger to not like the pre-2005 Mustangs, and if it was a V6 then it's even worse. I love Mustangs so I like the pre-2005 Stangs....except the V6.
Yeah, they were kinda turds, weren't they?
QuoteActually, my brother-in-law is a diehard bow-tie man, but my sister really wanted the Edgo, so they bought it and he now admits that he really really likes it.
It'd help if GM would have made a decent midsize crossover earlier. The Vue kinda counts, but pickins are slim in between until the Equinox and Terrain.
I'm still not too much of a fan of either of those, though. My pick of the class is currently the Murano.
The Murano is way more expensive.
Quote from: 68_427 on January 09, 2011, 06:40:20 PM
The Murano is way more expensive.
Than the Edge? Really? (goes to check...)
The Murano starts at $28,500. The Edge starts at $27,220. :huh:
And to get an Equinox with a V6, it starts at $26,800. That's not to big of a difference...
I was comparing it to the base Equinox and Terrain forgetting that the Murano is V6 only. How many Muranos does Nissan sell? I really like them but have never seen a base model of the current gen, I've only seen limited AWDs with NAV and everything (Like my friend's) and they are really really nice, like Infiniti nice.
Quote from: 68_427 on January 09, 2011, 06:49:55 PM
I was comparing it to the base Equinox and Terrain forgetting that the Murano is V6 only. How many Muranos does Nissan sell? I really like them but have never seen a base model of the current gen, I've only seen limited AWDs with NAV and everything (Like my friend's) and they are really really nice, like Infiniti nice.
I have not a clue. I've only driven basic cold weather rental spec: cloth seats and AWD.
Tucson: initially impressive but noisy at speed, exhibited a strange undulation on the freeway, and the variable steering ratio was way too busy.
Sportage: wow, much better than the Tucson! No complaints about the steering, drove nicely on the freeway, got the best average mpg out of any of the cars today (24 :facepalm:) Tons of features and looks great on the outside. Engine is gutless up hills but that's not surprising. A very good contender among the smaller utes.
Sorrento: almost too plush! Steering and ride are both excellent, engine is strong and transmission shifts imperceptibly. Higher trims come with a third row, which we don't really want (dripping salty dive gear on top of leather seats? no thx) Real leather only available on SX model, which comes with tradeoffs in fuel economy and ride comfort.
Rogue: Decent but lacked panache, even when compared to its Korean competition. Steering was dead on center and required a pretty significant tug in order to affect any kind of change of direction. CVT did its job well, barely even noticed it was there. Interior was totally uninspired, though. The nav screen is a tiny double DIN screen well out of the way.
Edge (longer test drive this time): OMG this brute is super fucking comfortable! My only major complaint about the driving experience is that the steering is at once too light and too quick. There isn't a lot of resistance keeping you from steering off center, and when you do, minor movements in the wheel result in significant course corrections. Don't sneeze at the wheel!
More test drives, including Subies, will wait for next weekend.
I'm going to go ahead and recommend you try out the Murano if you're looking at the Edge. I can't speak for the refresh, but I thought the Nissan was nicer than the Ford when I drove them.
I'm going to second the Murano test drive. Also it sounds like you enjoyed the Sportage, and you know it'll be available with the 2.0T right?
EDIT: I'm pretty sure you can only get leather on the Murano SL which starts at over $35K
I'll consider it, but apples-to-apples, the Edge is almost 5k less expensive than the Murano. And with my discount it's almost 7k cheaper.
Yeah I don't see it really being any better at all, let alone $7K better.
Oh, we looked at the Juke inside the dealer building. It's not the seats that are the problem there, it's the size of the doors! The aperture is definitely too small for my inlaws.
The stereotype about the French being beanpoles- does not apply in their case.
Are you still going to drive one? I'd like to know what you think.
I'd go for the Edge, though it's a shame the front end of the current generation has Ford Goofgrille as standard equipment. The first-generation looked cool in a chubby robot way.
I skipped some (all) pages.
Think about Mazda at all? Their SUVs and the Mazda5 seem nice.
(But do please tell how the new Subies drive. And why is the Forester (which seems larger) more expensive than the outback?!)
He said he tried a CX-7 before and it "drove like a tank", and then he tried one again and it was the tits.
(http://www.lincah.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/02/2010-mazda-cx-7-front-angle-picture-588x441.jpg),
you silly shit.
Carter Subaru has an '09 Oubtack XT w5sp M/T. Gray on black. 21 k miles. $27k (could easily be talked down $5k IMO). (http://www.autotrader.com/fyc/vdp.jsp?ct=c&car_id=292013032&dealer_id=578774&car_year=2009&doors=&systime=&model=SUBOUTBK&search_lang=en&start_year=2007&keywordsfyc=__dHVyYm8%2C__&keywordsrep=116117114098111&highlightFirstMakeModel=&search_type=both&distance=0&min_price=&rdm=1294809064102&drive=&marketZipError=false&advanced=y&fuel=&keywords_display=turbo&sownerid=1393439&lastBeginningStartYear=1981&end_year=2009&showZipError=y&make2=&certified=&engine=&page_location=findacar%3A%3Aispsearchform&body_code=0&transmission=Manual&default_sort=newsortbyprice_DESC&max_mileage=&address=98065&color=&sort_type=priceDESC&max_price=&awsp=false&make=SUB&num_records=25&seller_type=b&cardist=27&standard=false&rdpage=thumb)
Gods, if conditions where a wee bit more favorable I'd be ALL over this thing.
Quote from: GoCougs on January 11, 2011, 10:14:08 PM
Carter Subaru has an '09 Oubtack XT w5sp M/T. Gray on black. 21 k miles. $27k (could easily be talked down $5k IMO). (http://www.autotrader.com/fyc/vdp.jsp?ct=c&car_id=292013032&dealer_id=578774&car_year=2009&doors=&systime=&model=SUBOUTBK&search_lang=en&start_year=2007&keywordsfyc=__dHVyYm8%2C__&keywordsrep=116117114098111&highlightFirstMakeModel=&search_type=both&distance=0&min_price=&rdm=1294809064102&drive=&marketZipError=false&advanced=y&fuel=&keywords_display=turbo&sownerid=1393439&lastBeginningStartYear=1981&end_year=2009&showZipError=y&make2=&certified=&engine=&page_location=findacar%3A%3Aispsearchform&body_code=0&transmission=Manual&default_sort=newsortbyprice_DESC&max_mileage=&address=98065&color=&sort_type=priceDESC&max_price=&awsp=false&make=SUB&num_records=25&seller_type=b&cardist=27&standard=false&rdpage=thumb)
Gods, if conditions where a wee bit more favorable I'd be ALL over this thing.
KEVIN GET THAT THING MANG.
Quote from: GoCougs on January 11, 2011, 10:14:08 PM
Carter Subaru has an '09 Oubtack XT w5sp M/T. Gray on black. 21 k miles. $27k (could easily be talked down $5k IMO). (http://www.autotrader.com/fyc/vdp.jsp?ct=c&car_id=292013032&dealer_id=578774&car_year=2009&doors=&systime=&model=SUBOUTBK&search_lang=en&start_year=2007&keywordsfyc=__dHVyYm8%2C__&keywordsrep=116117114098111&highlightFirstMakeModel=&search_type=both&distance=0&min_price=&rdm=1294809064102&drive=&marketZipError=false&advanced=y&fuel=&keywords_display=turbo&sownerid=1393439&lastBeginningStartYear=1981&end_year=2009&showZipError=y&make2=&certified=&engine=&page_location=findacar%3A%3Aispsearchform&body_code=0&transmission=Manual&default_sort=newsortbyprice_DESC&max_mileage=&address=98065&color=&sort_type=priceDESC&max_price=&awsp=false&make=SUB&num_records=25&seller_type=b&cardist=27&standard=false&rdpage=thumb)
Gods, if conditions where a wee bit more favorable I'd be ALL over this thing.
You've been talking about an Accord replacement for a while now. Is there a concrete timeframe? I'm always looking myself, but I like my car, it runs as well as it did the day I bought it, and I really really like not having a car payment. So while I'd love a Tacoma or something like a WRX, the Protege stays for another two years (reasonable timeline for finishing school, getting a job, and getting my student loans paid off).
Quote from: thecarnut on January 11, 2011, 10:17:13 PM
KEVIN GET THAT THING MANG.
He needs to make sure it comes with the optional golden retriever package.
We actually like the higher load floor of small SUVs - makes suiting up in dive gear much, much easier. And, *that* would've saved my back from this awful injury. So I don't think we are going to go with a wagon.
Quote from: the Teuton on January 11, 2011, 10:27:53 PM
He needs to make sure it comes with the optional golden retriever package.
Too late, golden retriever package is factory installed. :cry:
Quote from: Laconian on January 11, 2011, 11:04:13 PM
We actually like the higher load floor of small SUVs - makes suiting up in dive gear much, much easier. And, *that* would've saved my back from this awful injury. So I don't think we are going to go with a wagon.
The Outback is more butch than the lesbians who usually drive them. And it's awesome. And it rides really high. And it has a turbo and a stick. You need to get one.
QuoteToo late, golden retriever package is factory installed. :cry:
Perhaps you need to order one aftermarket.
Crap, that dealer is in Ballard. We're not going to go that far when we have a Subie dealer just 3 miles from home.
http://www.eastsidesubaru.com
Quote from: the Teuton on January 11, 2011, 11:11:15 PM
Perhaps you need to order one aftermarket.
How tacky. I don't want people to call me a ricer.
Quote from: Laconian on January 11, 2011, 11:14:23 PM
How tacky. I don't want people to call me a ricer.
When its tail wags, it creates a force quite like the "VTEC just kicked in, yo."
It's something to behold. The only problem is how often if might have to empty its waste gate. It gets better with age and proper tuning.
Quote from: Laconian on January 11, 2011, 11:14:00 PM
Crap, that dealer is in Ballard. We're not going to go that far when we have a Subie dealer just 3 miles from home.
http://www.eastsidesubaru.com
Subaru dealer only three miles down the road, eh? I'm with Teuton; get over there and get yourself a Forester. It will do everything you want it to do and it's a pretty good drive, too. Good value for money and it should last well into the next decade if you take care of it.
It's hard to find '05-'09 Outback XT w/manual transmission though...
I thought they stopped making the turbo manual wagon. I guess that was just for Legacy trim, not Outbacks.
Quote from: Secret Chimp on January 12, 2011, 10:06:49 AM
I thought they stopped making the turbo manual wagon. I guess that was just for Legacy trim, not Outbacks.
As of (2009?) there is no more legacy wagon. All dat's left
-Legacy sedan
-Outback (wagon)
-Forester
(Did they kill the Tribeca?)
Quote from: Laconian on January 11, 2011, 11:14:00 PM
Crap, that dealer is in Ballard. We're not going to go that far when we have a Subie dealer just 3 miles from home.
http://www.eastsidesubaru.com
WHAT. is. up. with. this.
http://www.eastsidesubaru.com/used/Nissan/2005-Nissan-350Z-35340a120a0a006401da30c30c906ad7.htm
Gotta see the open door pics.
Test drove the RAV4 and the Venza.
RAV4 has some things going for it - the cargo space is huge, thanks to the external spare tire (even though we aren't fans of the look). Steering is decent and it tracks nicely on the highway. It manages to do OK with the 4AT too. Not a bad car, will probably revisit it again in the daylight once we've seen everything else.
Venza is ridiculously comfortable for everybody but the driver. All the seats have wonderful cushioning, have squishy floor mats underfoot, and its massive girth invites us to get fatter just so we can enjoy the horizontal real estate. But man, what a crap drive. Windshield visibility is below average, thanks to the combination of low roof and high hood height. The steering is totally Buick-grade - super light, slow steering that requires way too much hand-over-hand to make even minor turns. And all that pork just totally overwhelms the 4 cylinder engine, which constantly wails and growls, and to little effect. I'd love to be chauffeured in a Venza, but driving one? No thanks!
I take you drove the 4 cylinder RAV4? Drive the V6, it's a screamer. Still gets something like 26mpg highway too.
Seriously, I'm not a Toyota fan or a cute ute fan, but I would totally rock a V6 RAV4.
Drive a Santa Fe as well. You can get a V6 Limited for a good price.
(http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_IP2BRhYArlM/TSRy1-uMI7I/AAAAAAAAIQY/edefGVXS0pA/s640/2011-volvo-xc60-r-design-front-side-view.jpg)
(http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_IP2BRhYArlM/TSRyrfp94CI/AAAAAAAAIQU/W4rmF208DXg/s640/2011-volvo-xc60-r-design-rear-angle-view.jpg)
(http://images.forum-auto.com/mesimages/46/VOLVO-XC60.jpg)
That's a very good looking car.
However, it looks absolutely retarded in red.
Quote from: CALL_911 on January 12, 2011, 09:42:03 PM
That's a very good looking car.
However, it looks absolutely retarded in red.
Yeah I wish they used black for the press photos.
An XC60 is an excellent choice but isn't it over his budget? Same deal with the BMW X3, Land Rover LR2, Lincoln MKX, Mercedes GLK, Audi Q5, Cadillac SRX and the Infiniti EX. All very nice but a tad expensive.
I think it's time for some lateral thinking. Anyone suggest a Mini Countryman yet?
Quote from: Madman on January 12, 2011, 09:54:42 PM
An XC60 is an excellent choice but isn't it over his budget? Same deal with the BMW X3, Land Rover LR2, Lincoln MKX, Mercedes GLK, Audi Q5, Cadillac SRX and the Infiniti EX. All very nice but a tad expensive.
I think it's time for some lateral thinking. Anyone suggest a Mini Countryman yet?
Yeah, but that's tighter inside than the already not spacious Juke.
Quote from: Madman on January 12, 2011, 09:54:42 PM
An XC60 is an excellent choice but isn't it over his budget? Same deal with the BMW X3, Land Rover LR2, Lincoln MKX, Mercedes GLK, Audi Q5, Cadillac SRX and the Infiniti EX. All very nice but a tad expensive.
I think it's time for some lateral thinking. Anyone suggest a Mini Countryman yet?
Most of those vehicles can be had within the price range 1-2 years used with less than 25k miles on them.
I'm having a hard time talking the significant other into buying used. His last three cars have been new Hondas and I think the smell of freshly cured epoxy and outgassing plastics is having some kind of narcotic effect on his brain.
So, the TSX wagon doesn't come with a stick - isn't the automatic transmission a bad match for the high-revving TSX I4?
Quote from: Laconian on January 12, 2011, 10:55:47 PM
So, the TSX wagon doesn't come with a stick - isn't the automatic transmission a bad match for the high-revving TSX I4?
It's a 5-speed auto with a big 4-cylinder engine.
It's not perfect, but you could do a lot worse. Does it have to be a Honda now?
My old boss at Enterprise was addicted to VWs so much that he forced his boyfriend into a Jetta, bought a newer Jetta to replace that car after it was flood totalled, and traded in his '08 Jetta for a CC.
Before all of those, he owned an Audi A4.
Being obsessive like that isn't the way to go through life. Heck, I only buy cars with names that begin with the letter "S" right now. At least I have some creativity.
Quote from: Laconian on January 12, 2011, 10:55:47 PM
So, the TSX wagon doesn't come with a stick - isn't the automatic transmission a bad match for the high-revving TSX I4?
My sister has an automatic TSX.
I'm not a fan of that thing's transmission. That and it is ssssllllooooowwww
Quote from: Laconian on January 12, 2011, 10:55:47 PM
So, the TSX wagon doesn't come with a stick - isn't the automatic transmission a bad match for the high-revving TSX I4?
Depends on how big of a hurry you're in. The experience is just more like any other four-cylinder midsize family car than an upscale entry-luxer.
Hey Iffy, if were you to revisit your small SUV comparo, how do you think the new Sportage would slot into your rankings?
BTW, I liked the new Sorento, but I loved the Santa Fe. Just saying...
Quote from: the Teuton on January 12, 2011, 11:12:25 PM
BTW, I liked the new Sorento, but I loved the Santa Fe. Just saying...
The Santa Fe is getting kind of old, don't you think?
Quote from: Laconian on January 12, 2011, 11:13:14 PM
The Santa Fe is getting kind of old, don't you think?
It is, but it's still very good.
Quote from: Laconian on January 12, 2011, 11:13:14 PM
The Santa Fe is getting kind of old, don't you think?
The pillars are thinner, it's more upright and easier to see out of, the materials quality is better, and it's still very nice. It's better than the Escape, that's for sure. And I like the Escape.
I don't think we'll be going with a V6 SUV, in any case. My experience driving these SUVs has taught me that these cars are equally bland once they are up to speed. Why bother paying a premium on the car and the gasoline when the car is fundamentally a boring box?
If we were towing, hauling a large family, or constantly driving up mountain passes, then I would probably be thinking otherwise. Gluttonous horsepower would be better spent on the future sports car, anyway.
Iffy, broken link alert: http://www.examiner.com/autos-in-national/a-week-the-2010-subaru-forester-day-5-interior-details , click the "Day 8" link.
Quote from: the Teuton on January 12, 2011, 11:17:25 PM
The pillars are thinner, it's more upright and easier to see out of, the materials quality is better, and it's still very nice. It's better than the Escape, that's for sure. And I like the Escape.
Are you sure you've driven the new Sorento? It's hard for me to fault the visibility or the material quality (well, most of it anyway.)
I remember Iffy saying one time that they were all relatively mediocre on some level.
Honestly, I'd go with an A4 Avant if you could swing one.
Quote from: Laconian on January 12, 2011, 11:24:04 PM
I don't think we'll be going with a V6 SUV, in any case. My experience driving these SUVs has taught me that these cars are equally bland once they are up to speed. Why bother paying a premium on the car and the gasoline when the car is fundamentally a boring box?
If we were towing, hauling a large family, or constantly driving up mountain passes, then I would probably be thinking otherwise. Gluttonous horsepower would be better spent on the future sports car, anyway.
Iffy, broken link alert: http://www.examiner.com/autos-in-national/a-week-the-2010-subaru-forester-day-5-interior-details , click the "Day 8" link.
Your boyfriend's dead set against used?
Those RAV4s are quite nice, I must say.
What are you leaning towards at this point? Still the Edge?
Nay, the Edge is a monster. TrueDelta indicates that most drivers have been getting 15-16mpg during mostly city and suburban driving. And the recent reliability reports are not encouraging, either - way more shop visits on average than the class average.
We still have a few quality candidates to test drive in the next few days: the Subarus, the Honda CR-V, and possibly the Acura RDX.
My personal favorite so far has been the Sportage. I think it's the best looking car in the class, the interior is quite nice for the price, and I didn't mind driving it either. It's not too big, not too small, a little low on power but not horribly so. Perhaps with the upcoming rockin' Hyundai 2.0 turbo it would be VERY compelling. It wasn't good enough to convince me to buy on the spot, though. I won't push for it until I know what the CR-V and Forester are like, and I also have to figure out what the depreciation story is like with Kias.
I wonder if special-offer leasing could be used as a hedge against epic Korean depreciation.
The safe bet: a Kia Rondo. Or a Suzuki Verona.
If only Ssangyong sold the Rodius here!
Quote from: Laconian on January 12, 2011, 11:57:04 PM
If only Ssangyong sold the Rodius here!
It would be AWESOME.
Another option is on the table: wait until the 2012 models. Could we be a single-car household until then? It wouldn't be super easy, but we've been doing it this past week without too much trouble. The turbo Sportage and new CR-V will be released then.
This is the philosophy I've taken with upgrading my computer. Just keep waiting, the new CPU/GPU/etc. are right around the corner. And guess what, my computer's from 2004. :lol:
You need two cars.
What you need is a Great Wall X240!
(http://www.caradvice.com.au/wp-content/uploads/2009/08/GreatWall-X240_001a1.jpg)
Or a Ssangyong Actyon!
(http://www.indiancarsbikes.in/wp-content/uploads/2010/08/Ssangyong-Actyon-front-view-image.jpg)
Wait.
Roomster!
(http://skoda-roomster.info/images/wallpapers/Skoda%20Roomster%20%20Red-284797.jpeg)
:rockon:
Quote from: omicron on January 13, 2011, 05:53:30 AM
Wait.
Roomster!
(http://skoda-roomster.info/images/wallpapers/Skoda%20Roomster%20%20Red-284797.jpeg)
:rockon:
Dood, good idea. But go domestic.
(http://blog.niot.net/blog-images/chicago-08-preview-ford-transit-connect-rumored-to-arrive.jpg)
add some paint and goodies
(http://media2.blackfalconmedia.com/2009/4/medium/1375521.jpg)
http://www.worldcarfans.com/109040318445/ford-transit-connect-family-one-concept-to-debut-in-new-york
mebbe some stripes
(http://www.mylocalvanhire.co.uk/vanblog/wp-content/uploads/2008/04/ford-transit-connect-sportvan.jpg)
and rims
(http://image.automotive.com/f/auto-shows/piloti-inspires-ford-transit-connect-at-sema/11024531+w570+cr1+re0+ar1/ford-transit-connect-concept-h-r-special-springs-piloti-drawjpg.jpg)
then they can cruise for hookers
(http://www.anorak.co.uk/wp-content/uploads/google-prostitute.jpg)
http://www.anorak.co.uk/213823/media/google-street-view-is-for-sex-gallery.html
(just kidding about that last part. :lol: )
A passenger version of the Transit Connect isn't as crazy at it sounds. They're doing a five-seater with windows all around now. Get's pretty good mileage, too.
Quote from: Laconian on January 12, 2011, 11:24:04 PM
I don't think we'll be going with a V6 SUV, in any case. My experience driving these SUVs has taught me that these cars are equally bland once they are up to speed. Why bother paying a premium on the car and the gasoline when the car is fundamentally a boring box?
If we were towing, hauling a large family, or constantly driving up mountain passes, then I would probably be thinking otherwise. Gluttonous horsepower would be better spent on the future sports car, anyway.
Iffy, broken link alert: http://www.examiner.com/autos-in-national/a-week-the-2010-subaru-forester-day-5-interior-details , click the "Day 8" link.
Examiner.com broke literally thousands of my links months ago and are allegedly working to fix them. If you ever come upon a broken link, change "DC-Car" to "Autos" in the URL. (It's ridiculous, I know.)
Quote from: Laconian on January 12, 2011, 11:47:23 PM
Nay, the Edge is a monster. TrueDelta indicates that most drivers have been getting 15-16mpg during mostly city and suburban driving. And the recent reliability reports are not encouraging, either - way more shop visits on average than the class average.
We still have a few quality candidates to test drive in the next few days: the Subarus, the Honda CR-V, and possibly the Acura RDX.
My personal favorite so far has been the Sportage. I think it's the best looking car in the class, the interior is quite nice for the price, and I didn't mind driving it either. It's not too big, not too small, a little low on power but not horribly so. Perhaps with the upcoming rockin' Hyundai 2.0 turbo it would be VERY compelling. It wasn't good enough to convince me to buy on the spot, though. I won't push for it until I know what the CR-V and Forester are like, and I also have to figure out what the depreciation story is like with Kias.
I wonder if special-offer leasing could be used as a hedge against epic Korean depreciation.
The new Sportage is actually rated for 4/5 stars for resale value by the Automotive Lease Guide (and the new Optima is 5/5), so they seem very hopeful that poor Kia resale is a thing of the past. That score is below the CR-V or Forester but above the Escape or RAV4.
Quote from: omicron on January 13, 2011, 05:46:17 AM
What you need is a Great Wall X240!
(http://www.caradvice.com.au/wp-content/uploads/2009/08/GreatWall-X240_001a1.jpg)
Holy crap, is that an Isuzu Axiom?
Kinda want, kinda fear for my life against.
With a few exceptions, I don't think visibility in new cars is nowhere near as bad as Teuton makes it to be.
I think anything is a good choice. The Santa Fe is "nice" but IMO doesn't measure up inside to the other cars you are looking at, especially the Edge.
Quote from: the Teuton on January 13, 2011, 08:27:35 AM
Holy crap, is that an Isuzu Axiom?
Kinda want, kinda fear for my life against.
I looked it up: body from an Axiom, chassis from a Toyota 4Runner, engine from a Mitsubishi Galant (4G64 four-banger!).
:mask:
Quote from: 2o6 on January 13, 2011, 08:31:16 AM
With a few exceptions, I don't think visibility in new cars is nowhere near as bad as Teuton makes it to be.
I think anything is a good choice. The Santa Fe is "nice" but IMO doesn't measure up inside to the other cars you are looking at, especially the Edge.
Note: I drive a compact car where I can see out of every window, have nary a blindspot, and can still perch my arm on the window sill. Make of that what you wish.
Quote from: 93JC on January 13, 2011, 08:32:24 AM
I looked it up: body from an Axiom, chassis from a Toyota 4Runner, engine from a Mitsubishi Galant (4G64 four-banger!).
:mask:
How in the hell does that work?
With the exception of the engine (let's drop a 4G63 in it), it sounds like it might be a nice car. :mask:
I'm just going to say this:
When I was in the Soul and Sportage back to back, the Soul was roughly the same size inside, but had more head and shoulder room, and was easier to get in and out of in the rear, something you may find important.
The Equinox and Terrain are both very good vehicles, but to get that 32MPG rating, you have to be incredibly docile in your driving. It's also kinda slow, too.
Quote from: omicron on January 13, 2011, 05:46:17 AM
What you need is a Great Wall X240!
(http://www.caradvice.com.au/wp-content/uploads/2009/08/GreatWall-X240_001a1.jpg)
You guys get that in Aussieland? I'm sorry. GW is probably one of the worse Chinese makes.
Quote from: the Teuton on January 13, 2011, 08:33:21 AM
Note: I drive a compact car where I can see out of every window, have nary a blindspot, and can still perch my arm on the window sill. Make of that what you wish.
.....as do I. I also learned to drive in a full size conversion van.
Quote from: 93JC on January 13, 2011, 08:32:24 AM
I looked it up: body from an Axiom, chassis from a Toyota 4Runner, engine from a Mitsubishi Galant (4G64 four-banger!).
:mask:
It's funny, I read on line how one member at ChinaCarTimes thing GW is probably one of the better makes in terms of design, when literally all of their cars are clones.
Quote from: Laconian on January 13, 2011, 12:02:00 AM
Another option is on the table: wait until the 2012 models. Could we be a single-car household until then? It wouldn't be super easy, but we've been doing it this past week without too much trouble. The turbo Sportage and new CR-V will be released then.
This is the philosophy I've taken with upgrading my computer. Just keep waiting, the new CPU/GPU/etc. are right around the corner. And guess what, my computer's from 2004. :lol:
Ford will also be introducing the Escape replacement; the Kuga.
Quote from: 2o6 on January 13, 2011, 08:39:04 AM
.....as do I. I also learned to drive in a full size conversion van.
You may give an excuse for ponderous visibility (like everything GM makes right now), but I won't.
Quote from: the Teuton on January 13, 2011, 08:55:23 AM
You may give an excuse for ponderous visibility (like everything GM makes right now), but I won't.
I'm not making excuses, I honestly don't think it's an issue.
Quote from: AutobahnSHO on January 12, 2011, 09:12:27 PM
WHAT. is. up. with. this.
http://www.eastsidesubaru.com/used/Nissan/2005-Nissan-350Z-35340a120a0a006401da30c30c906ad7.htm
Gotta see the open door pics.
Moron also badged it as a "Fairlady Z." :facepalm:
Quote from: 2o6 on January 13, 2011, 09:19:21 AM
I'm not making excuses, I honestly don't think it's an issue.
The sightlines past the A-pillars in the Edge are atrocious.
Otherwise, it's a decent ride.
Rav4 has a 4AT???? WTF?
Quote from: Laconian on January 12, 2011, 10:51:14 PM
I'm having a hard time talking the significant other into buying used. His last three cars have been new Hondas and I think the smell of freshly cured epoxy and outgassing plastics is having some kind of narcotic effect on his brain.
Ah, that's cool. You know what else is cool? Missing out on some really great choice of vehicles. Oh wait. That's not cool. Haha.
If you could get a better vehicle why wouldn't you get it? Seems silly. The GLK, SRX, and XC60 look good on paper, but I have never driven them either. I think I want to have sex with a 9-4x and I know that's wrong, but I'm in love.
Of what you like that's left, I think the Sorento is the better choice and will have better livability over the long haul in comparison to the Sportage.
Quote from: SVT666 on January 13, 2011, 09:41:19 AM
Rav4 has a 4AT???? WTF?
It's cheaper to make that way.
Quote from: WookieOnRitalin on January 13, 2011, 09:50:27 AM
Ah, that's cool. You know what else is cool? Missing out on some really great choice of vehicles. Oh wait. That's not cool. Haha.
If you could get a better vehicle why wouldn't you get it? Seems silly. The GLK, SRX, and XC60 look good on paper, but I have never driven them either. I think I want to have sex with a 9-4x and I know that's wrong, but I'm in love.
Of what you like that's left, I think the Sorento is the better choice and will have better livability over the long haul in comparison to the Sportage.
Better livability in which ways?
Seems we have tested a lot of the same suvs...
My findings were...
- used x3s felt like kmart quality
- forester was utter shit
- Mitsubishi outlander was rubbish
- Ford edge was a solid effort with a failure prone awd system and weak towing
- Mazda cx7 was the clear sports car of the group but has limited utility
- jeep grand Cherokee was as good or better then the edge in every way and tons better in the utility and 4x4 aspects
Quote from: Madman on January 13, 2011, 07:11:11 AM
A passenger version of the Transit Connect isn't as crazy at it sounds. They're doing a five-seater with windows all around now. Get's pretty good mileage, too.
I'd go for one. I guess I kinda like the quirky ones, plus I enjoyed living in Europe almost 4 years...
What about a Grand Cherokee? It has the utility of a truck and the ride of a car.
Jeep! Jeep!
Quote from: the Teuton on January 13, 2011, 07:51:25 PM
What about a Grand Cherokee? It has the utility of a truck and the ride of a car.
I assumed price would be an issue on that one, considering it starts at $30k.
Quote from: r0tor on January 13, 2011, 12:51:42 PM
Seems we have tested a lot of the same suvs...
My findings were...
- used x3s felt like kmart quality
- forester was utter shit
- Mitsubishi outlander was rubbish
- Ford edge was a solid effort with a failure prone awd system and weak towing
- Mazda cx7 was the clear sports car of the group but has limited utility
- jeep grand Cherokee was as good or better then the edge in every way and tons better in the utility and 4x4 aspects
Thanks for your list. Which type of utility are you referring to? We've found that most SUVs offer enough space for our needs, esp. with the rear seats folded flat. Are you planning on towing with your Jeep?
4x4 capability isn't a big deal here since it snows very rarely. It would be nice for jaunts up to the ski slopes, but things don't get nearly as bad as they do in the NE.
Quote from: Laconian on January 13, 2011, 10:26:28 AM
Better livability in which ways?
Better ride. Quieter. Better interior quality. Better visibility. More comfortable. More features. More room. More cargo.
Sorento just seems better overall. I much prefer it to the Sportage and its only a couple grand more.
On a subjective stance, I find the flow of the design to be much more suited to the Sorento as well. Lines are cleaner. Proportions are better. Better stance. Better presence. It looks like something that should costs thousands more. Try stacking both the Sportage and Sorento side by side. The more I compare the two, the more cheesy the Sportage design seems. It's gimmicky and giving an idea of faux sport. The Sorento does not look that way. It looks and is premium. It just says quality.
Combine that with its general higher competency is almost every area than the Sportage, then the choice becomes clear to me anyway.
You're right about the Sorento being plusher and higher quality in general, but it is a *lot* more car - more than we need, I think. Style is subjective, and I actually prefer the Sportage exterior style and dimensions, particularly with that contrasting black glass roof.
Both cars are likely on the shortlist and will probably require another test-drive before we figure out which makes the final cut.
Quote from: 93JC on January 13, 2011, 08:32:24 AM
I looked it up: body from an Axiom, chassis from a Toyota 4Runner, engine from a Mitsubishi Galant (4G64 four-banger!).
:mask:
1830kg, 100kW and an interior made from crackers. It's not even hilarious like a Ssangyong.
That's 4034lb and 134hp for those of you born in a barn.
Quote from: Laconian on January 13, 2011, 10:53:45 PM
Thanks for your list. Which type of utility are you referring to? We've found that most SUVs offer enough space for our needs, esp. with the rear seats folded flat. Are you planning on towing with your Jeep?
4x4 capability isn't a big deal here since it snows very rarely. It would be nice for jaunts up to the ski slopes, but things don't get nearly as bad as they do in the NE.
The jeep is just built stronger, has a bit more storage capacity, and a much better 4x4 system. It also rides and handles as good or better then most everything else I drove. The "towing" package for the edge gives you a whopping 1 1/4" hitch receiver - so basically all you can tow is a bike rack. Jeep comes standard with a real hitch receiver.
The edges awd system also is similar to the cx7 and new explorer but it lacks water cooling that both of the others have. Early edges had a lock button and the awd was constantly turning itself off because it overheated when that function was used. Fords response was to remove the lock switch and remove the thermocouple in the pto. It's also suspected they also dramatically decreased the awd engagement. Since then there is a huge problem with the edge blowing seals on the power take off. Ford claims the explorer got the water cooling system in their own words because of an increased chance of owners taking it offroad. Clearly the edge is designed to only deal with wet pavement or occasional light snow.
But for your needs where it doesn't snow all that much it could be sufficient.
Quote from: omicron on January 14, 2011, 01:36:02 AM
1830kg, 100kW and an interior made from crackers. It's not even hilarious like a Ssangyong.
That's 4034lb and 134hp for those of you born in a barn.
You know, Jesus was born in a barn.
Quote from: ifcar on January 14, 2011, 06:58:03 AM
You know, Jesus was born in a barn.
Yeah, and look where he wound up - nailed to a cross in his 30's!
Quote from: omicron on January 14, 2011, 01:36:02 AM
1830kg, 100kW and an interior made from crackers. It's not even hilarious like a Ssangyong.
That's 4034lb and 134hp for those of you born in a barn.
I can't help but think
why? Why even offer this thing for sale in Australia, or any other first-world country? Surely Australian consumers stay away in droves given the much, much more competent alternatives.
If I wanted a new car based on an old design and built in a shed I'd get a Morgan. Hell, I'd get a Lada Niva before I'd touch any of this Chinese garbage.
Quote from: omicron on January 14, 2011, 01:36:02 AM
1830kg, 100kW and an interior made from crackers. It's not even hilarious like a Ssangyong.
That's 4034lb and 134hp for those of you born in a barn.
Kilowatts are for generators, not for cars, you headstanding communist.
r0t0t0t0r:
"Even a minimally optioned 2011 Grand Cherokee with the V8 lists for $38,490, and it?s easy to configure one deep into the forties. Compared to the 2010, prices are up about $1,800, but the content level is up even more"
Hope you don't mind my asking, but how much did you get yours for?
Quote from: ifcar on January 14, 2011, 06:58:03 AM
You know, Jesus was born in a barn.
I thought you guys weren't a fan...
Quote from: Laconian on January 14, 2011, 07:11:04 PM
r0t0t0t0r:
"Even a minimally optioned 2011 Grand Cherokee with the V8 lists for $38,490, and it?s easy to configure one deep into the forties. Compared to the 2010, prices are up about $1,800, but the content level is up even more"
Hope you don't mind my asking, but how much did you get yours for?
Why do you need the V8? I priced A 4WD V6 model at 32K.
A JGC is LARGE.
But it's so nice.
What happened to the Miata? How did I miss this?
He did a barrel role
Quote from: dazzleman on January 15, 2011, 07:44:51 AM
What happened to the Miata? How did I miss this?
http://www.carspin.net/forums/index.php?topic=23960.0
Quote from: Laconian on January 14, 2011, 07:11:04 PM
r0t0t0t0r:
"Even a minimally optioned 2011 Grand Cherokee with the V8 lists for $38,490, and it?s easy to configure one deep into the forties. Compared to the 2010, prices are up about $1,800, but the content level is up even more"
Hope you don't mind my asking, but how much did you get yours for?
Get the v6... its nearly as fast as the hemi because the hemi adds like 400 pounds.
I got mine for 35 or 36k... that's with the Loredo x package, off road package, towing package, and nav
Quote from: 68_427 on January 15, 2011, 07:48:03 AM
He did a barrel role
That's almost funny
but you're talking the death of his MIATA and it's spelled "barrel roll". Like rolling something, not playing a role. :lol:
Quote from: dazzleman on January 15, 2011, 07:44:51 AM
What happened to the Miata? How did I miss this?
THAT is funny. :lol: :lol: :lol:
Only because I'm usually the completely obvlivious one. There's no less than 3 threads about it.. ;)
Subarus and Acuras (used RDX or new TSXwagen) today.
Quote from: AutobahnSHO on January 15, 2011, 11:18:22 AM
That's almost funny
but you're talking the death of his MIATA and it's spelled "barrel roll". Like rolling something, not playing a role. :lol:
D'OH! Can't believe I let that slip.
Quote from: Laconian on January 15, 2011, 12:34:39 PM
Subarus and Acuras (used RDX or new TSXwagen) today.
hehehe
Those are in the same segment now?
Quote from: AutobahnSHO on January 15, 2011, 03:13:08 PM
hehehe
Those are in the same segment now?
No, but we aren't bound to a specific segment. We have relatively loose requirements and budget.
Outback: drove very comfortably, like a floatier Accord, and wow! Great fuel economy for an AWD vehicle of that size. Interior in the Limited was pretty good, though I could see places where the silver paint was fading.
Forester: Don't like the dead pedal position, the steeply angled firewall cuts into passenger footroom. Interior is definitely low-rent and the passenger seat is too close to the floor, lending to an impression that one is peering out from a bathtub. Rear seats don't recline.
TSX Wagon: as Cale says, "jdm tyte". Steering and handling felt really dialled in, engine felt eager and sounded great. Visibility is excellent all around. Seats are firm and supportive. Cargo room is very good with the seats folded down. Dashboard is high quality and well-built, but it doesn't scream "premium". Rear seat ingress is made difficult by the tight rear quarters though. My inlaws already have joint problems and that kind of shit doesn't get better with age. The tidy wagon shape looks good overall, except for that awful Acura grille. Sigh!
RDX: Less sporting, but comfortable in a different way. Engine didn't feel as strong as I had hoped, even with the b00st gauge at full. Cornering traction was scary good even on the sopping wet onramps - the salesman encouraged me to hit the throttle while going around a sweeping bend. The car just tucked into the turn even more. I was afraid it was going to start plowing.
I think the RDX is not worth considering because it is too expensive without offering anything substantially better than its less expensive competition. I would be just about as happy in a Sorento. The TSX wagon is an interesting left-field choice because it offers a combination of athleticism, utility, fuel economy, and reliability for a semi-reasonable price. My boyfriend was fantasizing about having the TSX for his daily commute.
The TSX doesn't have the optional V6 right?
The TSX wagon has no V6 and no manual option.
You know, come to think of it I've only test driven a couple used cars I haven't bought. I zero in on the price (usually under $3k,) and then as long as the car is mechanically ok I pull the trigger.
The current van we found online- other comparables were upwards of $10k, we saw it for $8k and rushed to the dealer. Drove it home the next day. (they were changing out the timing belt and whatnot.)
So it's fun to read about you guys thrashing so many cars while mulling the decision.
---------------------------------------
Kinda unrelated, next year I want (probly don't need) a new car. Really want a Miata, but then my son will be 13, just a couple years away from driving. I could get a little bit newer than I'd buy for my work DD, and hand it down. So I'm thinking Subaru, Kia Soul, etc...
You could dangle the Miata in front of your son as a reward for behaving from age 13-16. :lol:
TSX wagon does not have a V6, but so what? The I4 is gutsy and fuel efficient.
Quote from: 93JC on January 14, 2011, 08:17:05 AM
I can't help but think why? Why even offer this thing for sale in Australia, or any other first-world country? Surely Australian consumers stay away in droves given the much, much more competent alternatives.
If I wanted a new car based on an old design and built in a shed I'd get a Morgan. Hell, I'd get a Lada Niva before I'd touch any of this Chinese garbage.
This is a country started by cheese-thieves and drunks, mind.
Great Wall +250.8% (6690 sales)
The Chinese brand has gained by being the new kid on the block. 2010 was the company's first full year on sale in Australia, so the percentages were always bound to be way out there. The SA220 has not sold significantly better than it did in 2009, but that's more than offset by the V240, which more than doubled its sales during its second year. But it's the X240 SUV that is on fire. It has accounted for nearly half all Great Wall sales for 2010, proving that Aussies love SUVs and an unknown quantity is no hurdle when the price is that good.
There is one reason and one reason only for Great Wall's success = price. That X240 costs $23,990 with lots of ticks on the equipment list and shiny/leathery things on the inside, whereas a base Captiva 5, RAV4 or CR-V are an extra $4k, $5k and $7k respectively. Normal people would go out and buy a CPO example of the aforementioned vehicles, but the drunks who like new things on the cheap are flocking to the Great Wall.
Incidentally, they still haven't allowed one out for testing by any website, magazine or newspaper. That should tell you everything.
Quote from: Laconian on January 16, 2011, 12:27:36 AM
You could dangle the Miata in front of your son as a reward for behaving from age 13-16. :lol:
Yes but due to your boyfriend's accident I won't let him drive one (if I have one) till he's more experienced. I can see the same thing happening to my son, and I used to almost get plowed into all the time when I had a silver CRX.
Drove the Sorento SX. The cargo area fits our dive gear without requiring that the seats be folded flat. Nice
The suspension was great too. Stiff but very absorbant-no bouncing or floating whatsoever
So is that the one then?
It's a very strong contender.
We just drove the CR-V and found it to be too basic and much too noisy - it drove nicely but felt flimsy. The tumble-forward system for the rear seats definitely feels outdated by the standards of the competition and the floor is full of weird bumps and warts.
I think we have the list whittled down to the final three, and it's a tough choice because they have their own unique merits:
Utility+Comfort=Sorento
Mileage+Utility=Outback
Mileage+Fun=TSX (even though it's mileage w/premium gas)
I almost wish we didn't visit the Acura dealer, this "fun" factor thing is too nebulous and has thoroughly clouded the judgment of my significant other. He keeps having visions of himself ripping along the backroads on the way to work. :heated:
We'll take the tanks + totes to the Acura dealer tomorrow and see how well the wagon deals with it.
Haha, it sounds like you really hate the TSX. :D
Sorento is my top pick of the classically shaped SUVs. If I knew anybody who had a family with lanky teenagers or lots of kids, I would recommend it in a heartbeat. I logged on Consumer Reports and checked the reliability ratings and it's red dots everywhere, ie. the 2010 is excellent in every regard.
That engine+transmission combo is tremendous, too.
Quote from: thecarnut on January 16, 2011, 07:01:39 PM
Haha, it sounds like you really hate the TSX. :D
Well, I'm going to get a dedicated fun car in a year or so. It seems silly to make sacrifices for fun when we're going to have that base thoroughly covered anyways.
Quote from: Laconian on January 16, 2011, 06:59:28 PM
It's a very strong contender.
We just drove the CR-V and found it to be too basic and much too noisy - it drove nicely but felt flimsy. The tumble-forward system for the rear seats definitely feels outdated by the standards of the competition and the floor is full of weird bumps and warts.
I think we have the list whittled down to the final three, and it's a tough choice because they have their own unique merits:
Utility+Comfort=Sorento
Mileage+Utility=Outback
Mileage+Fun=TSX (even though it's mileage w/premium gas)
I almost wish we didn't visit the Acura dealer, this "fun" factor thing is too nebulous and has thoroughly clouded the judgment of my significant other. He keeps having visions of himself ripping along the backroads on the way to work. :heated:
We'll take the tanks + totes to the Acura dealer tomorrow and see how well the wagon deals with it.
You also mentioned ingress/egress issues with the Acura for the in-laws. They aren't around frequently enough for that to be a primary concern?
Quote from: The Pirate on January 16, 2011, 07:03:16 PM
You also mentioned ingress/egress issues with the Acura for the in-laws. They aren't around frequently enough for that to be a primary concern?
Once a year tops.
The prices we have so far:
Acura TSXwagen invoice is $32,219, probably around $32,800 with Costco discount. We'll get firmer numbers tomorrow.
Subaru 2.5i Limited w/Nav is $30,751
Sorento EX V6 w/Leather, Nav is $31,145
Sorento SX is $33,000 (?? no Costco no-haggle price available, but should be around a $1000 premium)
You're going with a factory nav? Why? So expensive, so behind the times and so hard to upgrade compared to a portable unit.
Quote from: ifcar on January 16, 2011, 07:20:32 PM
You're going with a factory nav? Why? So expensive, so behind the times and so hard to upgrade compared to a portable unit.
I love my portable GPS, but I don't really like leaving it in the car, and it's not always inconvenient to carry with it me.
Quote from: ifcar on January 16, 2011, 07:20:32 PM
You're going with a factory nav? Why? So expensive, so behind the times and so hard to upgrade compared to a portable unit.
SACRED COW! DO NOT QUESTION THE INTEGRATED NAV!
(I agree with you and have argued this point at length... at least with the Sorento the nav is fully modern)
Quote from: The Pirate on January 16, 2011, 07:23:15 PM
I love my portable GPS, but I don't really like leaving it in the car, and it's not always inconvenient to carry with it me.
But you can take it with you outside the car (borrowing another car, hiking, whatever), keep it when you sell the car, enjoy newer tech than is in any reasonably-priced in-dash nav now, upgrade it when newer tech becomes available, program it whenever you please, spend $200 instead of $2,000....
The convenience of it always being there and un-stealable is a definite plus, but there are just so many drawbacks.
Does the Sorento have a standard double-DIN headunit? ie. could it be replaced with an aftermarket navigation HU? The nav package on that car includes some dumb features we could do without, like shiny wheels and RGB LED mood lighting. Feh. I don't want to drop two grand on blang.
Quote from: Laconian on January 15, 2011, 05:57:18 PM
No, but we aren't bound to a specific segment. We have relatively loose requirements and budget.
Outback: drove very comfortably, like a floatier Accord, and wow! Great fuel economy for an AWD vehicle of that size. Interior in the Limited was pretty good, though I could see places where the silver paint was fading.
Forester: Don't like the dead pedal position, the steeply angled firewall cuts into passenger footroom. Interior is definitely low-rent and the passenger seat is too close to the floor, lending to an impression that one is peering out from a bathtub. Rear seats don't recline.
TSX Wagon: as Cale says, "jdm tyte". Steering and handling felt really dialled in, engine felt eager and sounded great. Visibility is excellent all around. Seats are firm and supportive. Cargo room is very good with the seats folded down. Dashboard is high quality and well-built, but it doesn't scream "premium". Rear seat ingress is made difficult by the tight rear quarters though. My inlaws already have joint problems and that kind of shit doesn't get better with age. The tidy wagon shape looks good overall, except for that awful Acura grille. Sigh!
RDX: Less sporting, but comfortable in a different way. Engine didn't feel as strong as I had hoped, even with the b00st gauge at full. Cornering traction was scary good even on the sopping wet onramps - the salesman encouraged me to hit the throttle while going around a sweeping bend. The car just tucked into the turn even more. I was afraid it was going to start plowing.
I think the RDX is not worth considering because it is too expensive without offering anything substantially better than its less expensive competition. I would be just about as happy in a Sorento. The TSX wagon is an interesting left-field choice because it offers a combination of athleticism, utility, fuel economy, and reliability for a semi-reasonable price. My boyfriend was fantasizing about having the TSX for his daily commute.
Are you set on buying something hideous?
Look, I'm going to be frank here. You're gay. I'm going to go out on a limb and say your boyfriend is gay too. And that means you should be driving an Audi. Buy a used A3 2.0T and be done with it.
Quote from: ifcar on January 16, 2011, 07:28:22 PM
But you can take it with you outside the car (borrowing another car, hiking, whatever), keep it when you sell the car, enjoy newer tech than is in any reasonably-priced in-dash nav now, upgrade it when newer tech becomes available, program it whenever you please, spend $200 instead of $2,000....
The convenience of it always being there and un-stealable is a definite plus, but there are just so many drawbacks.
I understand all that, merely mentioning one drawback I've noticed that makes an integrated unit more appealing. In the grand scheme of portable vs. integrated I do agree with you.
Quote from: Raza on January 16, 2011, 07:32:47 PM
Are you set on buying something hideous?
Look, I'm going to be frank here. You're gay. I'm going to go out on a limb and say your boyfriend is gay too. And that means you should be driving an Audi. Buy a used A3 2.0T and be done with it.
I don't want to buy a car that is constantly on fire because VW phoned in the electrical engineering.
Quote from: Laconian on January 16, 2011, 07:27:29 PM
SACRED COW! DO NOT QUESTION THE INTEGRATED NAV!
(I agree with you and have argued this point at length... at least with the Sorento the nav is fully modern)
Modern-ish...
My experience with portable GPSs is limited to the Garmins installed in Suzukis, but they're just much more attractive, intuitive and advanced than any I've seen built-in.
Sorento vs. Grand Vitara Garmin:
(http://img341.imageshack.us/img341/3089/photos17496.jpg)
(http://img262.imageshack.us/img262/2913/photos15028.jpg)
Key advantages:
-The Garmin adjusts the zoom based on your speed. Drive slower, you automatically get more detail.
-The Garmin moves street name labels around as you drive so you can always see them.
-The Garmin display is just better-looking.
But if it's nonnegotiable, it is what it is. You could certainly do worse than the Sorento's, and you do get the spiffy audio display.
Quote from: Laconian on January 16, 2011, 07:36:24 PM
I don't want to buy a car that is constantly on fire because VW phoned in the electrical engineering.
That's like saying that you don't have black friends because you think you're going to get robbed.
Quote from: Laconian on January 16, 2011, 07:36:24 PM
I don't want to buy a car that is constantly on fire because VW phoned in the electrical engineering.
You're thinking of the BMW 335i. 2 years, 55,000 miles and only one problem in the whole run. Knock on wood.
Quote from: 2o6 on January 16, 2011, 07:39:15 PM
That's like saying that you don't have black friends because you think you're going to get robbed.
Seems pretty reasonable to me. All black people look alike, how do you know which ones are the robbers and which ones aren't?
:lol:
Quote from: omicron on January 16, 2011, 04:57:59 AM
This is a country started by cheese-thieves and drunks, mind.
Great Wall +250.8% (6690 sales)
The Chinese brand has gained by being the new kid on the block. 2010 was the company's first full year on sale in Australia, so the percentages were always bound to be way out there. The SA220 has not sold significantly better than it did in 2009, but that's more than offset by the V240, which more than doubled its sales during its second year. But it's the X240 SUV that is on fire. It has accounted for nearly half all Great Wall sales for 2010, proving that Aussies love SUVs and an unknown quantity is no hurdle when the price is that good.
There is one reason and one reason only for Great Wall's success = price. That X240 costs $23,990 with lots of ticks on the equipment list and shiny/leathery things on the inside, whereas a base Captiva 5, RAV4 or CR-V are an extra $4k, $5k and $7k respectively. Normal people would go out and buy a CPO example of the aforementioned vehicles, but the drunks who like new things on the cheap are flocking to the Great Wall.
Incidentally, they still haven't allowed one out for testing by any website, magazine or newspaper. That should tell you everything.
I googled the SA220 and V240 to get an idea of what this alphanumeric gobbledygook is. The SA220 is a very poorly proportioned pickup, but the V240? My god...
(http://www.edu.ics.saitama-u.ac.jp/~nagumo/eiga/alien/flamethrower.gif)
Quote from: Raza on January 16, 2011, 07:42:15 PM
You're thinking of the BMW 335i. 2 years, 55,000 miles and only one problem in the whole run. Knock on wood.
Now that is a gay car.
TSX and Outback have unfortunate front ends, but the Sorento looks excellent from all angles.
(http://l.images.easyautosales.com/2011-Kia-Sorento-25776386-932.jpg)
At least the TSX could be salvaged with an aftermarket grille. Alas, ricerdom is a slippery slope.
Quote from: 2o6 on January 16, 2011, 07:39:15 PM
That's like saying that you don't have black friends because you think you're going to get robbed.
Black people aren't made from the same mold. Cars built on an assembly line are.
Quote from: Laconian on January 16, 2011, 07:49:40 PM
Black people aren't made from the same mold. Cars built on an assembly line are.
That's what you think. :devil:
:mask:
Quote from: thecarnut on January 16, 2011, 07:55:43 PM
That's what you think. :devil:
:mask:
SAME SLAVE SHIP, HUH?
Quote from: Laconian on January 16, 2011, 07:49:40 PM
Black people aren't made from the same mold. Cars built on an assembly line are.
Yeah, they are. All black people are the same when built in the same factory, so to speak.
Quote from: Laconian on January 16, 2011, 07:14:14 PM
The prices we have so far:
Acura TSXwagen invoice is $32,219, probably around $32,800 with Costco discount. We'll get firmer numbers tomorrow.
Subaru 2.5i Limited w/Nav is $30,751
Sorento EX V6 w/Leather, Nav is $31,145
Sorento SX is $33,000 (?? no Costco no-haggle price available, but should be around a $1000 premium)
Quote from: Laconian on January 16, 2011, 07:48:58 PM
At least the TSX could be salvaged with an aftermarket grille. Alas, ricerdom is a slippery slope.
TSX wagon is the way to go. Wagons rule over SUVs every time! Yeah, the Acura beak is tres unfortunate. Instead of aftermarket, get a grille for the Rest-of-World Accord. Maybe some of those snazzy "Accord Euro" badges just to complete the look. But please stop there. I better not see any coffee can exhausts or "stickerz!" on this thing!
What? Don't you know about the synergy of stickers and VTEC?!
If you did that chimp might end up with a TSX too.
Oh, and since I get a discount for Audis, for the hell of it I checked the prices for A4 Avants... Bloody highway robbery, that's what those cars are!
Interesting to see how this has unfolded.
So, bearing in mind that the TSX is no more than a Euro Accord that has benefitted form Acura's unique styling enhancements, you are effectively going to end up with an Accord and an Accord?
Do yourself a favor and test drive a jeep grand Cherokee...
Quote from: 93JC on January 16, 2011, 07:44:13 PM
I googled the SA220 and V240 to get an idea of what this alphanumeric gobbledygook is. The SA220 is a very poorly proportioned pickup, but the V240? My god...
(http://www.edu.ics.saitama-u.ac.jp/~nagumo/eiga/alien/flamethrower.gif)
At risk of lightning strike, it is essentially a ute with Down Syndrome.
:lol: :clap:
Save me a seat in hell.
Quote from: Colin on January 17, 2011, 12:54:05 AM
Interesting to see how this has unfolded.
So, bearing in mind that the TSX is no more than a Euro Accord that has benefitted form Acura's unique styling enhancements, you are effectively going to end up with an Accord and an Accord?
:clap:
Acuras are "nice" here, just like Lexus. The average 'Murrican has no clue what's underneath the badge.
Quote from: Raza on January 16, 2011, 07:32:47 PM
Look, I'm going to be frank here. You're gay. I'm going to go out on a limb and say your boyfriend is gay too. And that means you should be driving an Audi. Buy a used A3 2.0T and be done with it.
bwahahahahahahaahahahah
BTW EVERYONE knows that Subarus are the Gay/Lesbian cars. ;)
Quote from: AutobahnSHO on January 17, 2011, 08:27:49 AM
bwahahahahahahaahahahah
BTW EVERYONE knows that Subarus are the Gay/Lesbian cars. ;)
But gay /lesbians spray 50ft roosts. I had my car spinning in second at redline for like 10 seconds leaving my friends house. I felt badass then realized I was in a butch lesbo cruiser.
Quote from: Raza on January 16, 2011, 08:33:54 PM
Yeah, they are. All black people are the same when built in the same factory, so to speak.
Not true.
Even SVT engines vary in power, running temps, fuel economy, acceleration, etc, and they are made on the same line with the exact same parts, much like these people you refer to.
:huh:
:lol:
Quote from: Raza link=topic=23976.msg1456700#msg1456700 date=1295231567
Look, I'm going to be frank here. You're gay. I'm going to go out on a limb and say your boyfriend is gay too.
I was thinking, "What should a gay man who seemingly enjoys cars be driving?"
Then it popped into my mind is if a bolt from God himself struck me; Yellow Soltice GXP convertible.
(http://i241.photobucket.com/albums/ff207/lawhog/lawhog2/677A1DF60BB74A2CBF8D43175753F0201.jpg)
Quote from: hounddog on January 17, 2011, 09:30:07 AM
I was thinking, "What should a gay man who seemingly enjoys cars be driving?"
Then it popped into my mind is if a bolt from God himself struck me; Yellow Soltice GXP convertible.
(http://i241.photobucket.com/albums/ff207/lawhog/lawhog2/677A1DF60BB74A2CBF8D43175753F0201.jpg)
With stage I upgrade it goes to 300hp/300tq. For under 1K. I'd drive one.
Agree.
If they were bigger inside I would consider one as well.
I actually know a fellow who removed his GXP engine and put in an LT1 crate engine. :lol:
Quote from: hounddog on January 17, 2011, 09:49:31 AM
Agree.
If they were bigger inside I would consider one as well.
I actually know a fellow who removed his GXP engine and put in an LT1 crate engine. :lol:
Mallet did an LS7 swap a few years ago. Definitely cool.
Oh, we're not that kind of gay. We're the you-assume-we're-straight-until-you-ask-us-about-how-our-girlfriend-or-wife-is-doing-and-then-we-correct-you-and-then-you-apologize-profusely-for-making-assumptions kind.
We are going to check the cargo capabilities of the TSX today, and if it goes well, we're going to get our credit pulled so we can have some solid numbers in hand. Same w/Sorento.
I think it's down to Sorento vs. TSX. Outback is nice but the interior isn't as well built or as comfortable as the Sorento. Our commutes are only 5 miles and 8 miles one way, so even a relative guzzler like the Sorento won't hit our pocketbooks that much - we only drive like 7 or 8000 miles a year anyways.
At the Acura dealer again. I want to state for the record that the ZDX is uuuuuuugggglllyyyy.
Quote from: Laconian on January 17, 2011, 12:27:57 PM
Oh, we're not that kind of gay.
There is a difference?
By the way, the Soltice is a cool little car, and owning one would not require one to be flamer-gay.
Quote from: hounddog on January 17, 2011, 02:26:41 PM
There is a difference?
By the way, the Soltice is a cool little car, and owning one would not require one to be flamer-gay.
Yes. Some people make it explicitly known that they're gay. I see those people on campus all the time.
Laconian isn't like that. :huh:
I was being facetious.
Quote from: Laconian on January 17, 2011, 02:17:14 PM
At the Acura dealer again. I want to state for the record that the ZDX is uuuuuuugggglllyyyy.
An understatement........
Have you tried to get into the back of the ZDX? You really have to bend double as there is so little clearance. Not that there is much more in the way of headroom once you have got in the thing. This must be one of the goofiest designs of recent years. I don't think I've ever seen one on the roads, but then I read that they've only sold about 3000 of them to date, so that's hardly surprising. Fail on on an epic scale.
Quote from: Colin on January 17, 2011, 02:43:33 PM
An understatement........
Have you tried to get into the back of the ZDX? You really have to bend double as there is so little clearance. Not that there is much more in the way of headroom once you have got in the thing. This must be one of the goofiest designs of recent years. I don't think I've ever seen one on the roads, but then I read that they've only sold about 3000 of them to date, so that's hardly surprising. Fail on on an epic scale.
I managed to get into the back of one and all I was able to see when I turned my head to look out of it was the C pillar. :facepalm:
Visit a jeep dealer damn it!! :lockedup:
Quote from: Laconian on January 17, 2011, 12:27:57 PM
Oh, we're not that kind of gay. We're the you-assume-we're-straight-until-you-ask-us-about-how-our-girlfriend-or-wife-is-doing-and-then-we-correct-you-and-then-you-apologize-profusely-for-making-assumptions kind.
If it happens often enough, I hope you've developed a snappy comeback. Like, "Damnedest thing -- she has a penis!"
Lol just tried the back seat. Yup, worst car ever.
Quote from: Laconian on January 17, 2011, 03:43:47 PM
Lol just tried the back seat. Yup, worst car ever.
:lol: :lol:
Just buy the TSX so r0tor stops saying JEEP GC JIZZ :lol:
Jeeeeeeeeeeeeeep!!!!!
Quote from: Laconian on January 17, 2011, 02:17:14 PM
At the Acura dealer again. I want to state for the record that the ZDX is uuuuuuugggglllyyyy.
LOL
I'd never heard of it.
This review says "it looks slick and is nice up front but the backseat is tiny."
Then the OTHER HALF of the review is the stereo and the nav. :facepalm:
http://reviews.cnet.com/suv/2010-acura-zdx/4505-10868_7-33770295.html#reviewPage1
Quote from: AutobahnSHO on January 17, 2011, 04:16:12 PM
LOL
I'd never heard of it.
This review says "it looks slick and is nice up front but the backseat is tiny."
Then the OTHER HALF of the review is the stereo and the nav. :facepalm:
http://reviews.cnet.com/suv/2010-acura-zdx/4505-10868_7-33770295.html#reviewPage1
CNET is a tech reviewer. It reviews all cars from a tech perspective, and just notes anything else it comes across while looking for that.
(http://cache.gawkerassets.com/assets/images/12/2010/03/2011_acura_tsx_wagon.jpg)
Quote from: Laconian on January 16, 2011, 10:32:42 PM
Oh, and since I get a discount for Audis, for the hell of it I checked the prices for A4 Avants... Bloody highway robbery, that's what those cars are!
But they're so sexy!
(http://img705.imageshack.us/img705/7071/pic0074j.jpg)
Space for inlaws? Replace Miata? Practical? Reliable? Fun?
RX-8 or WRX hatch.
wow last gen TSX wagon looks... kinda weird.
(http://www.riccardoemiliani.com/images/cars/accordtourerLG54sidelrge.jpg)
Quote from: 68_427 on January 17, 2011, 04:22:49 PM
wow last gen TSX wagon looks... kinda weird.
(http://www.riccardoemiliani.com/images/cars/accordtourerLG54sidelrge.jpg)
Yeah I actually like the new TSX wagon over the old one.
Howabout a V70-R?
http://www.autotrader.com/fyc/vdp.jsp?ct=u&car_id=292294231&dealer_id=613428&car_year=2005&doors=&systime=&model=V70&search_lang=en&start_year=1981&keywordsfyc=&keywordsrep=&highlightFirstMakeModel=&search_type=both&distance=200&min_price=&rdm=1295306747008&drive=&marketZipError=false&advanced=&fuel=&keywords_display=&sownerid=1362806&lastBeginningStartYear=1981&end_year=2012&showZipError=y&make2=&certified=&engine=&page_location=findacar%3A%3Aispsearchform&body_code=0&transmission=&default_sort=newsortbyprice_DESC&max_mileage=&address=98101&color=&sort_type=priceDESC&max_price=&awsp=false&make=VOLVO&num_records=100&seller_type=b&cardist=148&standard=false
(http://graphics8.nytimes.com/images/2006/09/22/automobiles/24block600.jpg)
Quote from: 68_427 on January 17, 2011, 04:17:55 PM
(http://cache.gawkerassets.com/assets/images/12/2010/03/2011_acura_tsx_wagon.jpg)
Gay.
Quote from: Colonel Cadillac on January 17, 2011, 04:18:28 PM
(http://img705.imageshack.us/img705/7071/pic0074j.jpg)
Gayer.
Quote from: 68_427 on January 17, 2011, 04:22:49 PM
(http://www.riccardoemiliani.com/images/cars/accordtourerLG54sidelrge.jpg)
Gayer yet.
Quote from: Colonel Cadillac on January 17, 2011, 04:27:44 PM
(http://graphics8.nytimes.com/images/2006/09/22/automobiles/24block600.jpg)
Gayest.
V70R's are not gay in the least bit. 300 HP, a 6-speed manual, and AWD is not gay.
AWD stationwagon is the epitome of gay.
:huh:
Oh right. Since laconian is gay he should buy the vehicle that screams I like horse cocks inside my anus.
(http://wallpapers-diq.com/wallpapers/17/Dodge_Durango_2004%2C_2nd_Generation_SUV.jpg)
:lol:
Little red x and a smilie?
I am not quite certain I wish to know what the "x" was considering the 'meat' of that post.
:evildude:
Quote from: hounddog on January 17, 2011, 04:34:28 PM
AWD stationwagon is the epitome of gay.
:huh:
V70R's are just awesome.
Volvo does heavily market its cars towards gay people. So does Jag and a few other companies we haven't mentioned yet in this thread.
Don't worry I'll just show ya. I'm here to help.
(http://img607.imageshack.us/img607/8122/durangohd.jpg)
Quote from: CJ on January 17, 2011, 04:43:13 PM
V70R's are just awesome.
Performance may be nice, but the car overall is gay.
(why else do you think they use the "male" symbol in their logo?)
Quote from: hounddog on January 17, 2011, 04:34:28 PM
AWD stationwagon is the epitome of gay.
:huh:
I owned an AWD station wagon and had a labrador retriever, too. I may have groped guys in lycra during my high school days, but I can't say I've ever made out with one.
I don't think AWD wagons are necessarily gay.
Quote from: 68_427 on January 17, 2011, 04:44:04 PM
Don't worry I'll just show ya. I'm here to help.
(http://img607.imageshack.us/img607/8122/durangohd.jpg)
Lets see; 12,000 pound towing ability and true 4x4 ability which was purchased by a woman.
Good try, though.
:ohyeah:
Quote from: hounddog on January 17, 2011, 04:44:41 PM
Performance may be nice, but the car overall is gay.
(why else do you think they use the "male" symbol in their logo?)
It's the symbol for iron. :huh:
Quote from: the Teuton on January 17, 2011, 04:45:11 PM
I owned an AWD station wagon and had a labrador retriever, too. I may have groped guys in lycra during my high school days, but I can't say I've ever made out with one.
I don't think AWD wagons are necessarily gay.
Subaru is the official car of GLBT.
Just thought you should know. :huh:
:lol:
Quote from: CJ on January 17, 2011, 04:48:36 PM
It's the symbol for iron. :huh:
Sarcasim not your thing, is it?
Quote from: hounddog on January 17, 2011, 04:50:13 PM
Sarcasim not your thing, is it?
Dude, haven't you learned by now that your sarcasm sucks? Or if I'm being nice here, it doesn't translate well over the internet?
I feel like you go through this shit in every second thread.
Call 911, I really could not possibly care any less what you think about, well, pretty much anything.
At every turn you go far out of your way to try to insult me and Randy.
Grow up, son.
Quote from: hounddog on January 17, 2011, 04:58:24 PM
Call 911, I really could not possibly care any less what you think about, well, pretty much anything.
At every turn you go far out of your way to try to insult me and Randy.
Grow up, son.
That's very nice.
My point still stands.
Quote from: hounddog on January 17, 2011, 04:46:42 PM
Lets see; 12,000 pound towing ability and true 4x4 ability which was purchased by a woman.
Good try, though.
:ohyeah:
If didn't need or want 12,000 lbs. towing capacity and "true 4x4," I'd so much rather have the V70-R. Or an S4 wagon. Or an 535xiT.
THERE IS NO - BETWEEN V70 AND R. IT'S JUST V70R.
Sorry. Just one of my pet peeves. When Volvo labeled the 850 T-5, it bugged the SHIT out of me. They fixed that with the introduction of the V70 and S70 T5. I hate hyphens.
How can you hate hyphens? They're so cuddly and cute :wub:
J-e-e-p
Quote from: Colin on January 17, 2011, 02:43:33 PM
An understatement........
Have you tried to get into the back of the ZDX? You really have to bend double as there is so little clearance. Not that there is much more in the way of headroom once you have got in the thing. This must be one of the goofiest designs of recent years. I don't think I've ever seen one on the roads, but then I read that they've only sold about 3000 of them to date, so that's hardly surprising. Fail on on an epic scale.
My buddy has an RDX and he loves the ZDX. He actually would have bought the damn thing if it weren't so expensive.
You should stop being friends with him. He obviously is dumb.
Quote from: hounddog on January 17, 2011, 04:34:28 PM
AWD stationwagon is the epitome of gay.
:huh:
I think you're overusing the joke.
Quote from: 68_427 on January 17, 2011, 06:44:12 PM
You should stop being friends with him. He obviously is dumb.
He likes Acuras. He had a TL (older one, looked just like an Accord), then another TL (the one right after that), then a detour into Ford with an Expedition and then an Edge, and now the RDX. He has two kids and he and his wife share one car, so it has to be big enough for everything.
Personally, I've never even seen a ZDX.
Does he get a new car every year?! Did he not consider the MDX?
Quote from: 68_427 on January 17, 2011, 06:50:01 PM
Does he get a new car every year?! Did he not consider the MDX?
That's over 13 years. I've know him for about 13 years. He's in his 30s, he's not my age. But yeah, he used to do a string of 24 month leases because he was family friends with the owner of a large car dealership in the area.
Getting hard pulls on our credit and some firm numbers for the top contenders.
Acura salesguy gave us the usual luxury douche lines.
Quote from: Laconian on January 17, 2011, 03:43:47 PM
Lol just tried the back seat. Yup, worst car ever.
:pullover:
I've seen a couple of ZDXs on the road, including one last week:
(http://img19.imageshack.us/img19/6350/3696o.jpg)
While ridiculous, they're no more so than the X6, and I see those almost regularly.
The X6 has better proportions IMO. You can tell the ZDX is FWD based.
The ZDX would be an interesting car if it weren't so high in the air. I think it would work, if it were sort of a stranger, sportier alternative to the TL.
I actually think the ZDX looks pretty nice....
Quote from: TBR on January 17, 2011, 08:49:55 PM
I actually think the ZDX looks pretty nice....
Based on the discussion we're having in the other thread about styling, I've decided I don't understand how your mind works at all. :lol:
The lack of rear passenger room and the weird opening to get inside is simply insane. I'm not a tall person, and my head was scraping the headliner. If I got in an accident, my head would bang against the roof, not the headrest. The cargo area is restricted by a weird "V" shaped opening, and the cargo floor is actually extremely high off the ground, meaning the liftgate and the cargo floor are much closer together than you might think.
No matter what you do to that car, it will remain a ridiculous abomination. Kill it with fire, chop off the hands of the designers, and start from scratch.
Quote from: hounddog on January 17, 2011, 04:34:28 PM
AWD stationwagon is the epitome of gay.
:huh:
No.
AWD Stationwagon= most utility + mostest traction
Quote from: Laconian on January 17, 2011, 07:21:55 PM
Getting hard pulls on our credit and some firm numbers for the top contenders.
Acura salesguy gave us the usual luxury douche lines.
You should buy the Sorento for that reason alone. And then tell him so.
Quote from: CJ on January 17, 2011, 05:37:15 PM
THERE IS NO - BETWEEN V70 AND R. IT'S JUST V70R.
Sorry. Just one of my pet peeves. When Volvo labeled the 850 T-5, it bugged the SHIT out of me. They fixed that with the introduction of the V70 and S70 T5. I hate hyphens.
Well, if you're getting technical....
(http://liveimages.carsales.com.au/private/carpoint/10223478.jpg)
V70SpaceR
More importantly, however:
(http://liveimages.carsales.com.au/private/carpoint/10223471.jpg)
:wub:
Buying a Vulva around these parts is just not okay. You have to start shopping at Whole Foods and be indignant at long lines at Starbucks and all kinds of horrible things.
Laconian, I think you should buy a Cadillac Fleetwood Sedan DeVille Brougham D'Elegance Landau Classic Signature Executive Platnium Grand Royale Super Deluxe Ultra Concours Diamond Custom Presidential Limited Special Touring Anniversary Edition featuring Body by Fisher?
I hear those are really nice! :rockon:
http://www.carspin.net/forums/index.php?topic=23476.msg1457547#msg1457547
Quote from: ifcar on January 17, 2011, 08:21:25 PM
I've seen a couple of ZDXs on the road, including one last week:
While ridiculous, they're no more so than the X6, and I see those almost regularly.
I very very rarely see ZDXs, I've seen more X6-M than I have ZDXs.. and this is So Cal...
But X6's design is actually starting to grow on me.. and I love the way the X6-M looks.. though I'd never get one.
Quote from: omicron on January 18, 2011, 06:48:04 AM
More importantly, however:
(http://liveimages.carsales.com.au/private/carpoint/10223471.jpg)
:wub:
Those are some of my favorite Volvo wheels ever. And it has the R wing. :wub:
Quote from: AutobahnSHO on January 18, 2011, 05:49:04 AM
No.
AWD Stationwagon= most utility + mostest traction
Wrong and wrong.
4x4 pickup or SUV (durango, armada, expedition, sequioa, etc) has more of both in spades.
Quote from: Laconian on January 17, 2011, 10:01:39 PM
The lack of rear passenger room and the weird opening to get inside is simply insane. I'm not a tall person, and my head was scraping the headliner. If I got in an accident, my head would bang against the roof, not the headrest. The cargo area is restricted by a weird "V" shaped opening, and the cargo floor is actually extremely high off the ground, meaning the liftgate and the cargo floor are much closer together than you might think.
No matter what you do to that car, it will remain a ridiculous abomination. Kill it with fire, chop off the hands of the designers, and start from scratch.
Then what you really need is the old style 5 series (the one prior to Dave or Randys). Room, handling, moderately comfy ride, decent seating if you only have small people in back.
And, you can get them for a steal now.
Quote from: hounddog on January 18, 2011, 02:19:11 PM
Wrong and wrong.
4x4 pickup or SUV (durango, armada, expedition, sequioa, etc) has more of both in spades.
Gas mileage= :facepalm:
My minivan gets better gas mileage AND has more interior room than almost any SUV out there.
And i'd guess 60% of US SUVs NEVER go offroad (or pull a trailer), another 20% probably only do so twice a year.
I would never make fun of the 20% that actually use them as intended.
My mom has a Chrysler Town and Country, and my Durango gets better mileage on the freeway, and almost exactly the same in town.
:huh:
Quote from: AutobahnSHO on January 18, 2011, 02:42:18 PM
Gas mileage= :facepalm:
My minivan gets better gas mileage AND has more interior room than almost any SUV out there.
And i'd guess 60% of US SUVs NEVER go offroad (or pull a trailer), another 20% probably only do so twice a year.
I would never make fun of the 20% that actually use them as intended.
And by offroad, i'm sure you don't mean going off of the tarmac to drive on some dirt roads. So I wonder how many that claims offroading means that.. :lol:
SUVs are in reality just a taller Wagon. How did they ever get so popular, especially in the 90s with the truck based ones, they're literally worse to drive than most cars and provide really no more space than a wagon would have back in the days..
I would probably get a WRX STi wagon.. but I just check Subaru's page nad it looks like they took out the STi Wagon? BooooooO!!
Quote from: NomisR on January 18, 2011, 02:48:39 PM
And by offroad, i'm sure you don't mean going off of the tarmac to drive on some dirt roads. So I wonder how many that claims offroading means that.. :lol:
SUVs are in reality just a taller Wagon. How did they ever get so popular, especially in the 90s with the truck based ones, they're literally worse to drive than most cars and provide really no more space than a wagon would have back in the days..
I would probably get a WRX STi wagon.. but I just check Subaru's page nad it looks like they took out the STi Wagon? BooooooO!!
It appears they took that hatch away from the STi limited but you can get the base STi in both sedan and hatch.
Quote from: AutobahnSHO on January 18, 2011, 02:42:18 PM
And i'd guess 60% of US SUVs NEVER go offroad (or pull a trailer), another 20% probably only do so twice a year.
I would never make fun of the 20% that actually use them as intended.
But that means 40% would go, even if only twice a year, which would be about 100% more often than do people who buy AWD stationwagons. :huh:
But, active behavior is not what we are talking about; capability. That is what we are talking about.
AWD stationwagons cannot do the things true 4x4 SUVs or pickups can, which by definition makes the 4X4 SUVs and pickups more versitile. :huh:
And, here is evidence of that simple fact;
Quote from: 68_427 on January 17, 2011, 04:44:04 PM
(http://img607.imageshack.us/img607/8122/durangohd.jpg)
vs;
Quote from: omicron on January 18, 2011, 06:48:04 AM
(http://liveimages.carsales.com.au/private/carpoint/10223471.jpg)
BMW 5er wagons are pretty scarce!!
SUVs might be more capable but their barndoor aerodynamics and all that weight do carry significant cost.
Just buy the TSX and be happy. :lol:
Quote from: Laconian on January 18, 2011, 02:57:10 PM
BMW 5er wagons are pretty scarce!!
SUVs might be more capable but their barndoor aerodynamics and all that weight do carry significant cost.
How about an E46 325i wagon? I saw one of those earlier today and immediately thought of you.
Quote from: Colonel Cadillac on January 18, 2011, 03:02:08 PM
How about an E46 325i wagon? I saw one of those earlier today and immediately thought of you.
I'd be willing to bet it's too small.
(http://ll.speedhunters.com/u/f/eagames/NFS/speedhunters.com/Images/Mike%20Garrett/1October/snap/tsxwag.jpg)
bump
Quote from: 68_427 on January 18, 2011, 02:51:17 PM
It appears they took that hatch away from the STi limited but you can get the base STi in both sedan and hatch.
Hmm, i'll have to think it over.. but I still can't get over the fact that my "fun" car would have better mileage than my daily driver... know of any fast wagons that gets more than 28mpg hwy? :lol:
Quote from: NomisR on January 18, 2011, 03:58:05 PM
Hmm, i'll have to think it over.. but I still can't get over the fact that my "fun" car would have better mileage than my daily driver... know of any fast wagons that gets more than 28mpg hwy? :lol:
You drive a tin can with a lawnmower motor in it. Of course it's going to get good gas mileage.
Quote from: the Teuton on January 18, 2011, 04:02:46 PM
You drive a tin can with a lawnmower motor in it. Of course it's going to get good gas mileage.
I was thinking of a BMW 335d but the more I think about it.. the more I don't want a BMW... otherwise, it would be a good choice even without the wagon form..
Quote from: NomisR on January 18, 2011, 04:09:07 PM
I was thinking of a BMW 335d but the more I think about it.. the more I don't want a BMW... otherwise, it would be a good choice even without the wagon form..
Hmmm...good point. What would you want?
Quote from: NomisR on January 18, 2011, 03:58:05 PM
Hmm, i'll have to think it over.. but I still can't get over the fact that my "fun" car would have better mileage than my daily driver... know of any fast wagons that gets more than 28mpg hwy? :lol:
(http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/0/08/2007_Ford_Focus_wagon_--_11-06-2010.jpg/250px-2007_Ford_Focus_wagon_--_11-06-2010.jpg)
A3 TDI?
Golf GTD?
(http://www.carenthusiast.co.uk/vw/vw_golf_gtd_2009_050.jpg)
Is there a non-european car that fits the qualifications?
Quote from: NomisR on January 18, 2011, 04:29:07 PM
Is there a non-european car that fits the qualifications?
No.
The new Hyundai Veloster might fit.
What's happening now?
Pretty sure they like the Sorento.
The thing with the A3 and the Golf, they give me the same vibe as the BMW, although they no where as common as a 3 series. But if I were to go with those, I might as well get a BMW with the gobs of torque.
Quote from: CJ on January 18, 2011, 04:33:08 PM
What's happening now?
Pretty sure they like the Sorento.
He's secretly buying a jeep
Quote from: hounddog on January 18, 2011, 02:55:02 PM
But that means 40% would go, even if only twice a year, which would be about 100% more often than do people who buy AWD stationwagons. :huh:
But, active behavior is not what we are talking about; capability. That is what we are talking about.
AWD stationwagons cannot do the things true 4x4 SUVs or pickups can, which by definition makes the 4X4 SUVs and pickups more versitile. :huh:
And, here is evidence of that simple fact;
vs;
Pfft.
I drove my old Subaru through much worse than that. I do not lie when I say we went up into the mountains one spring and passed a lot of stuck pickups on our way up the hills. Sure they might have been in worse snow/mud than we were encountering, but still.
Think the TSX is in the lead. We're drawing a blank when thinking of what we really need an AWD SUV for - we've made do with an Accord for this long, and this addresses the one major utilitarian failing of the Accord, namely a trunk instead of a hatch.
Are you considering 2WD crossovers?
Quote from: ifcar on January 18, 2011, 09:33:51 PM
Are you considering 2WD crossovers?
Not really. Residuals on FWD SUVs are not very good here, the initial cost savings would probably be negated at vehicle resale.
http://www.autotrader.com/fyc/vdp.jsp?ct=c&car_id=291401319&dealer_id=71244&car_year=2007&doors=&systime=&model=328I&search_lang=en&start_year=2007&body_style=WAGON&keywordsrep=&keywordsfyc=&highlightFirstMakeModel=&search_type=certified&distance=100&min_price=&drive=&rdm=1295412213127&marketZipError=false&advanced=y&fuel=&keywords_display=&lastBeginningStartYear=2007&end_year=2011&showZipError=n&make2=&certified=y&engine=&page_location=findacar%3A%3Aispsearchform&body_code=128&transmission=&default_sort=newsortbyprice_DESC&max_mileage=&address=98101&color=&sort_type=priceDESC&max_price=&awsp=false&make=BMW&seller_type=b&num_records=25&cardist=26&standard=false&rdpage=thumb
Not sure what you think of certified cars. That's hella overpriced, but you could talk them down for sure.
I don't see why you'd get a used BMW when you can have a brand new Acura. Isn't the TSX slightly roomier too?
HHR too bad to be a contender?
...and/or jetta wagon?
Quote from: CALL_911 on January 18, 2011, 09:44:25 PM
http://www.autotrader.com/fyc/vdp.jsp?ct=c&car_id=291401319&dealer_id=71244&car_year=2007&doors=&systime=&model=328I&search_lang=en&start_year=2007&body_style=WAGON&keywordsrep=&keywordsfyc=&highlightFirstMakeModel=&search_type=certified&distance=100&min_price=&drive=&rdm=1295412213127&marketZipError=false&advanced=y&fuel=&keywords_display=&lastBeginningStartYear=2007&end_year=2011&showZipError=n&make2=&certified=y&engine=&page_location=findacar%3A%3Aispsearchform&body_code=128&transmission=&default_sort=newsortbyprice_DESC&max_mileage=&address=98101&color=&sort_type=priceDESC&max_price=&awsp=false&make=BMW&seller_type=b&num_records=25&cardist=26&standard=false&rdpage=thumb
Not sure what you think of certified cars. That's hella overpriced, but you could talk them down for sure.
(http://images.autotrader.com/scaler/565/421/images/2010/12/14/291/401/18507926804.291401319.IM1.MAIN.565x421_A.562x421.jpg)
:wub: :wub: :wub:
Quote from: mzziaz on January 19, 2011, 04:50:39 AM
HHR too bad to be a contender?
Holy shit, they're still making those? HHR is too bad to be considered a car, never mind a contender!
Quote from: mzziaz on January 19, 2011, 04:50:39 AM
HHR too bad to be a contender?
Why would anybody consider a buzzy refrigerator box on wheels if a TSX is in the running?
:wub:
(http://www.blogcdn.com/www.autoblog.com/media/2011/01/saab-estate-1295458683.jpg)
Meh.
The TSX Sport Wagon is a stunner in person. I saw a lot of them in Japan the last couple of years (as the Accord Tourer). Not enough power for me coming from its V6 sedan variant however. It'd be my ideal vehicle with the 3.5L V6, AWD and 6sp M/T.
Damn the 9-5 wagon looks good.
Yes it does.
That car isn't real, although it's probably what the 9-5 Combi will look like.
It looks awesome.
So is Tia Sex in line to be poichised this weekend?
http://www.carspin.net/forums/index.php?topic=24072
Google Voice does Engrish (the pushy Japanese guy that's trying to sell us the CR-V left us a message earlier this afternoon):
Yeah, good even a. This is a genius at over the Holland of a Kirkland. Thank you for supper last time. 4 Sierra be stay at. We just got it, on the ground. Block, E X L within 90 days and See, I would be so we just got it. If you wanted to kinda I would you look at it and just gimme a call my cellphone XXX-XXX-XXX stopped over there on the Kirkland I. I'll be here until 830 tonight. Thank, you, bye.
So what's the porblem?
Did you ever look at one of these:
(http://www.cartuningcentral.com/wp-content/uploads/2008/07/passat-wagon.jpg)
It never crossed my mind until I saw one today.
The Passat wagon comes in an extremely limited selection of trims, and we had TWO people swear to God that their current-gen Volkswagen Passats are the spawn of Satan.
Quote from: Colonel Cadillac on January 25, 2011, 10:34:45 AM
Did you ever look at one of these:
(http://www.cartuningcentral.com/wp-content/uploads/2008/07/passat-wagon.jpg)
It never crossed my mind until I saw one today.
They look good. I wouldn't normally consider VW, but the wagon looks nice.
The 2.0T is really hit or miss.