So......
I've hinted to wife that I'd like something other than Impreza. For whatever reason the seat inflames back pain. Weird hip/back angle.
She is ok with a $3k beater (and keeping Impreza) or going more ($8-13k?) and selling Impreza. (hard to get a read on her often LOL)
I'm looking at a couple Yaris/ Fit/ probably scam Rav4s for under $3k.
She saw a 2017 Camry 4banger for $13k and started messaging them. Weird. I guess she likes that it is really new. It was in a rear wreck, bumper was replaced by insurance.
I'd prefer something taller for seating (Rav4, CRV, CX-5, Escape), but then I also keep wondering if I could find a place to rent a Miata for a day or two to check if it would irritate my back......
:hammerhead:
I'm ok too with just driving Odyssey to work.
So really this one is all over the map. What say y'all??
I know what you mean about the Impreza seats. For $3Kish, you can probably get an SVT Focus. Pretty upright position and plenty of headroom.
https://greenville.craigslist.org/cto/d/greer-2003-ford-focus-svt/6804828163.html
Comfortable seats? You need a Cullinan. :lol:
(https://www.automobil-produktion.de/files/upload/post/apr/2018/05/191323/rolls-royce-cullinan-7.jpg)
Quote from: Eye of the Tiger on January 29, 2019, 08:40:12 PM
I know what you mean about the Impreza seats. For $3Kish, you can probably get an SVT Focus. Pretty upright position and plenty of headroom.
https://greenville.craigslist.org/cto/d/greer-2003-ford-focus-svt/6804828163.html
I looked real quick, only one around here is $7k
Quote from: cawimmer430 on January 30, 2019, 02:36:29 AM
Comfortable seats? You need a Cullinan. :lol:
(https://www.automobil-produktion.de/files/upload/post/apr/2018/05/191323/rolls-royce-cullinan-7.jpg)
You missed the "Cheap" part? :thumbsup:
I'd go newer. It's OK to finance. Rates are still reasonable
Camry sounds good.
Quote from: 12,000 RPM on January 30, 2019, 08:13:33 AM
I'd go newer. It's OK to finance. Rates are still reasonable
Camry sounds good.
:rolleyes:
$13k is plenty for a basic commuter, and IIRC, Will is pretty debt-averse from prior experience, which is also OK.
Quote from: AutobahnSHO on January 29, 2019, 08:33:00 PM
So......
I've hinted to wife that I'd like something other than Impreza. For whatever reason the seat inflames back pain. Weird hip/back angle.
She is ok with a $3k beater (and keeping Impreza) or going more ($8-13k?) and selling Impreza. (hard to get a read on her often LOL)
I'm looking at a couple Yaris/ Fit/ probably scam Rav4s for under $3k.
She saw a 2017 Camry 4banger for $13k and started messaging them. Weird. I guess she likes that it is really new. It was in a rear wreck, bumper was replaced by insurance.
I'd prefer something taller for seating (Rav4, CRV, CX-5, Escape), but then I also keep wondering if I could find a place to rent a Miata for a day or two to check if it would irritate my back......
:hammerhead:
I'm ok too with just driving Odyssey to work.
So really this one is all over the map. What say y'all??
Any limitations on mileage?
Quote from: BimmerM3 on January 30, 2019, 09:36:46 AM
:rolleyes:
$13k is plenty for a basic commuter, and IIRC, Will is pretty debt-averse from prior experience, which is also OK.
Any limitations on mileage?
I usually buy 125k+ but
option1 (Beater) is ok to be high as long as the car doesn't need any work the next year or two (we're probably moving summer 2020).
option2 (nicer) I'd like to keep it lower, found a few cheaper cars around 90-100k I suspect they're off-loading before having to pay for timing belt etc...
If we go this option, wife wants newer than our current cars (2010+?) and we want to keep it for 10 years. In which case I want to be pickier, I don't want a base model Camry for 10 years. I'd prefer something with a sunroof, maybe other options...
Quote from: BimmerM3 on January 30, 2019, 09:36:46 AM
:rolleyes:
$13k is plenty for a basic commuter, and IIRC, Will is pretty debt-averse from prior experience, which is also OK.
Yes, $13K is plenty, which is why I said the Camry sounds good. I'd wager with all the hassle + transaction fees it would be cheaper financially and much less stressful.
What do used BMW i3s go for?
A boat load of beaters hardly ever pays off in the long run
Quote from: AutobahnSHO on January 30, 2019, 08:00:27 AM
I looked real quick, only one around here is $7k
Must be a nice one, then.
3k - Gen 1 Scion XB
Quote from: r0tor on January 30, 2019, 10:13:35 AM
A boat load of beaters hardly ever pays off in the long run
:lockedup:
Quote from: r0tor on January 30, 2019, 10:13:35 AM
A boat load of beaters hardly ever pays off in the long run
LOLS I've bought mine for average $3k. Used cars have been more expensive since the 2008 recession but my $2500 beater lasted from 2008 until we were moving in 2015 so sold it. Put 80k+ miles on it too.
Quote from: 2o6 on January 30, 2019, 10:40:03 AM
3k - Gen 1 Scion XB
I've seen a couple of them, you think they're better than a Fit or whatever?
I recall Ford products having great seats. Very comfortable.
Quote from: AutobahnSHO on January 30, 2019, 02:48:29 PM
I've seen a couple of them, you think they're better than a Fit or whatever?
In my opinion, the main downside of the xB is the high speed aero, and snow plow front bumper. If you have a daily 40 mile highway commute, I'd reconsider. Otherwise, it's a good driving little box.
The transmission debacle has lowered the value of the 2012 Focus. I'm not sure the manual trans ones are any more valuable. If I was looking for cheap transportation, I might consider that.
https://www.cargurus.com/Cars/inventorylisting/viewDetailsFilterViewInventoryListing.action?sourceContext=carGurusHomePageModel&newSearchFromOverviewPage=true&inventorySearchWidgetType=AUTO&entitySelectingHelper.selectedEntity=d369&entitySelectingHelper.selectedEntity2=c21229&zip=27023&distance=500&searchChanged=true&modelChanged=false&filtersModified=true&sortType=CAR_YEAR&sortDirection=DESC#listing=223498109
Quote from: Eye of the Tiger on January 30, 2019, 02:54:51 PM
In my opinion, the main downside of the xB is the high speed aero, and snow plow front bumper. If you have a daily 40 mile highway commute, I'd reconsider. Otherwise, it's a good driving little box.
My commute is 3miles in 35mph speed limits with tons of stupid traffic lights.
Quote from: 68_427 on January 30, 2019, 02:56:47 PM
https://www.cargurus.com/Cars/inventorylisting/viewDetailsFilterViewInventoryListing.action?sourceContext=carGurusHomePageModel&newSearchFromOverviewPage=true&inventorySearchWidgetType=AUTO&entitySelectingHelper.selectedEntity=d369&entitySelectingHelper.selectedEntity2=c21229&zip=27023&distance=500&searchChanged=true&modelChanged=false&filtersModified=true&sortType=CAR_YEAR&sortDirection=DESC#listing=223498109
gross.
I dislike sedans, used to have tons of Fords but our Japanese cars have just lasted longer more cheaply.
Quote from: AutobahnSHO on January 30, 2019, 02:58:26 PM
My commute is 3miles in 35mph speed limits with tons of stupid traffic lights.
Perfect. I'd go for the automatic, then. Maybe add a cold air intake, a tri-Y header, and one of those coffee maker mufflers.
So PAUSE TIME...
Wife and I have finally started getting our Roth IRAs going, we're going to wait until after income taxes and travel settlement is all done. (Spent $850 on hotels moving, we get a huge chunk of change for "dislocation" and the 1600lbs we moved ourselves....)
Quote from: AutobahnSHO on January 30, 2019, 02:59:27 PM
gross.
I dislike sedans, used to have tons of Fords but our Japanese cars have just lasted longer more cheaply.
I mean you make it sound like your main reason for wanting a new car is seat comfort, so you should probably be looking at cars that were designed to be comfortable in the first place, and not sub compact cars designed to cost $10k-$15k new? :huh:
https://www.autotrader.com/cars-for-sale/vehicledetails.xhtml?listingId=499367150&zip=98003&referrer=%2Fcars-for-sale%2Fsearchresults.xhtml%3Fzip%3D98003%26startYear%3D1981%26sortBy%3DderivedpriceDESC%26maxPrice%3D19000%26incremental%3Dall%26firstRecord%3D0%26marketExtension%3Don%26endYear%3D2019%26modelCodeList%3DBMWI3%26makeCodeList%3DBMW%26searchRadius%3D300&startYear=1981&numRecords=25&maxPrice=19000&firstRecord=0&endYear=2019&modelCodeList=BMWI3&makeCodeList=BMW&searchRadius=300&makeCode1=BMW&modelCode1=BMWI3&clickType=listing
Comfort? Man, there was nothing as comfortable as my old '64 Coupe De Ville. :lol:
Quote from: 68_427 on January 30, 2019, 03:02:21 PM
I mean you make it sound like your main reason for wanting a new car is seat comfort, so you should probably be looking at cars that were designed to be comfortable in the first place, and not sub compact cars designed to cost $10k-$15k new? :huh:
It's only the angle of the seat in the Impreza that bugs me. A more upright seating position is what gives me no problems. SUVs, Minivan, even my old Legacy were no issue.
I always preferred hatches or wagons, I haven't owned a sedan since 2004...
Quote from: Galaxy on January 30, 2019, 03:03:50 PM
https://www.autotrader.com/cars-for-sale/vehicledetails.xhtml?listingId=499367150&zip=98003&referrer=%2Fcars-for-sale%2Fsearchresults.xhtml%3Fzip%3D98003%26startYear%3D1981%26sortBy%3DderivedpriceDESC%26maxPrice%3D19000%26incremental%3Dall%26firstRecord%3D0%26marketExtension%3Don%26endYear%3D2019%26modelCodeList%3DBMWI3%26makeCodeList%3DBMW%26searchRadius%3D300&startYear=1981&numRecords=25&maxPrice=19000&firstRecord=0&endYear=2019&modelCodeList=BMWI3&makeCodeList=BMW&searchRadius=300&makeCode1=BMW&modelCode1=BMWI3&clickType=listing
I literally cannot charge an electric car now. Parking on the street, no garage. Sidewalk separates car from house.
How about something like this
https://www.cargurus.com/Cars/inventorylisting/viewDetailsFilterViewInventoryListing.action?sourceContext=carGurusHomePageModel&newSearchFromOverviewPage=true&inventorySearchWidgetType=AUTO&entitySelectingHelper.selectedEntity=c3838&entitySelectingHelper.selectedEntity2=c23217&zip=27023&distance=200&searchChanged=true&modelChanged=false&filtersModified=true&sortType=PRICE&sortDirection=ASC#listing=230098280
Quote from: AutobahnSHO on January 30, 2019, 03:00:37 PM
So PAUSE TIME...
Wife and I have finally started getting our Roth IRAs going, we're going to wait until after income taxes and travel settlement is all done. (Spent $850 on hotels moving, we get a huge chunk of change for "dislocation" and the 1600lbs we moved ourselves....)
Well, at least get one of those little pillows to put on Impreza's seat. Or one of those wooden bead seat covers, like every Volvo 240 has.
Quote from: 68_427 on January 30, 2019, 03:26:12 PM
How about something like this
https://www.cargurus.com/Cars/inventorylisting/viewDetailsFilterViewInventoryListing.action?sourceContext=carGurusHomePageModel&newSearchFromOverviewPage=true&inventorySearchWidgetType=AUTO&entitySelectingHelper.selectedEntity=c3838&entitySelectingHelper.selectedEntity2=c23217&zip=27023&distance=200&searchChanged=true&modelChanged=false&filtersModified=true&sortType=PRICE&sortDirection=ASC#listing=230098280
Pretty far away but looks like nice.
3 mile commute with lots of lights... sounds like a job for a hybrid. Cheap now with cheap gas, sick resale when gas eventually goes back up.
Soooo many good options for <12k w/ under 100k miles. These are just scratching the surface.
2008 Acura RDX - https://www.cargurus.com/Cars/inventorylisting/viewDetailsFilterViewInventoryListing.action?shopperListingsSearch=57120987#listing=219838105
2008 Lexus RX 350 - https://www.cargurus.com/Cars/inventorylisting/viewDetailsFilterViewInventoryListing.action?shopperListingsSearch=57120987#listing=230431886
2011 Mazdaspeed3 - https://www.cargurus.com/Cars/inventorylisting/viewDetailsFilterViewInventoryListing.action?shopperListingsSearch=57120987#listing=230743585
2013 Ford Focus ST - https://www.cargurus.com/Cars/inventorylisting/viewDetailsFilterViewInventoryListing.action?shopperListingsSearch=57120987#listing=228687379
2018 Ford Focus - https://www.cargurus.com/Cars/inventorylisting/viewDetailsFilterViewInventoryListing.action?shopperListingsSearch=57120987#listing=206090210
2011 Dieselgate Golf - https://www.cargurus.com/Cars/inventorylisting/viewDetailsFilterViewInventoryListing.action?shopperListingsSearch=57120987#listing=226075644
Quote from: BimmerM3 on January 30, 2019, 06:13:34 PM
Soooo many good options for <12k w/ under 100k miles. These are just scratching the surface.
2008 Acura RDX - https://www.cargurus.com/Cars/inventorylisting/viewDetailsFilterViewInventoryListing.action?shopperListingsSearch=57120987#listing=219838105
2008 Lexus RX 350 - https://www.cargurus.com/Cars/inventorylisting/viewDetailsFilterViewInventoryListing.action?shopperListingsSearch=57120987#listing=230431886
2011 Mazdaspeed3 - https://www.cargurus.com/Cars/inventorylisting/viewDetailsFilterViewInventoryListing.action?shopperListingsSearch=57120987#listing=230743585
2013 Ford Focus ST - https://www.cargurus.com/Cars/inventorylisting/viewDetailsFilterViewInventoryListing.action?shopperListingsSearch=57120987#listing=228687379
2018 Ford Focus - https://www.cargurus.com/Cars/inventorylisting/viewDetailsFilterViewInventoryListing.action?shopperListingsSearch=57120987#listing=206090210
2011 Dieselgate Golf - https://www.cargurus.com/Cars/inventorylisting/viewDetailsFilterViewInventoryListing.action?shopperListingsSearch=57120987#listing=226075644
You can add a 2017 Fiesta Ecoboost to that list.
Except for the SUVs I'd be wary of the seating. Again, it's not the cushion or luxury of the seat, but the angles. I have Odyssey seat tilted back some. It's power so super adjustable as far as angle goes.....
Oh and just the first three are 260-300+ miles away.. !?!?...
Quote from: AutobahnSHO on January 30, 2019, 06:19:43 PM
Oh and just the first three are 260-300+ miles away.. !?!?...
That's really not that far. You can do round trip in half a day if it's a car you want. I bought my truck south east of Boston. It was 800 miles round trip, and just took one day.
Plus traffic moves fast in the south from what I've seen :ohyeah:
Quote from: AutobahnSHO on January 30, 2019, 06:19:43 PM
Oh and just the first three are 260-300+ miles away.. !?!?...
I didn't know your zip. I thought you were in the DC area so I just picked one of DC's zip codes.
Quote from: BimmerM3 on January 30, 2019, 06:44:06 PM
I didn't know your zip. I thought you were in the DC area so I just picked one of DC's zip codes.
lol 22315 but man some of those are not anywhere near DC :lol:
A 1986 Ford Ranger would be a great 3 mile commuter. The bench seat is mighty comfy.
So I forgot about autotrader....
Just browsing 10miles away my top choices under $6k or less are:
2x $6k manual CR-V with sunroof and 130-140k miles on them, a 2003 and 2005.
2010 Fit, $6k at 120k miles, but slushie no options.
2004 Prius but battery? 138k miles for $4k. Not sure about seats in these. Pictures look like it may or might not be like Impreza.
2005 Scion xA, manual, 141k, $3k
and want but not want, 1999 Z3 slushie, 137k miles for $4500- private party.
LOL made the mistake of looking at the SHOForum.
Guy has a pretty built out mechanically sound 1991 (my favorite! :wub: ) that needs some interior TLC (Seat cover and massive vacuum/shampoo job) and he knows that he won't get "$12k or $4k" for it, so he's open to offers. But it's in Indiana LOLOLOLOL.
I want in a heartbeat- this is my "if I were a rich guy at the Barrett Jackson auction" want car. But man it would be a moneypit...... :lol:
CR-V or Fit.
Prius batteries actually age pretty well. The engines make sludge around 150k though.
Quote from: AutobahnSHO on January 30, 2019, 07:12:19 PM
lol 22315 but man some of those are not anywhere near DC :lol:
20001 zip code w/ 100 mile search radius. :huh:
But mostly I was just making the point that you have a lot of good options.
Too bad you're not on the west coast:
https://sfbay.craigslist.org/nby/cto/d/monte-rio-ford-focus/6790436442.html
2004 Ford Focus hatchback, 48K miles, has the bigger 2.3L motor (same as the Mazda 3), 5MT for $2,600!
Quote from: Laconian on January 30, 2019, 07:28:39 PM
CR-V or Fit.
Prius batteries actually age pretty well. The engines make sludge around 150k though.
Since when? I've never heard this. The 1NZFXE in the Prius II is basically the same as the 1NZFE 1.5L in the Yaris/Echo/xB. The only difference is the head. I let three of them go with 120K +, and my roommate has a 2005 xB with 305K on it.
Also, Fit 1.5L's sometimes blow out coils and then shatter plugs, requiring the head to be helicoiled so you can put in a new spark plug.
K24's also sometimes use and burn oil later in life.
ALSO, you should actually SIT in a Honda Fit before you buy one. The Fit's seats are shaped weird, and the reason I don't have one is because of how much it made my back hurt after driving only for 20 mins.
----------------
The xB is a solid car, if a bit slow. More importantly, they don't have very many points of failure. The manual trans sometimes has brittle synchros, but replacement transmissions are cheap. The 4AT is pretty old school, but it's reliable and basically never breaks. The 1.5L is known for being one of the most reliable motors Toyota has ever made. The only things on the 1NZFE that really ever go wrong is the water pump, which is actually pretty easy to replace yourself.
Quote from: HurricaneSteve on January 30, 2019, 09:47:59 PM
Too bad you're not on the west coast:
https://sfbay.craigslist.org/nby/cto/d/monte-rio-ford-focus/6790436442.html
2004 Ford Focus hatchback, 48K miles, has the bigger 2.3L motor (same as the Mazda 3), 5MT for $2,600!
Ew gross, the 2.3L Duratec is an awful motor. No economy, plus those rod bearings seem to be made of glass. If you get a duratec car, get a 2.0L.
https://www.autotrader.com/cars-for-sale/vehicledetails.xhtml?listingId=505365361&zip=22315&referrer=%2Fcars-for-sale%2Fsearchresults.xhtml%3Fzip%3D22315%26startYear%3D1981%26incremental%3Dall%26endYear%3D2019%26modelCodeList%3DESCAPE%26makeCodeList%3DFORD%26listingTypes%3DUSED%252CCERTIFIED%26minPrice%3D8000%26sortBy%3Drelevance%26maxPrice%3D10000%26firstRecord%3D0%26marketExtension%3Don%26searchRadius%3D50&listingTypes=USED%2CCERTIFIED&minPrice=8000&startYear=1981&numRecords=25&maxPrice=10000&firstRecord=0&endYear=2019&modelCodeList=ESCAPE&makeCodeList=FORD&searchRadius=50&makeCode1=FORD&modelCode1=ESCAPE&clickType=listing
Actually Will, you and the missus will look great in this...
https://www.autotrader.com/cars-for-sale/vehicledetails.xhtml?listingId=503608842&zip=22315&referrer=%2Fcars-for-sale%2Fsearchresults.xhtml%3Fzip%3D22315%26startYear%3D2011%26vehicleStyleCodes%3DSUVCROSS%26incremental%3Dall%26endYear%3D2019%26sellerTypes%3Dd%26listingTypes%3Dused%252Ccertified%26minPrice%3D7000%26sortBy%3Drelevance%26maxPrice%3D10000%26firstRecord%3D0%26marketExtension%3Don%26searchRadius%3D50&sellerTypes=d&listingTypes=used%2Ccertified&minPrice=7000&startYear=2011&numRecords=25&maxPrice=10000&vehicleStyleCodes=SUVCROSS&firstRecord=0&endYear=2019&searchRadius=50&makeCode1=BMW&modelCode1=X3&digitalRetail=true&clickType=listing
Just noticed it has a check engine light, but with newish vehicles that could be anything. A quick diagnostic might reveal something trivial and cheap to fix, but in any case I think it's worth it at that price. If it's something major, you can just walk away. You can also spring for the extra 3 yr powertrain warranty.
Prius batteries are cheap and easy to replace.
Also eww at the old Focus, yall don't seem to remember 2o6's nightmare.
Quote from: 12,000 RPM on January 31, 2019, 05:10:46 AM
Prius batteries are cheap and easy to replace.
Also eww at the old Focus, yall don't seem to remember 2o6's nightmare.
By cheap you mean $1200+ used, or $30 per cell?
And Focus is a good driving, reliable-ish car.
Quote from: 2o6 on January 30, 2019, 11:01:17 PM
Ew gross, the 2.3L Duratec is an awful motor. No economy, plus those rod bearings seem to be made of glass. If you get a duratec car, get a 2.0L.
Define no economy. EPA had the 2.3L Focus at 25/33 which is similar to the 2.0 Mazda3 of the same era. I also see quite a few 1st gen Mazda3 hatches still flying around, as well as Mazda6's & Fusions so I don't know if a few junkyard adventures tell the whole story.
Quote from: 12,000 RPM on January 31, 2019, 05:10:46 AM
Prius batteries are cheap and easy to replace.
Also eww at the old Focus, yall don't seem to remember 2o6's nightmare.
A lack of care (and common sense) can deep six just about any car.
So, filed my taxes. Getting back about half what I paid in- in around a month.
Add in car savings and our budget will be around $10k, but several weeks from now.
Wife therefore wants to go nicer than beater and sell Impreza. We could probably get $3-4k from Impreza, which will cover taxes/registration and refill the immediate car repair fund.
My top priority is long-lasting and low maintenance hassle, followed by comfort, space, gas mileage.
Top picks are CR-V, Rav4, CX-5, Forester. They all have much better gas mileage than Odyssey (15.6mpg this last fillup of driving around locally), and Impreza usually only gets 18 city. Plus the more upright seating.
I will be looking out for AWD/ sunroof/ manual transmission combos....
https://washingtondc.craigslist.org/nva/cto/d/stafford-2009-subaru-impreza-wrx-low/6791002904.html
It has different seats!!!
(https://images.craigslist.org/00E0E_5mFpalCqXMF_600x450.jpg)
If it were me, I'd be looking at a spaceship Civic Si sedan. Fast, reliable, around $10,000 for a decent one, manual, practical, pretty good on gas, and comfortable. Fun to drive, too.
Quote from: Raza on February 01, 2019, 05:53:01 AM
If it were me, I'd be looking at a spaceship Civic Si sedan. Fast, reliable, around $10,000 for a decent one, manual, practical, pretty good on gas, and comfortable. Fun to drive, too.
They are so LOUD
I guess if this is a pure short distance car then it's fine. But if there's even a remote possibility of the commute going longer than 20 minutes, pass
So the possibilities for and AWD/manuL/sunroof crossover with upright seating are ... WRX, Civic Si ... There are grate ideas. Have you thought about an E36 M3? :lol:
Quote from: 12,000 RPM on February 01, 2019, 05:58:00 AM
They are so LOUD
I guess if this is a pure short distance car then it's fine. But if there's even a remote possibility of the commute going longer than 20 minutes, pass
I drove one to LA and back and didn't one notice it being loud :huh:
I think a spaceship Civic is a great idea. Drives well, reliable, in the price range, etc
They are incredibly fun to drive
Quote from: CaminoRacer on February 01, 2019, 07:34:04 AM
I drove one to LA and back and didn't one notice it being loud :huh:
Loss of hearing due to blasting around in your El Camino :huh:.
Quote from: FoMoJo on February 01, 2019, 07:36:13 AM
Loss of hearing due to blasting around in your El Camino :huh:.
Exactly. Everything is quiet compared to that.
Most Hondas have issues with road noise.
If you get a Civic, make sure it's 2009+. Early cars have block casting issues and will crack blocks with no warning and start pouring out coolant and oil.
Also, once again, be cautious; Si models, the K20 and K24 are generally solid, but yet again they tend to use and burn oil higher in miles. Sometimes seals on them like to weep, too.
Quote from: HurricaneSteve on January 31, 2019, 03:34:36 PM
Define no economy. EPA had the 2.3L Focus at 25/33 which is similar to the 2.0 Mazda3 of the same era. I also see quite a few 1st gen Mazda3 hatches still flying around, as well as Mazda6's & Fusions so I don't know if a few junkyard adventures tell the whole story.
Uh, junkyards definitely DO tell a lot of the story. If a motor is expensive at a junkyard, that generally means it's crap. Not to mention, I barely got 25MPG mixed out of my Mazda 3.
Here's some experience I've had with that shitty 2.3MZR/Duratec
2012 - Mazda 5 taken on trade from dealer I worked at. I start car to move it across the parking lot - clang clang clang, rod knock.
2012 - Mazda CX-7, identical story to above.
2014 - Passed on Mazda 5 that was in terrible physical shape, due to rod knock.
2014 - Too slow to contact seller to buy Manual trans Mazda 5 with rod knock.
2016 - I bought a 2008 Mazda 6 4cyl. Rod knock. The car only has 89k.
2016 - two of my car flipping friends bought identical Mazda 6's to mine; one with 110k, another with 140k. Both have rod knock. The one with 110k has a hole in the pan and a connecting rod sticking out.
2018 - I bought a 2007 Mazda 3 with 104k.... the valve train and bottom end is fucked up from low oil pressure despite regular oil changes. I get new motor installed. New motor has timing chain issues. I replace with another engine.
The 2.3L MZR is a shitty motor.
I am determined to get mine to 300k to spite you :lol:
Quote from: CaminoRacer on February 01, 2019, 08:16:05 AM
I am determined to get mine to 300k to spite you :lol:
You're like the only one
Quote from: AutobahnSHO on January 31, 2019, 07:42:25 PM
I will be looking out for AWD/ sunroof/ manual transmission combos....
Any particular priority order to those preferences? Getting all three (particularly the MT) in a CUV will be really tough.
Quote from: BimmerM3 on February 01, 2019, 08:28:40 AM
Any particular priority order to those preferences? Getting all three (particularly the MT) in a CUV will be really tough.
The MT is a long shot, I think only the Forester and maybe CX-5 had them? Not super concerned with that.
I really really want sunroof and wife will really really want AWD.
I really love the panorama roof available on Forester, but the chain on the CR-V and RAV4 is very appealing...
Quote from: CaminoRacer on February 01, 2019, 08:16:05 AM
I am determined to get mine to 300k to spite you :lol:
:lol:
Quote from: 2o6 on February 01, 2019, 08:06:07 AM
Uh, junkyards definitely DO tell a lot of the story. If a motor is expensive at a junkyard, that generally means it's crap. Not to mention, I barely got 25MPG mixed out of my Mazda 3.
Here's some experience I've had with that shitty 2.3MZR/Duratec
2012 - Mazda 5 taken on trade from dealer I worked at. I start car to move it across the parking lot - clang clang clang, rod knock.
2012 - Mazda CX-7, identical story to above.
2014 - Passed on Mazda 5 that was in terrible physical shape, due to rod knock.
2014 - Too slow to contact seller to buy Manual trans Mazda 5 with rod knock.
2016 - I bought a 2008 Mazda 6 4cyl. Rod knock. The car only has 89k.
2016 - two of my car flipping friends bought identical Mazda 6's to mine; one with 110k, another with 140k. Both have rod knock. The one with 110k has a hole in the pan and a connecting rod sticking out.
2018 - I bought a 2007 Mazda 3 with 104k.... the valve train and bottom end is fucked up from low oil pressure despite regular oil changes. I get new motor installed. New motor has timing chain issues. I replace with another engine.
The 2.3L MZR is a shitty motor.
The rest of the car disintegrated around it, but mine ran flawlessly for 100K. Before all of the stations switched to E10, I was getting mid 30s on the highway. Probably around 28 mpg combined. After the switch to E10 that dropped to like 31-32 and around 27 mixed. Between ethanolated fuel, plus winter blend, and cold winter temps (running the defrost non-stop), I was still getting 23 mpg in pure city driving. Hell of a lot better than my VW (which gets like 18 under the same conditions). A friend had a 2.3 Mazda3 of the same vintage and his motor was going strong as well with 6 figures on the odometer. And that was his auto-x car for a couple of seasons. Coworker had one, passed down to his kid, no engine issues. Sounds like it's either something about the Mazda5s or all of the used ones you looked at may not have been taken care of.
Quote from: MX793 on February 01, 2019, 05:12:29 PM
The rest of the car disintegrated around it, but mine ran flawlessly for 100K. Before all of the stations switched to E10, I was getting mid 30s on the highway. Probably around 28 mpg combined. After the switch to E10 that dropped to like 31-32 and around 27 mixed. Between ethanolated fuel, plus winter blend, and cold winter temps (running the defrost non-stop), I was still getting 23 mpg in pure city driving. Hell of a lot better than my VW (which gets like 18 under the same conditions). A friend had a 2.3 Mazda3 of the same vintage and his motor was going strong as well with 6 figures on the odometer. And that was his auto-x car for a couple of seasons. Coworker had one, passed down to his kid, no engine issues. Sounds like it's either something about the Mazda5s or all of the used ones you looked at may not have been taken care of.
Some people just don't believe in oil changes :huh:.
Quote from: FoMoJo on February 01, 2019, 05:32:38 PM
Some people just don't believe in oil changes :huh:.
Oil changes are a scam, and the earth is flat.
Quote from: MX793 on February 01, 2019, 05:12:29 PM
The rest of the car disintegrated around it, but mine ran flawlessly for 100K. Before all of the stations switched to E10, I was getting mid 30s on the highway. Probably around 28 mpg combined. After the switch to E10 that dropped to like 31-32 and around 27 mixed. Between ethanolated fuel, plus winter blend, and cold winter temps (running the defrost non-stop), I was still getting 23 mpg in pure city driving. Hell of a lot better than my VW (which gets like 18 under the same conditions). A friend had a 2.3 Mazda3 of the same vintage and his motor was going strong as well with 6 figures on the odometer. And that was his auto-x car for a couple of seasons. Coworker had one, passed down to his kid, no engine issues. Sounds like it's either something about the Mazda5s or all of the used ones you looked at may not have been taken care of.
They do it in the Ford Escape, as well.
Even a quick search of Mazda 2.3 rod knock gives you pages, and pages, and pages of these things destroying rod bearings.
If you maintain one new (or significantly low miles) it might be fine, but considering the pages upon pages of these things blowing up, i don't think they're a strong engine. Hell, the 2.5L is known swap for Mazda 3 owners when the 2.3L blows up, because it's a more reliable engine and it's a direct fit.
The 1ZZ Corolla is also notorious for doing similar things, but those got revised in 2005 ish, and they don't spin bearings and use oil as much.
Hmm......
https://www.autotrader.com/cars-for-sale/vehicledetails.xhtml?listingId=504068016&zip=22315&referrer=%2Fcars-for-sale%2Fsearchresults.xhtml%3Fzip%3D22315%26minPrice%3D8000%26startYear%3D1981%26sortBy%3Drelevance%26maxPrice%3D11000%26vehicleStyleCodes%3DSUVCROSS%26incremental%3Dall%26firstRecord%3D25%26marketExtension%3Don%26endYear%3D2019%26searchRadius%3D10&minPrice=8000&startYear=1981&numRecords=25&maxPrice=11000&vehicleStyleCodes=SUVCROSS&firstRecord=25&endYear=2019&searchRadius=10&makeCode1=VOLKS&modelCode1=TIGUAN&clickType=listing
Quote from: 2o6 on February 01, 2019, 08:06:07 AM
Uh, junkyards definitely DO tell a lot of the story. If a motor is expensive at a junkyard, that generally means it's crap. Not to mention, I barely got 25MPG mixed out of my Mazda 3.
Here's some experience I've had with that shitty 2.3MZR/Duratec
2012 - Mazda 5 taken on trade from dealer I worked at. I start car to move it across the parking lot - clang clang clang, rod knock.
2012 - Mazda CX-7, identical story to above.
2014 - Passed on Mazda 5 that was in terrible physical shape, due to rod knock.
2014 - Too slow to contact seller to buy Manual trans Mazda 5 with rod knock.
2016 - I bought a 2008 Mazda 6 4cyl. Rod knock. The car only has 89k.
2016 - two of my car flipping friends bought identical Mazda 6's to mine; one with 110k, another with 140k. Both have rod knock. The one with 110k has a hole in the pan and a connecting rod sticking out.
2018 - I bought a 2007 Mazda 3 with 104k.... the valve train and bottom end is fucked up from low oil pressure despite regular oil changes. I get new motor installed. New motor has timing chain issues. I replace with another engine.
The 2.3L MZR is a shitty motor.
Didn't you say on the 2007 Mazda 3 you bought that the VVT solenoid blew due to a lack of oil? And didn't you have to replace both the motor AND the transmission? In all of my years owning cars and driving, I have not once had to replace an engine or transmission, much less both at the same time. Something tells me despite what he had you believe, the previous owner was quite terrible with maintenance. As far as your other experiences, the Mazda 5 stands out but it's also the heaviest vehicle that Mazda placed the 2.3L in (it also seats up to 6 passengers) so I think that was a case of too small of an engine in too big of a car. The CX-7 was a disaster but that also was a heavy vehicle paired with a turbo at a time when few, if any SUV's were powered by turbos and turbo tech has come a long way since.
I won't deny that Toyota and Honda are at the top when it comes to reliability but that doesn't mean other cars that fall short of their standard are crap. I also don't recall any of their economy cars offering any engines larger than 2.0L (the closest competitors would be the 2.4L from GM and Chrysler, both of which had noticeably worse MPG than the Duractec/Mazda). The Ford Fusion also featured the 2.3L and has been one of the most reliable mid sized cars from that era so I have to say I'm a bit hesitant to call the 2.3L a "shitty motor" when much of your experience comes from buying broken down cars that people can't wait to get rid of because they skimped on maintenance and care.
Quote from: AutobahnSHO on February 01, 2019, 08:26:24 PM
Hmm......
https://www.autotrader.com/cars-for-sale/vehicledetails.xhtml?listingId=504068016&zip=22315&referrer=%2Fcars-for-sale%2Fsearchresults.xhtml%3Fzip%3D22315%26minPrice%3D8000%26startYear%3D1981%26sortBy%3Drelevance%26maxPrice%3D11000%26vehicleStyleCodes%3DSUVCROSS%26incremental%3Dall%26firstRecord%3D25%26marketExtension%3Don%26endYear%3D2019%26searchRadius%3D10&minPrice=8000&startYear=1981&numRecords=25&maxPrice=11000&vehicleStyleCodes=SUVCROSS&firstRecord=25&endYear=2019&searchRadius=10&makeCode1=VOLKS&modelCode1=TIGUAN&clickType=listing
I like, and it hits all your wish items.
In that case I think a RAV4 with the V-6 would be pretty awesome.
https://sfbay.craigslist.org/sby/ctd/d/sacramento-2009-toyota-rav4-lmtd-clean/6809602414.html
https://sfbay.craigslist.org/sfc/cto/d/daly-city-toyota-rav4-limited-2011/6804865473.html
I'd imagine you could find something similar in your neck of the woods.
Quote from: AutobahnSHO on February 01, 2019, 03:43:16 PM
The MT is a long shot, I think only the Forester and maybe CX-5 had them? Not super concerned with that.
I really really want sunroof and wife will really really want AWD.
I really love the panorama roof available on Forester, but the chain on the CR-V and RAV4 is very appealing...
My brother's waifu likes her V6 RAV4. Drives great, amazingly fast for what it is..
I don't know if the Tiguan had any problems, but my parents were not very happy with their Touareg.
2010 CR-V AWD w/ Sunroof, leather, heated seats
https://www.cargurus.com/Cars/inventorylisting/viewDetailsFilterViewInventoryListing.action?sourceContext=carGurusHomePageBody&newSearchFromOverviewPage=true&inventorySearchWidgetType=BODYSTYLE&bodyTypeGroup=bg7&zip=22315&distance=50&startYear=&endYear=&minPrice=0&maxPrice=10000&maxMileage=100000&makeId=4&makeId=6&makeId=7&makeId=37&makeId=42&makeId=53&wheelSystems=AWD&showNegotiable=false&installedOptionIds=2&modelChanged=undefined&filtersModified=true#listing=224992047
You can get an RDX for basically the same price.
https://www.cargurus.com/Cars/inventorylisting/viewDetailsFilterViewInventoryListing.action?sourceContext=carGurusHomePageBody&newSearchFromOverviewPage=true&inventorySearchWidgetType=BODYSTYLE&bodyTypeGroup=bg7&zip=22315&distance=50&startYear=&endYear=&minPrice=0&maxPrice=10000&maxMileage=100000&makeId=4&makeId=6&makeId=7&makeId=37&makeId=42&makeId=53&wheelSystems=AWD&showNegotiable=false&installedOptionIds=2&modelChanged=undefined&filtersModified=true#listing=218571705
Forester with only 75k miles
https://www.cargurus.com/Cars/inventorylisting/viewDetailsFilterViewInventoryListing.action?sourceContext=carGurusHomePageBody&newSearchFromOverviewPage=true&inventorySearchWidgetType=BODYSTYLE&bodyTypeGroup=bg7&zip=22315&distance=50&startYear=&endYear=&minPrice=0&maxPrice=10000&maxMileage=100000&makeId=4&makeId=6&makeId=7&makeId=37&makeId=42&makeId=53&wheelSystems=AWD&showNegotiable=false&installedOptionIds=2&modelChanged=undefined&filtersModified=true#listing=213527750
Yeah, I'm getting excited. I need to wait a few weeks to actually pull the trigger. Need that money!
I like the Tiguan idea. Dunno if you can get an R-Line but they come with 255 width tires or something stupid like that... would def be my pick :lol:
Quote from: BimmerM3 on February 01, 2019, 09:23:26 PM
I don't know if the Tiguan had any problems, but my parents were not very happy with their Touareg.
Night and day. It would be a shame to dismiss the Tiguan because its completely different and over-engineered stablemate has a bad reputation. The Tiguan is a perfectly fine vehicle.
Quote from: Rockraven on February 02, 2019, 08:14:01 AM
Night and day. It would be a shame to dismiss the Tiguan because its completely different and over-engineered stablemate has a bad reputation. The Tiguan is a perfectly fine vehicle.
I overhear the guy who sits over the wall from me complaining about how his Tig has been a money pit. Similar crap that my Jetta has (inexplicable broken rear springs, electrical gremlins, etc). Based on my experiences and those of people I've known with VWs over the past 20 years, I can soundly say "never again". At least not off-warranty, at any rate.
Quote from: MX793 on February 02, 2019, 10:46:37 AM
I overhear the guy who sits over the wall from me complaining about how his Tig has been a money pit. Similar crap that my Jetta has (inexplicable broken rear springs, electrical gremlins, etc). Based on my experiences and those of people I've known with VWs over the past 20 years, I can soundly say "never again". At least not off-warranty, at any rate.
And I had several VWs that were the most reliable cars I ever owned. My brother in law has bought VW's exclusively for decades. He traded in his '01 TDi with over 500,000 kms on it, and he currently has a '14 Tiguan, '17 Passat, and a '17 Mercedes 250-something (small crossover). I also know people who've had issues with CRVs and RAV4s. My brother lost the engine in his '98 RAV4 within 2 years.
It can definitely be hard to tell the difference between anecdotal experience and actual trends sometimes.
Quote from: BimmerM3 on February 02, 2019, 11:11:41 AM
It can definitely be hard to tell the difference between anecdotal experience and actual trends sometimes.
Do the research, pull the Carfax, have it looked over, and spring for the extra warranty if little/none remains. Standard used car buying stuff. That Tig looks like a good deal, and it checks everything off for him.
Looks good to me. :huh:
https://www.cars.com/research/volkswagen-tiguan-2012/consumer-reviews/
Quote from: Rockraven on February 02, 2019, 10:57:05 AM
And I had several VWs that were the most reliable cars I ever owned. My brother in law has bought VW's exclusively for decades. He traded in his '01 TDi with over 500,000 kms on it, and he currently has a '14 Tiguan, '17 Passat, and a '17 Mercedes 250-something (small crossover). I also know people who've had issues with CRVs and RAV4s. My brother lost the engine in his '98 RAV4 within 2 years.
My car has less than 76K miles. The interior has fallen apart in a manner I have not seen since mid-80s Chrysler products, and I've encountered or heard of others of the same vintage with the exact same issues (headliners coming unglued, paint on buttons bubbling up and falling off, etc). It has numerous electrical gremlins that I just deal with because the cost to chase them down and fix them isn't worth it. Again, an internet search shows a number of these that I've experienced being fairly common. I don't know about you, but in the winter time I kind of like having a rear defroster that I can turn on and not worry about it burning the fuse out if left on for more than 90 seconds. In less than 10K miles with this car, I've put more money into fixing non-corrosion related shit, plus all of the issues that I'm not bothering to address because they are inconvenient but don't result in a failed inspection or inability to drive the car, than any other vehicle I've owned, and I've run vehicles with far higher miles.
I also have a profound problem with the way VW builds their cars. Their design for repair and maintainability is poor. I've got a coolant level sensor that's failing (get bogus coolant warnings any time it's under 10F). I looked into what it takes to replace it. You have to replace the whole @#$%ing coolant reservoir if the sensor goes bad because it's molded into the reservoir bottle. My windshield sprayers failed a couple of years ago. I popped the hood and found that the line from the pump to the nozzles, which instead of being made of a rubbery material, was made out of a brittle, convoluted plastic tubing that's prone to breaking, had snapped at the hood hinge point (internet search showed this was an EXTREMELY common problem across multiple generations of Golf/Jetta). I figured I'd just need to buy a length of this cheap shit "hose" material for a couple of bucks to replace the piece between the pump and the T where it split to the nozzles. NOPE. Whole hose assembly is fused together (plastic tube is thermally welded to the fittings) so you have to replace everything from the pump to the nozzles. I patched it myself using some rubber line, barbed fittings, and duct tape from the hardware store. And, of course, interior adhesives and paints that clearly don't stand the test of time.
My cousin had a MKIV Jetta that she unloaded for a Honda the instant the warranty was up. She was sick of taking it into the dealer to fix niggling little electrical problems, especially once said problems would no longer be covered by warranty. Thankfully hers was a VR6, considering the 1.8Ts had a notorious timing belt tensioner design flaw that, instead of fixing, VW simply reduced the inspect & replace interval by a factor of 2. The place I bought my Mazda from also sold VWs and I can remember sitting in the service waiting area one day while my car was getting its annual state inspection while a pair of female Jetta owners traded stories about the problems their cars had had. Interestingly, their stories were near identical.
"Oh, your rear windows came off the tracks too?! This is my third time getting that fixed. Did you know they have to take the whole door apart to fix it?". Sadly, they still seemed enamored with their cars.
These cars are junk.
Quote from: MX793 on February 02, 2019, 11:38:56 AM
My car has less than 76K miles. The interior has fallen apart in a manner I have not seen since mid-80s Chrysler products, and I've encountered or heard of others of the same vintage with the exact same issues (headliners coming unglued, paint on buttons bubbling up and falling off, etc). It has numerous electrical gremlins that I just deal with because the cost to chase them down and fix them isn't worth it. Again, an internet search shows a number of these that I've experienced being fairly common. I don't know about you, but in the winter time I kind of like having a rear defroster that I can turn on and not worry about it burning the fuse out if left on for more than 90 seconds. In less than 10K miles with this car, I've put more money into fixing non-corrosion related shit, plus all of the issues that I'm not bothering to address because they are inconvenient but don't result in a failed inspection or inability to drive the car, than any other vehicle I've owned, and I've run vehicles with far higher miles.
I also have a profound problem with the way VW builds their cars. Their design for repair and maintainability is poor. I've got a coolant level sensor that's failing (get bogus coolant warnings any time it's under 10F). I looked into what it takes to replace it. You have to replace the whole @#$%ing coolant reservoir if the sensor goes bad because it's molded into the reservoir bottle. My windshield sprayers failed a couple of years ago. I popped the hood and found that the line from the pump to the nozzles, which instead of being made of a rubbery material, was made out of a brittle, convoluted plastic tubing that's prone to breaking, had snapped at the hood hinge point (internet search showed this was an EXTREMELY common problem across multiple generations of Golf/Jetta). I figured I'd just need to buy a length of this cheap shit "hose" material for a couple of bucks to replace the piece between the pump and the T where it split to the nozzles. NOPE. Whole hose assembly is fused together (plastic tube is thermally welded to the fittings) so you have to replace everything from the pump to the nozzles. I patched it myself using some rubber line, barbed fittings, and duct tape from the hardware store. And, of course, interior adhesives and paints that clearly don't stand the test of time.
My cousin had a MKIV Jetta that she unloaded for a Honda the instant the warranty was up. She was sick of taking it into the dealer to fix niggling little electrical problems, especially once said problems would no longer be covered by warranty. Thankfully hers was a VR6, considering the 1.8Ts had a notorious timing belt tensioner design flaw that, instead of fixing, VW simply reduced the inspect & replace interval by a factor of 2. The place I bought my Mazda from also sold VWs and I can remember sitting in the service waiting area one day while my car was getting its annual state inspection while a pair of female Jetta owners traded stories about the problems their cars had had. Interestingly, their stories were near identical.
"Oh, your rear windows came off the tracks too?! This is my third time getting that fixed. Did you know they have to take the whole door apart to fix it?". Sadly, they still seemed enamored with their cars.
These cars are junk.
That's all unfortunate. People here have recommended the Focus, but because of my personal experiences, I cannot recommend it. I wouldn't dissuade an Escape because of it though.
Quote from: Rockraven on February 02, 2019, 10:57:05 AM
And I had several VWs that were the most reliable cars I ever owned. My brother in law has bought VW's exclusively for decades. He traded in his '01 TDi with over 500,000 kms on it, and he currently has a '14 Tiguan, '17 Passat, and a '17 Mercedes 250-something (small crossover). I also know people who've had issues with CRVs and RAV4s. My brother lost the engine in his '98 RAV4 within 2 years.
Would you say, in general, the odds of a Tiguan having problems are the same as the odds of a RAV4/CR-V having problems?
I had a dead reliable VW too.
Quote from: 12,000 RPM on February 02, 2019, 11:49:38 AM
Would you say, in general, the odds of a Tiguan having problems are the same as the odds of a RAV4/CR-V having problems?
I had a dead reliable VW too.
No better or worse, IMHO.
Quote from: Rockraven on February 02, 2019, 11:45:19 AM
That's all unfortunate. People here have recommended the Focus, but because of my personal experiences, I cannot recommend it. I wouldn't dissuade an Escape because of it though.
Thing is, many issues aren't isolated to particular years or even particular models. There's a contingent of VW fanbois where I work who feel like VW can do no wrong. Another co-worker bought a Tig (used I think) apparently at their recommendation. Just last week I heard him complaining to one of the VW fan club about all of the issues he's had recently. I distinctly remember overhearing him say "It's a great car to drive, but I've never had so many issues like this in a car with this age and mileage. I'll never buy another one again". Reminds me of some family friends who were big into Audi in the late 90s and early 00s (always used and off warranty). My dad asked how reliable they were and the response was "Oh, you know, it wouldn't be an Audi if there wasn't some little problem here or there. The seat heaters nearly caught fire just the other day. Thankfully I noticed the burning smell before it could do any real damage".
I used to be really hard on VW (and Audi) in the 90s and early 00s because of all of the problems they had from anecdotes from friends and family. I gave them a chance because, based on some casual internet searching and input from co-workers who have newer (MkV+ Golf/Jetta-based cars), VW had gotten their act together after how awful the MkIV Golf/Jetta was and were producing solid cars. Should have done more research. Maybe they're better than they were 20 years ago, but they're still garbage. Only person who could think these were good, reliable vehicles either has only driven VWs or came from an even less reliable vehicle, like a Fiat or something British, and were so enthralled by the step up in reliability that they stopped looking.
Only positive thing I'll say about it is that their corrosion resistance is admirable. The car has spent its entire life in the rust belt and looks like it came from somewhere down south.
I
might consider buying a new one or CPO with a warranty, but I wouldn't touch an off-warranty used one, even with low miles (mine only had 66K on it when I bought it).
Quote from: Rockraven on February 02, 2019, 08:14:01 AM
Night and day. It would be a shame to dismiss the Tiguan because its completely different and over-engineered stablemate has a bad reputation. The Tiguan is a perfectly fine vehicle.
(https://i.imgur.com/Xw26nsH.jpg) (http://www.freeimagehosting.net/commercial-photography/)
Quote from: HurricaneSteve on February 02, 2019, 12:11:53 PM
(https://i.imgur.com/Xw26nsH.jpg) (http://www.freeimagehosting.net/commercial-photography/)
Need context. Is that one review? What are the complaints? Did you see the link I provided, based on 42 reviews?
Quote from: MX793 on February 02, 2019, 12:01:59 PM
Thing is, many issues aren't isolated to particular years or even particular models. There's a contingent of VW fanbois where I work who feel like VW can do no wrong. Another co-worker bought a Tig (used I think) apparently at their recommendation. Just last week I heard him complaining to one of the VW fan club about all of the issues he's had recently. I distinctly remember overhearing him say "It's a great car to drive, but I've never had so many issues like this in a car with this age and mileage. I'll never buy another one again". Reminds me of some family friends who were big into Audi in the late 90s and early 00s (always used and off warranty). My dad asked how reliable they were and the response was "Oh, you know, it wouldn't be an Audi if there wasn't some little problem here or there. The seat heaters nearly caught fire just the other day. Thankfully I noticed the burning smell before it could do any real damage".
I used to be really hard on VW (and Audi) in the 90s and early 00s because of all of the problems they had from anecdotes from friends and family. I gave them a chance because, based on some casual internet searching and input from co-workers who have newer (MkV+ Golf/Jetta-based cars), VW had gotten their act together after how awful the MkIV Golf/Jetta was and were producing solid cars. Should have done more research. Maybe they're better than they were 20 years ago, but they're still garbage. Only person who could think these were good, reliable vehicles either has only driven VWs or came from an even less reliable vehicle, like a Fiat or something British, and were so enthralled by the step up in reliability that they stopped looking.
Only positive thing I'll say about it is that their corrosion resistance is admirable. The car has spent its entire life in the rust belt and looks like it came from somewhere down south.
I might consider buying a new one or CPO with a warranty, but I wouldn't touch an off-warranty used one, even with low miles (mine only had 66K on it when I bought it).
That's fair, and basically what I recommended.
I did and some of those reviews are within three months of ownership which is hardly long enough to determine if a car is "fine". The image I posted is from Consumer Reports, while not perfect, uses a more comprehensive system to determine reliability.
Quote from: Rockraven on February 02, 2019, 12:19:26 PM
Need context. Is that one review? What are the complaints? Did you see the link I provided, based on 45+ reviews?
Quote from: HurricaneSteve on February 02, 2019, 12:24:57 PM
I did and some of those reviews are within three months of ownership which is hardly long enough to determine if a car is "fine". The image I posted is from Consumer Reports, while not perfect, uses a more comprehensive system to determine reliability.
Yes, some are, and some are far longer. Everyone here takes CR with a healthy dose of salt. One of the "flaws" they track is quantity and size of cupholders. They've also repeatedly based their predicted reliability scores on other, older models of the same marque.
I can understand that. But it's not just CR. This is from True Delta:
(https://i.imgur.com/TTJxje7.png) (http://www.freeimagehosting.net/commercial-photography/)
Quote from: Rockraven on February 02, 2019, 12:29:59 PM
Yes, some are, and some are far longer. Everyone here takes CR with a healthy dose of salt. One of the "flaws" they track is quantity and size of cupholders. They've also repeatedly based their predicted reliability scores on other, older models of the same marque.
I typically plan on keep cars for a long time. "Buy only with a warranty" is equivalent to "don't buy" for me. I might make an exception for some new cars with an exceptionally long warranty, but CPO warranties typically aren't enough to sway me.
Again, context. I have no idea what those numbers, or fewer-longer trips mean. Anyways, Will needs to do the research and make his choice. My opinion is that Tiguan seems like a good choice, because I haven't read or heard anything that says it isn't. RAV4s and CRVs (but not new, lol) are good choices too.
Quote from: Rockraven on February 02, 2019, 12:43:45 PM
Again, context. I have no idea what those numbers, or fewer-longer trips mean. Anyways, Will needs to do the research and make his choice. My opinion is that Tiguan seems like a good choice, because I haven't read or heard anything that says it isn't. RAV4s and CRVs (but not new, lol) are good choices too.
More trips = more trips to the shop to fix things. Numbers are, I believe, number of unique owners/vehicles being reported.
Obviously, a small sample size. Also, people tend to be more vocal when they have issues/complaints than when they are satisfied, so that introduces some bias into the equation. "No news is good news" is often true when determining what is a good car.
The headliner fabric is collapsing in the rear of my friend's Mk5 Jetta, so sitting in the back seat kind of feels like being in a tent.
When reviewing cars they do mention cup holders but it doesn't factor into reliability. You might be thinking of JD Power. Also did you know that the Passat has above average reliability and they have several Audi models with the same rating? They also recommend several BMW and Audi models over Acura and Lexus (both in subjective and quality areas). Again they're not perfect but I feel of the available publications and sources, CR seems to be pretty unbiased.
Quote from: Rockraven on February 02, 2019, 12:29:59 PM
Yes, some are, and some are far longer. Everyone here takes CR with a healthy dose of salt. One of the "flaws" they track is quantity and size of cupholders. They've also repeatedly based their predicted reliability scores on other, older models of the same marque.
Quote from: Rockraven on February 02, 2019, 12:43:45 PM
Again, context. I have no idea what those numbers, or fewer-longer trips mean. Anyways, Will needs to do the research and make his choice. My opinion is that Tiguan seems like a good choice, because I haven't read or heard anything that says it isn't. RAV4s and CRVs (but not new, lol) are good choices too.
:confused:
You have 2 big data sources and a lot of anecdotes pointing to the Tiguan not being a good car. I think you've made your mind up and ignore anything that doesn't jive with your beliefs.
V6 RAV4 is the correct answer
The HRV was available with a manual and AWD for like a year I think, maybe the CX5 too? But at a 10K budget, I think the manual trans requirement should be scrapped and focus on the other stuff.
Quote from: 12,000 RPM on February 03, 2019, 06:06:44 AM
:confused:
You have 2 big data sources and a lot of anecdotes pointing to the Tiguan not being a good car. I think you've made your mind up and ignore anything that doesn't jive with your beliefs.
V6 RAV4 is the correct answer
:confused:
They were 2 snapshots, no idea where from, that showed numbers without telling me what the numbers meant.
The link I posted, from Cars.com, showed 42 owner reviews with a 4.5/5 average.
V6 Rav4 is overkill for 3-mile stop-n-go commute. Actually, V6 Rav4 is overkill for anything.
I'd go with a Matrix/Vibe, but that is probably way under $10k.
Quote from: Rockraven on February 03, 2019, 07:58:03 AM
:confused:
They were 2 snapshots, no idea where from, that showed numbers without telling me what the numbers meant.
The link I posted, from Cars.com, showed 42 owner reviews with a 4.5/5 average.
Positive write-ups on 2-month-old cars aren't a good gauge. TrueDelta tracks longer term ownership. The track number of trips to the dealer/shop for repairs. The also report data on the nature of the repairs (engine, transmission, suspension, body/trim, electrical), cost of repairs, and you can browse right to the specific details of the repairs (symptoms, what was replaced/repaired, cost, and vehicle mileage). So you can see if the stuff that goes wrong is the big deal, $$$$, call a tow truck kind of issues or niggling stuff that's cheap and easy to fix and doesn't prevent the car from being driven.
The rate of repair on the Tig, per TrueDelta, is over 1.5x the average for all vehicles reported on their site. You only get a handful of free views before they force you to subscribe, but when I pulled up the breakdown on the 2012. Majority of issues reported were engine related (fuel pump seemed common).
Quote from: Eye of the Tiger on February 03, 2019, 08:15:22 AM
V6 Rav4 is overkill for 3-mile stop-n-go commute. Actually, V6 Rav4 is overkill for anything.
I'd go with a Matrix/Vibe, but that is probably way under $10k.
i iz getting old. This is not just commute but anytime wife and I want to go anywhere without needed 5 seats behind us... Like longer road trips too. Again the objective is upright seating, or I'd be grabbing some awesome wagon action first. I'll probably go sit in a few (Carmax or something?) just to see if something like Matrix/ mazda5 might be doable, but...
Quote from: AutobahnSHO on February 03, 2019, 09:55:32 AM
i iz getting old. This is not just commute but anytime wife and I want to go anywhere without needed 5 seats behind us... Like longer road trips too. Again the objective is upright seating, or I'd be grabbing some awesome wagon action first. I'll probably go sit in a few (Carmax or something?) just to see if something like Matrix/ mazda5 might be doable, but...
Old people love Highlanders, and you can get those with the 4 cylinder. Very upright and roomy seating.
Quote from: Eye of the Tiger on February 03, 2019, 09:58:07 AM
Old people love Highlanders, and you can get those with the 4 cylinder. Very upright and roomy seating.
Worse gas mileage than Rav4 or CR-V. Don't need the space- we will be keeping minivan.
Quote from: Rockraven on February 03, 2019, 07:58:03 AM
:confused:
They were 2 snapshots, no idea where from, that showed numbers without telling me what the numbers meant.
The link I posted, from Cars.com, showed 42 owner reviews with a 4.5/5 average.
TrueDelta and CR draw from a much bigger sample pool with much more robust methodologies.
Like I said you're formed an opinion and ignore any data that doesn't jive, vs seeking out the data to form an opinion. Not a good way to approach this IMO
Quote from: 12,000 RPM on February 03, 2019, 12:16:45 PM
TrueDelta and CR draw from a much bigger sample pool with much more robust methodologies.
Like I said you're formed an opinion and ignore any data that doesn't jive, vs seeking out the data to form an opinion. Not a good way to approach this IMO
I. DIDN'T. KNOW. WHERE. THE . PICS. WERE. FROM. BUT. I. DID. LOOK. AT. OTHER. DATA. AND. FORMED. THE. OPINION. THAT. THE. TIGUAN. IS. STILL. A. DECENT. OPTION.
THE. CRV. AND. RAV4. ARE. SAFE. BUT. MORE. EXPENSIVE. OPTIONS. BUT. THERE'S. MORE. OUT. THERE. THAT. ARE. GOOD. TOO. JFC. MAYBE. WE. SHOULD. ALL. JUST. BUY. THE. ALMIGHTY. FUCKING. CRV. OR. RAV4.
FUCK. If I didn't hate the CRV and RAV4 before, I do now. :lol:
WHAT. IF. TOYONDA. MADE. A. CRAV-4.
PERFECTION.
Quote from: Eye of the Tiger on February 03, 2019, 12:55:03 PM
WHAT. IF. TOYONDA. MADE. A. CRAV-4.
PERFECTION.
It would be the best vehicle evar. Best seats, best power, best cargo volume, best cupholders, best sunvisors, best appreciation, best as it gets older, just best.
There are other good options besides the RAV-4 and CR-V. It just so happens the Tiguan isn't one of them. :lol: Don't let your CRAV-4 hate cloud your judgment. ;)
$10,998, 6-speed emmanual, big sunroof, some kind of AWD system, apparently, MPG 25/31.
Have you tried a Mini Cooper? The seating is upright and comfortable. Very good ergo all around. Now, I haven't personally sat in the Countryman, but I imagine it is even more upright and roomy.
(https://images2.autotrader.com/hn/c/7a67919abf1848cbaff8ec349adb45f4.jpg)
https://www.autotrader.com/cars-for-sale/vehicledetails.xhtml?listingId=505126506
Reliability? Don't ask, don't tell. It has low miles.
Quote from: AutobahnSHO on February 01, 2019, 03:43:16 PM
The MT is a long shot, I think only the Forester and maybe CX-5 had them? Not super concerned with that.
I really really want sunroof and wife will really really want AWD.
I really love the panorama roof available on Forester, but the chain on the CR-V and RAV4 is very appealing...
Chain is nice, unless you have to have it changed. That can get quite expensive..
Used Prius. Deadly dull super-reliable commuting appliance.
Quote from: Eye of the Tiger on February 03, 2019, 02:56:37 PM
$10,998, 6-speed emmanual, big sunroof, some kind of AWD system, apparently, MPG 25/31.
Have you tried a Mini Cooper? The seating is upright and comfortable. Very good ergo all around. Now, I haven't personally sat in the Countryman, but I imagine it is even more upright and roomy.
(https://images2.autotrader.com/hn/c/7a67919abf1848cbaff8ec349adb45f4.jpg)
https://www.autotrader.com/cars-for-sale/vehicledetails.xhtml?listingId=505126506
Reliability? Don't ask, don't tell. It has low miles.
Not a CRV4, ergo it's junk.
Quote from: Rockraven on February 03, 2019, 03:47:29 PM
Not a CRV4, ergo it's junk.
Actually, ERGO it's junk.
(https://newworld.be/images/projects/1338541392_283011_256258761054760_256244464389523_1205400_348990_n.jpg)
:lol:
Saw a Murano 'vert this afternoon :mask:
Quote from: AutobahnSHO on February 03, 2019, 04:33:32 PM
Saw a Murano 'vert this afternoon :mask:
Has your back injury turned you into a 50 year old woman?
Quote from: MX793 on February 03, 2019, 05:07:50 PM
Has your back injury turned you into a 50 year old woman?
:cry:
The most amusing thing about seeing a Murano convertible isn't the car itself; it's that someone bought it. New. From a dealership. With money.
Quote from: MX793 on February 03, 2019, 05:07:50 PM
Has your back injury turned you into a 50 year old woman?
:lol:
Nissan Murano Convertible
The Official Vehicle of Menopause
Proud Sponsor of the National Osteoperosis Foundation
Red Hat Discount!
Nissan has more motorsport credibility than many other companies, which is of utmost importance in this segment.
The Murano CrossCabriolet is a masterpiece, honestly. Where else can you find a vehicle that so masterfully draws on the heritage of open top sports cars like the original Fairlady and F30 Leopard, off road legends like the Pathfinder and Patrol, and mainstream marvels like an Enterprise spec Altima? Channeling 240HP from the legendary VQ35 to all four wheels... the Murano CrossCabriolet delivers a driving experience that simply remains unparalleled.
:lol: it does check a couple boxes...... :mask:
Quote from: Eye of the Tiger on February 03, 2019, 05:16:04 PM
:lol:
Nissan Murano Convertible
The Official Vehicle of Menopause
Proud Sponsor of the National Osteoperosis Foundation
Red Hat Discount!
I wonder what the Red Hat society thinks of MAGA red hats interfering with their namesake brand,
Look at Wizard's Passat RIP thread for some VWinspiration.
Same engine as the Tiguan :mask:
"I know a guy who...."
I owned a few VW/Audi cars and haven't had any significant issues (actually no issues with my current VW)...that being said I wouldn't recommend the brand to someone looking for solid/no hassle ownership. I mean...you might get lucky and it might be fine, but statistically speaking you are more likely to have mechanical and/or electrical issues in a VW car. I own the car i do because it is and was a relatively unique mixture of AWD/Manual/Small (and Hatchback). I think at the time only the Ford Focus RS was available in a similar package but it was still brand new and dealers were only selling them with markups (and no test drives).
2011/12 Escape V6 Duratec, 6spd auto, awd, traditional styling. Safe, roomy, runs forever. Avoid the Mazda sourced I4, valve lash noises, but seems to run okay. Comfortable seats. None of the import or Euro idiosyncrasies. Good old domestic best bang for the buck. Top model should be well within your range of dollars.
Quote from: FoMoJo on February 04, 2019, 02:03:19 PM
2011/12 Escape V6 Duratec, 6spd auto, awd, traditional styling. Safe, roomy, runs forever. Avoid the Mazda sourced I4, valve lash noises, but seems to run okay. Comfortable seats. None of the import or Euro idiosyncrasies. Good old domestic best bang for the buck. Top model should be well within your range of dollars.
Yeah I need to check them out. Never been in one. I pointed one out to wifey, she's cool with them.
Quote from: AutobahnSHO on February 04, 2019, 02:31:15 PM
Yeah I need to check them out. Never been in one. I pointed one out to wifey, she's cool with them.
There is also a hybrid version that is, reportedly, very reliable as well. Those used as NYC taxis reportedly have the highest mileage on them. Likely, the best mileage as well. 2012 is the last year of the 'traditional' design. Don't know much about the replatformed ones. For the amount of money that you're willing to spend, you can likely get one with all the bells and whistles available.
Escape of that era isn't a bad option, that's for sure.
They used the hybrids as NYC cabs so that speaks to their durability
They are tight AF inside though... def keep the Odyssey for long trips
So I got a foam/gel pillow and I was driving Impreza to work last week without discomfort. It's weird sitting up so much higher though (about 2in).
Odyssey was getting only 16.3mpgeez so when I fill up at the end of this week I'm excited to see what Impreza gets doing the same 8to4 grind...
We're going to save up for now. Got moving moneyz and tax refund filed, we'll have a nice little car egg.
PLUS started Roth IRA for wife and dropped a clam into one for me.