Tesla

Started by SJ_GTI, February 23, 2017, 07:11:02 AM

giant_mtb

Quote from: Laconian on November 09, 2018, 12:17:46 PM
I thought panels were painted by dipping panels in big electrostatically charged buckets?

No, they do go through dips to clean/prep them, but they are hung/suspended/whatever and travel through painting tunnels with robotic arms that spray the charged panels.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Kamz8MA3DEw

FoMoJo

Quote from: Laconian on November 09, 2018, 12:17:46 PM
I thought panels were painted by dipping panels in big electrostatically charged buckets?
I though only the primer was applied that way.
"The only reason for time is so that everything doesn't happen at once." ~ Albert Einstein
"As the saying goes, when you mix science and politics, you get politics."

12,000 RPM

Man looks like they really fixed the track longevity issue

https://youtu.be/c6Gm_Xv3f3Y?t=146

Lightning Lap 2019 killer?
Protecctor of the Atmospheric Engine #TheyLiedToUs

Laconian

So weird how quietly that car just devours the track...
Kia EV6 GT-Line / MX-5 RF 6MT

2o6


giant_mtb


12,000 RPM

Quote from: 2o6 on November 11, 2018, 12:20:08 AM
So y'all are pro Tesla now? 🤔
I don't think anyone has been anti-Tesla CARS, just Elon Musk
Protecctor of the Atmospheric Engine #TheyLiedToUs

CaminoRacer

Quote from: 12,000 RPM on November 11, 2018, 05:47:01 AM
I don't think anyone has been anti-Tesla CARS, just Elon Musk


I'm not even entirely anti-Musk. He just talks too much and promises too many things.

I like most of what Tesla is doing. I think they're trying to change too many things for the sake of change though. Like having literally everything be controlled through the giant iPad, the gullwing doors on the X, etc.
2020 BMW 330i, 1969 El Camino, 2017 Bolt EV

MrH

I'm anti Elon. He's a fucking fraudster, top to bottom.
2023 Ford Lightning Lariat ER
2019 Acura RDX SH-AWD
2023 BRZ Limited

Previous: '02 Mazda Protege5, '08 Mazda Miata, '05 Toyota Tacoma, '09 Honda Element, '13 Subaru BRZ, '14 Hyundai Genesis R-Spec 5.0, '15 Toyota 4Runner SR5, '18 Honda Accord EX-L 2.0t, '01 Honda S2000, '20 Subaru Outback XT, '23 Chevy Bolt EUV

93JC

I just can't stand the Tesla/Elon acolytes and their bullshit.

I have nothing against electric cars—I've done the math and it is very compelling—but the hyperbole from the fanbois would have you believe that any electric car that isn't a Tesla is a colossal turd for a myriad of reasons that boil down to "because it's not a Tesla". I don't like that kind of bullshit.

I like the idea of the Tesla sales model, selling directly to consumers for a fixed non-negotiable price with no hidden fees and other such bullshit endemic to sales at dealerships. I don't like that the sales model is predicated on putting down big deposits years in advance, and when it is finally being built the actual cost is grossly inflated from the promised cost.

I don't like the gewgaws like "Falcon doors", and I'll never get past the execrable touchscreen controls for eeeeeverything.

93JC

https://electrek.co/2018/11/14/tesla-model-3-cold-weather-flaws/


QuoteElectrek received several reports from local Model 3 owners having issues with their door handles, windows, and charge ports over the last few days.

The door handles of the Model 3 are embedded inside the door and you need to press on one side for it to pop out and pull on it.

Once you pull, the window slides down slightly and enables you to open the door.

With the cold, several owners are reporting that the door handles are extremely hard to pop out and when they do, the window doesn't always come down.

:facepalm:

Laconian

Kia EV6 GT-Line / MX-5 RF 6MT

MrH

It's almost like this is the result of a company that has no design standards or validation :huh:
2023 Ford Lightning Lariat ER
2019 Acura RDX SH-AWD
2023 BRZ Limited

Previous: '02 Mazda Protege5, '08 Mazda Miata, '05 Toyota Tacoma, '09 Honda Element, '13 Subaru BRZ, '14 Hyundai Genesis R-Spec 5.0, '15 Toyota 4Runner SR5, '18 Honda Accord EX-L 2.0t, '01 Honda S2000, '20 Subaru Outback XT, '23 Chevy Bolt EUV

MX793

#2353
Quote from: 93JC on November 15, 2018, 10:50:39 AM
https://electrek.co/2018/11/14/tesla-model-3-cold-weather-flaws/


:facepalm:

To be fair, I've encountered similar "clearly the designer doesn't live where it's cold/snowy" design features on a number of new cars.  Windshield washer nozzles buried down under the hood in a place where snow/slush/water can collect and freeze into a solid block, plugging the nozzles, if a car is parked outside is a big pet peeve.  Driving in winter with non-functional washer nozzles is like driving without wipers.

Cars with frameless side windows that slightly lower the window when you open the door are all problematic in winter because these can freeze and the upper lip that the glass tucks into, while somewhat compliant in warm weather, hardens in freezing temps.  Makes it difficult to open the door and near impossible to close properly until things thaw out.  In the case of recent Mustangs, Ford put a stupid trough at the base of the window that collects ice and is impossible to clean out with a normal scraper.
Needs more Jiggawatts

2016 Ford Mustang GTPP / 2011 Toyota Rav4 Base AWD / 2014 Kawasaki Ninja 1000 ABS
1992 Nissan 240SX Fastback / 2004 Mazda Mazda3s / 2011 Ford Mustang V6 Premium / 2007 Suzuki GSF1250SA Bandit / 2006 VW Jetta 2.5

giant_mtb

If you haven't had to use your door to communicate at the drive-thru because your window was frozen shut, you haven't lived!

2o6

I said that the model 3's doorhandles were bad design from day one and y'all yelled at me

CaminoRacer

Another one of those things that Tesla didn't have to reimagine to be have a kick-ass electric car, but they decided they had to DISRUPT EVERYTHING.
2020 BMW 330i, 1969 El Camino, 2017 Bolt EV

MX793

Didn't Aston or Jag do similar, pop out handles?  And then you have the touch-activated latches on newer Corvettes (a design that has actually gotten someone killed).
Needs more Jiggawatts

2016 Ford Mustang GTPP / 2011 Toyota Rav4 Base AWD / 2014 Kawasaki Ninja 1000 ABS
1992 Nissan 240SX Fastback / 2004 Mazda Mazda3s / 2011 Ford Mustang V6 Premium / 2007 Suzuki GSF1250SA Bandit / 2006 VW Jetta 2.5

BimmerM3

Quote from: MrH on November 15, 2018, 11:33:52 AM
It's almost like this is the result of a company that has no design standards or validation :huh:

I think you could just as easily make the argument that the majority of their target market cares more about either the environmental advantages of owning an EV and/or having the latest-and-greatest tech rather than having a 100% problem-free vehicle, and Musk&Co is aware of that. It was certainly true to some extent for production delays - the three people I know who pre-ordered Model 3s all expected the delays and actually received their vehicles earlier than they initially expected to despite being later than the official estimates from when they put their deposit down.

MrH

Quote from: MX793 on November 15, 2018, 11:51:09 AM
Didn't Aston or Jag do similar, pop out handles?  And then you have the touch-activated latches on newer Corvettes (a design that has actually gotten someone killed).

The corvette has manual releases on the floor if the electronic latch were to fail.  Something the Model 3 rear doors or trunks don't have.
2023 Ford Lightning Lariat ER
2019 Acura RDX SH-AWD
2023 BRZ Limited

Previous: '02 Mazda Protege5, '08 Mazda Miata, '05 Toyota Tacoma, '09 Honda Element, '13 Subaru BRZ, '14 Hyundai Genesis R-Spec 5.0, '15 Toyota 4Runner SR5, '18 Honda Accord EX-L 2.0t, '01 Honda S2000, '20 Subaru Outback XT, '23 Chevy Bolt EUV

2o6

Quote from: BimmerM3 on November 15, 2018, 11:53:32 AM
I think you could just as easily make the argument that the majority of their target market cares more about either the environmental advantages of owning an EV and/or having the latest-and-greatest tech rather than having a 100% problem-free vehicle, and Musk&Co is aware of that. It was certainly true to some extent for production delays - the three people I know who pre-ordered Model 3s all expected the delays and actually received their vehicles earlier than they initially expected to despite being later than the official estimates from when they put their deposit down.


I've argued till I was blue in the face that a lot of Tesla design decisions would have been laughed out in a freshman design 101 class. You can have your cake and eat it too.

2o6

Example: I woke up to freezing rain this morning and my car coated in ice. How the hell would I have gotten in my car if it was a model 3?

Its things like that that tell me their industrial design department and user experience people didn't consider anything beyond what looks cool in a sketch.

BimmerM3

Quote from: 2o6 on November 15, 2018, 11:58:53 AM

I've argued till I was blue in the face that a lot of Tesla design decisions would have been laughed out in a freshman design 101 class. You can have your cake and eat it too.

TBH, I was largely playing Devil's Advocate there, but I guess my overall point is that despite all these problems, buyers don't seem to care a whole lot and Tesla keeps exceeding expectations financially. Earlier this year, a bunch of experts were saying that they'd be bankrupt by now, but they've become profitable and appear to be stronger than ever.

2o6

We shall see. I wouldn't be surprised if they suddenly flip to unprofitable again. The internet has a tendency to make very recent developments feel like long-standing trends. And make blunders sound as if they happened years ago. That $420 BS was only like three months ago.

MrH

Quote from: BimmerM3 on November 15, 2018, 12:09:33 PM
TBH, I was largely playing Devil's Advocate there, but I guess my overall point is that despite all these problems, buyers don't seem to care a whole lot and Tesla keeps exceeding expectations financially. Earlier this year, a bunch of experts were saying that they'd be bankrupt by now, but they've become profitable and appear to be stronger than ever.

There's a million indications there is some serious fraud going on.  Until DOJ and SEC probes close, no charges are filed, and they continue to post profits, there's still a massive, massive probability they go bankrupt.
2023 Ford Lightning Lariat ER
2019 Acura RDX SH-AWD
2023 BRZ Limited

Previous: '02 Mazda Protege5, '08 Mazda Miata, '05 Toyota Tacoma, '09 Honda Element, '13 Subaru BRZ, '14 Hyundai Genesis R-Spec 5.0, '15 Toyota 4Runner SR5, '18 Honda Accord EX-L 2.0t, '01 Honda S2000, '20 Subaru Outback XT, '23 Chevy Bolt EUV

12,000 RPM

Quote from: BimmerM3 on November 15, 2018, 11:53:32 AM
I think you could just as easily make the argument that the majority of their target market cares more about either the environmental advantages of owning an EV and/or having the latest-and-greatest tech rather than having a 100% problem-free vehicle, and Musk&Co is aware of that. It was certainly true to some extent for production delays - the three people I know who pre-ordered Model 3s all expected the delays and actually received their vehicles earlier than they initially expected to despite being later than the official estimates from when they put their deposit down.
When it comes to tech, latest is not necessarily the greatest. See: Honda's walk of shame on volume controls
Protecctor of the Atmospheric Engine #TheyLiedToUs

MX793

Quote from: MrH on November 15, 2018, 11:58:41 AM
The corvette has manual releases on the floor if the electronic latch were to fail.  Something the Model 3 rear doors or trunks don't have.

True, and for that, I give Chevy the nod for a superior design.  But in a panic (like your car is on fire, or sinking in a body of water), how many people are going to remember that there's an emergency release hidden on the floor of the car?  It's still not a great design done for questionable benefit.  Change for the sake of change is not always a good thing.
Needs more Jiggawatts

2016 Ford Mustang GTPP / 2011 Toyota Rav4 Base AWD / 2014 Kawasaki Ninja 1000 ABS
1992 Nissan 240SX Fastback / 2004 Mazda Mazda3s / 2011 Ford Mustang V6 Premium / 2007 Suzuki GSF1250SA Bandit / 2006 VW Jetta 2.5

12,000 RPM

I could have sworn a guy died because he didn't know his Corvette didn't have a secret door handle.

Personally the Model 3's door handles are a deal breaker. God forbid you have your kid in the back, lose power (or a fire starts) and you need to get them out. All disruption is not good
Protecctor of the Atmospheric Engine #TheyLiedToUs

MX793

Quote from: 12,000 RPM on November 15, 2018, 02:11:20 PM
I could have sworn a guy died because he didn't know his Corvette didn't have a secret door handle.

Personally the Model 3's door handles are a deal breaker. God forbid you have your kid in the back, lose power (or a fire starts) and you need to get them out. All disruption is not good

Yes.  An elderly gentleman in Texas died of heat stroke after his car had an electrical failure and he wasn't aware there was an emergency release handle.
Needs more Jiggawatts

2016 Ford Mustang GTPP / 2011 Toyota Rav4 Base AWD / 2014 Kawasaki Ninja 1000 ABS
1992 Nissan 240SX Fastback / 2004 Mazda Mazda3s / 2011 Ford Mustang V6 Premium / 2007 Suzuki GSF1250SA Bandit / 2006 VW Jetta 2.5

BimmerM3

Quote from: 12,000 RPM on November 15, 2018, 01:47:13 PM
When it comes to tech, latest is not necessarily the greatest. See: Honda's walk of shame on volume controls

True, but that doesn't change the fact that A LOT of people perceive Tesla as having the latest and greatest tech. I'd also argue that volume controls are UX not tech, but I suppose that's beside the point.