***Today's Shoot: Hyundai Nexo vs Hyundai Kona E***

[cawimmer430]

Today's shoot for Focus SUV Magazine: the Hyundai Nexo (Fuel Cell) and Hyundai Kona E (Electric Car).


Unedited out-of-camera RAW-converted-to-JPEG shot.




And yeah, during and after the shoot I was able to test drive both cars on the long runway and do a few "laps". This is the first time in my life that I drove and experienced both a pure EV and a Fuel Cell vehicle. Here my impressions.






Short video of me driving the Hyundai Nexo for the first time.

www.youtube.com/watch?v=xuwY_wAgcBs




KONA E (Electric Car)

Decent interior quality. Not cheap or overtly premium in feel, just decent with great build quality. Very roomy interior and comfortable seating position.

Smooth, quiet and quick acceleration and obviously instant torque. It's a "slow" car (0-100 km/h in under 10 seconds) but it feels faster because of the instant torque and smooth acceleration.

Decent steering feedback and a well-balanced suspension. Not overly sporty, but not vague either.

I could feel the weight balance due to the placement of the batteries in the vehicle's floor region.

On the downside, the range went down when you turned on heating. The car was relatively fully charged and when I drove it had a range of 410 km (max range at full batteries is 460 km) - but when you turned on the heater (it was a cold and rainy day), the range went down from 410 km to 360 km. That's 50 km that just went missing!










NEXO (Fuel Cell)

Decent interior quality. Not cheap or overtly premium in feel, just decent with great build quality. Very roomy interior and comfortable seating position.

Again, smooth, quiet and quick acceleration and obviously instant torque. Like the Kona E, it's not blisteringly fast but it feels fast due to the instant torque.

Decent steering feedback and a well-balanced suspension. Not overly sporty, but not vague either. Drove pretty similar to the Kona E despite being larger.

The hydrogen tank was pretty much 90% full, and the car had a range in excess of 460 km.





















Verdict? Despite these cars being nothing special in terms of how they drove, I found them surprisingly both fun to drive. There really wasn't a big difference between them. They more or less had the same steering and suspension feel and felt similar the way they drove. I found the Kona E, the EV, to be slightly, just slightly more responsive when you hammered it.

One thing that really unnerved me in both cars was the silence. It's something that most of us are used to, but I like hearing my engine make noise. The silence in both cars was a very unnerving feeling; I found it also somewhat distracting ("Huh, where's the engine noise!?"). It's definitely something you need to get used to. Other than that I had no issues adjusting to driving an EV or Fuel Cell car. What I also liked was how both cars would slow down so much when you took your foot off the accelerator, but you quickly get used to it. So, I had fun today.

Which one would I take? Hmmm... I'm all about range and quick refueling, so for now the Nexo wins. I really hope that in the future EVs will have more range and quicker charging times. Then I could see myself actually owning one.

[FoMoJo]

Nice review.  I really surprised that Hyundai has a fairly advanced fuel cell programme.

[cawimmer430]

Nice review.  I really surprised that Hyundai has a fairly advanced fuel cell programme.

The Japanese and South Koreans are betting on hydrogen whereas the Europeans and Americans seem to focus on EVs.

Daimler has a fuel cell program (B-Class F-Cell and GLC F-Cell) and to my knowledge are investing in both EVs and fuel cell cars.


Why is nobody focusing on synthetic CO2-free fuels? IMO this is a suitable alternative and can use the existing infrastructure. Excess energy from renewable energy sources can be diverted to a nearby synthetic fuel plant...

[Galaxy]

Why is nobody focusing on synthetic CO2-free fuels? IMO this is a suitable alternative and can use the existing infrastructure. Excess energy from renewable energy sources can be diverted to a nearby synthetic fuel plant...

Because that still produces local pollutants when it is burned. Even a hydrogen combustion engine produces NOx because it reacts with nitrogen in the air.

[cawimmer430]

Because that still produces local pollutants when it is burned. Even a hydrogen combustion engine produces NOx because it reacts with nitrogen in the air.

And those pollutants can probably easy be dealt with with the correct and improved catalytic converters. Right? 

All forms of mobility will have an ecological footprint somewhere. It's unavoidable [for now].

[BimmerM3]

The Japanese and South Koreans are betting on hydrogen whereas the Europeans and Americans seem to focus on EVs.

Daimler has a fuel cell program (B-Class F-Cell and GLC F-Cell) and to my knowledge are investing in both EVs and fuel cell cars.


Why is nobody focusing on synthetic CO2-free fuels? IMO this is a suitable alternative and can use the existing infrastructure. Excess energy from renewable energy sources can be diverted to a nearby synthetic fuel plant...

There are people who are focusing on it. Just not automakers because it's not as production-ready as EV tech. It might be able to use some of the existing infrastructure as far as fueling stations and whatnot go, but the infrastructure of actually producing those fuels at a reasonable cost doesn't exist.

[Laconian]

Hauling around two tons of metal is going to cost no matter what. People need to ride bikes or ebikes more

[cawimmer430]

...but the infrastructure of actually producing those fuels at a reasonable cost doesn't exist.

Not yet.

But I am hoping it will exist in the future. I'm sold on the idea of using cleaner synthetic high energy density fuels, and I am sure chemists and engineers will be able to engineer a cleaner formula and cleaner combustion respectively.

[93JC]

The Japanese and South Koreans are betting on hydrogen whereas the Europeans and Americans seem to focus on EVs.

Point of clarification: fuel cell vehicles are also electric. They just use the fuel cell to generate electricity, rather than using a battery to store it.

[Laconian]

I'm jealous! I would love to try a fuel cell car, myself.

[cawimmer430]

Point of clarification: fuel cell vehicles are also electric. They just use the fuel cell to generate electricity, rather than using a battery to store it.

Yep, I am aware of that.

One thing I forgot to mention was that the heater blower was also on in the Nexo - and its range stayed steady at 455 km+. In the electric Kona E the range went down from 410 to 360 km when you turned on the blower. That alone pushes me towards the Nexo, also because the refueling aspect is shorter.

[cawimmer430]

I'm jealous! I would love to try a fuel cell car, myself.

There was hardly a difference. If you've driven a pure EV car the Nexo feels and drives just like one. There's a bit of a "swoosh" sound when you turn it on but then it's quiet and drives like an EV. It's funny but I found pretty much zero difference in the way the Kona E and the Nexo drove. They literally drove and felt the same.

[93JC]

They probably have exactly the same motor.

[cawimmer430]

They probably have exactly the same motor.

Could be. The only real difference I experienced was the "swoosh" sound of the Nexo upon starting, and I did feel that the Kona E was slightly, just slightly, a little more responsive. Maybe it's because it weighed less.

[Morris Minor]

Late to this one. But nice job with the review Christian.

I only have an O-Level in chemistry, but don't you need to go through a whole energy-consuming process to pry hydrogen apart from whatever molecule it's in?  It's not like we can send people down hydrogen mines.

Then I guess you have to compress it & store it & distribute it.

[cawimmer430]

Late to this one. But nice job with the review Christian.

I only have an O-Level in chemistry, but don't you need to go through a whole energy-consuming process to pry hydrogen apart from whatever molecule it's in?  It's not like we can send people down hydrogen mines.

Then I guess you have to compress it & store it & distribute it.

Glad you liked it. 

[veeman]

The fuel cell car, while in theory a great idea, is not going to work in the USA.  There are literally no hydrogen refueling pumps outside of California and that entire state has something like 60 of them total, all in southern cal or the Bay Area.  The cost of fuel is very high (2.5 times the equivalent cost of gasoline) and therefore needs to be very heavily subsidized. 

[Galaxy]

The fuel cell car, while in theory a great idea, is not going to work in the USA.  There are literally no hydrogen refueling pumps outside of California and that entire state has something like 60 of them total, all in southern cal or the Bay Area.  The cost of fuel is very high (2.5 times the equivalent cost of gasoline) and therefore needs to be very heavily subsidized. 

Any alternative fuel source is going to be expensive to begin with because the infrastructure first has to be built. How much do you think petroleum would cost if we were to all buy it at a pharmacy like Bertha Benz?

[cawimmer430]

The fuel cell car, while in theory a great idea, is not going to work in the USA.  There are literally no hydrogen refueling pumps outside of California and that entire state has something like 60 of them total, all in southern cal or the Bay Area.  The cost of fuel is very high (2.5 times the equivalent cost of gasoline) and therefore needs to be very heavily subsidized. 

The cost of producing hydrogen through traditional means is also expensive and energy-intensive here. As far as I am aware there are a few hydrogen production plants in Germany which use excess power from renewable green energy to produce hydrogen. It's production is sufficient to keep up with the current low demand for it.

As interesting as a Fuel Cell car is, I am more interested in these E-Fuels: synthetic CO2-free gasoline and diesel.

[veeman]

Any alternative fuel source is going to be expensive to begin with because the infrastructure first has to be built. How much do you think petroleum would cost if we were to all buy it at a pharmacy like Bertha Benz?

The point is that it's a no go in the USA.  Regardless of the reasons it's 2.5 times the price to drive a given distance and that's not going to change without big subsidies.  The USA has huge infrastructure problems with old bridges and tunnels, subways, and trains and there is absolutely no serious talk for installing thousands of hydrogen fuel pumps across the US.  Electric cars can be charged at home.  Hydrogen fuel cell cars cannot be. 

[Galaxy]

The point is that it's a no go in the USA.  Regardless of the reasons it's 2.5 times the price to drive a given distance and that's not going to change without big subsidies.  The USA has huge infrastructure problems with old bridges and tunnels, subways, and trains and there is absolutely no serious talk for installing thousands of hydrogen fuel pumps across the US.  Electric cars can be charged at home.  Hydrogen fuel cell cars cannot be. 

Fundamentally it is very simple science. Take a glass of tap water, add some table salt, throw in a battery, and voila you are creating hydrogen, albeit in minute quantities. Scaling it up is quite difficult, and liquefying it adds a whole new dimension. Honda was working on a home station, but it is more of a test project.

I do agree that hydrogen is essentially dead in the water with the way battery performance is increasing, the only way I really see the technology catching on is if the battery industry hits a technological barrier.


That is for cars, for other modes of transportation I see a brighter future. Aircraft have a problem with batteries since the weight is a no go, at least beyond a certain size. Hydrogen might play a role here. It should be noted that the first battery powered electric aircraft will soon enter (small/short range) commercial service. An airline in Vancouver is using this technology

https://www.magnix.aero/

to retrofit their combustion powered fleet.

A US airline has ordered this aircraft

https://www.eviation.co/alice/

to fly from Boston to places like Nantucket, and Martha's Vineyard.


For ships, a US University from Florida has developed a device that can create Hydrogen from sea water. That would be nice in combination with the solar energy generating sails that a company from France is developing. Would be nice as a package with electric drive.