Next Z4 Prototype Drive....

[MexicoCityM3]

It looks like it is going to be good....

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vjw5VAmV9bs

[12,000 RPM]

Looks promising. Based on the 2 series, I know there are still people at BMW who know how to make driver's cars.

[Galaxy]

One thing that is starting to annoy me is the trend that companies make concept cars that look like they may be 99% production ready, and then proceed to leave out the most tantalizing parts.

For example the Z4 concept:



That shark nose would have really made the design the design. I'm afraid without it will look more dull.

Audi did the same with the A6/A8.




That additional level to the headlights just ruin the whole design.

[12,000 RPM]

Yea, if they are things that could carry out to production that is annoying.

[Payman]

Oh yeah, is this still happening? This and the Supra are taking so long, my GAF factor has waned, much like the new NSX.

[12,000 RPM]

I'm over the whole new release hype cycle. Everyone forgets about everything after like a month tops. Only cars that really hold my interest now are cars I can actually afford.

[MrH]

This will probably be $60k+.  Yeah, does nothing for me.  I can't justify that much on a fun car.

[MX793]

One thing that is starting to annoy me is the trend that companies make concept cars that look like they may be 99% production ready, and then proceed to leave out the most tantalizing parts.

For example the Z4 concept:



That shark nose would have really made the design the design. I'm afraid without it will look more dull.

Audi did the same with the A6/A8.




That additional level to the headlights just ruin the whole design.

The completely different greenhouse shape plays a big part as well.

Reminds me of the Subaru WRX concept from 2013 when Subaru said they were breaking the WRX off from the Impreza line and making it a unique model instead of a trim level.  It was really sleek and got enthusiasts really excited.  Then we got the all new 2015 WRX and it was... an Impreza with a more agressive body kit just like the previous generation.

[Raza]

This will probably be $60k+.  Yeah, does nothing for me.  I can't justify that much on a fun car.

Sigh.

[12,000 RPM]

What is a reasonable point of entry for a fun car, and could such a thing be produced new?

I could probably spend (another) $20K on something like an Exocet Miata to drive for the rest of my life.

[Raza]

What is a reasonable point of entry for a fun car, and could such a thing be produced new?

I could probably spend (another) $20K on something like an Exocet Miata to drive for the rest of my life.

How much does an MX-5 or BRZ/FRS cost? Average around $30K?

[HurricaneSteve]

I got mine brand new for 22.4K but that's the Sport (base) model. Club, Grand Touring and RF versions are all closer to 30K.

How much does an MX-5 or BRZ/FRS cost? Average around $30K?

[12,000 RPM]

How much does an MX-5 or BRZ/FRS cost? Average around $30K?

That's about right.

[Laconian]

I got mine brand new for 22.4K but that's the Sport (base) model. Club, Grand Touring and RF versions are all closer to 30K.

Oh neat, another ND owner. Yeee

[Raza]

That's about right.

I imagine that, give or take, is the bare minimum. Gone are the days of 22K 350Zs.

[HurricaneSteve]

Haha that's right. You live in the Seattle area, right? So you would know how much smaller cars make life easier in the city I'd imagine. I briefly considered other cars (Mustang, Camaro, BRZ/86, WRX) but at the end of the day I needed a car that would fit in the garage and anything larger than the Miata wouldn't work. I also couldn't justify paying 32K for a weekend toy (RF) so when the local Mazda dealership offered me a great price on the Sport model I took it. Hope you're enjoying your RF!

Oh neat, another ND owner. Yeee

[Galaxy]

This will probably be $60k+.  Yeah, does nothing for me.  I can't justify that much on a fun car.

For the last Z4 $60.000+ was a loaded model. For the new one maybe add $1.000.

Average sales price should be more around ~$45.000.

[Laconian]

Love it, but wish I lived in an area with less traffic so I could drive it more! I live close enough to my job that it's accruing miles at a glacial pace - 3,500 over the past 1.5 years. Poor Miata!

$32k is a lot for a Miata but the RF is such a stunner in person..

[12,000 RPM]

For the last Z4 $60.000+ was a loaded model. For the new one maybe add $1.000.

Average sales price should be more around ~$45.000.

I'm guessing they're ditching the 4 banger which should move prices up. Or maybe not, who knows

In any case I think it's going to be a lot more expensive than $1K more on average

[MX793]

I'm guessing they're ditching the 4 banger which should move prices up. Or maybe not, who knows

In any case I think it's going to be a lot more expensive than $1K more on average

Fairly certain the turbo-4 is still slated as the base engine.

[MrH]

What is a reasonable point of entry for a fun car, and could such a thing be produced new?

I could probably spend (another) $20K on something like an Exocet Miata to drive for the rest of my life.

$30k is probably the limit for me.  Maybe that'll move up as I get older and make more, but yeah.  The Miata is pretty much the only new "fun" car that fits the bill.  At this point, I'm committed to the two car strategy for myself, which quickly prices things like this out of my budget.

[12,000 RPM]

Non sports cars are getting so damn good as well. Crossovers and hybrids are putting down the numbers of high performance cars of just like 10 years ago... with better gas mileage. Ironically I feel like most people who want sports cars don't really care about face peeling performance.

[MX793]

Non sports cars are getting so damn good as well. Crossovers and hybrids are putting down the numbers of high performance cars of just like 10 years ago... with better gas mileage. Ironically I feel like most people who want sports cars don't really care about face peeling performance.

There's so much more to it than the numbers, though.  The experience is completely difference.  For starters, sitting lower to the ground increases the sensation of speed.  Then there's the weight factor and it's effect on tactile sensation of what the vehicle is doing.

[12,000 RPM]

There's so much more to it than the numbers, though.  The experience is completely difference.  For starters, sitting lower to the ground increases the sensation of speed.  Then there's the weight factor and it's effect on tactile sensation of what the vehicle is doing.

Agreed, which is why I think the Miata endures (and it's not exactly slow anymore)

But I think sports cars are a one stop shop for speed, sensation and status.... Now I think their remaining market just wants sensation. A 90k 911 is no faster or now capable than a 90k M5, and a Range Rover Velar has more "status" than either. 20-30 years ago that want the case

[Submariner]

I'm guessing they're ditching the 4 banger which should move prices up. Or maybe not, who knows

In any case I think it's going to be a lot more expensive than $1K more on average

The video said that the Z40i (or whatever it's called - the one with the TT 3.0) will go on sale for roughly £40,000 so maybe $52-53k here?

[MrH]

Agreed, which is why I think the Miata endures (and it's not exactly slow anymore)

But I think sports cars are a one stop shop for speed, sensation and status.... Now I think their remaining market just wants sensation. A 90k 911 is no faster or now capable than a 90k M5, and a Range Rover Velar has more "status" than either. 20-30 years ago that want the case

Exactly.  It's all about sensation now.  The baseline is so high for everything in terms of outright speed and grip, it doesn't matter what type of vehicle it is if they're both numb.  And honestly, the Miata crushes just about everything on the market in sensation and feeling.  The ND is plenty fast for me to outrun pretty much everyone on the road, and it's about to get faster too.  I'd rather have a 911 GT3, but compared to a mustang GT?  Yeah, give me the miata.

[HurricaneSteve]

Any city that's worth living in will be loaded with traffic unfortunately. I'm sure your car is totally fine with the mileage rate! In 10 months I've only put on 900 miles on mine but I was taking public transportation until a couple of months ago. I also don't trust city drivers so I rarely go anywhere where it's prone to get dented. How are the roads outside of the city to drive on?

And I do agree the RF looks amazing! Unfortunately I have a wedding to pay for and figured I could put the 8-10K saved to better use.

Love it, but wish I lived in an area with less traffic so I could drive it more! I live close enough to my job that it's accruing miles at a glacial pace - 3,500 over the past 1.5 years. Poor Miata!

$32k is a lot for a Miata but the RF is such a stunner in person..

[68_427]

These cars are small.  The Supra has a shorter wheelbase than the 86 twins

[12,000 RPM]

JFC man. The 86 twins were smaller than my 350Z. These things are gonna be tiny

[MrH]

A 350Z is not a small sports car by any means.