Poll
Question:
I have found several 2008 Dodge Grand Caravan SXT's, loaded up with almost all the options, with under 20,000 miles on the clock, going for $16K in California. Would you buy one?
Option 1: Yes! Yes! Yes! Jump on it!
votes: 1
Option 2: Yes, if an inspection checks out.
votes: 9
Option 3: I would be leary.
votes: 10
Option 4: No way!
votes: 15
Seems like a great deal to me.
Buying a rented car = (literally) marrying an ex prostitute.
Quote from: sportyaccordy on February 11, 2009, 12:35:45 PM
Buying a rented car = (literally) marrying an ex prostitute.
Ditto. If they're letting the car go at 20K, then there are probably some serious problems with it, and with it being a rental most likely the Transmission and engine. Looks good, but there's some risks. Also, it's americans. Americans are typically not respectful of other people's property.
I'd be leary of abuse but if a mechanic checked it out, then I dunno...
no
Quote from: 2o6 on February 11, 2009, 12:38:06 PM
Ditto. If they're letting the car go at 20K, then there are probably some serious problems with it, and with it being a rental most likely the Transmission and engine.
Not at all. They just don't typically keep any car longer than that.
But I wouldn't go for it for two reasons: it's not only an abused rental, but Chrysler's also been demonstrating lots of first-year glitches with the 2008 vans.
And it's in California, making problem resolution very difficult.
Quote from: ifcar on February 11, 2009, 01:17:19 PM
Not at all. They just don't typically keep any car longer than that.
But I wouldn't go for it for two reasons: it's not only an abused rental, but Chrysler's also been demonstrating lots of first-year glitches with the 2008 vans.
And it's in California, making problem resolution very difficult.
Gotta agree there. Someone I know works for a rental agency closeby. They replace most models each year.
I'd say get the car checked by a mechanic. Cali seems pretty far to be looking though. Every once in a while there are some steals locally on 1 yr old cars, most of which are lease returns ( yes, one year.. ) or rental fleet returns.
Nope.
I was going to say "FUCK NO", but now that I think about it I'd be leery. Get it checked, obviously, and you may find a gem.
Probably not, though.
My dad did so twice. Both times he had 2 or 3 kids in college, so a brand new car wasn't in the works. Both were Oldsmobile Silhouettes ('01 and '03). First one had around 25K miles when they got it, and it was perfectly reliable for it's stay with them. They traded it on the second two years later, with 85K miles. For a while, my parents were racking up tons of miles, with all the kids in school several hours away in different directions. Second one didn't do so well. Mechanically, it was fine, but had all sorts of problems with the HVAC system, and some issues with the rear suspension (self leveling air setup). He dumped that one and got into an '04 loaded up Chevy Venture (not a rental). That one was okay, but they got rid of it with 70K miles (again, concerns with the electronics and suspension).
They have an '07 or '08 Toyota Sienna now, and love it - much nicer than the GM vans in virtually every category. There was a Toyota Highlander in there somewhere too, but that wasn't around for that long. My mom really likes minivans.
For the price, buying a rental could be a viable option, though I'd strongly consider buying an extended warranty. Cost should be fairly reasonable if the vehicle is low-mileage.
My brother's Buick Regal was a previous rental, as well. He bought it with ~65K miles (had an owner between him and the rental company). His car has around 112K miles on it now, and has been just fine.
You're taking a bit of a gamble for sure, but cars are pretty resilient these days. Definitely get it checked out, and consider the warranty, but it's certainly worth considering for the right price.
It's worth considering. Rentals are sometimes abused, a minivan rental probably hasn't been driven as hard though, simply by the demographic that's going to rent one. Rental agencies maintain them pretty strictly as well, and they still have whatever warranty is left on them from the factory. Have a mechanic check to make sure there's not and major issues, check and see how the warranty works too though, Chryslers lifetime warranty to consumers wasn't transferable, so it had to have been something different for the fleet, but it should still have what's left of it should anything go wrong.
Absolutely not. I drive a rental minivan every single weekend in the fall and spring. They get the absolute living shit kicked out of them. After my experiences over the past four years, minivans are probably the last rentals I would consider!
16K? Have to go California to get it?
You can get a better deal on the used market. If you negotiate, you could probably get $18k on a unused 2008 model at a dealer.
Quote from: 3.0L V6 on February 11, 2009, 03:21:31 PM
16K? Have to go California to get it?
You can get a better deal on the used market. If you negotiate, you could probably get $18k on a unused 2008 model at a dealer.
Hmm, excellent point. I'm not in the market, so I don't track prices, but now is probably a hell of a time to buy a new car (and a Chrysler at that).
Only buy a rental if it's a Pontiac Sunfire.
New Mazda 5 = $19k
Quote from: NACar on February 11, 2009, 03:40:39 PM
New Mazda 5 = $19k
New Mazda5 = almost exactly half the cargo space of a Grand Caravan.
Quote from: ifcar on February 11, 2009, 03:46:15 PM
New Mazda5 = almost exactly half the cargo space of a Grand Caravan.
If space is all he needs, he should get a box truck.
ifcar = boring
Quote from: NACar on February 11, 2009, 03:47:34 PM
If space is all he needs, he should get a box truck.
Seating is nice, too.
Quote
ifcar = boring
I don't recall ever denying that.
Quote from: 3.0L V6 on February 11, 2009, 03:21:31 PM
16K? Have to go California to get it?
You can get a better deal on the used market. If you negotiate, you could probably get $18k on a unused 2008 model at a dealer.
You're not comparing apples to apples. I can find a used 2008 SE for $16K in BC without a problem, but I can find a used 2008 SXT in Seattle for $16K. The cheapest used 2008 Grand Caravan SXT I can find in my province is listed for $25,995 on autotrader.ca.
When it's time to buy, it might be a different story though.
Quote from: NACar on February 11, 2009, 03:40:39 PM
New Mazda 5 = $19k
No thanks. We tried one out. Too small for our family.
Quote from: HEMI666 on February 11, 2009, 04:14:25 PM
No thanks. We tried one out. Too small for our family.
I thought you only had two kids. Ok... I'll sell you my 7-seat Turbowagon for $1200. I'd rather see you driving that than some Caravan heap. You just have to come get it. :lol:
Quote from: ifcar on February 11, 2009, 03:49:36 PM
Seating is nice, too.
I don't recall ever denying that.
What's your dream car?
Not if it were a car I had to depend on. I know what I do to rentals.
Prepare yourself for beat to shit interior panels, bad transmissions, and the faint smell of stale cigarette smoke that just won't go away.
Quote from: Raza on February 11, 2009, 04:22:49 PM
Not if it were a car I had to depend on. I know what I do to rentals.
Prepare yourself for beat to shit interior panels, bad transmissions, and the faint smell of stale cigarette smoke that just won't go away.
If it had a warranty, then not a big deal but if Chryslers has a non transferable warranty.. i definitely wouldn't.
Quote from: 3.0L V6 on February 11, 2009, 03:21:31 PM
16K? Have to go California to get it?
You can get a better deal on the used market. If you negotiate, you could probably get $18k on a unused 2008 model at a dealer.
The problem is every last 2008 Grand Caravan available in BC for under $25K is an SE. That van comes with the 3.3L. The only way to get the 4.0L is to get the SXT.
Quote from: NomisR on February 11, 2009, 04:22:16 PM
What's your dream car?
That will entirely depend on what everyone's building when I'm ready to buy a car.
Quote from: ifcar on February 11, 2009, 04:25:14 PM
That will entirely depend on what everyone's building when I'm ready to buy a car.
That would be a reality car. He didn't ask that.
No. I know how people drive something they don't own.
I would buy a rental if and only if the price was right, and if I needed a dedicated winter beater.
Chrysler won't be around in a year, and you'll have to go through a bunch of red tape at some subcontracted dealership (probably Nissan, GM, or Ford) to get the car serviced. It's not worth the hassle, imo.
Values will drop like an anvil in a few months. It's not worth getting right now.
Quote from: ifcar on February 11, 2009, 04:25:14 PM
That will entirely depend on what everyone's building when I'm ready to buy a car.
Dream car doesn't have to be something be affordable or be built.. it's something that you would have a poster of to put on your wall. like (http://www.lotustalk.com/forums/attachments/f95/110558d1233717735-wtb-exige-oh-sh-t-poster-lotus_holysht.jpg)
Quote from: the Teuton on February 11, 2009, 04:36:39 PM
Chrysler won't be around in a year, and you'll have to go through a bunch of red tape at some subcontracted dealership (probably Nissan, GM, or Ford) to get the car serviced. It's not worth the hassle, imo.
Values will drop like an anvil in a few months. It's not worth getting right now.
Well, he probably won't be getting the car serviced at a dealer anyways, so shouldn't be a problem. Find a good mechanic and you're set
Quote from: HEMI666 on February 11, 2009, 04:13:54 PM
You're not comparing apples to apples. I can find a used 2008 SE for $16K in BC without a problem, but I can find a used 2008 SXT in Seattle for $16K. The cheapest used 2008 Grand Caravan SXT I can find in my province is listed for $25,995 on autotrader.ca.
When it's time to buy, it might be a different story though.
Fair enough. I didn't know the 4.0L was a requirement for you.
But that rental still isn't a deal for you. Considering the exchange rate ($1CDN = ~0.80USD), the pain in the ass of driving it from California to BC, the fact that it was a rental vehicle and the company that warrants it may not be around very long and I think it's overvalued.
Considering the economy, if you wait you can probably find a real bargain within the next six to twelve months.
Quote from: 3.0L V6 on February 11, 2009, 04:48:41 PM
Fair enough. I didn't know the 4.0L was a requirement for you.
But that rental still isn't a deal for you. Considering the exchange rate ($1CDN = ~0.80USD), the pain in the ass of driving it from California to BC, the fact that it was a rental vehicle and the company that warrants it may not be around very long and I think it's overvalued.
Considering the economy, if you wait you can probably find a real bargain within the next six to twelve months.
I'm not buying until January.
rental = run for the hills
Quote from: HEMI666 on February 11, 2009, 04:24:59 PM
The problem is every last 2008 Grand Caravan available in BC for under $25K is an SE. That van comes with the 3.3L. The only way to get the 4.0L is to get the SXT.
I know you're a minivan fan, but have you thought of a wagon? Low ride height and cargo load level may make it more practical in practical terms than a minivan. I mean, if you cut out cargo space in the cargo area that is not likely (or safe) to be used, how different is a wagon from a minivan or SUV?
My Polo was a former rental car and it was the most reliable car our family had ever owned. But we bought it for round about 1500$.
I don`t think I`d buy a former rental car in this price range though.
Quote from: Raza on February 11, 2009, 05:01:08 PM
I know you're a minivan fan, but have you thought of a wagon? Low ride height and cargo load level may make it more practical in practical terms than a minivan. I mean, if you cut out cargo space in the cargo area that is not likely (or safe) to be used, how different is a wagon from a minivan or SUV?
What if little Billy wants to bring a friend? And since Billy gets to bring a friend, Sally is also going to want to bring one. That's something to consider.
Try finding a newer Odyssey. They're pretty, dare I say it, FUN to drive.
I'll buy an ex-rental when I've got some dead bodies I need stuffed in a trunk and driven into the river.
Quote from: CJ on February 11, 2009, 05:56:12 PM
What if little Billy wants to bring a friend? And since Billy gets to bring a friend, Sally is also going to want to bring one. That's something to consider.
Try finding a newer Odyssey. They're pretty, dare I say it, FUN to drive.
There are 7 seat wagons. Like the E55 AMG.
Quote from: Pommes-T on February 11, 2009, 05:04:40 PM
My Polo was a former rental car and it was the most reliable car our family had ever owned. But we bought it for round about 1500$.
I don`t think I`d buy a former rental car in this price range though.
Americans are different from europeans. Why do you think that there are no MT shift rentals in the US?
Quote from: Raza on February 11, 2009, 06:39:31 PM
There are 7 seat wagons. Like the E55 AMG.
They're much, much different. For example: Loading things into the car. It's hard to bend over to struggle to get in a baby seat, or bend over to put things inside a car. Minivans have height, and a flatter loading floor to get people inside much easier.
Quote from: Raza on February 11, 2009, 05:01:08 PM
I know you're a minivan fan, but have you thought of a wagon? Low ride height and cargo load level may make it more practical in practical terms than a minivan. I mean, if you cut out cargo space in the cargo area that is not likely (or safe) to be used, how different is a wagon from a minivan or SUV?
Also, Minivans are more space efficient, having a low ride height (like a car) but the high roofline of an SUV. With 7 seat wagons, that rear bench is rear facing: it intrudes on cargospace, and is hard to get kids back there and still have room to fill it up with cargo.
Quote from: CJ on February 11, 2009, 05:56:12 PM
What if little Billy wants to bring a friend? And since Billy gets to bring a friend, Sally is also going to want to bring one. That's something to consider.
Try finding a newer Odyssey. They're pretty, dare I say it, FUN to drive.
There's a reason we're not looking at them...price.
Quote from: Raza link=topic=17566.msg994218#msg994218 date=1234402771
There are 7 seat wagons. Like the E55 AMG.
We have a 6 seat wagon now, don't want another one. They are simply not as practical as a minivan. With two car seats in it, the back row has been rendered useless.
Quote from: HEMI666 on February 11, 2009, 08:14:11 PM
We have a 6 seat wagon now, don't want another one. They are simply not as practical as a minivan. With two car seats in it, the back row has been rendered useless.
Do you have the second-row center console or a passage?
Quote from: HEMI666 on February 11, 2009, 08:14:11 PM
We have a 6 seat wagon now, don't want another one. They are simply not as practical as a minivan. With two car seats in it, the back row has been rendered useless.
Minivans are no picnic. THey are way up high, and you have to climb into them. ANd if your kid falls out of a minivan, there is a 212.5% greater chance that they will sustain a boo-boo.
Quote from: ifcar on February 11, 2009, 08:16:12 PM
Do you have the second-row center console or a passage?
Middle passage. But for anyone taller then say 42", it's nearly impossible to maneuver yourself through it and into the back seat. Especially when there are car seats in the way. Believe me I had to do it on Sunday. I would buy another wagon when the kids are older and don't need car seats anymore, but as long as there are car seats in our cars, it's going to be a minivan for us.
Quote from: HEMI666 on February 11, 2009, 11:48:44 PM
Middle passage. But for anyone taller then say 42", it's nearly impossible to maneuver yourself through it and into the back seat. Especially when there are car seats in the way. Believe me I had to do it on Sunday. I would buy another wagon when the kids are older and don't need car seats anymore, but as long as there are car seats in our cars, it's going to be a minivan for us.
Car seats really do fuck a lot of things up.
Quote from: HEMI666 on February 11, 2009, 11:48:44 PM
Middle passage. But for anyone taller then say 42", it's nearly impossible to maneuver yourself through it and into the back seat. Especially when there are car seats in the way. Believe me I had to do it on Sunday. I would buy another wagon when the kids are older and don't need car seats anymore, but as long as there are car seats in our cars, it's going to be a minivan for us.
So are you hoping for a two-passenger bench seat that you can get to the rear along the side of, or just something where it's easier to get between the captain's chairs?
Get something more in line with the Daimler part of DaimlerChrysler.
http://www.autotrader.com/fyc/vdp.jsp?ct=u&car_id=255939089&dealer_id=54200403&car_year=2006&rdm=1234460157046&model=R_CLASSCLASS_SERIES&num_records=25&systime=&make2=&highlightFirstMakeModel=&start_year=1981&keywordsfyc=&keywordsfyc=&keywordsrep=&keywordsrep=&engine=&certified=&body_code=0&fuel=&awsp=false&search_type=both&distance=25&marketZipError=false&search_lang=en&showZipError=n&make=MB&keywords_display=&color=&page_location=findacar%3A%3Aispsearchform&min_price=&drive=&default_sort=priceDESC&seller_type=b&max_mileage=&style_flag=1&sort_type=priceDESC&address=15213&advanced=&end_year=2010&doors=&transmission=&max_price=&cardist=12&standard=false
Quote from: Soup DeVille on February 12, 2009, 01:19:15 AM
Car seats really do fuck a lot of things up.
Why did they ever make this a law? It should be the parent's choice on it and not the government's rules. I grew up fine without one as with majority of us on here.
Quote from: NomisR on February 12, 2009, 10:43:48 AM
Why did they ever make this a law? It should be the parent's choice on it and not the government's rules. I grew up fine without one as with majority of us on here.
Yeah, my parents only used on when I was really young. I am not really sure when they stopped, but it was definitely earlier than parents do now.
Quote from: TBR on February 12, 2009, 11:27:02 AM
Yeah, my parents only used on when I was really young. I am not really sure when they stopped, but it was definitely earlier than parents do now.
+1
I think they just keep increasing the minimum weight and height... :rage:
Apparently life was rather unsafe back then. How are we all alive?
Quote from: the Teuton on February 12, 2009, 11:36:39 AM
Apparently life was rather unsafe back then. How are we all alive?
A lot of children died in car accidents. A lot. Traffic was also nowhere near as crazy as it is now, and drivers were a lot more respectful back in the day.
Quote from: ifcar on February 12, 2009, 04:37:36 AM
So are you hoping for a two-passenger bench seat that you can get to the rear along the side of, or just something where it's easier to get between the captain's chairs?
The latter.
In theory, sure. It's no different than with any other used car: it's on a car-by-car basis - condition, records, options, etc.
In practice, probably not. I simply wouldn't be interested in the typical rental car.
Quote from: HEMI666 on February 12, 2009, 01:51:43 PM
A lot of children died in car accidents. A lot. Traffic was also nowhere near as crazy as it is now, and drivers were a lot more respectful back in the day.
I grew up riding around in a sardine can on wheels, a 1985 Astro that my mom got in 1990. I don't remember having a car seat at any point. I do remember riding in the front seat.
Have you ever seen the crash tests for the old Astro before the updates?
It was pretty gruesome in all respects. I was in a few minor fender benders in that car, and I was fine.
In saying this, do all parents of young children go to such great lengths of protection with their kids these days?
Quote from: the Teuton on February 12, 2009, 02:19:37 PM
I grew up riding around in a sardine can on wheels, a 1985 Astro that my mom got in 1990. I don't remember having a car seat at any point. I do remember riding in the front seat.
Have you ever seen the crash tests for the old Astro before the updates?
It was pretty gruesome in all respects. I was in a few minor fender benders in that car, and I was fine.
In saying this, do all parents of young children go to such great lengths of protection with their kids these days?
By law you have to. By the way, if the means are there to protect my child from getting killed, I will take them. There is nothing worse in this world, then knowing that your child died because you didn't protect them.
Quote from: NomisR on February 12, 2009, 10:43:48 AM
Why did they ever make this a law? It should be the parent's choice on it and not the government's rules. I grew up fine without one as with majority of us on here.
That's true, but a lot of kids went through windshields or got thrown around the inside of a car during an accident. There are also 10 times as many cars on the road these days.
Quote from: HEMI666 on February 12, 2009, 02:23:06 PM
By law you have to. By the way, if the means are there to protect my child from getting killed, I will take them. There is nothing worse in this world, then knowing that your child died because you didn't protect them.
And this is why I don't think I could or would ever want children.
I suppose you have to water them three times a day, too?
Seriously, what kind of BS legislation is that that mandates what you have to buy for your kids? That'd be like someone forcing my parents to buy me my first car just because they're my parents.
That's retarded.
Quote from: the Teuton on February 12, 2009, 02:26:29 PM
And this is why I don't think I could or would ever want children.
Because you wouldn't want to take the necessary precautions to protect them? You're right, you shouldn't have kids.
QuoteI suppose you have to water them three times a day, too?
Technicaly, yes. They need to eat breakfast, lunch, and supper.
QuoteSeriously, what kind of BS legislation is that that mandates what you have to buy for your kids? That'd be like someone forcing my parents to buy me my first car just because they're my parents.
It's not even remotely the same.
QuoteThat's retarded.
You're retarded. There are a lot of dumb parents out there who shouldn't even have kids. Unfortunately you have to protect those children from their own parents.
Quote from: NomisR on February 12, 2009, 10:43:48 AM
Why did they ever make this a law? It should be the parent's choice on it and not the government's rules. I grew up fine without one as with majority of us on here.
You're just goading me, aren't you?
Quote from: HEMI666 on February 12, 2009, 02:25:56 PM
That's true, but a lot of kids went through windshields or got thrown around the inside of a car during an accident. There are also 10 times as many cars on the road these days.
The lack of a law mandating what you have to do doesn't in any way keep you from doing it.
Quote from: Soup DeVille on February 12, 2009, 02:57:11 PM
The lack of a law mandating what you have to do doesn't in any way keep you from doing it.
No, it does. Before the car seat law, people used to just duct tape their babies to the hood of their cars.
(I forced everyone to wear seatbelts in my car before it was mandatory for all passengers.)
Quote from: Soup DeVille on February 12, 2009, 02:57:11 PM
The lack of a law mandating what you have to do doesn't in any way keep you from doing it.
No, but there are way too many parents who would just let their kids climb all over inside the car while they are driving. Remember seeing kids riding on the rear parcel shelf of the family sedan? I remember seeing that, even after car seat laws.
I'll buy another Volvo when I have kids. I'll find a pre-owned XC90 or V70.
One of my best friends bought a rental Tempo. Worked out fine for him.
I would totally jump on a newer Caravan if I could. Just for the sto n' go.
--People without families will never understand the uefulness of a minivan, and many of the dads out there get SUVs just because they too spineless to handle the minivan criticism.
They truly are the most functional Large vehicles out there, if you don't NEED an offroad vehicle or a truck.
I think my Mazda used to be a rental. :mask:
Quote from: AutobahnSHO on February 12, 2009, 05:28:50 PM
One of my best friends bought a rental Tempo. Worked out fine for him.
I would totally jump on a newer Caravan if I could. Just for the sto n' go.
--People without families will never understand the uefulness of a minivan, and many of the dads out there get SUVs just because they too spineless to handle the minivan criticism.
They truly are the most functional Large vehicles out there, if you don't NEED an offroad vehicle or a truck.
My dad traded his Monte SS for a Voyager in '93 - after that, it was all minivans. I thought the SS was going to be my first car. Nope. I lived the fuckin minivans for a long time, and saw first hand how "useful" they were. I hated them. Sure, we packed them full many times, going upta camp, to the beach, etc, but we never needed any of that shit. Stupid women just needed to learn how to pack lighter. The vans were the beginning of a time of excess - going to the beach for the day? Let's bring the entire kitchen pantry and half our wardrobes, and of course we have three dogs because everybody ash to have their own, and each dog has a couple of bags just in case they need a change of clothes, too!
If I ever have a family with women, they will not bring more than one bag each, period, end of discussion. If you say one more word about it, I will just cancel the whole trip. 99% of the time, a van was a complete waste, and encouraged being even more wasteful. I never felt as safe in those vans - they handled like complete turds. How did we ever live with a 2-door coupe before? We did, and it was great. I hated all of the vans, and still do. They were a waste of gasoline, a waste of space on the road, and waste of money. Buying a minivan for a two-kid family is like buying a tug boat to go whitewater rafting - you know, just in case you have to pull an oil tanker into port on the way down river. If I have three kids, I can deal with a station wagon. If I have four kids, I can deal with the likes of the Mazda 5. Unless I have five kids or become a plumber, I will never drive one of those lumbering abominations - but in either of those cases I would probably end up killing myself, so the point is moot.
Quote from: HEMI666 on February 12, 2009, 04:29:07 PM
No, but there are way too many parents who would just let their kids climb all over inside the car while they are driving. Remember seeing kids riding on the rear parcel shelf of the family sedan? I remember seeing that, even after car seat laws.
I remember doing that.
I survived; as did most other kids my age and before. yes, there have been some preventable deaths, but lets be clear about this: we are talking about a marginal increase in safety statistically.
Quote from: NACar on February 12, 2009, 05:54:56 PM
My dad traded his Monte SS for a Voyager in '93 - after that, it was all minivans. I thought the SS was going to be my first car. Nope. I lived the fuckin minivans for a long time, and saw first hand how "useful" they were. I hated them. Sure, we packed them full many times, going upta camp, to the beach, etc, but we never needed any of that shit. Stupid women just needed to learn how to pack lighter. The vans were the beginning of a time of excess - going to the beach for the day? Let's bring the entire kitchen pantry and half our wardrobes, and of course we have three dogs because everybody ash to have their own, and each dog has a couple of bags just in case they need a change of clothes, too!
If I ever have a family with women, they will not bring more than one bag each, period, end of discussion. If you say one more word about it, I will just cancel the whole trip. 99% of the time, a van was a complete waste, and encouraged being even more wasteful. I never felt as safe in those vans - they handled like complete turds. How did we ever live with a 2-door coupe before? We did, and it was great. I hated all of the vans, and still do. They were a waste of gasoline, a waste of space on the road, and waste of money. Buying a minivan for a two-kid family is like buying a tug boat to go whitewater rafting - you know, just in case you have to pull an oil tanker into port on the way down river. If I have three kids, I can deal with a station wagon. If I have four kids, I can deal with the likes of the Mazda 5. Unless I have five kids or become a plumber, I will never drive one of those lumbering abominations - but in either of those cases I would probably end up killing myself, so the point is moot.
LOL
The reduction in kids "on my side" arguments and bothering each other is totally worth the hit I take in mileage and handling.
FWIW the '99 is WAAAY better than the '92 I got rid of last year.
-I've moved my entire house in minivans.
-I can haul 2 adults plus my kids, in relative comfort.
I'll take a pic tomorrow of my "custom" seating which gives me even MORE room than most other vehicles out there..
Quote from: AutobahnSHO on February 12, 2009, 06:04:42 PM
LOL
The reduction in kids "on my side" arguments and bothering each other is totally worth the hit I take in mileage and handling.
FWIW the '99 is WAAAY better than the '92 I got rid of last year.
-I've moved my entire house in minivans.
-I can haul 2 adults plus my kids, in relative comfort.
I'll take a pic tomorrow of my "custom" seating which gives me even MORE room than most other vehicles out there..
I have many fond memories of the "on my side" arguments in the back of the Monte.
But if it gets out of hand, there's a thing called duct tape. Apply over mouth and around wrists. No more arguments.
Quote from: Soup DeVille on February 12, 2009, 05:59:39 PM
I remember doing that.
I survived; as did most other kids my age and before. yes, there have been some preventable deaths, but lets be clear about this: we are talking about a marginal increase in safety statistically.
Marginal? :rolleyes:
Quote from: NACar on February 12, 2009, 05:54:56 PM
My dad traded his Monte SS for a Voyager in '93 - after that, it was all minivans. I thought the SS was going to be my first car. Nope. I lived the fuckin minivans for a long time, and saw first hand how "useful" they were. I hated them. Sure, we packed them full many times, going upta camp, to the beach, etc, but we never needed any of that shit. Stupid women just needed to learn how to pack lighter. The vans were the beginning of a time of excess - going to the beach for the day? Let's bring the entire kitchen pantry and half our wardrobes, and of course we have three dogs because everybody ash to have their own, and each dog has a couple of bags just in case they need a change of clothes, too!
If I ever have a family with women, they will not bring more than one bag each, period, end of discussion. If you say one more word about it, I will just cancel the whole trip. 99% of the time, a van was a complete waste, and encouraged being even more wasteful. I never felt as safe in those vans - they handled like complete turds. How did we ever live with a 2-door coupe before? We did, and it was great. I hated all of the vans, and still do. They were a waste of gasoline, a waste of space on the road, and waste of money. Buying a minivan for a two-kid family is like buying a tug boat to go whitewater rafting - you know, just in case you have to pull an oil tanker into port on the way down river. If I have three kids, I can deal with a station wagon. If I have four kids, I can deal with the likes of the Mazda 5. Unless I have five kids or become a plumber, I will never drive one of those lumbering abominations - but in either of those cases I would probably end up killing myself, so the point is moot.
I'll take a picture of the inside of our car after we go grocery shopping next time, and I'll post it up here for you to see.
It's funny. Autobahn will agree with me here, that 90% of the people I hear saying that you don't need a minivan are people with no kids. The other 10% are really short people who don't need the room.
I'ld buy a used police car before I bought a rental.
Quote from: HEMI666 on February 12, 2009, 07:35:50 PM
I'll take a picture of the inside of our car after we go grocery shopping next time, and I'll post it up here for you to see.
It's funny. Autobahn will agree with me here, that 90% of the people I hear saying that you don't need a minivan are people with no kids. The other 10% are really short people who don't need the room.
You don't need a minivan. You want a minivan.
Man, that R350 that Teuton posted...Mercedes' resale is dropping like a rock!
That's crazy how much that's dropped in price. A used CLS possibly my daily driver out of school? That'd be the most ballin'est shit ever.
Quote from: rohan on February 12, 2009, 07:37:54 PM
I'ld buy a used police car before I bought a rental.
Buying the rental is about the same as marrying a hooker. Both have been ridden hard with little care and compassion and will leave you with fun problems you'll discover when you become the owner.
Quote from: HEMI666 on February 12, 2009, 07:35:50 PM
I'll take a picture of the inside of our car after we go grocery shopping next time, and I'll post it up here for you to see.
It's funny. Autobahn will agree with me here, that 90% of the people I hear saying that you don't need a minivan are people with no kids. The other 10% are really short people who don't need the room.
I'm 6'4" and more pounds than I care to mention here. I have two boys, 2 and 4 years old. I drive a Civic.
Quote from: Soup DeVille on February 12, 2009, 09:27:34 PM
I'm 6'4" and more pounds than I care to mention here. I have two boys, 2 and 4 years old. I drive a Civic.
pwnt
Quote from: thecarnut on February 12, 2009, 09:28:47 PM
pwnt
Admittedly, 75% of the child hauling is done in the Pilot, but I do regularly take the boys out in the Civic, and occasionally to see their grandpa, who lives 1.5 hours away.
Quote from: Soup DeVille on February 12, 2009, 09:30:50 PM
Admittedly, 75% of the child hauling is done in the Pilot, but I do regularly take the boys out in the Civic, and occasionally to see their grandpa, who lives 1.5 hours away.
You have Civic and Pilot
Hemi has Focus and Freestyle (isn't that his other car?)
:huh:
Quote from: NACar on February 12, 2009, 09:33:28 PM
You have Civic and Pilot
Hemi has Focus and Freestyle (isn't that his other car?)
:huh:
Freestyle is getting replaced.
And the Focus has two more doors than the Civic.
Quote from: NACar on February 12, 2009, 09:33:28 PM
You have Civic and Pilot
Hemi has Focus and Freestyle (isn't that his other car?)
:huh:
Yes, it is. I don't know how much kiddie hauling his Focus does though.
(My older son loves to ride in the Civic BTW, because he can see out the windshield much better, and it has a sunroof)
Quote from: thecarnut on February 12, 2009, 09:35:04 PM
Freestyle is getting replaced.
And the Focus has two more doors than the Civic.
Replace Freestyle with something cool, like a Flex! Not a Caravan :lol:
Quote from: Soup DeVille on February 12, 2009, 09:27:34 PM
I'm 6'4" and more pounds than I care to mention here. I have two boys, 2 and 4 years old. I drive a Civic.
I have a 9, 4, and 3yr old. I drive a Subaru Legacy.
Like you said later, little cars are fine for OCCASIONAL family hauling, but long-term they don't work out.
Honestly I really WOULD trade the Caravan in for a Volvo 7seater wagon or the like, but the wife is stuck on the minivan now...
Quote from: Soup DeVille on February 12, 2009, 09:35:04 PM
Yes, it is. I don't know how much kiddie hauling his Focus does though.
Very little. Only when my wife needs her car and I need to go somewhere with the kids.
Quote from: HEMI666 on February 12, 2009, 07:35:50 PM
I'll take a picture of the inside of our car after we go grocery shopping next time, and I'll post it up here for you to see.
It's funny. Autobahn will agree with me here, that 90% of the people I hear saying that you don't need a minivan are people with no kids. The other 10% are really short people who don't need the room.
Mini van > SUV, for families that don't tow.
Quote from: NomisR on February 13, 2009, 11:40:20 AM
Mini van > SUV, for families that don't tow.
Minivans are capable of towing small trailers, small travel trailers, tent trailers, and even boats.
Quote from: HEMI666 on February 13, 2009, 11:47:54 AM
Minivans are capable of towing small trailers, small travel trailers, tent trailers, and even boats.
Well, so Minivans > SUV period! I'd take one over an SUV if it was my choice. But I'd probably get something small like the Mazda5.
Quote from: NomisR on February 13, 2009, 12:11:57 PM
Well, so Minivans > SUV period! I'd take one over an SUV if it was my choice. But I'd probably get something small like the Mazda5.
Does that thing even qualify as a minivan?? More like a mini minivan.
I like them.
In dealerships, we call them "executive cars". Well, the 82 year old salesman still calls them that. What person buying something like a base model Focus, believes that a Ford executive would that, probably deserves to own a former rental. It is even funnier when you open the door and find an Avis or Enterprise sticker.
But, my daughter's 2007 Focus is a former Enterprise driver, and it has given her a single problem. I did buy an 100k ESP warranty for it though.
I'd consider a previous rental, if it was a really good price, and it was only a year or so old. Cars are pretty resilient today, and I don't think that much damage could be done in a relatively short period of time.
Quote from: dazzleman on February 16, 2009, 08:39:02 AM
I'd consider a previous rental, if it was a really good price, and it was only a year or so old. Cars are pretty resilient today, and I don't think that much damage could be done in a relatively short period of time.
As long as there's no puke on the carpet.