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Auto Talk => General Automotive => Topic started by: cawimmer430 on September 09, 2019, 03:53:51 AM

Title: Berliners call for SUV ban after fatal traffic accident
Post by: cawimmer430 on September 09, 2019, 03:53:51 AM
This is so retarded. Welcome to Shit Hole Germany, where right now the hysteria, stupidity and more stupidity reigns supreme. Well, Berlin is a shit hole anyway. It's run by Red-Red-Green political parties - aka COMMUNISTS. :facepalm:

If instead of a Porsche SUV it was an electric car, I wonder if Berliners would call for a ban for EVs...



Berliners call for SUV ban after fatal traffic accident

Four people were killed in Berlin when a Porsche SUV veered onto a sidewalk. While hundreds of people held a candlelight vigil on Saturday evening, environmental protection organizations called for a ban on SUV vehicles.

A 3-year-old boy, a 64-year-old woman and two men in their late 20s were killed in an apparent road accident in Berlin on Friday evening, Berlin police said Saturday.

A Porsche SUV mounted a footpath full of pedestrians at the corner of Invaliden and Acker streets in central Berlin. The vehicle hit construction fencing and landed in a vacant building plot.

"Given the evidence so far, we assume this was a traffic accident and not a deliberate act," police spokesman Thilo Cablitz said.

The injured driver was taken to hospital for treatment, where he died. Two other people from the vehicle were also hospitalized.

"Initial indications that a medical emergency involving the driver could have been the cause, as well as all other witness statements, information and evidence, are part of the investigation," the police said.

Authorities are reconstructing the accident to determine the cause. Police are also investigating whether the SUV hit pedestrians.


Sorrow and anger

Berliners organized a vigil for the victims on Saturday evening. A four-minute silence was observed for the four victims, as people laid flowers at the accident site.

Berlin's Mayor Michael Müller dubbed it a "terrible accident."

"My thoughts are with the victims, and their relatives and friends," he said in a statement.

The deaths also sparked anger among the citizens and activists.

Stephan von Dassel, the district mayor of Berlin-Mitte, said "armor-like SUV cars" don't belong in the city, as every driving error puts the lives of innocent people at risk.

"These [cars] are also climate killers. They are a threat even without an accident," Von Dassel said.


Protest against SUVs

Environmental activists protested against SUV vehicles on Saturday. A Greenpeace member told AFP news agency that environmentalists blocked a SUV loading dock for about three hours.

It is "completely irresponsible to produce and drive SUVs," said Benjamin Stephan, a Greenpeace official, adding that German manufacturers must move away from "climate killers" and produce lighter electronic cars.

"The risk of dying in an accident involving an SUV is much higher than a normal car. Pedestrians have a 50% higher risk of fatal accidents due to the higher bonnet," according to Greenpeace.



Link: https://www.dw.com/en/berliners-call-for-suv-ban-after-fatal-traffic-accident/a-50342322
Title: Re: Berliners call for SUV ban after fatal traffic accident
Post by: 12,000 RPM on September 09, 2019, 05:21:26 AM
Yea only SUVs, not cars, kill pedestrians

Good luck Wimmer... seems like every western country is gunning for the top step on the podium of stupidity :facepalm:
Title: Re: Berliners call for SUV ban after fatal traffic accident
Post by: Soup DeVille on September 09, 2019, 06:13:34 AM
"lighter electronic cars.".

Either that's a poor translation, or someone has been watching too much Tron.
Title: Re: Berliners call for SUV ban after fatal traffic accident
Post by: cawimmer430 on September 09, 2019, 07:00:25 AM
Quote from: 12,000 RPM on September 09, 2019, 05:21:26 AM
Yea only SUVs, not cars, kill pedestrians

Good luck Wimmer... seems like every western country is gunning for the top step on the podium of stupidity :facepalm:

Exactly.  :ohyeah:

But right now there's this mass hysteria in Germany about climate change and CO2 and it's literally all being blamed on cars. And among all cars the hate is being thrown at SUVs, even small ones like a VW Tiguan or Skoda Kodiaq. The Fridays for Future movement led by Greta Thunberg, has brainwashed a large number of idiot German youths into hating all things cars. These kids are now leaving "hate letters" on SUVs aimed at shaming the drivers of such cars. It's so pathetic and stupid. Oh, and the political parties SPD and Greens (both very lefty) want to penalize SUV drivers with higher car taxes.

Germany 2019, a total shit hole. Not only because of this climate change hysteria.
Title: Re: Berliners call for SUV ban after fatal traffic accident
Post by: cawimmer430 on September 09, 2019, 07:04:27 AM
Quote from: Soup DeVille on September 09, 2019, 06:13:34 AM
"lighter electronic cars.".

Either that's a poor translation, or someone has been watching too much Tron.

Yep. A Tesla Model S weighs 2.1 tons. That's probably heavier than most of the normal-sized SUVs sold in Germany! Goes to show how stupid these Germans are who are calling for an SUV ban.

Well, some of them are also calling for a ban on cars which make more than 200-horsepower. This country is so embarrassing now. Oh, also this...



Germany's military has become a complete joke

It can't fulfil its role as a Nato member, let alone form the heart of a European defence force

(https://spectator.imgix.net/content/uploads/2019/08/Ross-Clark-.jpg)

It is not hard to think of times when German military weakness would have been lauded as good news across the rest of Europe, but perhaps not when the German minister accused of running her country's armed forces into the ground has just been named as the next president of the European Commission.

The most recent embarrassment for the Bundeswehr — the grounding of all 53 of its Tiger helicopters this month due to technical faults — is just the latest in a long series of humiliations to have sprung from Ursula von der Leyen's spell as defence minister. A country once feared for its ruthless military efficiency has become a joke among European powers.

If von der Leyen can be transposed on to the British political scene she might be seen as a teutonic Chris Grayling — attacked from all sides, not least her own, for her chronic mishandling of her brief. To quote fellow Christian Democrat Rupert Scholz, who served as Helmut Kohl's defence minister: 'The Bundeswehr's condition is catastrophic. The entire defence capability of the federal republic is suffering.'

It is not fair to blame all the problems of the German military on von der Leyen, who has been defence minister only since 2013. For understandable reasons, the German military was a little constrained in its development between 1945 and 1990, when defence was in any case effectively contracted out to foreign powers. Even now Germany remains bound by military constraints — under the Treaty for the Final Settlement with Respect to Germany, which returned the country's sovereignty in 1991, German armed forces are limited to 370,000 personnel, of whom no more than 345,000 are allowed to be in the army and air force. It cannot have nuclear weapons. After the Cold War, German governments of all colours did not consider defence a priority — unwilling to see that Russia could ever rise again as a threat.

Nevertheless, that doesn't excuse some of the inadequacies of the military which have come to light under von der Leyen's leadership. Under her watch, German military exercises have been reduced to a laughing stock. In 2014, a battalion on a Nato exercise in Norway was forced to use a painted broomstick to simulate a gun because it didn't have a real one. Nearly half the soldiers involved in the exercise could not be issued with pistols.

Things were no better this year when Germany took control of Nato's Very High Readiness Joint Task Force, charged with combatting the threat from Russia. Germanypromised to have 44 Leopard 2 tanks and 14 Marder armoured infantry vehicles available for the task, yet in the event could only muster nine and three respectively. A leaked document revealed that the Luftwaffe's Eurofighter and Tornado fighter jets, along with its transport helicopters, are only available for use for an average of four months per year — spending the rest of the time laid up for maintenance and repair.

As for the F-125 Baden-Württemberg frigates which were supposed to be coming into service two years ago, the navy refused to commission them. They failed their sea trials after problems with radar, the flameproof coating on the fuel tanks and the central computer system. Nor did the frigates have any torpedo tubes or sonar — essential for tackling the threat from submarines.

Last year's annual report by the Parliamentary Armed Forces Commissioner — the German equivalent of a defence select committee report — confirmed the inability of the military to keep its equipment in use, adding that for a period from October 2017, when a Type 212A submarine damaged its rudder, none of the country's six submarines were available for use.

This year, the government overcame the embarrassment by making information on the availability of equipment classified, so that it was left out of the report. The Commissioner, Dr Hans-Peter Bartels, was not impressed. He described the Bundeswehr — the equivalent of the armed forces and Ministry of Defence combined — as a 'bureaucratic monster', citing the example of the commander of a tactical air wing with 1,500 military and non-military staff and flying assets totalling €3 billion under his command — and yet who was trusted to spend only €250 a year without getting approval from above.

Not that centralisation of funding has helped promote carefulness with money. One of the scandals laid at von der Leyen's door is that of the Gorch Fock, a naval training ship which was sent for an overhaul in 2016 and which has yet to be returned to its duties. Meanwhile, the arc of estimated costs will be familiar to anyone who follows British public sector projects — it has risen from €10 million to €135 million.

What von der Leyen has done is increase the military budget, which rose sharply last year from €38.5 billion to €43.5 billion. A further €3 billion a year is planned by 2024. But even at that level, Germany will fall well short of its obligation as a Nato member to spend 2 per cent of GDP per year on defence — it will merely take its spending from 1.2 per cent to 1.5 per cent. True, few of Nato's European member states fulfil this obligation, but of all of them you might expect the continent's largest economy to be setting an example. Since the end of the Cold War, Germany has found it all too easy to exempt itself, or play only a token part, in joint military operations around the world — its aggressive past serving as a convenient excuse, as if it is telling the world: now, you wouldn't want a Germany which was flexing its military muscles, would you?

Spending money is one thing; spending it well is another. The German military has never really made a successful transformation from a conscript force to a smaller professional force. Conscription was suspended in 2011, two years before von der Leyen's arrival as defence minister. But several times since then the government has toyed with the idea of reviving it — more for social ends than military ones. Germany's armed forces are of a similar size to Britain's — 173,000 personnel compared with our 155,000. Yet not all are being kept in adequate training. In 2017, 19 out of 129 helicopter pilots lost their licenses because they were unable to meet the required number of flying hours.

There is a question of how committed von Leyen has been to maintaining an independent German defence force. In 2014, she told Der Spiegel that a single joint EU defence force 'would be a logical consequence of an increasingly close military cooperation in Europe' — an idea which appals even staunch British europhiles such as Vince Cable. Since being proposed as Commission president, von der Leyen has retreated on that idea — perhaps aware that her record of running the German military will not inspire confidence.

In 1945, the US military sent a team to Germany with the aim of capturing Albert Speer before the military police did — they were so impressed by the ability of the Nazis' armaments machine to recover from bombing raids that they were desperate to debrief him. We may no longer be at risk of Germany putting its military to aggressive use. But there is little sign that it has the organisation and competence to fulfil its role as a Nato member, let alone form the heart of a European defence force.


Link: https://www.spectator.co.uk/2019/08/germanys-military-has-become-a-complete-joke/



:cry: :tounge: :facepalm:



If people ask where I am from I'm gonna now claim Denmark.  :lol:


Title: Re: Berliners call for SUV ban after fatal traffic accident
Post by: shp4man on September 09, 2019, 07:53:29 AM
I always wondered if modern Germany had any nukes. Per the article, I guess not.
If the Socialists are able to beat Trump in 2020,  the USA will become more like modern Germany.
Not looking forward to it.
Title: Re: Berliners call for SUV ban after fatal traffic accident
Post by: cawimmer430 on September 09, 2019, 08:58:53 AM
Jesus, now these weirdos are protesting at the Frankfurt IAA. And not only against SUVs, against all cars! Including the electric car. They want completely car-free cities. Fucking morons. How are we supposed to get around? Shit Hole Germanistan.  :facepalm:


Their leader; typical lefty, unemployed teen who calls herself "Tina Velo".

(https://www.welt.de/img/wirtschaft/mobile199968200/4501627517-ci23x11-w780/IAA-2019-Tina-Velo.jpg)


Link (in Kraut): https://www.welt.de/wirtschaft/article199968204/IAA-Aktivisten-fordern-Verbot-von-SUVs.html
Title: Re: Berliners call for SUV ban after fatal traffic accident
Post by: FoMoJo on September 09, 2019, 09:02:40 AM
Quote from: cawimmer430 on September 09, 2019, 08:58:53 AM
Jesus, now these weirdos are protesting at the Frankfurt IAA. And not only against SUVs, against all cars! Including the electric car. They want completely car-free cities. Fucking morons. How are we supposed to get around? Shit Hole Germanistan.  :facepalm:


Their leader; typical lefty, unemployed teen who calls herself "Tina Velo".

(https://www.welt.de/img/wirtschaft/mobile199968200/4501627517-ci23x11-w780/IAA-2019-Tina-Velo.jpg)


Link (in Kraut): https://www.welt.de/wirtschaft/article199968204/IAA-Aktivisten-fordern-Verbot-von-SUVs.html
"Sand in the Gear"?

People need to scream at each other now to be heard.  Kind of sucks.
Title: Re: Berliners call for SUV ban after fatal traffic accident
Post by: shp4man on September 09, 2019, 09:09:39 AM
And we have the "Green New Deal".   No ICE cars, little or no real meat products (cow farts bad), no jet travel (jet exhaust bad) , carbon taxes out the ass, complete renewable energy, leave the oil in the ground and most importantly.....Free money for everybody all losers!   

:lol: :muffin:
Title: Re: Berliners call for SUV ban after fatal traffic accident
Post by: cawimmer430 on September 09, 2019, 09:09:49 AM
Quote from: FoMoJo on September 09, 2019, 09:02:40 AM
"Sand in the Gear"?

People need to scream at each other now to be heard.  Kind of sucks.

Yes. That's a radical anti-car group.

Unbelievable what is happening here. There was a funny quote in that article from some radical cunt from Greenpeace. She claims that "Carmakers are like heroin dealers. Getting people hooked on their product. And Volkswagen is about to offer their clients more heroin in the form of electric cars."  :facepalm: :facepalm: :facepalm:

If public transportation were fast, efficient and if you didn't have to wait forever for it to arrive, then maybe more people would take it. As it turns out, the overrated German public transportation system such as S-Bahns and U-Bahns are slow, inefficient and you have to wait forever at your station for one to arrive. No wonder people are taking their cars. Also, public transportation is expensive here, even with a year-long pass.

Sure people should be sensible about how they use their car. I tend to walk or take my bicycle around town. But if I have a project then I need my car and there's no way around that.
Title: Re: Berliners call for SUV ban after fatal traffic accident
Post by: cawimmer430 on September 09, 2019, 09:16:26 AM
Quote from: shp4man on September 09, 2019, 09:09:39 AM
And we have the "Green New Deal".   No ICE cars, little or no real meat products (cow farts bad), no jet travel (jet exhaust bad) , carbon taxes out the ass, complete renewable energy, leave the oil in the ground and most importantly.....Free money for everybody all losers!   

:lol: :muffin:

Yeah, we have the same bullshit demands from several political parties and environmental groups here. They want to tax the hell out of flying, fossil fuels, meat and all other products which produce CO2. Two political parties, the SPD and the Greens, want to tax SUVs and make car ownership even more expensive than it already is. Assholes.  :lockedup:

Germany's disastrous Energiewende (change of energy) has ensured that we are paying the highest electricity costs in the world. Solar and wind won't cut it. But these "environmentalists" are demanding that we shut down our brown coal power plants NOW. Um... and how are we going to provide electricity to our industry and population? We hardly have any nuclear power plants left. Solar and wind are inefficient and unreliable. These people are so stupid. Blind ideology and resistant to the reality of the situation.

Here: https://www.spiegel.de/international/germany/german-failure-on-the-road-to-a-renewable-future-a-1266586.html


Like I said, SHIT HOLE GERMANY. It's unbelievable what is happening here. Many people just can't believe how this country is being run into the wall by idiot politicians, uncontrolled mass Islamic migration from primitive peoples who will never integrate or contribute to this nation, a disastrous energy policy, the second highest tax load in Europe (behind Belgium), and now a potential CO2/carbon tax (yeah, that will really help our economy... not).
Title: Re: Berliners call for SUV ban after fatal traffic accident
Post by: NomisR on September 09, 2019, 09:48:26 AM
People on a certain political spectrum likes to point to Europe and says we need to be like you guys, and when people point out the slippery slope theory, they call the critics exaggerating and fear mongering, yet we have exactly the same slippery slope phenomenon that people have been pointing to. 

Just curious, do people that support these policies not own cars?
Title: Re: Berliners call for SUV ban after fatal traffic accident
Post by: Submariner on September 09, 2019, 09:50:41 AM
That "teen" Tina looks 40.
Title: Re: Berliners call for SUV ban after fatal traffic accident
Post by: FoMoJo on September 09, 2019, 09:56:20 AM
Quote from: cawimmer430 on September 09, 2019, 09:09:49 AM
Yes. That's a radical anti-car group.

Unbelievable what is happening here. There was a funny quote in that article from some radical cunt from Greenpeace. She claims that "Carmakers are like heroin dealers. Getting people hooked on their product. And Volkswagen is about to offer their clients more heroin in the form of electric cars."  :facepalm: :facepalm: :facepalm:

If public transportation were fast, efficient and if you didn't have to wait forever for it to arrive, then maybe more people would take it. As it turns out, the overrated German public transportation system such as S-Bahns and U-Bahns are slow, inefficient and you have to wait forever at your station for one to arrive. No wonder people are taking their cars. Also, public transportation is expensive here, even with a year-long pass.

Sure people should be sensible about how they use their car. I tend to walk or take my bicycle around town. But if I have a project then I need my car and there's no way around that.
Rational discussion of the issue would be preferred.  You have to keep in mind that those who believe the science of climate change, and that global warming is being accelerated by the excessive burning of fossil fuels, have been shouting at brick walls...'fulminating at the void'...for  decades now, and even into 2nd and 3rd generations.  It must be getting frustrating for them to see such little progress and, primarily, the fact that those vested in fossil fuels have been able to control the politicians to do virtually nothing about it.
Title: Re: Berliners call for SUV ban after fatal traffic accident
Post by: NomisR on September 09, 2019, 10:19:54 AM
Quote from: FoMoJo on September 09, 2019, 09:56:20 AM
Rational discussion of the issue would be preferred.  You have to keep in mind that those who believe the science of climate change, and that global warming is being accelerated by the excessive burning of fossil fuels, have been shouting at brick walls...'fulminating at the void'...for  decades now, and even into 2nd and 3rd generations.  It must be getting frustrating for them to see such little progress and, primarily, the fact that those vested in fossil fuels have been able to control the politicians to do virtually nothing about it.

At least in the US, there's this...

https://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/full/10.1111/ajps.12221?campaign=wolearlyview

But we keep on looking to limit private companies while ignoring the government that can't be regulated to begin with.
Title: Re: Berliners call for SUV ban after fatal traffic accident
Post by: 12,000 RPM on September 09, 2019, 10:59:25 AM
Govt can be and is regulated :rolleyes:

When the governor of my state put our economy on the chopping block for that bathroom bill we got him the fuck outta there at the next election

Good luck getting that kind of prompt response to any big corporation fucking your shit up
Title: Re: Berliners call for SUV ban after fatal traffic accident
Post by: Galaxy on September 09, 2019, 11:06:38 AM
"Hundreds" of people protesting in a city of 3.6 Million is not really relevant. You will always have idiots.
Title: Re: Berliners call for SUV ban after fatal traffic accident
Post by: NomisR on September 09, 2019, 11:22:14 AM
Quote from: 12,000 RPM on September 09, 2019, 10:59:25 AM
Govt can be and is regulated :rolleyes:

When the governor of my state put our economy on the chopping block for that bathroom bill we got him the fuck outta there at the next election

Good luck getting that kind of prompt response to any big corporation fucking your shit up

Government are rarely held accountable especially to the same degree as private industry.  Try again.
Title: Re: Berliners call for SUV ban after fatal traffic accident
Post by: 12,000 RPM on September 09, 2019, 11:33:00 AM
Quote from: NomisR on September 09, 2019, 11:22:14 AM
Government are rarely held accountable especially to the same degree as private industry.  Try again.
If you say so
Title: Re: Berliners call for SUV ban after fatal traffic accident
Post by: NomisR on September 09, 2019, 12:03:46 PM
Quote from: 12,000 RPM on September 09, 2019, 11:33:00 AM
If you say so

:rolleyes:

http://archive.news.indiana.edu/releases/iu/2015/10/when-governments-regulate-governments.shtml

Government holding government responsible?  Again, look at the latest cases with the DoJ...
Title: Re: Berliners call for SUV ban after fatal traffic accident
Post by: CaminoRacer on September 09, 2019, 12:07:49 PM
Quote from: NomisR on September 09, 2019, 12:03:46 PM
:rolleyes:

http://archive.news.indiana.edu/releases/iu/2015/10/when-governments-regulate-governments.shtml

Government holding government responsible?  Again, look at the latest cases with the DoJ...

The citizens are the ones supposed to hold the government accountable. We do a terrible job of it.
Title: Re: Berliners call for SUV ban after fatal traffic accident
Post by: NomisR on September 09, 2019, 12:10:45 PM
Quote from: CaminoRacer on September 09, 2019, 12:07:49 PM
The citizens are the ones supposed to hold the government accountable. We do a terrible job of it.

We can get rid of the politicians and there's still a huge group of unelected "officials" that we can't touch because of union. 
Title: Re: Berliners call for SUV ban after fatal traffic accident
Post by: FoMoJo on September 09, 2019, 12:42:30 PM
Quote from: NomisR on September 09, 2019, 12:10:45 PM
We can get rid of the politicians and there's still a huge group of unelected "officials" that we can't touch because of union. 
Typically, they are the ones that have a useful function; not saying they do that function well.
Title: Re: Berliners call for SUV ban after fatal traffic accident
Post by: MX793 on September 09, 2019, 04:36:20 PM
I'm kind of surprised there aren't mass movements to ban smoking/cigarettes in Germany.  Cigarette consumption, per capita, is quite high (1.6x the US).  It produces pollution, is harmful, if not deadly, both to the smoker and bystanders subjected to second-hand smoke alike.
Title: Re: Berliners call for SUV ban after fatal traffic accident
Post by: Payman on September 10, 2019, 04:07:49 AM
Quote from: Galaxy on September 09, 2019, 11:06:38 AM
"Hundreds" of people protesting in a city of 3.6 Million is not really relevant. You will always have idiots.

This. Nothing to see here, move along.
Title: Re: Berliners call for SUV ban after fatal traffic accident
Post by: cawimmer430 on September 10, 2019, 04:24:43 AM
Quote from: MX793 on September 09, 2019, 04:36:20 PM
I'm kind of surprised there aren't mass movements to ban smoking/cigarettes in Germany.  Cigarette consumption, per capita, is quite high (1.6x the US).  It produces pollution, is harmful, if not deadly, both to the smoker and bystanders subjected to second-hand smoke alike.

THIS!

It's almost comical how these environmental groups are pushing for car-free cities because of pollutants, but have not yet forcefully addressed smoking, especially smoking in public.

In the summers I refuse to eat outside in beer gardens or restaurants because I want to enjoy my food/drink - and not inhale the second hand smoke that's all around me. Some people even smoke while they eat - disgusting.
Title: Re: Berliners call for SUV ban after fatal traffic accident
Post by: cawimmer430 on September 10, 2019, 04:30:09 AM
Quote from: NomisR on September 09, 2019, 09:48:26 AM
Just curious, do people that support these policies not own cars?

The irony is that in Germany many Green Party voters are from the wealthier classes and drive (among others) big luxury SUVs. There's a cliche here that these people live in big mansion-like homes, have a fleet of fuel-thirsty luxury cars, travel around the world by [private] jet and live a very high-CO2-output lifestyle. They vote Green as a sort of penance for all of their "sins".

We have a saying here: "Grüne Politik muss man sich leisten können!, an allure to the fact that life under a Green Party is going to be very expensive and full of radical changes.

But to answer your question, many of these people hating on SUVs do not have cars, or they have sensible small cars and think they are doing less damage to the environment because of that.

Title: Re: Berliners call for SUV ban after fatal traffic accident
Post by: cawimmer430 on September 10, 2019, 04:30:51 AM
Quote from: Submariner on September 09, 2019, 09:50:41 AM
That "teen" Tina looks 40.

It's probably the drug cocktails that she consumes on a daily basis. They make her look old. :lol:
Title: Re: Berliners call for SUV ban after fatal traffic accident
Post by: cawimmer430 on September 10, 2019, 04:36:37 AM
Quote from: FoMoJo on September 09, 2019, 09:56:20 AM
Rational discussion of the issue would be preferred.  You have to keep in mind that those who believe the science of climate change, and that global warming is being accelerated by the excessive burning of fossil fuels, have been shouting at brick walls...'fulminating at the void'...for  decades now, and even into 2nd and 3rd generations.  It must be getting frustrating for them to see such little progress and, primarily, the fact that those vested in fossil fuels have been able to control the politicians to do virtually nothing about it.

I know, I know. I am passionate about cars so I view this as an attack on my passion and hobby. And in a way it is. These people are calling for a car-free world. It's insane. What's next? A world in which air travel is forbidden? We will always need cars, trucks, airplanes, ships, trains, scooters and other forms of mobility. Yes, their power sources need to change and become cleaner but that will take time.

Emissions-free driving will be the future, but this is a process which won't happen overnight. Our politicians want a CO2-free Europe by 2050; I think that's impossible unless they enact radical dictatorship type of laws, which with the EU is a possibility. The EU is not a democracy.

But you know, for me the bigger problem is the rapid human population explosion. For me that's the biggest contributing factor to global warming. More people means more space, which means more forests are cut down to create space. More food is needed (food production = very CO2 intensive), more homes, more electricity etc. Every week there are 1 million babies born in Africa. Whatever the West does to lower CO2 emissions is for me a waste of time. We need to stop the population explosion in Africa, Asia and elsewhere. Too many people = too many problems.
Title: Re: Berliners call for SUV ban after fatal traffic accident
Post by: NomisR on September 10, 2019, 09:37:02 AM
Quote from: cawimmer430 on September 10, 2019, 04:30:09 AM
The irony is that in Germany many Green Party voters are from the wealthier classes and drive (among others) big luxury SUVs. There's a cliche here that these people live in big mansion-like homes, have a fleet of fuel-thirsty luxury cars, travel around the world by [private] jet and live a very high-CO2-output lifestyle. They vote Green as a sort of penance for all of their "sins".

We have a saying here: "Grüne Politik muss man sich leisten können!, an allure to the fact that life under a Green Party is going to be very expensive and full of radical changes.

But to answer your question, many of these people hating on SUVs do not have cars, or they have sensible small cars and think they are doing less damage to the environment because of that.



Shouldn't they be abandoning cars altogether?    Then again, when you look at the study about people who believe in climate change, it appears that people who don't believe in climate change act in a more eco friendly matter than those who do.  Same apply to those that believes in bigger government are less likely to donate to charitable causes than those who don't.  :huh: 
Title: Re: Berliners call for SUV ban after fatal traffic accident
Post by: Laconian on September 10, 2019, 11:57:49 AM
Quote from: NomisR on September 10, 2019, 09:37:02 AM
Shouldn't they be abandoning cars altogether?    Then again, when you look at the study about people who believe in climate change, it appears that people who don't believe in climate change act in a more eco friendly matter than those who do.  Same apply to those that believes in bigger government are less likely to donate to charitable causes than those who don't.  :huh: 

Awesome strawman, really terrific! Everybody is equally bad, so let's not do anything. Yes.

Well developed mass transit means car ownership is effectively optional in many western European cities. Increasing of Europeans are taking trains instead of planes because of the environmental costs - +10% YOY ridership growth during peak tourism season.
Title: Re: Berliners call for SUV ban after fatal traffic accident
Post by: Xer0 on September 10, 2019, 01:58:11 PM
Wimmer, I feel like you need to make an "everything wrong in Germany" thread to compile the long list of things that irk you.  It would be fun to look through it and see how these evolve as the years go.

Quote from: Laconian on September 10, 2019, 11:57:49 AM
Awesome strawman, really terrific! Everybody is equally bad, so let's not do anything. Yes.

Well developed mass transit means car ownership is effectively optional in many western European cities. Increasing of Europeans are taking trains instead of planes because of the environmental costs - +10% YOY ridership growth during peak tourism season.

European trains ain't got nothing on the Japanese.  Now those guys have got the public transit system down.
Title: Re: Berliners call for SUV ban after fatal traffic accident
Post by: FoMoJo on September 10, 2019, 01:59:22 PM
Quote from: cawimmer430 on September 10, 2019, 04:36:37 AM
I know, I know. I am passionate about cars so I view this as an attack on my passion and hobby. And in a way it is. These people are calling for a car-free world. It's insane. What's next? A world in which air travel is forbidden? We will always need cars, trucks, airplanes, ships, trains, scooters and other forms of mobility. Yes, their power sources need to change and become cleaner but that will take time.

Emissions-free driving will be the future, but this is a process which won't happen overnight. Our politicians want a CO2-free Europe by 2050; I think that's impossible unless they enact radical dictatorship type of laws, which with the EU is a possibility. The EU is not a democracy.

But you know, for me the bigger problem is the rapid human population explosion. For me that's the biggest contributing factor to global warming. More people means more space, which means more forests are cut down to create space. More food is needed (food production = very CO2 intensive), more homes, more electricity etc. Every week there are 1 million babies born in Africa. Whatever the West does to lower CO2 emissions is for me a waste of time. We need to stop the population explosion in Africa, Asia and elsewhere. Too many people = too many problems.
I like cars too.  My favourites are the ones that pollute the most; '60s muscle cars. :ohyeah:

Certainly, the transition to clean energy must be done in stages and won't happen overnight.  Much progress has already been made, but it will take time to get to a safe level.  In the meantime, it's best just to ignore the 'looney left' as well as the 'radical right'.

As for overpopulation, that's true, but almost impossible to stop.
Title: Re: Berliners call for SUV ban after fatal traffic accident
Post by: Laconian on September 10, 2019, 02:21:06 PM
Quote from: Xer0 on September 10, 2019, 01:58:11 PM
European trains ain't got nothing on the Japanese.  Now those guys have got the public transit system down.

Japanese mass transit seriously turns me on. Oh my god. I was kind of looking forward to riding in a Toyota Crown cab, but after experiencing the extreme convenience and reliability of their subway, I kept thinking "why the hell would I ride in a car?!"
Title: Re: Berliners call for SUV ban after fatal traffic accident
Post by: GoCougs on September 10, 2019, 02:31:43 PM
Quote from: Xer0 on September 10, 2019, 01:58:11 PM
European trains ain't got nothing on the Japanese.  Now those guys have got the public transit system down.

The Japanese do, and it is a center point in the two-decade long decline of their culture - too expensive, too crowded, too inflexible. Great for visitors but those poor people are fooked in the long run.
Title: Re: Berliners call for SUV ban after fatal traffic accident
Post by: Xer0 on September 10, 2019, 02:43:50 PM
Quote from: GoCougs on September 10, 2019, 02:31:43 PM
The Japanese do, and it is a center point in the two-decade long decline of their culture - too expensive, too crowded, too inflexible. Great for visitors but those poor people are fooked in the long run.

The Japanese are just not having sex and are selectively choosing to not continue their culture by getting old and leaving behind no kids, I don't think that a great public transit system is the cause of this though  :hmm:
Title: Re: Berliners call for SUV ban after fatal traffic accident
Post by: GoCougs on September 10, 2019, 02:46:52 PM
Quote from: NomisR on September 10, 2019, 09:37:02 AM
Shouldn't they be abandoning cars altogether?    Then again, when you look at the study about people who believe in climate change, it appears that people who don't believe in climate change act in a more eco friendly matter than those who do.  Same apply to those that believes in bigger government are less likely to donate to charitable causes than those who don't.  :huh: 

The #2 principal refutation point of Global Warming is the bigger the advocate, the bigger the violator, running up the entire chain to the biggest violator on the planet, the US military ("GW will destabilize the world, so you must give use trillion$ for us to spend to be 'prepared'" (i.e., continue to be the planet's largest consumer of fossil fuels (and polluter in general))).

Once WtP see the politicians, celebrities and CEOs eschew their mansions and vacation homes and yachts and private flights and luxo vehicles, I think WtP will start to maybe take GW seriously, or at least think about looking at it.
Title: Re: Berliners call for SUV ban after fatal traffic accident
Post by: GoCougs on September 10, 2019, 02:51:29 PM
Quote from: Xer0 on September 10, 2019, 02:43:50 PM
The Japanese are just not having sex and are selectively choosing to not continue their culture by getting old and leaving behind no kids, I don't think that a great public transit system is the cause of this though  :hmm:

Because it's so crowded, expensive, and restrictive due to widespread public transportation - having relationships and babies is just one more expense and stressor that isn't worth it.
Title: Re: Berliners call for SUV ban after fatal traffic accident
Post by: NomisR on September 10, 2019, 03:01:39 PM
Quote from: Laconian on September 10, 2019, 11:57:49 AM
Awesome strawman, really terrific! Everybody is equally bad, so let's not do anything. Yes.

Well developed mass transit means car ownership is effectively optional in many western European cities. Increasing of Europeans are taking trains instead of planes because of the environmental costs - +10% YOY ridership growth during peak tourism season.

If you believe that much about it and believe that it's going to be the end of the world, why shouldn't you give up cars, planes, eating meat, smaller homes and everything else.  This is more the case of Ralph in the Simpsons saying "I did something" when all these people did was to vote to take away the rights of everyone else or in reality, make it more expensive so us plebeians can't afford the luxuries that destroys the climate while the "elites" still continues to enjoy the luxuries while lecturing us that we need to all cut back.  They're not leading by example but instead, telling others to cut back but they're the good guys because they support the initiative to have the government tell people to cut back.   
Title: Re: Berliners call for SUV ban after fatal traffic accident
Post by: NomisR on September 10, 2019, 03:04:11 PM
Quote from: Laconian on September 10, 2019, 02:21:06 PM
Japanese mass transit seriously turns me on. Oh my god. I was kind of looking forward to riding in a Toyota Crown cab, but after experiencing the extreme convenience and reliability of their subway, I kept thinking "why the hell would I ride in a car?!"

Mass transit is great for younger people without kids but is it really that great once you get up there in age or you have kids?  While I was in Taiwan, while mass transit is almost as convenient as it is in Japan, it's much easier to get a personal transport vehicle to transport your whole family. 
Title: Re: Berliners call for SUV ban after fatal traffic accident
Post by: CaminoRacer on September 10, 2019, 03:27:15 PM
Quote from: FoMoJo on September 10, 2019, 01:59:22 PM
I like cars too.  My favourites are the ones that pollute the most; '60s muscle cars. :ohyeah:

Certainly, the transition to clean energy must be done in stages and won't happen overnight.  Much progress has already been made, but it will take time to get to a safe level.  In the meantime, it's best just to ignore the 'looney left' as well as the 'radical right'.

As for overpopulation, that's true, but almost impossible to stop.

I think I'm gonna add catalytic converters to the El Camino. Flowmaster makes universal ones that don't really restrict the flow so you lose <5 hp. And then I wouldn't be contributing nearly as much to the worsening smog around here. And I wouldn't smell like gas as bad after driving it.
Title: Re: Berliners call for SUV ban after fatal traffic accident
Post by: FoMoJo on September 10, 2019, 03:36:19 PM
Quote from: CaminoRacer on September 10, 2019, 03:27:15 PM
I think I'm gonna add catalytic converters to the El Camino. Flowmaster makes universal ones that don't really restrict the flow so you lose <5 hp. And then I wouldn't be contributing nearly as much to the worsening smog around here. And I wouldn't smell like gas as bad after driving it.
Well, smelling like gas was always one of the benefits of driving a '60s muscle car.  Love the smell of raw gasoline, however, not particularly appreciated by rest of normal society.  Always best to do your bit to promote a cleaner environment. Kudos.
Title: Re: Berliners call for SUV ban after fatal traffic accident
Post by: Soup DeVille on September 10, 2019, 03:38:35 PM
Quote from: CaminoRacer on September 10, 2019, 03:27:15 PM
I think I'm gonna add catalytic converters to the El Camino. Flowmaster makes universal ones that don't really restrict the flow so you lose <5 hp. And then I wouldn't be contributing nearly as much to the worsening smog around here. And I wouldn't smell like gas as bad after driving it.

Cats and an EGR valve will take care of about 85% of the difference. Neither hurt performance
Title: Re: Berliners call for SUV ban after fatal traffic accident
Post by: Xer0 on September 10, 2019, 03:49:43 PM
Quote from: NomisR on September 10, 2019, 03:04:11 PM
Mass transit is great for younger people without kids but is it really that great once you get up there in age or you have kids?  While I was in Taiwan, while mass transit is almost as convenient as it is in Japan, it's much easier to get a personal transport vehicle to transport your whole family.

While I understand that public transit tends to suck and be very inconvenient for a family, I don't see how the trend line goes "great public transit->declining birth rates".  I kinda feel like they are separate and one doesn't cause the other.
Title: Re: Berliners call for SUV ban after fatal traffic accident
Post by: Soup DeVille on September 10, 2019, 03:51:43 PM
Quote from: Xer0 on September 10, 2019, 03:49:43 PM
While I understand that public transit tends to suck and be very inconvenient for a family, I don't see how the trend line goes "great public transit->declining birth rates".  I kinda feel like they are separate and one doesn't cause the other.

Much harder to get knocked up in the backseat.
Title: Re: Berliners call for SUV ban after fatal traffic accident
Post by: NomisR on September 10, 2019, 04:06:29 PM
Quote from: Xer0 on September 10, 2019, 03:49:43 PM
While I understand that public transit tends to suck and be very inconvenient for a family, I don't see how the trend line goes "great public transit->declining birth rates".  I kinda feel like they are separate and one doesn't cause the other.

Yeah, not sure where that's headed.  There's a completely different issue with Japan, although, on public transportations men today make an effort to make their hands visible so they don't get accused of anything.. so there's that..

Quote from: Soup DeVille on September 10, 2019, 03:51:43 PM
Much harder to get knocked up in the backseat.

Chikan?
Title: Re: Berliners call for SUV ban after fatal traffic accident
Post by: MX793 on September 10, 2019, 07:14:04 PM
Quote from: Soup DeVille on September 10, 2019, 03:51:43 PM
Much harder to get knocked up in the backseat.

I seem to recall a story about Henry Ford reducing the size of the rear seats in the Model T after reading that a sizable portion of children were being conceived in the back seat of his cars.
Title: Re: Berliners call for SUV ban after fatal traffic accident
Post by: r0tor on September 10, 2019, 07:20:08 PM
It's the lack of drifting to make girls pants fall down that's the problem.
Title: Re: Berliners call for SUV ban after fatal traffic accident
Post by: Laconian on September 10, 2019, 07:25:54 PM
Quote from: MX793 on September 10, 2019, 07:14:04 PM
I seem to recall a story about Henry Ford reducing the size of the rear seats in the Model T after reading that a sizable portion of children were being conceived in the back seat of his cars.

Sounds apocryphal...
Title: Re: Berliners call for SUV ban after fatal traffic accident
Post by: MX793 on September 10, 2019, 07:30:34 PM
Quote from: Laconian on September 10, 2019, 07:25:54 PM
Sounds apocryphal...

Found it

https://www.learner.org/series/biographyofamerica/prog20/transcript/page03.html (https://www.learner.org/series/biographyofamerica/prog20/transcript/page03.html)

QuoteAnd boys started picking up girls at their homes and taking them for joyrides, moving courtship from the front porch to the back seat of the family Ford. Ever the prude, Ford tried to discourage this by making smaller back seats. But with the Model T being a full seven feet high, couples -- it became the joke -- could make love standing up.

Recall hearing it somewhere else, as well.  Maybe in the "Cars that Built America" documentary miniseries on History?
Title: Re: Berliners call for SUV ban after fatal traffic accident
Post by: cawimmer430 on September 11, 2019, 02:54:39 AM
Quote from: NomisR on September 10, 2019, 09:37:02 AM
Shouldn't they be abandoning cars altogether?    Then again, when you look at the study about people who believe in climate change, it appears that people who don't believe in climate change act in a more eco friendly matter than those who do.  Same apply to those that believes in bigger government are less likely to donate to charitable causes than those who don't.  :huh: 

What is the alternative? People in cities could theoretically make it through the day without a car, but the people living in the provinces require a car. The much applauded "efficient and reliable German public transportation" system is a joke, especially the railways which have been privatized and are now managed in such a way that they have low expenses and maximum profit - the railways here suck.

Climate change is occurring, but I just don't see how we can stop it. The figures which we get from the critics are that 96% of CO2 is made by nature and 4% by man. How can this influence our global climate? I think we have to adapt to climate change. Attempting to "stop" or "slow it down" seem like a waste of time, money and resources to me, especially because decarbonization is expensive and we are a carbon/fossil fuel society.

Today in the Bundestag Field Marshall Angela von Paulus, eh, Merkel, basically stated that Germany is going to do everything in its power to become CO2 neutral. Great. Life here is going to become even more expensive and so will food, car ownership etc.  :banghead:
Title: Re: Berliners call for SUV ban after fatal traffic accident
Post by: cawimmer430 on September 11, 2019, 02:59:16 AM
Quote from: Xer0 on September 10, 2019, 01:58:11 PM
Wimmer, I feel like you need to make an "everything wrong in Germany" thread to compile the long list of things that irk you.  It would be fun to look through it and see how these evolve as the years go.

Trust me, there's so much crap happening here and it boggles the mind. But Germans keep voting for the political parties that want to remain on the same path. It's infuriating.



Quote from: Xer0 on September 10, 2019, 01:58:11 PMEuropean trains ain't got nothing on the Japanese.  Now those guys have got the public transit system down.

Yep. Recently read an article where Japan has a new generation of Shinkansen trains which reaches speeds of up to 400 km/h between cities which are only 50 km (so like 25 miles) apart.

The last time I took a train from Munich to Hamburg using an Intercity Express Train, that piece of shit slugged along at speeds between 90 and 120 km/h with the occasional burst into the 140 km/h section. Pathetically slow. And that's the best and "fastest" train in Germany. Our railway network is a joke and our railways are not designed for high speed. And that's the reason why the Intercity trains are so slow despite them actually being capable of much higher speeds.
Title: Re: Berliners call for SUV ban after fatal traffic accident
Post by: cawimmer430 on September 11, 2019, 03:06:53 AM
Quote from: FoMoJo on September 10, 2019, 01:59:22 PM
I like cars too.  My favourites are the ones that pollute the most; '60s muscle cars. :ohyeah:

Certainly, the transition to clean energy must be done in stages and won't happen overnight.  Much progress has already been made, but it will take time to get to a safe level.  In the meantime, it's best just to ignore the 'looney left' as well as the 'radical right'.

As for overpopulation, that's true, but almost impossible to stop.

Agreed.

But what's happening in my country is pure idiocy. We have a lack of EV charging infrastructure, a lack of EV choices and energy supply problems - and still the government wants to make owning ICE-powered cars more expensive so that Germany can reach its CO2 emission goals set by the Paris Climate Accords.

Meanwhile, millions of Germans still depend on their cars to get to work because they have working times at which no public transport system is active, or they work somewhere where there is no public transport or if they used our slow and unreliable public transport system they'd arrive late for work.

Before the government makes owning ICE cars artificially more expensive, they need to invest in the infrastructure for EVs etc. This takes decades. But not in Crap Hole Germany. Here we have no EV charging infrastructure and things are being set in place to make owning ICE cars hell on earth. Now they want to introduce a carbon tax... and furthermore Germany is about to enter a recession and the government wants to further increase taxes... it's madness.  :(
Title: Re: Berliners call for SUV ban after fatal traffic accident
Post by: giant_mtb on September 11, 2019, 06:57:25 AM
Quote from: cawimmer430 on September 11, 2019, 02:54:39 AM
What is the alternative? People in cities could theoretically make it through the day without a car, but the people living in the provinces require a car. The much applauded "efficient and reliable German public transportation" system is a joke, especially the railways which have been privatized and are now managed in such a way that they have low expenses and maximum profit - the railways here suck.

Climate change is occurring, but I just don't see how we can stop it. The figures which we get from the critics are that 96% of CO2 is made by nature and 4% by man. How can this influence our global climate? I think we have to adapt to climate change. Attempting to "stop" or "slow it down" seem like a waste of time, money and resources to me, especially because decarbonization is expensive and we are a carbon/fossil fuel society.

Today in the Bundestag Field Marshall Angela von Paulus, eh, Merkel, basically stated that Germany is going to do everything in its power to become CO2 neutral. Great. Life here is going to become even more expensive and so will food, car ownership etc.  :banghead:

You ever heard of methane?
Title: Re: Berliners call for SUV ban after fatal traffic accident
Post by: Xer0 on September 11, 2019, 08:32:28 AM
Quote from: Soup DeVille on September 10, 2019, 03:51:43 PM
Much harder to get knocked up in the backseat.

Some crazy shit happens in the back of the L trains in Chicago.
Title: Re: Berliners call for SUV ban after fatal traffic accident
Post by: CaminoRacer on September 11, 2019, 09:39:51 AM
Quote from: cawimmer430 on September 11, 2019, 03:06:53 AM
Agreed.

But what's happening in my country is pure idiocy. We have a lack of EV charging infrastructure, a lack of EV choices and energy supply problems - and still the government wants to make owning ICE-powered cars more expensive so that Germany can reach its CO2 emission goals set by the Paris Climate Accords.

Meanwhile, millions of Germans still depend on their cars to get to work because they have working times at which no public transport system is active, or they work somewhere where there is no public transport or if they used our slow and unreliable public transport system they'd arrive late for work.

Before the government makes owning ICE cars artificially more expensive, they need to invest in the infrastructure for EVs etc. This takes decades. But not in Crap Hole Germany. Here we have no EV charging infrastructure and things are being set in place to make owning ICE cars hell on earth. Now they want to introduce a carbon tax... and furthermore Germany is about to enter a recession and the government wants to further increase taxes... it's madness.  :(

But making things more expensive is how you encourage new solutions, like EV charging networks and better public transportation.

You may disagree with it, but it does make a bit of sense.
Title: Re: Berliners call for SUV ban after fatal traffic accident
Post by: Laconian on September 11, 2019, 10:54:04 AM
If Germany is serious, they need to get off coal. Too bad they're so uptight about nuclear.
Title: Re: Berliners call for SUV ban after fatal traffic accident
Post by: AutobahnSHO on September 11, 2019, 11:26:11 AM
Quote from: Laconian on September 11, 2019, 10:54:04 AM
If Germany is serious, they need to get off coal. Too bad they're so uptight about nuclear.

+1
Title: Re: Berliners call for SUV ban after fatal traffic accident
Post by: NomisR on September 11, 2019, 12:27:53 PM
Quote from: Laconian on September 11, 2019, 10:54:04 AM
If Germany is serious, they need to get off coal. Too bad they're so uptight about nuclear.

What's the actual reasoning behind this?
Title: Re: Berliners call for SUV ban after fatal traffic accident
Post by: Xer0 on September 11, 2019, 12:35:27 PM
Quote from: NomisR on September 11, 2019, 12:27:53 PM
What's the actual reasoning behind this?

Nuclear is pretty scary for a lot of people and I'm sure the recent HBO series about Chernobyl freaked a bunch of people out.  Even France is scaling back its Nuclear reactors and isn't building new ones to replace its older units, IIRC. 
Title: Re: Berliners call for SUV ban after fatal traffic accident
Post by: NomisR on September 11, 2019, 12:42:40 PM
Quote from: Xer0 on September 11, 2019, 12:35:27 PM
Nuclear is pretty scary for a lot of people and I'm sure the recent HBO series about Chernobyl freaked a bunch of people out.  Even France is scaling back its Nuclear reactors and isn't building new ones to replace its older units, IIRC. 

Fearmongering I suppose.  People forgetting the Chernobyl incident is a completely different design compared to the west, Fukushima is a 50 year old design that is no longer used and current one would not have had the same issues, and 3 mile island the effects was negligible. 
Title: Re: Berliners call for SUV ban after fatal traffic accident
Post by: Laconian on September 11, 2019, 12:44:51 PM
Quote from: Xer0 on September 11, 2019, 12:35:27 PM
Nuclear is pretty scary for a lot of people and I'm sure the recent HBO series about Chernobyl freaked a bunch of people out.  Even France is scaling back its Nuclear reactors and isn't building new ones to replace its older units, IIRC. 

AFAIK the actual Chernobyl event already had them freaked out, but the Fukushima disaster was the final nail in the coffin.
Title: Re: Berliners call for SUV ban after fatal traffic accident
Post by: GoCougs on September 11, 2019, 12:54:18 PM
Chernobyl and Fukishima were just steps away from being 10-1000x worse, which could've rendered uninhabitable entire countries. Overall a good track record of safety but just ONE bad mistake would be infinitely worse than the sum total benefit; IOW, for most, the risk/reward ratio doesn't pan out.
Title: Re: Berliners call for SUV ban after fatal traffic accident
Post by: FoMoJo on September 11, 2019, 01:36:54 PM
Quote from: GoCougs on September 11, 2019, 12:54:18 PM
Chernobyl and Fukishima were just steps away from being 10-1000x worse, which could've rendered uninhabitable entire countries. Overall a good track record of safety but just ONE bad mistake would be infinitely worse than the sum total benefit; IOW, for most, the risk/reward ratio doesn't pan out.
Lessons learned, don't build shitty reactors or reactors that are vulnerable to natural elements, earthquakes, tsunamis, floods, etc.  Nuclear is still a good option when done right.
Title: Re: Berliners call for SUV ban after fatal traffic accident
Post by: CaminoRacer on September 11, 2019, 01:42:36 PM
Quote from: FoMoJo on September 11, 2019, 01:36:54 PM
Lessons learned, don't build shitty reactors or reactors that are vulnerable to natural elements, earthquakes, tsunamis, floods, etc.  Nuclear is still a good option when done right.

And don't be part of the USSR where they constantly did sketchy stuff.
Title: Re: Berliners call for SUV ban after fatal traffic accident
Post by: FoMoJo on September 11, 2019, 01:52:49 PM
Quote from: CaminoRacer on September 11, 2019, 01:42:36 PM
And don't be part of the USSR where they constantly did sketchy stuff.
Although each/most participating nations have their own Atomic/Nuclear Commission, it would seem that the International Atomic Energy Agency (IAEA) should have more teeth to ensure that all nations with nuclear capabilities must meet stringent standards with nuclear energy plants.  If the world wasn't so stupid, this would have happened long ago.
Title: Re: Berliners call for SUV ban after fatal traffic accident
Post by: NomisR on September 11, 2019, 01:53:14 PM
Quote from: CaminoRacer on September 11, 2019, 01:42:36 PM
And don't be part of the USSR where they constantly did sketchy stuff.

I can't really imagine China being that much better.  That 3 Gorge dam is just a disaster waiting to happen.
Title: Re: Berliners call for SUV ban after fatal traffic accident
Post by: Galaxy on September 11, 2019, 02:22:12 PM
Quote from: cawimmer430 on September 11, 2019, 03:06:53 AM

Before the government makes owning ICE cars artificially more expensive, they need to invest in the infrastructure for EVs etc. This takes decades.

The government does not need to do anything it is private companies, and individuals that need to step up the game. The government should only set the ground rules. I do not want the government building a charger network.

It did not take Tesla that long to build their network. VW built over 4000 chargers in the US in under one year.

Is it a challenge? Yes. But I think it is becoming apparent that fossil fuels just have to many downsides.

One current example: Our neighbors from the Netherlands today announced that they are stopping natural gas extraction (Trump must be on the phone already) in 2022, after it was confirmed in the last few month that the earth quake in 2012 was due to natural gas extraction, and that a large % of the ground in the Netherlands is in danger of collapsing.

Quote from: Laconian on September 11, 2019, 10:54:04 AM
If Germany is serious, they need to get off coal. Too bad they're so uptight about nuclear.

Yeah, the coal is a black eye for the country really, and one can't really say that we are governed by Eco-terrorists when we in 2018 used eminent domain against an entire village of some ~100 people to strip mine the place.

Quote from: NomisR on September 11, 2019, 12:27:53 PM
What's the actual reasoning behind this?

Germany is still impacted by Chernobyl today. Every wild boar hunted needs to be tested for radiation, in some countries in southern Germany 2/3 shot are disposed off as radioactive waste. The wild boars in Germany are more contaminated then the average apple in Chernobyl today. It is a food chain problem. Chernobyl dumped radioactive Caesium over Germany, mushrooms soak that up like a sponge, and the wild boars eat the mushrooms.

Fukushima was basically the final straw. If the human robots can not handle it safely then...

Quote from: NomisR on September 11, 2019, 12:42:40 PM
Fearmongering I suppose.  People forgetting the Chernobyl incident is a completely different design compared to the west, Fukushima is a 50 year old design that is no longer used and current one would not have had the same issues, and 3 mile island the effects was negligible. 

The question is what design errors do the modern reactors have that has gone unnoticed? Some of the new reactor proposals use sodium for cooling. Every thrown sodium into water in school? The engineers say "We have water proofed the reactor, no water can reach the sodium, we can guarantee it." No they can't.

Title: Re: Berliners call for SUV ban after fatal traffic accident
Post by: r0tor on September 11, 2019, 08:18:06 PM
It should be noted that 3 mile Island was just about an epic disaster.  The people on the scene were pretty convinced they had a bubble under the containment dome that was going to blow up... and they did but thankfully it didn't blow up
Title: Re: Berliners call for SUV ban after fatal traffic accident
Post by: NomisR on September 12, 2019, 10:28:38 AM
Quote from: Galaxy on September 11, 2019, 02:22:12 PM
Germany is still impacted by Chernobyl today. Every wild boar hunted needs to be tested for radiation, in some countries in southern Germany 2/3 shot are disposed off as radioactive waste. The wild boars in Germany are more contaminated then the average apple in Chernobyl today. It is a food chain problem. Chernobyl dumped radioactive Caesium over Germany, mushrooms soak that up like a sponge, and the wild boars eat the mushrooms.

Fukushima was basically the final straw. If the human robots can not handle it safely then...

It took a 9.0 earthquake with an outdated reactor design for this to happen though.

Quote

The question is what design errors do the modern reactors have that has gone unnoticed? Some of the new reactor proposals use sodium for cooling. Every thrown sodium into water in school? The engineers say "We have water proofed the reactor, no water can reach the sodium, we can guarantee it." No they can't.


Of course, but when you look at things like the mini nuclear reactors that's been developed in recent years, that seems like a better idea or at least a lot less risky and more self contained as they're already buried. 

Quote from: r0tor on September 11, 2019, 08:18:06 PM
It should be noted that 3 mile Island was just about an epic disaster.  The people on the scene were pretty convinced they had a bubble under the containment dome that was going to blow up... and they did but thankfully it didn't blow up

Would modern computer systems eliminate more of the errors that have occurred in 3 mile island though?
Title: Re: Berliners call for SUV ban after fatal traffic accident
Post by: shp4man on September 12, 2019, 01:39:11 PM
San Onofre, the nuke power station closest to San Diego, got shut down recently.
It was built in 1966.
So some cooling pipes were old and in need of replacement, and the replacement parts were made in China.
Would you want to live close to a nuke power plant with parts made in China?  :lol:
So of course the parts failed, caused some radiation leaks, and they shut it down permanently.
The spent fuel since 66 is still stored there because they can't find a place that will take it.
This is the problem with nukes.
Title: Re: Berliners call for SUV ban after fatal traffic accident
Post by: cawimmer430 on September 12, 2019, 04:56:53 PM
Quote from: giant_mtb on September 11, 2019, 06:57:25 AM
You ever heard of methane?

Is that the stuff that powers the Galaxy Class starships of the Federation? :praise:
Title: Re: Berliners call for SUV ban after fatal traffic accident
Post by: cawimmer430 on September 12, 2019, 05:42:07 PM
Quote from: CaminoRacer on September 11, 2019, 09:39:51 AM
But making things more expensive is how you encourage new solutions, like EV charging networks and better public transportation.

You may disagree with it, but it does make a bit of sense.

Sure, but there are so many problems that I can think off that result from this. My biggest complaint is:

They are literally forcing everyone in this country to sell their ICE cars and buy an EV or Fuel Cell vehicle - despite the infrastructure not being there. There are not even enough EV choices on the market.

And this brings up some other questions or problems such as what's going to happen to those German ICE cars? Are they going to be wrecked? The most likely scenario is that these vehicles are going to be exported to Eastern Europe and Africa (that's where most older cars from Germany end up) where their anti-pollution systems are the first items which are removed.

How is that going to reduce global CO2 emissions? Our ICE cars are just going to be polluting somewhere else and emit more toxins and more CO2.

Germany has become a cheap labor country. There are many poorer people here who depend on their older cars to get to work or their various jobs (yep, jobs) because our [expensive] public transport can't bring them there or bring them there on time. Fuel prices here are already insane and these people can barely afford to keep their car running. How are they supposed to buy a new car, much less an EV? Our government wants to screw us with a carbon tax which would increase the fuel prices by 10 cents per liter and gradually increase so that by the year 2030 we are going to pay 60 cents more per liter. Just the other day I fueled up my car at a price of 1.60 Euros per liter. OUCH. So by 2030 that would be 2.20+ Euros per liter! PER LITER!!!  :lockedup:

And to add to ^that^, those older cars are below current EURO6 emission standards which means these people may not be able to drive their cars into some cities. They are literally being disowned and given no alternative to get around. Again, our public transport system is overrated, overburdened, unreliable, unsafe, expensive and non-existent outside of major cities.


My second complaint is.

Which countries in the world are going to follow Germany's disastrous renewable energy policy?

Merkel's stupidity has burdened us with the highest energy prices in Europe, if not the world. And electricity prices are about to get more expensive!

For your information, under Merkel we've shut down most of our nuclear power plants and are phasing out the few remaining ones. Our main source of energy is from our vast reserves of brown coal. To our credit, our brown coal power plants are some of the cleanest in the world with various pollutant filtration systems. But they don't filter out CO2, which is why the Greenies here are whining.

We already have power supply problems but the morons who are ruining this country want to shut down the brown coal power plants.

And then what? Wind and solar won't even provide 1/4th of our energy needs. In fact wind power plants are being built on forests which we're cutting down (how idiotic!) and they are being built as close to some towns as possible. Why do I mention this? Because some studies have shown that giant rotating propellers from wind power plants cause health problems to the people who live nearby in the form of low frequency waves. The wind power plants also shred an estimated millions of insects and birds and bats every year, so they're bad for the environment and people living nearby.

We don't have the landscape for hydroelectric power unlike Norway for example. We are already buying nuclear power from France and the Czech Republic or brown coal power from Poland if our energy grid is low on power. It's about to get worse if our coal power plants are taken off the grid. There's a serious chance of a blackout happening here.

Which countries are going to follow this disastrous example? The few countries with nuclear power will and should stick to it, and those that use coal power and other fossil fuels are very likely to stick with it because it's cheap, plentiful and it provides a reliable source of power.  ;)


And here's another thought.

The emerging markets are not going to switch to clean energy overnight because it's simply to expensive. The people in those countries don't want to be saddled with a high cost of living just to satisfy some unproven CO2 theories.

The people in those countries want to enjoy their newfound wealth. They want to drive nice cars (not EVs which they won't be able to charge...), they want to fly around the world and see other countries, they want to take a cruise on a ship, they want to enjoy meat etc. - all of which produces a ton of CO2.

There are no current programs in many countries to lower CO2 emissions. And there won't be when they see how ridiculous the program is in Germany and how badly it's failing - and how expensive it's becoming.

Also, what incentive do oil-rich countries have to switch to renewable energy? NONE. Oil is plentiful, cheap and it powers proven technology (internal combustion engines, jet engines and so forth) and is vital to their economy. Giving up on oil is bad for business and their economic prosperity.


I realize that eventually fossil-fueled cars, airplanes etc. are going to [have to] be replaced, but this takes time if you are going to do it properly. And it has to be affordable! And that's the problem. The way our government is making one retarded decision after the other, this whole "lowering our CO2 emissions" BS is going to cost us more and more and the results are not going to make a difference for decades. And the rest of the world, are they going along for the ride? Nope. India, China and Russia can supposedly emit as much CO2 as they want until 2030 when they suddenly have to lower their emissions (yeah right, they're going to give the retarded EU the middle finger...). The US? Well Trump gave the Paris Climate Accords the finger - and I doubt that the average American, just like the average German etc. - will want to give up their enjoyable lifestyle and pay even more for goods that they consume (fuel, meat etc.).

According to a German study the complete decarbonization of Germany is going to cost every single person in a German household 640,- Euros: per month. That's 7680,- Euros a year, and just for one person. A family of four? Whoa!!! And those 640,- Euros per person are just a rough estimate with potential rising cost per year!

Again, I personally view this whole climate change and CO2 hysteria rather relaxed. Is climate change real? Yes. Can we stop it or slow it down? I don't think so - unless it were truly a GLOBAL EFFORT - which will never happen in this world. Our best chances are to invest our resources into adapting to it and living with it. Just my two cents.

Sorry for the jumbled up writing style. I'm in bed on my iPad and about to fall asleep.  ;)
Title: Re: Berliners call for SUV ban after fatal traffic accident
Post by: cawimmer430 on September 12, 2019, 05:48:12 PM
Quote from: Galaxy on September 11, 2019, 02:22:12 PM
The government does not need to do anything it is private companies, and individuals that need to step up the game. The government should only set the ground rules. I do not want the government building a charger network.

And according to an article I read on Welt.de about two weeks ago, the companies which are being contracted to build EV charging stations are building the wrong ones: 22kW chargers with overpriced electricity that is naturally charged by the hour. Someone is making a profit!  ;)

Personally, I am still not convinced by EVs. I think we should research and invest more into these so-called e-fuels: synthetic fuels made out of air in which the CO2 is removed and which, when burned in an internal combustion engine, emit no CO2 as a result. With ever improving catalytic converters etc. this would seem like a really neat idea, especially since the energy density of liquid fuels can't be beat.
Title: Re: Berliners call for SUV ban after fatal traffic accident
Post by: shp4man on September 12, 2019, 05:48:32 PM
Makes sense, Wimmer. I especially like the cost per person of green energy thing. It's insanely expensive.
Title: Re: Berliners call for SUV ban after fatal traffic accident
Post by: cawimmer430 on September 12, 2019, 05:52:53 PM
Quote from: shp4man on September 12, 2019, 05:48:32 PM
Makes sense, Wimmer. I especially like the cost per person of green energy thing. It's insanely expensive.

And as of now can't supply the ever increasing energy needs of a [still] highly industrialized nation like Germany.

I really wonder if our politicians have some kind of ulterior motive or if the global elites somehow have dirt on them and are forcing them to ruin this country. Man, these days I am so convinced that there is something going on in the background that us normal folks have no knowledge of. Merkel's idiotic uncontrolled mass "migration" policy, the disastrous energy change etc. It does not make sense, but she's sticking to it!!!
Title: Re: Berliners call for SUV ban after fatal traffic accident
Post by: Raza on September 12, 2019, 10:33:04 PM
Quote from: Soup DeVille on September 09, 2019, 06:13:34 AM
"lighter electronic cars.".

Either that's a poor translation, or someone has been watching too much Tron.

Not possible.
Title: Re: Berliners call for SUV ban after fatal traffic accident
Post by: cawimmer430 on September 13, 2019, 02:36:56 AM
Hilarious talk show on German TV last night. Among the guests were Herbert Diess of Volkswagen, politician Michael Kretschmer (CDU), car expert Ferdinand Dudenhöffer, a retarded Green Party politician named Antonia Hofreiter whose specialty is gender studies (no idea what he was doing here...) and a radical "activist" (more like terrorist) named Janna Aljets (aka "Tina Velo").

So basically the Green Party gender expert and Janna Aljets were hating on cars. Antonia Hofreiter wants more trains and less cars while Janna Aljets wants a complete ban of all things cars, including electric cars. Both of these fucktards were PWNED by the other guests in all categories.

What does a moron with no arguments do? She attacks the other guests as "white old men who are responsible for all the problems in the world". Pathetic. Janna Aljets went as far to claim that "men (males) lack creativity in the transport segment and that we need more women making creative decisions here." Aha, so "creative decisions" like her demands to abolish all forms of vehicular mobility? Fuck that stupid cunt.  :rage:

Here's the entire talk show for those of you who speak the Kraut language. At times it's absolutely hilarious how Antonia Hofreiter and Janna Aljets are PWNED.  :lol:  :praise:


www.youtube.com/watch?v=vVbdwOhuNE4


Welt.de Link (German): https://www.welt.de/vermischtes/article200222250/Maybrit-Illner-Fahrrad-Aktivistin-will-Autos-verbieten-und-erntet-Raunen.html
Title: Re: Berliners call for SUV ban after fatal traffic accident
Post by: cawimmer430 on September 13, 2019, 05:36:03 AM
Frankfurt IAA 2019... radical lefties from "Greenpeace" who hate all things automotive are damaging cars by jumping on their roofs while holding up signs which read "climate killers". And they are not being arrested or escorted out! What the god damn fuck? Shit Hole Germany.


(https://taz.de/picture/3671944/948/23733006.jpeg)

(https://www.welt.de/img/politik/deutschland/mobile200241826/1972508947-ci102l-w1024/IAA-2019-Merkel.jpg)

(https://www.waz-online.de/var/storage/images/rnd/nachrichten/wirtschaft/die-iaa-wird-zum-symbol-des-umbruchs-und-der-zerrissenheit/728703111-1-ger-DE/Die-IAA-wird-zum-Symbol-des-Umbruchs-und-der-Zerrissenheit_big_teaser_article.jpg)

(https://apps-cloud.n-tv.de/img/21268734-1568285977000/16-9/750/124229546.jpg)

(https://www.hessenschau.de/tv-sendung/iaa-136~_t-1568042695277_v-16to9.jpg)

(https://www.fr.de/bilder/2019/09/09/12987215/508368629-2019-internationale-automobil-ausstellung-frankfurt-X27WQVPNLa7.jpg)



They are even protesting at seaports. Here some brand new BMW SUVs are coming in from the USA and these assholes are there to cause trouble...

(https://www.haz.de/var/storage/images/rnd/nachrichten/panorama/klimakiller-an-bord-greenpeace-blockiert-suv-auslieferung/728303595-2-ger-DE/Klimakiller-an-Bord-Greenpeace-blockiert-SUV-Auslieferung_master_reference.jpg)
Title: Re: Berliners call for SUV ban after fatal traffic accident
Post by: Soup DeVille on September 13, 2019, 05:42:27 AM
BMW probably decided it was better to let the idiots damage the cars than to have every paper in the country run headlines of protestors being dragged off or teargassed.
Title: Re: Berliners call for SUV ban after fatal traffic accident
Post by: AutobahnSHO on September 13, 2019, 06:20:25 AM
Quote from: Raza  on September 12, 2019, 10:33:04 PM
Not possible.

+1

Tron: Legacy is my go-to relaxation flick. Best (and longest!) music video EVER!!!!!!!
Title: Re: Berliners call for SUV ban after fatal traffic accident
Post by: SJ_GTI on September 13, 2019, 07:22:14 AM
Looks to me like we need to build a wall around Berlin (to keep the crazies there and away from the rest of us), and make Germany pay for it.
Title: Re: Berliners call for SUV ban after fatal traffic accident
Post by: FoMoJo on September 13, 2019, 07:50:53 AM
Quote from: cawimmer430 on September 13, 2019, 05:36:03 AM
Frankfurt IAA 2019... radical lefties from "Greenpeace" who hate all things automotive are damaging cars by jumping on their roofs while holding up signs which read "climate killers". And they are not being arrested or escorted out! What the god damn fuck? Shit Hole Germany.


(https://taz.de/picture/3671944/948/23733006.jpeg)

Good advertising for BMW..."Roofs that can withstand even the most idiotic assaults.  The next time someone jumps on your roof, make sure that you're in a BMW."
Title: Re: Berliners call for SUV ban after fatal traffic accident
Post by: CaminoRacer on September 13, 2019, 10:18:13 AM
Quote from: FoMoJo on September 13, 2019, 07:50:53 AM
Good advertising for BMW..."Roofs that can withstand even the most idiotic assaults.  The next time someone jumps on your roof, make sure that you're in a BMW."

:lol:
Title: Re: Berliners call for SUV ban after fatal traffic accident
Post by: cawimmer430 on September 14, 2019, 10:41:53 AM
Quote from: Soup DeVille on September 13, 2019, 05:42:27 AM
BMW probably decided it was better to let the idiots damage the cars than to have every paper in the country run headlines of protestors being dragged off or teargassed.

There's a young girl, maybe 15-16 years old in my neighborhood, and I see her when she walks her dog. Maybe two months ago I got into a conversation with her about the dog. After awhile the topic turned to global warming. She really believes that by 2030 the world is gonna implode, explode... whatever, if we don't get rid of all CO2.

She protests at Friday's for Future in Munich.

Her father is an engineer at BMW.


If that was my kid, I'd disown it.
Title: Re: Berliners call for SUV ban after fatal traffic accident
Post by: cawimmer430 on September 14, 2019, 10:44:34 AM
More news from Merkel's Shit Hole Germany. More stupid teenagers and Greenies protesting against SUVs. They are now carrying signs and stickers which read FCK SUV.

When are they going to protest against sports cars? Or fat luxury sedans? Fucking retarded little shits.  :facepalm:



(https://www.welt.de/img/politik/deutschland/mobile200299222/0871624377-ci23x11-w1600/Climate-change-protest-during-Frankfurt-Motorshow-IAA-in-Frankfurt.jpg)



Link: https://www.welt.de/politik/deutschland/article200299232/Proteste-gegen-IAA-Auf-den-Schildern-steht-FCK-SUV-Ich-hasse-Autos-und-Schwule-gegen-SUV.html
Title: Re: Berliners call for SUV ban after fatal traffic accident
Post by: dazzleman on September 14, 2019, 11:50:19 AM
Quote from: cawimmer430 on September 14, 2019, 10:44:34 AM
More news from Merkel's Shit Hole Germany. More stupid teenagers and Greenies protesting against SUVs. They are now carrying signs and stickers which read FCK SUV.

When are they going to protest against sports cars? Or fat luxury sedans? Fucking retarded little shits.  :facepalm:



(https://www.welt.de/img/politik/deutschland/mobile200299222/0871624377-ci23x11-w1600/Climate-change-protest-during-Frankfurt-Motorshow-IAA-in-Frankfurt.jpg)



Link: https://www.welt.de/politik/deutschland/article200299232/Proteste-gegen-IAA-Auf-den-Schildern-steht-FCK-SUV-Ich-hasse-Autos-und-Schwule-gegen-SUV.html

My brother was just telling me today about a friend of his who had an argument with his millennial daughter about the date of the Pearl Harbor attack.  She insisted that it took place in 1967 and that there was no need for her to look it up because she was sure she was right. And she kept after him about it for days.  They finally looked it up together and when she saw that she was wrong, she just shrugged it off and offered no apology for her aggressive behavior while being wrong.  That is what we have trained people to behave like  and it is ruining our society and the western world in general.  We live in an age when the ignorant are strongest in their opinions.
Title: Re: Berliners call for SUV ban after fatal traffic accident
Post by: giant_mtb on September 14, 2019, 02:55:29 PM
Quote from: dazzleman on September 14, 2019, 11:50:19 AM
My brother was just telling me today about a friend of his who had an argument with his millennial daughter about the date of the Pearl Harbor attack.  She insisted that it took place in 1967 and that there was no need for her to look it up because she was sure she was right. And she kept after him about it for days.  They finally looked it up together and when she saw that she was wrong, she just shrugged it off and offered no apology for her aggressive behavior while being wrong.  That is what we have trained people to behave like  and it is ruining our society and the western world in general.  We live in an age when the ignorant are strongest in their opinions.

Days?  They could've Googled in in 12 seconds and been done with it.
Title: Re: Berliners call for SUV ban after fatal traffic accident
Post by: Laconian on September 14, 2019, 03:00:50 PM
:hesaid:

She just sounds dumb to me, lol
Title: Re: Berliners call for SUV ban after fatal traffic accident
Post by: giant_mtb on September 14, 2019, 03:03:17 PM
Quote from: Laconian on September 14, 2019, 03:00:50 PM
:hesaid:

She just sounds dumb to me, lol

Or the father was exaggerating when he said "days" to emphasize his point that miLeNnIaLs aRe dUmB.
Title: Re: Berliners call for SUV ban after fatal traffic accident
Post by: FoMoJo on September 14, 2019, 03:10:58 PM
Quote from: giant_mtb on September 14, 2019, 03:03:17 PM
Or the father was exaggerating when he said "days" to emphasize his point that miLeNnIaLs aRe dUmB.
No doubt some are, but the majority are likely better informed than their parents.  Of course stuff like Pearl Harbour is ancient history to a lot of them.
Title: Re: Berliners call for SUV ban after fatal traffic accident
Post by: cawimmer430 on September 15, 2019, 05:44:05 AM
Quote from: dazzleman on September 14, 2019, 11:50:19 AM
My brother was just telling me today about a friend of his who had an argument with his millennial daughter about the date of the Pearl Harbor attack.  She insisted that it took place in 1967 and that there was no need for her to look it up because she was sure she was right. And she kept after him about it for days.  They finally looked it up together and when she saw that she was wrong, she just shrugged it off and offered no apology for her aggressive behavior while being wrong.  That is what we have trained people to behave like  and it is ruining our society and the western world in general.  We live in an age when the ignorant are strongest in their opinions.

Wow. Just wow.  :mask:

Looks like such times are back. I mean there are people out there who insist that the world is flat!  :facepalm:
Title: Re: Berliners call for SUV ban after fatal traffic accident
Post by: Soup DeVille on September 15, 2019, 06:21:29 AM
Quote from: cawimmer430 on September 14, 2019, 10:41:53 AM
There's a young girl, maybe 15-16 years old in my neighborhood, and I see her when she walks her dog. Maybe two months ago I got into a conversation with her about the dog. After awhile the topic turned to global warming. She really believes that by 2030 the world is gonna implode, explode... whatever, if we don't get rid of all CO2.

She protests at Friday's for Future in Munich.

Her father is an engineer at BMW.


If that was my kid, I'd disown it.

15 year old kids have always known everything, didn't you know that?
Title: Re: Berliners call for SUV ban after fatal traffic accident
Post by: cawimmer430 on September 15, 2019, 11:31:39 AM
Quote from: Soup DeVille on September 15, 2019, 06:21:29 AM
15 year old kids have always known everything, didn't you know that?

The problem is that this is what these children are told by their teachers and by that annoying Greta Thunberg. Greta Thunberg, you know, that 16-year-old Swedish anti-CO2 activist who 'can see CO2 with her eyes' (according to her mother) and who is currently protesting in front of the White House.

The good news is that Americans aren't as stupid as the Germans. Here our children are running after Greta as if she is some kind of rock star. In America, you guys are like, "Who the fuck is this?" :lol:

And going back to the German education system, it's literally in the hands of the Green Party. Most teachers are pro-Green Party, so they are actually brainwashing these kids to hate cars and protest against them.

Like I keep saying: SHIT HOLE GERMANY.
Title: Re: Berliners call for SUV ban after fatal traffic accident
Post by: FoMoJo on September 15, 2019, 04:34:01 PM
Quote from: cawimmer430 on September 15, 2019, 11:31:39 AM
The problem is that this is what these children are told by their teachers and by that annoying Greta Thunberg. Greta Thunberg, you know, that 16-year-old Swedish anti-CO2 activist who 'can see CO2 with her eyes' (according to her mother) and who is currently protesting in front of the White House.

The good news is that Americans aren't as stupid as the Germans. Here our children are running after Greta as if she is some kind of rock star. In America, you guys are like, "Who the fuck is this?" :lol:

And going back to the German education system, it's literally in the hands of the Green Party. Most teachers are pro-Green Party, so they are actually brainwashing these kids to hate cars and protest against them.

Like I keep saying: SHIT HOLE GERMANY.
Someone has to lead the way.  Why not Germany. :lol:

As for Greta Thunberg, she may be 16, but she looks about 12.  As she is autistic, Aspergers apparently, it seemlngly gives her a single minded focus on whatever she applies herself to; climate change in her case.  I happened to be watching when she landed in NYC after crossing the Atlantic on a boat.  She was interviewed by a clutch of reporters and her responses were very direct and possessed a certain quality that presented itself as a lack of guile.  She obviously believes very strongly in her cause.  A brave little girl and, hopefully, she will not end up as a target of political animus.  She has already been cal "mentally unstable" by one of our right wing politicians.
Title: Re: Berliners call for SUV ban after fatal traffic accident
Post by: cawimmer430 on September 16, 2019, 05:39:22 AM
Quote from: FoMoJo on September 15, 2019, 04:34:01 PM
Someone has to lead the way.  Why not Germany. :lol:

Well we're doing it wrong. Here are some of the idiot moves of our incompetent government.

1) Shutting down all nuclear power plants for fear of "Tsunamis" wrecking havoc on them. Now there's a push to shut down all brown coal power plants because of CO2 hysteria. Brown coal is now our main energy supplier. Wind and solar power won't even provide 1/4th of our energy requirements. We have to buy electricity from France, Poland or the Czech Republic to prevent blackouts.

2) Merkel wanted one million electric cars on German roads by 2021/2022. As of January 2019 there are only 83,200 electric cars in all of Germany. To make matters worse, the charging infrastructure is completely lacking. Many car owners in the city have no garage and can't charge their potential EV cars "at home." The government wants to ban the sale of ICE cars by 2030.

3) Ownership costs of ICE cars is going to be artificially inflated through higher fuel prices, an even higher yearly car tax (which was increased in September 2018 already...), potential driving bans of gasoline/diesel cars in some cities or a ban from the city center (that would affect me for example).

4) Forcing people in the city to take public transportation or bicycles. I have no issue with taking my bike around the city which I do all the time, but when I have projects I need my car. It's that simple. I don't like using public transportation which is expensive, inefficient, unreliable and unsafe thanks to Merkels disastrous open border policy for primitive religiously-brainwashed peoples from Islamic nations (and with them in the country the crime rates and sexual assaults have gone up!). These "refugees" can use public transportation for free, Germans are paying for them through their taxes and yet have to pay for expensive and unreliable transportation themselves. What a farce! Public transport does not exist in the countryside, but our city-dwelling politicians don't care. The ICE car ban would theoretically also affect those in the countryside. Another farce!

5) The government wants to introduce a CO2 tax which would not only make fuel and heating oil more expensive, but everything else: food, rent, flying etc. They also want to make flying more expensive and potentially get rid of domestic flights. The reason people fly is because it is cheap, fast and reliable. Our overrated and now privatized rail system is extremely expensive, slow as fuck and unreliable and uncomfortable - and unsafe thanks to knife-wielding "refugees" (there have been several knife attacks and stabbings on German trains by these primitive peoples). The VAT on train tickets is 19%. The government wants to reduce it to 7% - another farce. It's not going to change the fact that train tickets will still be expensive and that the trains are slow, unreliable and unsafe.

6) These changes are going to make life for all Germans more expensive. We have a tax load of almost 50% here, and add to that the other taxes that we pay and we're literally almost at 70% tax load. And now we're supposed to pay more for "protecting the climate"? Germany's CO2 emissions globally are like 2.2% IIRC. China is at almost 30% and the US is at like 18%. Whatever we do will not change a thing globally. It's a waste of time, money and resources and we're only harming ourself. No country in the world is going to "follow our disastrous lead".

There's much more, but I am about to blow up based on my hatred for this crap government ruining our country. Gotta go for a walk and blow off steam...  :thumbsup:




Quote from: FoMoJo on September 15, 2019, 04:34:01 PMAs for Greta Thunberg, she may be 16, but she looks about 12.  As she is autistic, Aspergers apparently, it seemlngly gives her a single minded focus on whatever she applies herself to; climate change in her case.  I happened to be watching when she landed in NYC after crossing the Atlantic on a boat.  She was interviewed by a clutch of reporters and her responses were very direct and possessed a certain quality that presented itself as a lack of guile.  She obviously believes very strongly in her cause.  A brave little girl and, hopefully, she will not end up as a target of political animus.  She has already been cal "mentally unstable" by one of our right wing politicians.

The thing with Greta is that she is being misused by her family and several organizations which would profit from carbon taxes and CO2 emissions certificates. She's being pushed by a Swedish billionaire who makes money with CO2 emissions certificates by the way.

One of Greta's family members discovered climate change in the 19th century (IIRC) and the family has been making money with this topic ever since. It's like an oil sheikh telling you that oil is good and you must use and burn as much as possible of it in your car and don't forget to replenish your supply once your fuel tank is nearing empty.  ;)

Greta is a scam. I was suspicious of her from day one. I am sure she truly believes that CO2 is gonna screw up the world, but that's because she's brainwashed.
Title: Re: Berliners call for SUV ban after fatal traffic accident
Post by: shp4man on September 16, 2019, 08:09:05 AM
Put your energy and concerns into replacing your politicians with more common sense, for the people alternatives.
Title: Re: Berliners call for SUV ban after fatal traffic accident
Post by: FoMoJo on September 16, 2019, 09:48:53 AM
This might be better in the political forum.

I will only say that the environmental/climate change/global warming issue has become ridiculous on both ends of the discussion. 
Title: Re: Berliners call for SUV ban after fatal traffic accident
Post by: cawimmer430 on September 16, 2019, 01:44:03 PM
Quote from: shp4man on September 16, 2019, 08:09:05 AM
Put your energy and concerns into replacing your politicians with more common sense, for the people alternatives.

And this is why I vote. ;)

(https://www.geolitico.de/wp-content/uploads/2015/11/Logo-der-Alternative-fuer-Deutschland.jpg)
Title: Re: Berliners call for SUV ban after fatal traffic accident
Post by: cawimmer430 on September 16, 2019, 01:45:40 PM
Quote from: FoMoJo on September 16, 2019, 09:48:53 AM
I will only say that the environmental/climate change/global warming issue has become ridiculous on both ends of the discussion. 

I do think we need to cut down on consumerism a bit, but what some politicians and groups are demanding is bordering on insanity or radical communism. A lot of Germans who grew up in the former East Germany are telling us that what is our politicians are planing reminds them of their former communist government.