Fucking sexy.
Okay, so now that that's out of the way: I don't think I could ever buy this car.
The interior is great: the materials, fit and finish are all top-notch. The ergonomics are great too. There's tons of room in back, despite the roofline and the lack of rear doors. And even though the form-over-function hatch cuts down the opening, there's a generous amount of luggage room too.
The problems with this car are brief but important. The price is too high first of all. C$35,960 for a 2.4i with an automatic, sunroof, "premium package" and DynAudio sound system is way too steep, Volvo. It's nice but it ain't that nice.
The other problems are dynamic, specifically the steering and braking. They're too light. There's feedback, they're both linear in operation, the effort is just too slight. I like steering with a little weight to it, and brakes with a little more resistance in the pedal.
Given the exterior I expected more Mini Cooper thann, well, Volvo 240, in these respects.
Oh, bother. Don't say that! I like meaty steering, too, so now you've gone and ruined my C30 dreams.
Larger pulley for the power steering and a less aggressive brake pad compound. Problem solved!
I test drove one when they first came out a few years ago. I did notice the brakes were a bit soft and grabby, and that the steering was lighter than the S40, but I don't remember thinking it was too light ... maybe it had to do with the fact that I was already used to the numb, overboosted, lifeless steering of the Camry I was renting at the time, but I figured Volvo made the steering that way to make the car feel more nimble or something.
My biggest complaint, actually, was that the clutch engagement point was all the way down on the floor, which made me stall the car several times.
Fine car, though, other than the fact that many extra-cost options such as cruise control should be included at no cost in the car's base price.
Yes, I think I could deal with the shortcomings if the pricing was more generous. I was shocked to find out that the leather shift knob and steering wheel were only available with the premium package. If this car was $24,000 instead of $36,000 I'd probably have driven it home. But for what it is it's just too steep. Oh well.
Quote from: 93JC on June 30, 2009, 08:47:17 PM
Yes, I think I could deal with the shortcomings if the pricing was more generous. I was shocked to find out that the leather shift knob and steering wheel were only available with the premium package. If this car was $24,000 instead of $36,000 I'd probably have driven it home. But for what it is it's just too steep. Oh well.
So what else are you looking at?
It's too much bloody money for what you get. You pay a premium for a car not as good as a GTI in any way.
I'd rather have a Jetta for the price. The S40/C30 looks great, but it doesn't seem to be worth it.
A Focus XR5 Turbo with the T5 engine, five doors, more interior space and an equally-sharp exterior costs around 15% less than a C30 T5 ($36,990 vs. $43,450).
Quote from: The Pirate on June 30, 2009, 09:35:55 PM
So what else are you looking at?
:huh: :lol:
Everyone seems to keep telling me to try a GTI, or at the very least a Rabbit, but I have no desire to own a Volkswagen. The C30 interested me mostly because of the looks. I knew going in it would be expensive, but I wanted to see how it would perform anyway. I'm not really interested in any of its competitors.
If anything I'm looking for something roughly-speaking that size, but closer to half the price. I tried a Saturn Astra: it was too slow. I've tried a Pontiac G5 and Ford Focus for shits and giggles, and so far the Focus is the most complete package. A little chintzy on the inside but overall it's the best performer for what it is.
The Hyundai Elantra Touring is the most appealing car left that I have yet to try. I'll also try a new Mazda 3 (although I already know it's too much $$$ like the Rabbit...), Civic, Forte, Soul, Lancer, Impreza... to be honest the only ones I've ruled out completely are the Cobalt/G5/HHR, Elantra sedan, Spectra, Corolla and Matrix/Vibe.
Oh, and Caliber/Compass/Patriot and PT Cruiser. So low on my radar I almost forgot they existed.
Quote from: 93JC on July 01, 2009, 10:21:58 AM
:huh: :lol:
Everyone seems to keep telling me to try a GTI, or at the very least a Rabbit, but I have no desire to own a Volkswagen. The C30 interested me mostly because of the looks. I knew going in it would be expensive, but I wanted to see how it would perform anyway. I'm not really interested in any of its competitors.
If anything I'm looking for something roughly-speaking that size, but closer to half the price. I tried a Saturn Astra: it was too slow. I've tried a Pontiac G5 and Ford Focus for shits and giggles, and so far the Focus is the most complete package. A little chintzy on the inside but overall it's the best performer for what it is.
The Hyundai Elantra Touring is the most appealing car left that I have yet to try. I'll also try a new Mazda 3 (although I already know it's too much $$$ like the Rabbit...), Civic, Forte, Soul, Lancer, Impreza... to be honest the only ones I've ruled out completely are the Cobalt/G5/HHR, Elantra sedan, Spectra, Corolla and Matrix/Vibe.
Oh, and Caliber/Compass/Patriot and PT Cruiser. So low on my radar I almost forgot they existed.
The Impreza and Mazda3 are priced almost identically, at least in the USA. Though you could probably deal more with an Impreza.
I love the C30 on the road, but I don't see it as being a real hot hatch.
Genesis?
Don't do the Rabbit/Golf. It's an incredibly refined car, but it's completely overrated, imo. The brakes are too grabby at city speeds, the engine sounds like a diesel (even in the gas model!), and the seats are fairly uncomfortable. That, and no reasonable straight man owns one.
Proof:
-My boss drives one. He's a bit of an asshole, but he seems reasonable. I just found out yesterday the guy is gay. True story.
-Raza ain't reasonable.
Quote from: 280Z Turbo on June 30, 2009, 08:02:44 PM
Larger pulley for the power steering and a less aggressive brake pad compound. Problem solved!
Steering issue more likely due to front end geometry.
Quote from: the Teuton on July 01, 2009, 10:27:47 AM
Don't do the Rabbit/Golf. It's an incredibly refined car, but it's completely overrated, imo. The brakes are too grabby at city speeds, the engine sounds like a diesel (even in the gas model!), and the seats are fairly uncomfortable. That, and no reasonable straight man owns one.
Proof:
-My boss drives one. He's a bit of an asshole, but he seems reasonable. I just found out yesterday the guy is gay. True story.
-Raza ain't reasonable.
I have to disagree. The only two things that kept me from buying a GTI over the WRX were the AWD and perceived reliability. Otherwise it was great fun to drive, if not quite as powerful.
Quote from: R-inge on July 01, 2009, 10:52:19 AM
I have to disagree. The only two things that kept me from buying a GTI over the WRX were the AWD and perceived reliability. Otherwise it was great fun to drive, if not quite as powerful.
Are you a reasonable straight man, and do you own one?
I rest my case.
Quote from: the Teuton on July 01, 2009, 10:54:04 AM
Are you a reasonable straight man, and do you own one?
I rest my case.
I drive a Subaru, which automatically calls into question my sexual orientation and IQ. Have you met the average WRX driver? Holy crap, if there was ever a good argument for abortion, that is it.
Quote from: R-inge on July 01, 2009, 11:02:31 AM
I drive a Subaru, which automatically calls into question my sexual orientation and IQ. Have you met the average WRX driver? Holy crap, if there was ever a good argument for abortion, that is it.
:lol:
Quote from: R-inge on July 01, 2009, 11:02:31 AM
I drive a Subaru, which automatically calls into question my sexual orientation and IQ. Have you met the average WRX driver? Holy crap, if there was ever a good argument for abortion, that is it.
The average WRX owner is a lot like the average Honda owner except with a bit more douche, a lot less rice, and a generally less Ebonics. The average WRX owner also has a bit more technical skill.
In any case, Jettas were designed to house the asses of skinny white women. This is fact.
Where the white women at!?
Quote from: the Teuton on July 01, 2009, 11:07:12 AM
The average WRX owner is a lot like the average Honda owner except with a bit more douche, a lot less rice, and a generally less Ebonics. The average WRX owner also has a bit more technical skill.
In any case, Jettas were designed to house the asses of skinny white women. This is fact.
:lol:
Quote from: the Teuton on July 01, 2009, 11:07:12 AM
The average WRX owner is a lot like the average Honda owner except with a bit more douche, a lot less rice, and a generally less Ebonics. The average WRX owner also has a bit more technical skill.
In any case, Jettas were designed to house the asses of skinny white women. This is fact.
Re: this and your Golf/Rabbit post. I know you aren't that much of an idiot, so what gives?
Sweeping generalizations like that are full of shit, and just make you look like a punk. Sure, a base model Jetta is going to have a certain amount of appeal to a driver (and yes, lots of them are women) who wants a decent sized, comfy car that isn't as mundane as a Corolla. Same can be said about certain trims of the Civic, Impreza and Mazda3. Each of those cars also offers a rorty version (GLI, Si, WRX, MS3) that is a credible enthusiast option.
And the whole Golf/Rabbit for a gay man? :facepalm: Gay peoples car tastes run the gamut, just like anybody else. I know of gay people that drive Chevy Silverados, Pilots, Impalas, Civics, Subarus, etc. Having a preference for a person of the same sex has little to do with what one prefers in a car.
DISCLAIMER TO CAVEMAN:
SWEEPING GENERALIZATIONS AND SARCASM LEND TO HUMOR. SORRY FOR OFFENDING YOU. THAT BEING SAID, THE JETTA ISN'T MY FAVORITE CAR IN THE WORLD. AND YES, I'D BUY A COROLLA BEFORE I'D BUY A JETTA.
Quote from: the Teuton on July 01, 2009, 11:32:16 AM
DISCLAIMER TO CAVEMAN:
SWEEPING GENERALIZATIONS AND SARCASM LEND TO HUMOR. THAT BEING SAID, THE JETTA ISN'T MY FAVORITE CAR IN THE WORLD. AND YES, I'D BUY A COROLLA BEFORE I'D BUY A JETTA.
You're an idiot.
Quote from: the Teuton on July 01, 2009, 10:54:04 AM
Are you a reasonable straight man, and do you own one?
I rest my case.
:facepalm:
Tell me again how you came to the conclusion that the car is overrated? Is it the multiple magazine comparison wins, the five star Evo and Car rating, the Top Gear COTY award, or something else?
Quote from: Raza link=topic=19105.msg1100316#msg1100316 date=1246469597
:facepalm:
Tell me again how you came to the conclusion that the car is overrated? Is it the multiple magazine comparison wins, the five star Evo and Car rating, the Top Gear COTY award, or something else?
I would consider one if I was in the market. I like the fact that it looks larger than it is.
Teuton doesn't like big things. A Solara convertible would be up his alley.
Quote from: Raza on July 01, 2009, 11:33:17 AM
:facepalm:
Tell me again how you came to the conclusion that the car is overrated? Is it the multiple magazine comparison wins, the five star Evo and Car rating, the Top Gear COTY award, or something else?
First, they don't have the sucktastic 2.5 in Your-Rope. It has enough get up and go, but it's not my favorite. That engine was panned when it was in the Euro Bora.
Second, those same multiple mags that have handed the Jetta wins also said that the the M3 was a better car than the GT-R. I don't trust most magazines' opinions as fact.
I'd take a good look at a Jetta for the moar hp. They seem to be about the same price on the used car market.
Quote from: 2o6 on July 01, 2009, 11:35:27 AM
A Solara convertible would be up his alley.
I'm not going to lie, I'd drive one. It wouldn't be my cup of tea, but I wouldn't turn one down.
Quote from: the Teuton on July 01, 2009, 11:36:38 AM
First, they don't have the sucktastic 2.5 in Your-Rope. It has enough get up and go, but it's not my favorite. That engine was panned when it was in the Euro Bora.
Second, those same multiple mags that have handed the Jetta wins also said that the the M3 was a better car than the GT-R. I don't trust most magazines' opinions as fact.
Being nitpickey, the Bora is no longer called the Bora. It's now the Jetta again. Intrestingly enough, the MK3 Jetta was called the Vento.
Quote from: the Teuton on July 01, 2009, 11:37:44 AM
I'm not going to lie, I'd drive one. It wouldn't be my cup of tea, but I wouldn't turn one down.
I would take anything at this point.
Quote from: the Teuton on July 01, 2009, 11:37:44 AM
I'm not going to lie, I'd drive one. It wouldn't be my cup of tea, but I wouldn't turn one down.
My uncle has a red 5 speed first gen Solara. He calls it his sports car just to get a rise out of me :lol:
Quote from: the Teuton on July 01, 2009, 11:36:38 AM
First, they don't have the sucktastic 2.5 in Your-Rope. It has enough get up and go, but it's not my favorite. That engine was panned when it was in the Euro Bora.
Second, those same multiple mags that have handed the Jetta wins also said that the the M3 was a better car than the GT-R. I don't trust most magazines' opinions as fact.
With regards to the European magazine, I was talking about 2.0T cars, mostly the GTI.
The Rabbit also beat the Impreza, Focus, Corolla, Astra, Lancer, xD, and SX4, with the "sucktastic" 2.5L I5 in C&D. It was also named one of the most fun cars under $20,000. The GTI just beat a group of more powerful, faster, newer cars in its class despite not being the best performer by the stopwatch.
I really have a hard time believing you dislike the A5 cars on their merits or shortcomings.
Quote from: Raza link=topic=19105.msg1100316#msg1100316 date=1246469597
:facepalm:
Tell me again how you came to the conclusion that the car is overrated? Is it the multiple magazine comparison wins, the five star Evo and Car rating, the Top Gear COTY award, or something else?
Most overrated things get more positive attention than they deserve, right? Isn't that the definition of the term?
Quote from: Tave on July 01, 2009, 11:43:47 AM
Most overrated things get more positive attention than they deserve, right? Isn't that the definition of the term?
So the logic here is that if everyone thinks it good, it can't be?
It's a car, not a band.
Quote from: Raza link=topic=19105.msg1100341#msg1100341 date=1246470516
So the logic here is that if everyone thinks it good, it can't be?
Anyone who thinks a car is overrated would not be surprised to find positive feedback about that car.
Quote from: TBR on July 01, 2009, 10:25:30 AM
The Impreza and Mazda3 are priced almost identically, at least in the USA. Though you could probably deal more with an Impreza.
Yeah, they're pretty similarly priced. The 3 is available in the stripped-down GX model with a 2.0 L engine for $16,000-$17,000, but it jumps quickly once you start adding options.
I don't really like the Impreza, but I'll give it a go anyway.
Quote from: R-inge on July 01, 2009, 10:25:44 AM
I love the C30 on the road, but I don't see it as being a real hot hatch.
It isn't. It's, like, the hot hatch for old fogies who don't want a hot hatch. If there was a Buick hot hatch I think it would be something like this.
Although I'll give it this: the handling is great. No body roll, no pitching and wallowing from being underdamped and oversprung: very, very neutral. I liked that about it.
Quote from: Tave on July 01, 2009, 10:26:24 AM
Genesis?
I want something more practical.
(And I think it's ugly.)
Quote from: Raza link=topic=19105.msg1099941#msg1099941 date=1246419454
It's too much bloody money for what you get. You pay a premium for a car not as good as a GTI in any way.
IMO, the C30 is better looking and has a better interior than the GTI.
Quote from: Tave on July 01, 2009, 11:53:00 AM
Anyone who thinks a car is overrated would not be surprised to find positive feedback about that car.
Well, I could be stubborn, but I suppose you're right on that front.
Quote from: nickdrinkwater on July 01, 2009, 12:04:29 PM
IMO, the C30 is better looking and has a better interior than the GTI.
I could see you on the exterior looks (though I don't agree with you, but it is, at least, partially subjective) but after spending time in both, I couldn't honestly say that the C30's interior is better. They're close; it's not as if I'm saying the GTI is leagues ahead or anything, but I prefer the design and materials of the GTI. I think the C30's interior is cool, but the shiny dashboard is just a little grating.
Mark, what about a used Mazdaspeed3 or Civic Si sedan?
Quote from: Raza link=topic=19105.msg1100361#msg1100361 date=1246471661
I could see you on the exterior looks (though I don't agree with you, but it is, at least, partially subjective) but after spending time in both, I couldn't honestly say that the C30's interior is better. They're close; it's not as if I'm saying the GTI is leagues ahead or anything, but I prefer the design and materials of the GTI. I think the C30's interior is cool, but the shiny dashboard is just a little grating.
Yeah, I can see where you're coming from with the grating thing, I might get sick of that dash too. FWIW I don't think the Mk5 Golf GTI is a bad looking car - but I still think the Mk4 is the best looker. The new one is totally bland.
Have you driven the C30, and did you consider it when you were looking for a car?
Quote from: nickdrinkwater on July 01, 2009, 12:14:20 PM
Yeah, I can see where you're coming from with the grating thing, I might get sick of that dash too. FWIW I don't think the Mk5 Golf GTI is a bad looking car - but I still think the Mk4 is the best looker. The new one is totally bland.
Have you driven the C30, and did you consider it when you were looking for a car?
I did consider it when looking; two things kept me from driving it though. The exorbitant price tag being one (the cheapest on the lot was $28,000) and the other being the fact they didn't have a single stickshift car available. I didn't see the point in driving a car that would feel so different from the one I considered purchasing. But as cool as these cars are and even if they had a stick, I don't think I could have justified the extra expense ($4,000 more than the GTI I was considering; and really $5,000 when you factor in my loyalty bonus) unless it was demonstrably better in a way other than being not the obvious choice.
You know, I used to feel the same way about the A4s; but now that I seem them and A5s on the road together so often, I think, other than in R32 guise, the A5s look better from bottom to top. The mundane Rabbits look much better than the mundane A4 Golfs, and the A5 GTI looks better than the A4 GTI (to me, anyway). The R32s are still a toss-up though. Some days I think MkIV, some days MkV.
Quote from: Raza link=topic=19105.msg1100398#msg1100398 date=1246472716
I did consider it when looking; two things kept me from driving it though. The exorbitant price tag being one (the cheapest on the lot was $28,000) and the other being the fact they didn't have a single stickshift car available. I didn't see the point in driving a car that would feel so different from the one I considered purchasing. But as cool as these cars are and even if they had a stick, I don't think I could have justified the extra expense ($4,000 more than the GTI I was considering; and really $5,000 when you factor in my loyalty bonus) unless it was demonstrably better in a way other than being not the obvious choice.
You know, I used to feel the same way about the A4s; but now that I seem them and A5s on the road together so often, I think, other than in R32 guise, the A5s look better from bottom to top. The mundane Rabbits look much better than the mundane A4 Golfs, and the A5 GTI looks better than the A4 GTI (to me, anyway). The R32s are still a toss-up though. Some days I think MkIV, some days MkV.
28k?! That's ridiculous. I know you guys get a bigger engine, but I think after discount you can get an R-Design 1.6 C30 for ?15k. That's an official promotional discount, not including haggling. I would never pay 28k USD for a C30, either!
The A5 is definitely more modern but somehow the A4 is just classier to me. It was the first car that brought the premium feel to the mainstream market, and Ford and Vauxhall have mimicked that ever since here. The A5 is supposedly superior in every aspect, but I just find that the A4 has more character.
It's funny you should mention the R32. I saw an A4 R32 today - they're much rarer than the new shape R32 here. It may be my bias again, but they look a lot more special than the A5 R32, which to me is a GTI with a blue paint job and a chrome grille :lol: No offence.
Of course, on your side of the argument is that the A4 GTIs were watered down and mediocre, whereas the A5 GTI is (was) a class leader.
Quote from: nickdrinkwater on July 01, 2009, 12:39:32 PM
28k?! That's ridiculous. I know you guys get a bigger engine, but I think after discount you can get an R-Design 1.6 C30 for ?15k. That's an official promotional discount, not including haggling. I would never pay 28k USD for a C30, either!
The A5 is definitely more modern but somehow the A4 is just classier to me. It was the first car that brought the premium feel to the mainstream market, and Ford and Vauxhall have mimicked that ever since here. The A5 is supposedly superior in every aspect, but I just find that the A4 has more character.
It's funny you should mention the R32. I saw an A4 R32 today - they're much rarer than the new shape R32 here. It may be my bias again, but they look a lot more special than the A5 R32, which to me is a GTI with a blue paint job and a chrome grille :lol: No offence.
Of course, on your side of the argument is that the A4 GTIs were watered down and mediocre, whereas the A5 GTI is (was) a class leader.
Yeah, the only engine we get here is the turbo five out of the Focus ST. Starting price on that model is 19K and change (GBP, of course) which is about what a GTI costs over there, right?
The A4 did indeed change the market of economy cars. Actually, since I started driving Volkswagens, their interiors have impressed me, full stop, even without regard to price. And, although I haven't spent much time in A4s, I'm told the interior of the A4 was slightly higher quality than the A5. I'll have to believe it for now, I guess.
But then again, the A5 is (was) the class leader. That always feels good. :lol:
However, if we had Seat here, I'd probably be driving a Leon FR or Cupra. I like things that are a bit less obvious.
The local Volvo dealer was expecting to receive a stickshift C30 with no options besides cruise control, and they offered to to me for $24k. More reasonable, but even at that price, there were better choices for me.
Quote from: the Teuton on July 01, 2009, 11:36:38 AM
First, they don't have the sucktastic 2.5 in Your-Rope. It has enough get up and go, but it's not my favorite. That engine was panned when it was in the Euro Bora.
Two completely different engines. The Bora was available with a 2.3 L
VR5.
Quote from: Raza on July 01, 2009, 12:07:41 PM
I think the C30's interior is cool, but the shiny dashboard is just a little grating.
:confused:
Shiny?
Quote from: Raza on July 01, 2009, 12:08:16 PM
Mark, what about a used Mazdaspeed3 or Civic Si sedan?
Rare. Asking price is about the same as a new one. (~$35,000)
Quote from: 93JC on July 01, 2009, 01:20:39 PM
:confused:
Shiny?
You didn't think it was shiny? The center console, specifically?
Quote from: 93JC on July 01, 2009, 01:21:13 PM
Rare. Asking price is about the same as a new one. (~$35,000)
So what else are you looking into?
Oooooooooooh shiny....
Quote from: Raza on July 01, 2009, 01:24:01 PM
So what else are you looking into?
I already posted that shizz.
Quote from: Raza on July 01, 2009, 01:23:20 PM
You didn't think it was shiny? The center console, specifically?
No.
(http://volvoroundworld.com/wp-content/uploads/2008/08/volvo-c30-interior.jpg)
:huh:
i love that center console.
Quote from: 93JC on July 01, 2009, 10:21:58 AM
:huh: :lol:
Everyone seems to keep telling me to try a GTI, or at the very least a Rabbit, but I have no desire to own a Volkswagen. The C30 interested me mostly because of the looks. I knew going in it would be expensive, but I wanted to see how it would perform anyway. I'm not really interested in any of its competitors.
If anything I'm looking for something roughly-speaking that size, but closer to half the price. I tried a Saturn Astra: it was too slow. I've tried a Pontiac G5 and Ford Focus for shits and giggles, and so far the Focus is the most complete package. A little chintzy on the inside but overall it's the best performer for what it is.
The Hyundai Elantra Touring is the most appealing car left that I have yet to try. I'll also try a new Mazda 3 (although I already know it's too much $$$ like the Rabbit...), Civic, Forte, Soul, Lancer, Impreza... to be honest the only ones I've ruled out completely are the Cobalt/G5/HHR, Elantra sedan, Spectra, Corolla and Matrix/Vibe.
Oh, and Caliber/Compass/Patriot and PT Cruiser. So low on my radar I almost forgot they existed.
Not considering used cars?
Quote from: J86 on July 01, 2009, 01:39:27 PM
i love that center console.
The floating design is very nice; I just think all that apparently un-shiny stuff would get on my nerves after a while.
It'd be cool if the C30 had the spaceball shifter like the rare stickshift S60's
Quote from: Raza on July 01, 2009, 01:41:18 PM
Not considering used cars?
What he said. I remember you being in love with the '05 Mustang roof line when it came out
Quote from: Vinsanity on July 01, 2009, 01:41:57 PM
It'd be cool if the C30 had the spaceball shifter like the rare stickshift S60's
Is it different from the S60R's?
Quote from: Raza on July 01, 2009, 01:41:18 PM
Not considering used cars?
Not in this area, anyway. You see, there's a global economic crisis right now. People are losing their jobs. Consequently these people are selling the cars they can no longer afford to keep. But, they're upside-down on the loans: the cars are worth less than the outstanding principal. Despite the fact the cars are completely, utterly, totally not worth what people are asking for them, they won't budge on price. Because they need the money to pay off the rest of their retarded loan. And they get very offended when you tell them, "Look, I understand your predicament, but I'm not going to buy a used one with 60,000 km on it for $500 less than a new one."
Quote from: Raza on July 01, 2009, 01:41:54 PM
The floating design is very nice; I just think all that apparently un-shiny stuff would get on my nerves after a while.
I honestly don't know why you think it's shiny. The one I drove was silver with a fake satin (somewhere between glossy and matte) finish. It wasn't distracting at all.
My roomate's S40 has the same console. I've never noticed any glare on it.
Quote from: 93JC on July 01, 2009, 01:49:37 PM
Not in this area, anyway. You see, there's a global economic crisis right now. People are losing their jobs. Consequently these people are selling the cars they can no longer afford to keep. But, they're upside-down on the loans: the cars are worth less than the outstanding principal. Despite the fact the cars are completely, utterly, totally not worth what people are asking for them, they won't budge on price. Because they need the money to pay off the rest of their retarded loan. And they get very offended when you tell them, "Look, I understand your predicament, but I'm not going to buy a used one with 60,000 km on it for $500 less than a new one."
Okay.
Have you thought about the Rabbit?
Or maybe a Jetta TDI?
Besides, I think the standard finish is matte black plastic. The 'metal' accent is an option, or so the salesman with me last night said.
Quote from: 93JC on July 01, 2009, 01:53:31 PM
Besides, I think the standard finish is matte black plastic. The 'metal' accent is an option, or so the salesman with me last night said.
Matte black might look really good. I don't think that's how it is here, though.
The C30 is a good looking car, though. It might make an interesting used buy in a few years time.
Quote from: Raza on July 01, 2009, 01:53:07 PM
Have you thought about the Rabbit?
Or maybe a Jetta TDI?
Quote from: 93JC on July 01, 2009, 10:21:58 AM
Everyone seems to keep telling me to try a GTI, or at the very least a Rabbit, but I have no desire to own a Volkswagen. The C30 interested me mostly because of the looks. I knew going in it would be expensive, but I wanted to see how it would perform anyway. I'm not really interested in any of its [direct] competitors.
Quote from: Raza link=topic=19105.msg1100548#msg1100548 date=1246478104
Matte black might look really good. I don't think that's how it is here, though.
The C30 is a good looking car, though. It might make an interesting used buy in a few years time.
My psychic superpowers tell me you will never purchase a Volvo.
Quote from: 93JC on July 01, 2009, 01:55:43 PM
Have you ever driven a Rabbit? Or do you just enjoy being close-minded?
Quote from: Tave on July 01, 2009, 01:56:48 PM
My psychic superpowers tell me you will never purchase a Volvo.
I used to think I'd never own a Volkswagen either, or even a FWD car. Now I've had two. :lol:
Actually, when I was shopping for a new car, one of my early choices was the S60 T5. Too expensive, too hard to find with a manual though. I also shopped S40 and C30. Ran into the same problems.
Quote from: Tave on July 01, 2009, 01:52:24 PM
My roomate's S40 has the same console. I've never noticed any glare on it.
Maybe it's just me. Or the pictures are messing with my memory. Seems shiny though.
Quote from: Raza on July 01, 2009, 01:55:04 PM
Matte black might look really good. I don't think that's how it is here, though.
I just looked it up: the 2.4i comes with standard 'Bauxite' inlays. Aluminum inlays are part of the Premium Package, and are standard in the T5.
Quote from: Raza on July 01, 2009, 01:57:18 PM
Have you ever driven a Rabbit? Or do you just enjoy being close-minded?
Close-minded. :lol:
Actually my aunt and uncle have had Volkswagens for a long time, and their recent Mk V Jetta TDI (the old 1.9, not the new 2.0) had a few issues, and their new Tiguan has spent about as much time at the dealer as it has on the road since they got it in January. So, you know, I'm kind of wary.
Quote from: Raza on July 01, 2009, 01:44:43 PM
Is it different from the S60R's?
I believe it's the same
Quote from: 93JC on July 01, 2009, 02:03:06 PM
Close-minded. :lol:
Actually my aunt and uncle have had Volkswagens for a long time, and their recent Mk V Jetta TDI (the old 1.9, not the new 2.0) had a few issues, and their new Tiguan has spent about as much time at the dealer as it has on the road since they got it in January. So, you know, I'm kind of wary.
Oh well. Your loss.
Quote from: Vinsanity on July 01, 2009, 02:52:59 PM
I believe it's the same
That's what I thought. They look funny.
Quote from: the Teuton on July 01, 2009, 11:32:16 AM
DISCLAIMER TO CAVEMAN:
SWEEPING GENERALIZATIONS AND SARCASM LEND TO HUMOR. SORRY FOR OFFENDING YOU. THAT BEING SAID, THE JETTA ISN'T MY FAVORITE CAR IN THE WORLD. AND YES, I'D BUY A COROLLA BEFORE I'D BUY A JETTA.
The thing is you aren't very good at this humor stuff...
Quote from: 93JC on July 01, 2009, 01:49:37 PM
Not in this area, anyway. You see, there's a global economic crisis right now. People are losing their jobs. Consequently these people are selling the cars they can no longer afford to keep. But, they're upside-down on the loans: the cars are worth less than the outstanding principal. Despite the fact the cars are completely, utterly, totally not worth what people are asking for them, they won't budge on price. Because they need the money to pay off the rest of their retarded loan. And they get very offended when you tell them, "Look, I understand your predicament, but I'm not going to buy a used one with 60,000 km on it for $500 less than a new one."
That will change. Fast.
Anyway, you are a carguy and still pretty young, right?
Still you are looking at all those boremobiles the rest of the world is stuck with. You, on the other hand, are born in the land of milk and honey (or close enough) where gas still is cheap and V8's are bountyfull. Do you relly want to tell your grandchildren that you chose an econobox over one of the last 'murican fuck-the-climate-crisis-mobiles?
Now, man up and get a Mustang. :rockon:
:lol: You make a passionate argument, I'll give you that.
I still want something practical. Or more practical than a Mustang or Genesis coupe.
Hmm... now all I can think about is a C30 with the 4.4 L Yamaha V8...
Quote from: 93JC on July 01, 2009, 03:57:17 PM
:lol: You make a passionate argument, I'll give you that.
I still want something practical. Or more practical than a Mustang or Genesis coupe.
Hmm... now all I can think about is a C30 with the 4.4 L Yamaha V8...
More practical than a Mustang?
How about a Mustang
convertible? Limitless cargo space.
:facepalm:
I don't want a convertible. Maybe when I'm older, have more money, and a garage; or in other terms, have the ability to maintain a second 'toy' car.
come on. You look at a c30 but a stang isn't practical enough? I'm tempted to throw a facepalm here.
The Volvo has cheaper fuel and insurance costs
And has a usable cargo area, more importantly.
Quote from: 93JC on July 01, 2009, 04:26:24 PM
And has a usable cargo area, more importantly.
Yeah, but you'll need a ladder to get to the loading plane. And also, don't try anything too wide.
(http://www.autotropolis.com/web/images/still_0640_Larger/5518/5518_st0640_122.jpg)
As a credible GTI alternative, it really falls short in the hatchbackness of it. If it came out post-Scirocco, I think it would have been much more accepted as a stylized Scirocco hatch/coupe alternative.
Quote from: 93JC on July 01, 2009, 04:26:24 PM
And has a usable cargo area, more importantly.
The Mustang has fold down rear seats, about as much trunk/cargo room as my old 4dr Cavalier had
why do you need all this cargo room? I don't think you'd need to lug any more shit around than I would and the MINI was more than enough (less room than the Mustang) and am thinking about a 370Z when I get back
Audi A3? :huh:
The C30 is less expensive than the A3, so it's not likely.
You know, you could always 'import' a car from the US.
Thought of that. If I decide the C30 is what I like best, despite its price, I'll be looking at used ones from the states first.
For the money, I'd rather have a V50. It's essentially the same car as the C30 but with two extra doors and a lot more cargo room. Costs about the same and it's far more usable.
Cheers,
Madman of the People
Quote from: Madman on July 01, 2009, 09:22:09 PM
For the money, I'd rather have a V50. It's essentially the same car as the C30 but with two extra doors and a lot more cargo room. Costs about the same and it's far more usable.
Cheers,
Madman of the People
That's a good point. Plus the V50 has been around longer, so it would have better used prices. T5 FWD with a manual! (AWD if you're boring.)
Vee-fitty? "About the same"? Dude, it's a good $7,000 more than a C30. A V50 T5 (FWD) is a $40,000 car.
(http://www.edmunds.com/pictures/VEHICLE/1993/Jeep/3666/1993.jeep.cherokee.5977-300x189.jpg)
:praise:
Quote from: J86 on July 01, 2009, 09:33:41 PM
(http://www.edmunds.com/pictures/VEHICLE/1993/Jeep/3666/1993.jeep.cherokee.5977-300x189.jpg)
I agree. I don't see why there is all this pointless debate.
Quote from: omicron on July 03, 2009, 08:59:09 PM
I agree. I don't see why there is all this pointless debate.
They're paving the roads up in Canada nowadays. I can see why he might want a road car.
Quote from: 280Z Turbo on July 03, 2009, 09:03:14 PM
They're paving the roads up in Canada nowadays. I can see why he might want a road car.
Pshaw. Off-road vehicles have wheels, and suspension things! What more do you want? Don't talk to me about Grosse Pointe refinemente and luxurie, wenche!
Hey Mark, I know you said you ruled out the Cobalt, but what about the SS Turbo? It gets 30 mpg and will rip almost anything a new asshole.
The interior in those things is beyond terrible, but Hemi does have a point. They are kinda cool.
Quote from: the Teuton on July 04, 2009, 09:29:15 AM
The interior in those things is beyond terrible, but Hemi does have a point. They are kinda cool.
I honestly don't know where people are figuring the Cobalt SS has a "beyond terrible" interior. It's not class leading, but it certainly isn't terrible by any means.
(http://www.gminsidenews.com/forums/gallery/data/558/medium/css9.jpg)
(http://www.ridelust.com/wp-content/uploads/css101.jpg)
Of course, even the base Cobalt interiors look all right in pictures. A few materials, and of course the seats, are upgraded in the SS though.
Quote from: HEMI666 on July 03, 2009, 09:23:48 PM
Hey Mark, I know you said you ruled out the Cobalt, but what about the SS Turbo? It gets 30 mpg and will rip almost anything a new asshole.
Does it have the same steering as the regular one?
Quote from: 93JC on July 04, 2009, 10:32:38 AM
Does it have the same steering as the regular one?
No, the non-SS has a 4-spoke.
Edit- I don't know why I thought you said steering wheel.
Quote from: 93JC on July 04, 2009, 10:32:38 AM
Does it have the same steering as the regular one?
Nope. The steering in the SS is heavier, more direct, with much more feel and feedback. The steering is great in the SS. Trust me, you won't believe it's based on the regular Cobalt.
If I'm not mistaken, in the SS they ditch the electric steering for a normal hydraulic pump. It should be much better.
:facepalm:
The Cobalt SS Turbo is supposed to be even better than the SS/SC I drove. The SS/SC was almost as good as the Civic Si. The interior wasn't bad.
Just because it's got a bowtie on doesn't mean it's crap, people. Look beyond the names for once.
Quote from: HEMI666 on July 04, 2009, 10:25:45 AM
I honestly don't know where people are figuring the Cobalt SS has a "beyond terrible" interior. It's not class leading, but it certainly isn't terrible by any means.
(http://www.gminsidenews.com/forums/gallery/data/558/medium/css9.jpg)
(http://www.ridelust.com/wp-content/uploads/css101.jpg)
It's based on the Cobalt, which is pretty bad compared with the rest of the cars in its class. Nice seats and a few different trim pieces dress it up a bit, but it's still like putting lipstick on a pig to be honest. Sorry to have to disagree with you on that, I realize you like it a lot, but I just can't dig it.
Quote from: R-inge on July 04, 2009, 08:14:42 PM
It's based on the Cobalt, which is pretty bad compared with the rest of the cars in its class. Nice seats and a few different trim pieces dress it up a bit, but it's still like putting lipstick on a pig to be honest. Sorry to have to disagree with you on that, I realize you like it a lot, but I just can't dig it.
Now I don't know much about the Cobalt, and I haven't driven anything in this class except an '07 Focus (which I really didn't mind), but is it really
that bad? I mean, it's interior (I've sat in one) is kinda shitty, but I can't imagine it being terrible, at least mechanically speaking.
I could be completely wrong, as I have no experience with the car, but how bad could it possibly be?
Quote from: CALL_911 on July 04, 2009, 08:16:56 PM
I could be completely wrong, as I have no experience with the car, but how bad could it possibly be?
Even that's not exactly a ringing endorsement of a $20,000 car. "Oh really, it can't be THAT terrible. You'll love it!"
Quote from: ifcar on July 04, 2009, 08:20:13 PM
Even that's not exactly a ringing endorsement of a $20,000 car. "Oh really, it can't be THAT terrible. You'll love it!"
Find me the words "you'll love it" in my post.
I'm not endorsing, nor am I denigrating it. I'm speaking about the regular Cobalt, not the SS, is it really that bad?
Quote from: CALL_911 on July 04, 2009, 08:23:26 PM
Find me the words "you'll love it" in my post.
I'm not endorsing, nor am I denigrating it. I'm speaking about the regular Cobalt, not the SS, is it really that bad?
It has its very strong points and its very weak points. Overall, mediocre.
It's not 'that' bad, it's just not all that good either, relative to its competitors. For me, personally, the Cobalt/G5's steering was a deal-breaker. I hated it. It was overboosted and had no feedback whatsoever, and yet at speed the car wandered all over the place. Sometimes cars with very heavy steering will tend to wander a bit because of the imperfections in the pavement. They are fed back to the wheel and you have to keep correcting your course to keep it straight or keep your line around a corner consistent. But the Cobalt/G5 does it all the time. And with sloppy, disconnected steering to boot! Driving a G5 was one of the most tiring drives I've ever had!
To be honest, while the packaging of the Cobalt/G5 is better, I actually liked driving the Cavalier/Sunfire more...
Civic Si?
Quote from: 93JC on July 04, 2009, 08:36:08 PM
It's not 'that' bad, it's just not all that good either, relative to its competitors. For me, personally, the Cobalt/G5's steering was a deal-breaker. I hated it. It was overboosted and had no feedback whatsoever, and yet at speed the car wandered all over the place. Sometimes cars with very heavy steering will tend to wander a bit because of the imperfections in the pavement. They are fed back to the wheel and you have to keep correcting your course to keep it straight or keep your line around a corner consistent. But the Cobalt/G5 does it all the time. And with sloppy, disconnected steering to boot! Driving a G5 was one of the most tiring drives I've ever had!
To be honest, while the packaging of the Cobalt/G5 is better, I actually liked driving the Cavalier/Sunfire more...
The steering on the SS is nothing like the base car. Instead of listening to the BS from a bunch of people who haven't driven it, do yourself a favour and go drive the SS. My parents have the S/C version and they love it. I've driven it numerous times and I love it. They have had exactly zero warranty claims in the time they've had it. You are doing yourself a disservice by not driving it.
http://www.motorcarinvestments.com/car_view.php?car_id=826
hay thats a nice example
North Carolina? No thanks.
Quote from: CALL_911 on July 04, 2009, 08:16:56 PM
Now I don't know much about the Cobalt, and I haven't driven anything in this class except an '07 Focus (which I really didn't mind), but is it really that bad? I mean, it's interior (I've sat in one) is kinda shitty, but I can't imagine it being terrible, at least mechanically speaking.
I could be completely wrong, as I have no experience with the car, but how bad could it possibly be?
Sorry for the confusion but I was talking primarily about the interior. Although the chassis is kinda thrashy and loud as well... Hemi claims the SS drives differently, which is probably does, but with the stiffer ride it is undoubtedly even more thrashy and loud than the base version.
Sorry Craig, but while it's clearly a very fast and fine-handling car it every other respect I hate it's living guts. :praise:
Quote from: R-inge on July 04, 2009, 10:36:21 PM
Sorry for the confusion but I was talking primarily about the interior. Although the chassis is kinda thrashy and loud as well... Hemi claims the SS drives differently, which is probably does, but with the stiffer ride it is undoubtedly even more thrashy and loud than the base version.
Sorry Craig, but while it's clearly a very fast and fine-handling car it every other respect I hate it's living guts. :praise:
Drive it. You are doing yourself a disservice by hating it without even driving it. That's stupid.
I can't speak about the SS, but I will say that the normal Cobalt is the $15,000-18,000 car I'm least likely to own in the next decade. It's pretty terrible.
Quote from: the Teuton on July 05, 2009, 01:05:39 AM
I can't speak about the SS, but I will say that the normal Cobalt is the $15,000-18,000 car I'm least likely to own in the next decade. It's pretty terrible.
I'd take one over a Dodge Caliber
(http://www.caradvice.com.au/wp-content/uploads/2008/07/volvo-race.jpg)
Quote from: the Teuton on July 05, 2009, 01:05:39 AM
I can't speak about the SS, but I will say that the normal Cobalt is the $15,000-18,000 car I'm least likely to own in the next decade. It's pretty terrible.
I've driven worse then the base Cobalt. But the SS is nothing like the base Cobalt. Why don't you go drive one.
Again Mark, don't listen to a bunch of BS from people who haven't driven it. Go drive one and make up your own mind.
Quote from: Vinsanity on July 05, 2009, 02:16:59 AM
I'd take one over a Dodge Caliber
I forgot about that one. Yeah, that vehicle is, by far, the worst vehicle in its class, whatever its class may be. But I'm sure I'm doing myself a disservice by not driving the SRT-4 version. ;)
Quote from: HEMI666 on July 05, 2009, 12:20:32 AM
Drive it. You are doing yourself a disservice by hating it without even driving it. That's stupid.
I'd be doing myself a disservice by driving the thing. :evildude:
Mark is eccentric. The C30 is eccentric -- and it's a pretty cool car.
I say get one and then import a Focus RS suspension to swap onto it.
Quote from: the Teuton on July 05, 2009, 10:26:58 AM
Mark is eccentric a pretty cool guy. The C30 is eccentric -- and it's a pretty cool car.
I say get one and then import a Focus RS suspension to swap onto it.
Quote from: the Teuton on July 05, 2009, 08:52:53 AM
I forgot about that one. Yeah, that vehicle is, by far, the worst vehicle in its class, whatever its class may be. But I'm sure I'm doing myself a disservice by not driving the SRT-4 version. ;)
No, actually you would be doing yourself a disservice by driving the SRT-4 version. It's a piece of shit.
Quote from: HEMI666 on July 05, 2009, 11:08:13 AM
No, actually you would be doing yourself a disservice by driving the SRT-4 version. It's a piece of shit.
Have you driven one? I don't like the Cobalt particularly, but I hate the Caliber.
Quote from: the Teuton on July 05, 2009, 11:20:34 AM
Have you driven one? I don't like the Cobalt particularly, but I hate the Caliber.
Yes, I have driven one. It's a giant piece of shit. There isn't a lot of improvement over the base model. It still suffers from all the same problems.
The Cobalt SS on the other hand does not suffer the same problems as the base model. You won't even believe it's the same car.
I don't even see how you could compare a Cobalt to a premium euro hatch like the GTI, C30, etc. They aren't even in the same league. I mean, the Cobalt isn't even in the same league as the Civic dude!
Oh and you know what? I think I just might have driven a supercharged SS. I have a vague memory of a black one last year... :yawn: It was so memorable I hardly remembered it. :lol: (Going back through the archives to see if I mentioned it...)
Quote from: R-inge on July 05, 2009, 04:01:21 PM
I don't even see how you could compare a Cobalt to a premium euro hatch like the GTI, C30, etc. They aren't even in the same league. I mean, the Cobalt isn't even in the same league as the Civic dude!
Where did I compare them? Besides the Cobalt SS is better then the Civic Si.
Quote from: HEMI666 on July 06, 2009, 09:23:27 AM
Where did I compare them? Besides the Cobalt SS is better then the Civic Si.
The fact that you mention it in the same thread as a C30 made me think that you thought he should consider it over the Volvo. Maybe I'm wrong?
As for the Cobalt SS being better than the Civic Si... better "how"? Maybe on a track, but I'd prefer to drive the Civic on a daily basis. It doesn't offend my eyes when I get into it with crappy plastics and flimsy parts. Except the shifter... I bet racing controllers for the PC have better feel than a Civic shifter...
Quote from: R-inge on July 06, 2009, 10:08:46 AM
The fact that you mention it in the same thread as a C30 made me think that you thought he should consider it over the Volvo. Maybe I'm wrong?
As for the Cobalt SS being better than the Civic Si... better "how"? Maybe on a track, but I'd prefer to drive the Civic on a daily basis. It doesn't offend my eyes when I get into it with crappy plastics and flimsy parts. Except the shifter... I bet racing controllers for the PC have better feel than a Civic shifter...
300HP >>> 197 HP that makes virtually no torque
Quote from: 2o6 on July 06, 2009, 10:17:16 AM
300HP >>> 197 HP that makes virtually no torque
The Cobalt SS doesn't have 300 hp.
Quote from: TBR on July 06, 2009, 10:18:14 AM
The Cobalt SS doesn't have 300 hp.
260HP, and a factory tuning pack boosts it to 300HP.
Quote from: 2o6 on July 06, 2009, 10:22:31 AM
260HP, and a factory tuning pack boosts it to 300HP.
If all that mattered was power then the Caliber SRT4 would win this, tuning kit or not.
Quote from: TBR on July 06, 2009, 10:23:59 AM
If all that mattered was power then the Caliber SRT4 would win this, tuning kit or not.
No it wouldn't.
The Caliber SRT-4 doesn't have a very good chassis and it doesn't handle well. And the interior is abysmal, worse than the Cobalt.
The Cobalt has power and handling.
Quote from: R-inge on July 06, 2009, 10:08:46 AM
The fact that you mention it in the same thread as a C30 made me think that you thought he should consider it over the Volvo. Maybe I'm wrong?
Considerin the fact that he says the C30 is boring, then yes he should consider it over the C30. However the C30 is going after the same demographic.
QuoteAs for the Cobalt SS being better than the Civic Si... better "how"? Maybe on a track, but I'd prefer to drive the Civic on a daily basis. It doesn't offend my eyes when I get into it with crappy plastics and flimsy parts. Except the shifter... I bet racing controllers for the PC have better feel than a Civic shifter...
Handling, ride comfort, power, seats, steering, shifter, and price tag.
Quote from: R-inge on July 06, 2009, 10:08:46 AM
I bet racing controllers for the PC have better feel than a Civic shifter...
:confused: It's that bad, really?
I haven't had a chance to drive the newest Si (drove the previous one), but Honda usually has its manual transmissions down pat. That's surprising that the Civic Si has a sloppy shifter. :(
Quote from: Tave on July 06, 2009, 10:40:15 AM
:confused: It's that bad, really?
I haven't had a chance to drive the newest Si (drove the previous one), but Honda usually has its manual transmissions down pat. That's surprising that the Civic Si has a sloppy shifter. :(
It's not that it's sloppy, it's that it feels flimsy. I guess I have a different perspective on what feels good, because my shifter has a direct mechanical link to the transmission (rather than via cables), but mine is more sloppy, for sure. What I am mainly getting at is that there is no tactile feel in the shifter. Some folks like that though, so whatever floats yer boat. ;)
Quote from: HEMI666 on July 06, 2009, 10:39:21 AM
Considerin the fact that he says the C30 is boring, then yes he should consider it over the C30. However the C30 is going after the same demographic.
Handling, ride comfort, power, seats, steering, shifter, and price tag.
I'm sorry but this is just another car that we're going to have to agree to disagree on. I can only say that subjectively I prefer other cars over the Cobalt SS, and it is in fact so far down on my list of cars I'd like to own that even the "boring" C30 is WAAAAY over it. Sorry! ;)
Quote from: R-inge on July 06, 2009, 10:54:27 AM
I'm sorry but this is just another car that we're going to have to agree to disagree on. I can only say that subjectively I prefer other cars over the Cobalt SS, and it is in fact so far down on my list of cars I'd like to own that even the "boring" C30 is WAAAAY over it. Sorry! ;)
You're entitled to feel the way you do, since everyone is entitled to be wrong. :ohyeah:
Quote from: HEMI666 on July 06, 2009, 11:02:11 AM
You're entitled to feel the way you do, since everyone is entitled to be wrong. :ohyeah:
:lol:
Quote from: R-inge on July 06, 2009, 10:53:20 AM
It's not that it's sloppy, it's that it feels flimsy. I guess I have a different perspective on what feels good, because my shifter has a direct mechanical link to the transmission (rather than via cables), but mine is more sloppy, for sure. What I am mainly getting at is that there is no tactile feel in the shifter. Some folks like that though, so whatever floats yer boat. ;)
Yeah, I always thought that Subaru shifters tended to be kinda stiff and vague. Rowing my aunt's Outback gave me quite the workout!
Quote from: R-inge on July 06, 2009, 10:54:27 AM
I'm sorry but this is just another car that we're going to have to agree to disagree on. I can only say that subjectively I prefer other cars over the Cobalt SS, and it is in fact so far down on my list of cars I'd like to own that even the "boring" C30 is WAAAAY over it. Sorry! ;)
I actually see the C30 and Cobalt SS as completely differently positioned cars; the C30 is kind of like a "designer" sport compact with more of an emphasis on aesthetics and craftsmanship, whereas the Cobalt SS puts performance above all else, and has the soul of the Nova SS396 in a rental car's body.
Quote from: Vinsanity on July 06, 2009, 11:20:12 AM
I actually see the C30 and Cobalt SS as completely differently positioned cars; the C30 is kind of like a "designer" sport compact with more of an emphasis on aesthetics and craftsmanship, whereas the Cobalt SS puts performance above all else, and has the soul of the Nova SS396 in a rental car's body.
:hesaid:
Quote from: Vinsanity on July 06, 2009, 11:20:12 AM
I actually see the C30 and Cobalt SS as completely differently positioned cars; the C30 is kind of like a "designer" sport compact with more of an emphasis on aesthetics and craftsmanship, whereas the Cobalt SS puts performance above all else, and has the soul of the Nova SS396 in a rental car's body.
I agree with that assessment. And whereas the more stylish and nicely equipped muscle cars are still desire-able after many decades, the Cobalt SS is going to have the same long-term desire-ability of the Nova, which is to say, Not Much.
Quote from: R-inge on July 06, 2009, 11:52:04 AM
I agree with that assessment. And whereas the more stylish and nicely equipped muscle cars are still desire-able after many decades, the Cobalt SS is going to have the same long-term desire-ability of the Nova, which is to say, Not Much.
I think it have have the same kind of desirability as most hot hatches.
Is the interior the imterior really that bad? YES. 2he steering wheel is the worst steering wheel I've ever held. Everything feels shitty. Nothing in there feels like it'll last. It's the worst interior of any new car currently in production.
Nah, the Caliber is worse.
I didn't mind the interior of the Cobalt/G5 to be honest. It's just that, aside from the Caliber, everything else is better. :lol:
Quote from: CJ on July 06, 2009, 12:29:25 PM
Is the interior the imterior really that bad? YES. 2he steering wheel is the worst steering wheel I've ever held. Everything feels shitty. Nothing in there feels like it'll last. It's the worst interior of any new car currently in production.
:facepalm:
Quote from: CJ on July 06, 2009, 12:29:25 PM
Is the interior the imterior really that bad? YES. 2he steering wheel is the worst steering wheel I've ever held. Everything feels shitty. Nothing in there feels like it'll last. It's the worst interior of any new car currently in production.
One: You drive a Volvo which is a premium car.
Two: Have you been in a new Chrysler? It's absolutely terrible.
Quote from: HEMI666 on July 06, 2009, 12:37:50 PM
:facepalm:
+1. I'm not a huge fan of the Cobalt at all, but there are definitely worse interiors out there. I think the vast majority of Chrysler's shit is worse. The Dodge Avenger I was in not long ago was ten times worse.
Quote from: MrH on July 06, 2009, 01:19:32 PM
+1. I'm not a huge fan of the Cobalt at all, but there are definitely worse interiors out there. I think the vast majority of Chrysler's shit is worse. The Dodge Avenger I was in not long ago was ten times worse.
This is true. Chrysler has blown it for a long time in the interior design dept. Even the new Challenger suffers from it.
Quote from: R-inge on July 06, 2009, 01:21:24 PM
This is true. Chrysler has blown it for a long time in the interior design dept. Even the new Challenger suffers from it.
Just the obvious panel gaps were unacceptable in my mind, never mind the shitty, hollow feel to everything in the cabin, paired with an unattractive and boring interior design. I felt like I was riding in a giant plastic toy bin.
Quote from: R-inge on July 06, 2009, 01:21:24 PM
This is true. Chrysler has blown it for a long time in the interior design dept. Even the new Challenger suffers from it.
The design isn't bad. It's the build and materials quality is where they fail.
Quote from: 2o6 on July 06, 2009, 01:25:24 PM
The design isn't bad. It's the build and materials quality is where they fail.
Yes and no... part of the issue I saw was lines where you had two dash panels with the same texture meeting up. This is most obvious to my memory in the center console. In a way this could have been designed better by using a different texture for the radio surround. But you know... otherwise you're right the general materials quality is not good.
I'm not that picky when it comes to interiors. Really, I'm not. There are interiors that have impressed me. There are interiors that disgusted and infuriated me.
The Cobalt SS/SC did neither. I don't see where the problem is. It's not a Rolls Royce. Get over it.
BTW, our Cobalt LS had a 3-spoke steering wheel. I just wanted to correct that. I think all Cobalts do now.
I should hope a certain someone has bought himself a C30 T5.
HEY MARK, THE C30 TAKES THE IIHS TOP SAFETY PICK. YOU SHOULD REALLY BUY IT.
HEY CLAY. NO.