http://jalopnik.com/5550345/video-car-hits-pepsi-truck-causes-catastrophic-wreck
Pretty good reflexes from that Cayenne driver.
Saw that yesterday. Pretty good reason to make sure manufacturers design SUV's not to roll.
That was amazing.
That's awesome.
Quote from: SVT_Power on May 30, 2010, 09:07:13 PM
Saw that yesterday. Pretty good reason to make sure manufacturers design SUV's not to roll.
Maybe cute utes...
It's a Porsche Cayenne. That's not an SUV. It's a 4-door sports car with a raised suspension and AWD. :tounge:
Quote from: cawimmer430 on May 31, 2010, 08:02:31 AM
It's a Porsche Cayenne. That's not an SUV. It's a 4-door sports car with a raised suspension and AWD. :tounge:
It's a fantastic vehicle.
Wimmer has a good point-- cute ute.
Quote from: Rupert on May 31, 2010, 11:28:54 AM
Wimmer has a good point-- cute ute.
Eh, no one makes "real" SUV's anymore.
4Runner, XTerra, Land Rovers, Tahoe, Grand Cherokee, Liberty, Suburban...
Quote from: Rupert on May 31, 2010, 11:51:25 AM
4Runner, XTerra, Land Rovers, Tahoe, Grand Cherokee, Liberty, Suburban...
I'll give you the 4-runner and XTerra and Liberty. The GM trucks are basically minivans. GC is unibody with independent front suspension and a carlike ride. The Land Rover LR2 is based upon the Ford EUCD platform (FWD Mondeo!!!).
Quote from: 2o6 on May 31, 2010, 11:54:12 AM
The GM trucks are basically minivans.
Wrong. So wrong.
:rolleyes: Put some good tires on a Tahoe or Suburban, and it will do just as well as the same from 15 years ago. The Cherokee was unibody, and the Liberty also has IFS (as does everything else I listed); also, carlike ride does not necessarily mean it can't do truck stuff. Land Rover makes more than just the LR2, and those are all real SUVs.
Quote from: 2o6 on May 31, 2010, 12:16:25 PM
In the way they're used.
That doesn't matter. What matters is the way they
can be used.
Quote from: Rupert on May 31, 2010, 12:19:00 PM
That doesn't matter. What matters is the way they can be used.
So can a Cayenne.
A Cayenne/Touareg can do most anything a new Range Rover can do.
BTW the best SUV evar.
(http://lroffroad.files.wordpress.com/2009/04/005_2010lr4.jpg)
Quote from: 2o6 on May 31, 2010, 12:24:33 PM
So can a Cayenne.
:confused:
You guys are completely, utterly missing the point.
A truck with traditional trucky ground clearance - regardless of what obscure EUCD GM Omega Kappa platform it inherits - is still much more roll-prone than a car.
Mad props to that Cayenne driver - it doesn't look like he even hit the yellow truck on his right.
Or was it a she?
That was some crazy reaction by the Cayenne. Headed for certain destruction one second, on the complete opposite side of the freeway the next.
Random trivia: on several tracks, the old Cayenne Turbo proved to be a little quicker than the E46 M3.
Quote from: 68_427 on May 31, 2010, 12:55:40 PM
BTW the best SUV evar.
(http://img13.imageshack.us/img13/6330/961054.jpg)
Fixed. :ohyeah:
Wow, amazing reaction by the Cayenne driver.
Quote from: 2o6 on May 31, 2010, 11:48:16 AM
Eh, no one makes "real" SUV's anymore.
G-class? Wrangler?
Quote from: Submariner on May 31, 2010, 08:02:41 PM
G-class? Wrangler?
(http://www.madwhips.com/upload/images/jeep_wrangler_on_35_inch_dvinci_wheels_1-568-426.jpg)
(http://www.dubdaily.com/wp-content/uploads/2008/01/larry_johnson3.jpg)
Mad tyte.
Quote from: 2o6 on May 31, 2010, 12:24:33 PM
So can a Cayenne.
Quote from: the Teuton on May 31, 2010, 12:24:42 PM
A Cayenne/Touareg can do most anything a new Range Rover can do.
:confused: :confused:
Range Rover
Sport, maybe.
Quote from: Rupert on May 31, 2010, 11:31:43 PM
:confused: :confused:
Range Rover Sport, maybe.
The Cayenne is simply a Touraeg with a bigger engine and better interior. Both vehicles are pretty darn capable.
Wiki says the Touareg comes with 4-wheel drive, auto locking center diff (w/ manual override), low range, adjustable ride-height, and manually locking rear diff. Sounds decently capable to me.
I'd feel uncomfortable taking the Cayenne off-road, not because of its abilities, but because it's a Porsche and I wouldn't want it to get chipped/dinged/etc...
I know the VW is also an expensive vehicle, but the "Porsche" brand puts a high mental hurdle in front of me. I felt a little uncomfortable driving my uncle's ML430 in the mountains too.
Quote from: 2o6 on June 01, 2010, 08:08:01 AM
The Cayenne is simply a Touraeg with a bigger engine and better interior. Both vehicles are pretty darn capable.
The Cayenne has more differentiation than that...
It is a fantastically capable vehicle, especially so when equipped with the air suspension.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VbetkMgQJC8 Pretty impressive IMO
Quote from: Tave on June 01, 2010, 09:51:10 AM
Wiki says the Touareg comes with 4-wheel drive, auto locking center diff (w/ manual override), low range, adjustable ride-height, and manually locking rear diff. Sounds decently capable to me.
I'd feel uncomfortable taking the Cayenne off-road, not because of its abilities, but because it's a Porsche and I wouldn't want it to get chipped/dinged/etc...
I know the VW is also an expensive vehicle, but the "Porsche" brand puts a high mental hurdle in front of me. I felt a little uncomfortable driving my uncle's ML430 in the mountains too.
People take Range Rovers offroad as well which are as expensive as the Cayenne S. :huh:
Quote from: thecarnut on June 01, 2010, 10:14:52 AM
People take Range Rovers offroad as well which are as expensive as the Cayenne S. :huh:
Honestly, I wouldn't feel comfortable doing that, either.
Quote from: 2o6 on June 01, 2010, 10:16:23 AM
Honestly, I wouldn't feel comfortable doing that, either.
Why not? That's what it's meant for. I don't understand why people would buy such expensive SUV's that are so capable and never take them offroad due to being uncomfortable.
Quote from: thecarnut on June 01, 2010, 10:17:59 AM
Why not? That's what it's meant for. I don't understand why people would buy such expensive SUV's that are so capable and never take them offroad due to being uncomfortable.
I would be scared I'd tear up a very nice car. Doesn't matter if it can do it or not, It's just a very nice car.
Quote from: 2o6 on June 01, 2010, 10:19:18 AM
I would be scared I'd tear up a very nice car. Doesn't matter if it can do it or not, It's just a very nice car.
I don't think I would mind it too much. I can live with some scratches and dents if I have fun with it.
Quote from: thecarnut on June 01, 2010, 10:14:52 AM
People take Range Rovers offroad as well which are as expensive as the Cayenne S. :huh:
Yeah I know. Like I said, it's the mental hurdle.
Quote from: thecarnut on June 01, 2010, 10:17:59 AM
Why not? That's what it's meant for. I don't understand why people would buy such expensive SUV's that are so capable and never take them offroad due to being uncomfortable.
I'd absolutely buy a Range Rover and never go offroad - perhaps a wheel up in the flowerbed at the supermarket, but not much more than that. Nothing exceeds like excess, my good fellow!
looked like me dodging a ground hog once at 70mph.... yeesh
Quote from: thecarnut on June 01, 2010, 10:17:59 AM
Why not? That's what it's meant for. I don't understand why people would buy such expensive SUV's that are so capable and never take them offroad due to being uncomfortable.
Because they buy them as status symbols. If I wanted to offroad in something, I'd buy an old Cherokee or Wrangler; something that could take abuse and doesn't leave you with a guilty conscience or super high repair bill.
Quote from: Tave on June 01, 2010, 10:23:19 AM
Yeah I know. Like I said, it's the mental hurdle.
That's history and heritage for you! Range Rovers were tough, utilitarian offroad vehicles long before they replaced Escalades as doctors' wives' choice of transport for the school run. I'm with you there.
Though I wouldn't hesitate to take someone else's Cayenne offroad (or Mercedes C class coupe, for that matter ;) ).
How did that little car push the truck over like that? I guess is hit the front wheel just right? :confused:
Okay, just watched the video...damn, that was a heads up play by the Cayenne driver. If he doesn't make that, he's fucking dead.
Quote from: Catman on June 01, 2010, 05:03:39 PM
How did that little car push the truck over like that? I guess is hit the front wheel just right? :confused:
Popped into the front wheel and knocked the rig off course, then wedged against the front wheel to keep the driver from correcting.
Quote from: Raza on June 01, 2010, 11:58:01 AM
That's history and heritage for you! Range Rovers were tough, utilitarian offroad vehicles long before they replaced Escalades as doctors' wives' choice of transport for the school run. I'm with you there.
Though I wouldn't hesitate to take someone else's Cayenne offroad (or Mercedes C class coupe, for that matter ;) ).
Like P.J. O'Rourke says, the best car is always a rented car!
Quote from: hotrodalex on June 01, 2010, 08:13:21 PM
Like P.J. O'Rourke says, the best car is always a rented car!
Q: What's better than a rented car?
A: A rented car at 40% off.
I'm not sure you would continue to get 40% off if you return in it questionable condition... :lol:
Quote from: hotrodalex on June 01, 2010, 08:41:57 PM
I'm not sure you would continue to get 40% off if you return in it questionable condition... :lol:
Get the damage waiver...no worries.
Quote from: Colonel Cadillac on June 01, 2010, 09:58:40 AM
The Cayenne has more differentiation than that...
It is a fantastically capable vehicle, especially so when equipped with the air suspension.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VbetkMgQJC8 Pretty impressive IMO
Meh.
Quote from: Rupert on June 02, 2010, 10:43:57 PM
Meh.
Ah, yes - Rupert and I agree yet again. A bit of Googling shows that the the two-speed transfer case has been eliminated regulating it to not being any more capable than an Outback.
It's like this:
I have gone up roads that a Cayenne, et al. would not be able to get up, but I have never gone up a road that a proper SUV with a locker would not be able to get up. So, yeah, probably the Cayenne has some fancy traction control stuff that gives it grip that an open diff SUV wouldn't get, but it doesn't have the suspension, etc. that an SUV has. Even with a two-speed case, it's marginally capable; without, it's an Outback.
I'm gonna further pull a Cougs here and say that y'all don't know shit about this area of driving, and I do, because it's what I do for a living.
Quote from: Rupert on June 02, 2010, 11:48:36 PM
It's like this:
I have gone up roads that a Cayenne, et al. would not be able to get up, but I have never gone up a road that a proper SUV with a locker would not be able to get up. So, yeah, probably the Cayenne has some fancy traction control stuff that gives it grip that an open diff SUV wouldn't get, but it doesn't have the suspension, etc. that an SUV has. Even with a two-speed case, it's marginally capable; without, it's an Outback.
I'm gonna further pull a Cougs here and say that y'all don't know shit about this area of driving, and I do, because it's what I do for a living.
Tsk, tsk there Rupert - I've never said such a thing.
Not driving, but other topics.
Quote from: Rupert on June 03, 2010, 12:06:00 AM
Not driving, but other topics.
I only use the, "this is what I do for a living" when necessary; when someone tells me I'm wrong or is otherwise being an obtuse PITA (and even then it was usually only one or two members and usually after a a good dose of prolific brand/model jihadism/apologism). No one challenged you or said you were wrong.
(Stick with me and I'll teach you how to make friends on the UnnerTeds.)
Quote from: GoCougs on June 02, 2010, 11:38:04 PM
Ah, yes - Rupert and I agree yet again. A bit of Googling shows that the the two-speed transfer case has been eliminated regulating it to not being any more capable than an Outback.
Interesting tense, asshole
Just curious, why isn't the Cayenne capable? It looked pretty good in the videos. Could an Outback do the same?
I mean it's no Wrangler but for a big luxury SUV it looked great. :huh:
Quote from: GoCougs on June 03, 2010, 12:37:48 AM
Hmmm, trying to cogitate the anger of this response. Perhaps there's inertia from a past exchange but I'm having trouble placing such a thing.
Even with a two-speed t-case the Cayenne would be hard-pressed to outperform a Murano or Highlander off road, and would be left behind by an Xterra, 4Runner, Wrangler and a number of other similar vehicles. It does not nor has ever has come within 56 miles of being "fantastically capable" off road.
The entitlement worldview borne of being shamelessly spoiled rotten does not automatically translate into automatic knowledge of topics you have absolute zero experience or expertise on. You look ridiculous. "Ignore" it is for you.
The Cayenne has everything an Xterrar or 4Runner has, it's a proper SUV. Why would it not do everything those vehicles could do?
I was annoyed because you used the new Cayenne, a significantly less capable vehicle, as a reference when I was obviously using the current Cayenne as a reference. In other words, your argument was useless and you thought it had merit and thus my anger.
I also agree, while the Cayenne is very capable, the ground clearance is too low and suspension articulation is too low. If you check the reviews, that is one big thing that many reviewers complained about.
But the Touraeg solves that problem.
Quote from: 2o6 on June 03, 2010, 06:40:52 AM
I also agree, while the Cayenne is very capable, the ground clearance is too low and suspension articulation is too low. If you check the reviews, that is one big thing that many reviewers complained about.
But the Touraeg solves that problem.
With the air suspension, doesn't it get up to 11ish inches?
Quote from: GoCougs on June 03, 2010, 12:14:47 AM
I only use the, "this is what I do for a living" when necessary; when someone tells me I'm wrong or is otherwise being an obtuse PITA (and even then it was usually only one or two members and usually after a a good dose of prolific brand/model jihadism/apologism). No one challenged you or said you were wrong.
(Stick with me and I'll teach you how to make friends on the UnnerTeds.)
Uh-huh.
Quote from: thecarnut on June 03, 2010, 12:47:26 AM
Just curious, why isn't the Cayenne capable? It looked pretty good in the videos. Could an Outback do the same?
I mean it's no Wrangler but for a big luxury SUV it looked great. :huh:
Those videos were about traction, which is important, but is not the be-all end-all of 4x4 capability. An Outback with the same ground clearance could do the same.
Quote from: Rupert on June 04, 2010, 07:23:58 PM
Those videos were about traction, which is important, but is not the be-all end-all of 4x4 capability. An Outback with the same ground clearance could do the same.
umm show me an outback (or a "real SUV" for that matter) that you get 11" of ground clearance from factory....
Ground clearance is a subjective measurement. I can show you a stock SUV that is more capable than the Cayenne, though.
Quote from: Rupert on June 06, 2010, 01:46:23 PM
Ground clearance is a subjective measurement. I can show you a stock SUV that is more capable than the Cayenne, though.
Like what?
XTerra
Look, traction is important, and clearance is important, and those things are there on the Cayenne (though I wonder how relevant their claimed 11" is). But so are many other things, such as approach and departure angles, breakover, tires, suspension flex, axle articulation, etc. Those last two are not there on the Cayenne. What I am saying is that the Cayenne is a Subaru with somewhat more clearance. We all know that Subarus are pretty good off road for station wagons. We also all know that most real SUVs are better off road than a Subaru.
Remind me again; how many of you have extensive experience in driving off-road, and owning and working on 4wd vehicles?
Quote from: Rupert on June 06, 2010, 01:46:23 PM
Ground clearance is a subjective measurement. I can show you a stock SUV that is more capable than the Cayenne, though.
How the hell is ground clearance a subjective measurement?!
:wtf:
Quote from: MrH on June 06, 2010, 03:43:58 PM
How the hell is ground clearance a subjective measurement?!
:wtf:
Actually, it's going to depend on what is defining the clearance - if it's just the bottom of a pumpkin as in a rear live axle rig that's one thing but if it's the entire underside of the vehicle like in Ouback (i.e., pumpkins are tucked up in the chassis owing to CV joints), it's quite another. Both could in theory have the same clearance, but one will be significantly more prone to having issues off road; meaning stating that both have the same ground clearance isn't giving us the whole story.
Quote from: GoCougs on June 06, 2010, 03:59:40 PM
Actually, it's going to depend on what is defining the clearance - if it's just the bottom of a pumpkin as in a rear live axle rig that's one thing but if it's the entire underside of the vehicle like in Ouback (i.e., pumpkins are tucked up in the chassis owing to CV joints), it's quite another. Both could in theory have the same clearance, but one will be significantly more prone to having issues off road; meaning stating that both have the same ground clearance isn't giving us the whole story.
It's not giving you the whole story, but that doesn't mean it's subjective. It's a freakin number, that's defined and easy to measure. How much more objective can you get?
Quote from: MrH on June 06, 2010, 04:03:04 PM
It's not giving you the whole story, but that doesn't mean it's subjective. It's a freakin number, that's defined and easy to measure. How much more objective can you get?
Cougs is right, but my wording wasn't perfect. My point is that you can't just give the factory ground clearance number and call it good. I suppose I should have said that factory ground clearance numbers are pointless in a debate like this, where we're pitting IRS vs SRA.
Additionally, just saying "ground clearance" might mean multiple things.
Quote from: GoCougs on June 06, 2010, 03:42:55 PM
Remind me again; how many of you have extensive experience in driving off-road, and owning and working on 4wd vehicles?
Oh! Oh! I do! Pick me!
*crickets*
Quote from: Rupert on June 06, 2010, 07:40:22 PM
Oh! Oh! I do! Pick me!
Please share your gnarliest off-road experience in under 500 words.
Quote from: CALL_911 on June 06, 2010, 08:23:36 PM
Please share your gnarliest off-road experience in under 500 words.
(http://sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/photos-ak-sf2p/v64/23/13/14228342/n14228342_32363972_9535.jpg)
But a picture is worth 1,000 words.
Quote from: CALL_911 on June 06, 2010, 08:23:36 PM
Please share your gnarliest off-road experience in under 500 words.
LOL, nice e-vagina.
Quote from: the Teuton on June 06, 2010, 09:51:01 PM
(http://sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/photos-ak-sf2p/v64/23/13/14228342/n14228342_32363972_9535.jpg)
But a picture is worth 1,000 words.
Isn't that the one where the Jeep was stuck there for, like, a couple of weeks before they could get it out? I recall that was an epic thread, wherever it came from.
I think it was from C&D.
I remember them smashing a window in the process of removing it the first time around. :lol:
Impressive video. Annoying the cayenne driver didn't stop to give an accident report (the video shows them going on their merry way- awesome reaction maneuvering, but you'd think there would have at least been some damage to warrant stopping).
As a side note, I've driven that road dozens of times and that's a downright terrifying accident. I will think of that wreck the next few times I drive that stretch for sure!
Quote from: MrH on June 06, 2010, 03:43:58 PM
How the hell is ground clearance a subjective measurement?!
:wtf:
Because on a real off-roader the lowest part is some suspension or differential with the rest of the vehicle significantly higher.
On the car-based nonsense the clearance is pretty much flat across the bottom making it much easier to get hung up. You might scrape a differential across something and not get stuck, dragging the entire underside of a car-based crap across same obstacle is not going to happen.
Quote from: Rupert on June 07, 2010, 01:34:38 AM
Isn't that the one where the Jeep was stuck there for, like, a couple of weeks before they could get it out? I recall that was an epic thread, wherever it came from.
Three days, but yeah. It was pretty epic at the time. Imagine taking a shop vac to the thing and sucking out frogs.
Quote from: heelntoe on June 07, 2010, 03:26:56 AM
I think it was from C&D.
I remember them smashing a window in the process of removing it the first time around. :lol:
You have an amazingly good memory. Wow.
Quote from: Rupert on June 06, 2010, 02:54:50 PM
XTerra
I'd be willing to be that any of my 3 stock Range Rovers are/were better offroaders than a stock XTerra. Now, my buddy's modded '80s 4Runner? Ok, that thing's a beast. Gonna be going out with him and his wife this summer to get the tires really muddy on some serious offrad trails with the Rangie this summer, like we did with the older ones.
I know what tave was talking about ealier.. As a paint and bodyman, I HATE intentionally scratching up ANY car, even a beater. And something that you spent good money on and is in very clean shape, it's really hard to do. I can't stand a filty dirty car OR truck, even if that's what it's meant to do. So even if we get the things truly muddy and filthy offroad, I'd be cleaning/washing it up before it ever hit the road to go home... To me it's like going out in public in filthy, torn up work clothes and not showering. It's fine to WORK that way in the garden or garage, but that's the end of it.
Quote from: SVT32V on June 07, 2010, 11:26:40 AM
Because on a real off-roader the lowest part is some suspension or differential with the rest of the vehicle significantly higher.
On the car-based nonsense the clearance is pretty much flat across the bottom making it much easier to get hung up. You might scrape a differential across something and not get stuck, dragging the entire underside of a car-based crap across same obstacle is not going to happen.
That doesn't make it subjective. It's a definitive number you can measure. That's about as objective as it can get. If you don't think that number necessarily represents anything, fine, but that doesn't make it subjective.
Quote from: MrH on June 07, 2010, 01:59:26 PM
That doesn't make it subjective. It's a definitive number you can measure. That's about as objective as it can get. If you don't think that number necessarily represents anything, fine, but that doesn't make it subjective.
I didn't mean to imply that it was subjective, obviously it is a number you can measure. I was merely stating why this number can be misleading and not useful in a real world situation. Perhaps a better measure would be the average clearance.
Quote from: thewizard16 on June 07, 2010, 11:06:56 AM
As a side note, I've driven that road dozens of times and that's a downright terrifying accident. I will think of that wreck the next few times I drive that stretch for sure!
My dad drives down the DNT every day, including that stretch.
Quote from: Rupert on June 06, 2010, 03:00:15 PM
Look, traction is important, and clearance is important, and those things are there on the Cayenne (though I wonder how relevant their claimed 11" is). But so are many other things, such as approach and departure angles, breakover, tires, suspension flex, axle articulation, etc. Those last two are not there on the Cayenne. What I am saying is that the Cayenne is a Subaru with somewhat more clearance. We all know that Subarus are pretty good off road for station wagons. We also all know that most real SUVs are better off road than a Subaru.
Xterra and Cayenne both have 32 degree approach angles. The Xterra has the edge departure angle of 29 vs 26. The Cayenne has a breakover angle advantage of 25 vs 23 degrees.
Your only kidding yourself really...
Quote from: ChrisV on June 07, 2010, 01:01:56 PM
I'd be willing to be that any of my 3 stock Range Rovers are/were better offroaders than a stock XTerra. Now, my buddy's modded '80s 4Runner? Ok, that thing's a beast. Gonna be going out with him and his wife this summer to get the tires really muddy on some serious offrad trails with the Rangie this summer, like we did with the older ones.
I know what tave was talking about ealier.. As a paint and bodyman, I HATE intentionally scratching up ANY car, even a beater. And something that you spent good money on and is in very clean shape, it's really hard to do. I can't stand a filty dirty car OR truck, even if that's what it's meant to do. So even if we get the things truly muddy and filthy offroad, I'd be cleaning/washing it up before it ever hit the road to go home... To me it's like going out in public in filthy, torn up work clothes and not showering. It's fine to WORK that way in the garden or garage, but that's the end of it.
Yeah, given equivalent tires, I'm sure the Range Rovers are better off road.
Quote from: r0tor on June 08, 2010, 04:49:01 PM
Xterra and Cayenne both have 32 degree approach angles. The Xterra has the edge departure angle of 29 vs 26. The Cayenne has a breakover angle advantage of 25 vs 23 degrees.
Your only kidding yourself really...
Quote from: Rupert on June 06, 2010, 03:00:15 PM
[...] tires, suspension flex, axle articulation, etc. Those last two are not there on the Cayenne.
:huh:
Quote from: r0tor on June 08, 2010, 04:49:01 PM
Xterra and Cayenne both have 32 degree approach angles. The Xterra has the edge departure angle of 29 vs 26. The Cayenne has a breakover angle advantage of 25 vs 23 degrees.
Your only kidding yourself really...
There's so much more...
Lockable center diff?
Lockable f/r diffs?
Two speed t-case, and if so, what is the low ratio?
Stock tires, and clearance to put on larger tires?
Betcha on total the Xterra is the better rig off road.
Quote from: GoCougs on June 08, 2010, 08:34:45 PM
There's so much more...
Lockable center diff? Yes.
Lockable f/r diffs? Yes, rear. Although the new model loses this (and 400lbs) for more on road sporty manners.
Two speed t-case, and if so, what is the low ratio? Yes.
Stock tires, and clearance to put on larger tires? Yes. Stock tires suck, but so do the ones on the Range Rover Sport and plenty of other posh luxury SUV's.
Betcha on total the Xterra is the better rig off road.
Why do you keep bringing up the RR Sport? We are clearly not using it as a benchmark for good SUV, as evidenced by one of my previous posts.
Quote from: GoCougs on June 08, 2010, 08:34:45 PM
There's so much more...
Lockable center diff?
Lockable f/r diffs?
Two speed t-case, and if so, what is the low ratio?
Stock tires, and clearance to put on larger tires?
Betcha on total the Xterra is the better rig off road.
I hate betting (cause I generally lose), and I would, in fact, bet on that.
Strangely, Porsche's website is absent off-road technical data for the Cayenne, choosing rather to snowball with ACRONYMS and pseudo enthusiast language. That they call it "AWD" tells me quite a bit.
Quote from: GoCougs on June 08, 2010, 09:44:22 PM
Strangely, Porsche's website is absent off-road technical data for the Cayenne, choosing rather to snowball with ACRONYMS and pseudo enthusiast language. That they call it "AWD" tells me quite a bit.
While I'd guess that the Xterra is also a better truck offroad, I wouldn't read too much into Porsche's website. They know their audience, and they know their audience doesn't care. The idea is to make a car good enough on-road for women to drive, yet manly enough for men not to be ashamed to drive it. Any offroad credibility has little meaning to their demographic.
The Cayenne can also hydraulically disconnect its sway bars....
Quote from: GoCougs on June 08, 2010, 09:44:22 PM
Strangely, Porsche's website is absent off-road technical data for the Cayenne, choosing rather to snowball with ACRONYMS and pseudo enthusiast language. That they call it "AWD" tells me quite a bit.
Are you looking at the 2010? The new generation lost a lot of it's off road capability.
Quote from: 2o6 on June 09, 2010, 01:34:05 PM
Are you looking at the 2010? The new generation lost a lot of it's off road capability.
It lost it is off-road capability? Really?
The diffs are now part of an off-road option package, I believe.
Quote from: the Teuton on June 09, 2010, 02:24:16 PM
It lost it is off-road capability? Really?
The diffs are now part of an off-road option package, I believe.
IIRC, the locking diffs were removed.
And I'm not an english major.
Quote from: 2o6 on June 09, 2010, 02:40:48 PM
IIRC, the locking diffs were removed.
And I'm not an english major.
Its no big deal.
Yes, both the Touareg and Cayenne lost the locking differential and the air suspensions with the new redesigned models, however you can still get that as an option on the V6 Diesel powered Touareg model.