what do you guys think about this car. looks really cool to me. very masculine but not a caricature. don't see that many on the road. in non-sho trim, pretty good price. one quibble i've heard is that for the size of the car, the back seat is pretty cramped.
looks a lot better than most of the mainstream midsize/large cars out there like camcords, altimas, passats, sonatas.
i'm helping my brother in law decide on a new car and he's currently checking out the sonata. he didn't like the fusion and doesn't like the styling of the camry. he's going to test drive the passat soon. he digs the volvo s40 but the price is a tad bit too high for what he wants to spend (30 grand max).
I think the Ford Taurus is an excellent car if a person likes its looks. Discounts should be heavy. I would definitely sit in the car to define for yourself/family member what "tight" rear seat room means. I was told that the XC60 T6 for which I own a 2013 has a tight back seat, but not for me and thus are only praise from my rear seat occupants.
The Volvo S40 (sedan) and wagon variety, the V40 will no longer be sold in the U.S. until their replacements are readied. There may be some 2012 models left. The S40 may have disappeared before the wagon, but not too sure. If you can find any new ones left, these, too, should be available at a significant discount.
For 2013, the Volvo S60 has a lower priced T5 AWD model joining the higher priced T6 (Turbo 6). Both come standard with FWD and come at a lower price.
The Passat is rated high and with VW aiming to sell a significantly higher number of cars to try toppling Toyota, I imagine they are offering great deals, as well.
Oops, sorry. I meant he digs the volvo s60 but its a tad bit expensive. I think the s-40 is long in the tooth now having been on the market without a change for a few bit years.
Glad you think the new taurus is an excellent car if you like the looks.
Quote from: veeman on August 19, 2012, 07:59:29 AM
Oops, sorry. I meant he digs the volvo s60 but its a tad bit expensive. I think the s-40 is long in the tooth now having been on the market without a change for a few bit years.
Glad you think the new taurus is an excellent car if you like the looks.
I sure do. The only complaints that should have been addressed on the early release 2013 model is a complicated MYFORD SYNC system that Ford contributes to some owners complaining about quality/reliability. A buddy had such problems (and he is tech savvy) with Ford's system (including the NAVI) on his 2010 SHO, but insists FMC corrected the problem for the 2012 model year. He traded the SHO for a MY12 "decked out F-Series" four door pickup and has had no problems with the advanced Infotainment and navigation whatsoever onced getting acquainted with it.
The Taurus is a barge -- one of the largest cars available on the market today -- and it feels it when you drive it. Its price and fuel economy are also in full-size rather than midsize territory. But except for the trunk, you don't get huge-car interior volume. And the 2013s now have MyFord Touch, which seems to be a needlessly messy interface at best and one that doesn't even work reliably at that.
If he loves the looks he could do worse, but I wouldn't recommend one over a good midsize sedan.
Glad to hear about your interest in Volvo! They are really dealing on remaining 2012, like everyone else, but the 2013 Volvo S60 T5 AWD is still likely to be the best deal around (compared to other Volvo's) -- no telling, though, as this may be dependent on the region, dealer or what's in stock. If AWD isn't a must, the FWD S60 T5 (and T6) models are highly competitive, I think.
Keep us posted!
I do not necesary disagree with Iffy about the Taurus, but I would not rule out the car as some like the bulk. I would urge your family member to test drive everything he likes to either "rule in" or "rule out" models. There are a lot of great mid size cars out there and more new or significantly upgraded ones with excellent MPG rolling out shortly compared to the Taurus. Iffy has some great points!
I recall the time I came very close to purchasing a Nissan Altima SE Hybid (thinking 2008, cannot recall) based on the recommendation others. OMG! Thankfully I took out the only one I could find (loaded SE hybrid's were rare then) before ordering. The car was slower than molasses! I then, returned to what I always had driven, another high powered Nissan Maxima in SE trim. No regrets and that car saved by like during the 2010 MVA.
he keeps shifting between value and passion. he sold his convertible 3 series on autotrader because maintenance costs once his warranty expired were annoying him. now he just has a sienna which he drives with his wife and young kid. needs another car for himself. he's my age, 39, so not a kid but not an old dude. good job but can't blow money especially with such a young kid and no mortgage yet.
big guy and doesn't like feeling cramped. i suggested he get a vw gti and he's considering it but likely wants to go the midsize to large sedan route. then he told me he liked the jeep gc strictly on how it looks. i'm steering him away from it because the way he drives sometimes, i'm afraid he'll flip it.
i told him the problem he was facing was value vs passion. these midsize standard sedans he's test driving are boring him. that's when i suggested the ford taurus and he sounded intrigued when i showed him how it looked.
Quote from: veeman on August 19, 2012, 09:22:47 AM
he keeps shifting between value and passion. he sold his convertible 3 series on autotrader because maintenance costs once his warranty expired were annoying him. now he just has a sienna which he drives with his wife and young kid. needs another car for himself. he's my age, 39, so not a kid but not an old dude. good job but can't blow money especially with such a young kid and no mortgage yet.
big guy and doesn't like feeling cramped. i suggested he get a vw gti and he's considering it but likely wants to go the midsize to large sedan route. then he told me he liked the jeep gc strictly on how it looks. i'm steering him away from it because the way he drives sometimes, i'm afraid he'll flip it.
i told him the problem he was facing was value vs passion. these midsize standard sedans he's test driving are boring him. that's when i suggested the ford taurus and he sounded intrigued when i showed him how it looked.
Sometimes value AND passion go hand&hand and I say never settle. The JGC would be a top contender for me based on his criteria. Rollover? Well, he needs to learn to drive more responsibly -- his issue, not yours. You sound like the mature one :praise: ! Just make certain he makes the final decision so that he doesn't blame you if you recommend something he ends up buying and not liking.
I think the Taurus looks great, but yeah, as ifcar said, it's HUGE. And pretty poorly packaged. It's a very tight car inside for how large it is.
Can he hold out until the new Fusion? I think once that comes out, there will be no reason for the Taurus anymore (smaller exterior dimensions, probably the same or better interior space, better gas mileage, better driving dynamics, cheaper, looks better).
Go find my review of the Ford Taurus from last summer. That will tell you everything you need to know.
I had it for 7 days so I know what it's like to live with.
The Passat is a better car.
I read your review SVT666. I found it very helpful. Thanks.
Huge car. Great interior. Quiet. Doesn't drive that well. Ford could have done better.
Without actually having driven it, I'm digging the hugeness of this car. Has a real road presence. I'm finding the dodge/chrysler "manly" cars too much of a caricature.
Yesterday, my brother in law test drove the v6 passat, volvo s60 base model, nissan altima v6, and audi a6 uplevel version (not a good idea to test drive a way superior car that you're not going to get after test driving potential buys I think). He was with his wife and dad.
its interesting that non-car enthusiast folks often think of the engine variants in the cars they drive or test drive as afterthoughts. i'm asking him which engine he test drove (4 cylinder/6 cylinder/diesel) and its hard for him to remember. I'm like, dude, that's the most important thing to remember and take into account because it's going to totally affect the car's pick up and how quiet it is! different engines in the same car is like different cars.
he thought the passat interior wasn't that great and the car handled "alright". was fast. he thought the volvo s60 looked sweet both on the inside and outside, handled o.k., and pick up was just o.k. he didn't like the nissan. thought the interior was terrible and pick up was terrible. he dug the absent gear shifts of the cvt transmission though. was totally enamored by everything about the audi.
so far he's test driven the above and sonata, fusion, and hybrid camry.
don't know now where he's leaning.
How about the TSX V6?
Quote from: 68_427 on August 20, 2012, 10:48:15 AM
How about the TSX V6?
Good thinking 68_427, plus I am thinking an Audi A4 or even A3 (if not too small for his frame) since he loved the costly (but sweet A6). This is a great time to get an end-of-model-year deal. What might be priced over his budget as a 2013 could be had for far less if he opts for a '12 and shops around.
A base Volvo S60? Was it a MY13 sedan? Because if he deals on a remaining 2012 S60, he might find he could get a higher trim level (or T6 vs. T5) for less than a base (still loaded) '13. This holds true for most cars this time of the year.
Infiniti is practically giving G's away as well.
If he doesn't put a ton of mileage on his cars, why not just lease a new 3er? No maintenance costs, done with it in three years and by then maybe he'll be ready to re-evaluate a long-term purchase.
Going from a 3er to a Taurus just seems... weird.
Quote from: TurboDan on August 21, 2012, 10:39:34 PM
If he doesn't put a ton of mileage on his cars, why not just lease a new 3er? No maintenance costs, done with it in three years and by then maybe he'll be ready to re-evaluate a long-term purchase.
Going from a 3er to a Taurus just seems... weird.
If he's looking at gigantic cars like the Taurus then I'm guessing a 3 series is too small. The trunk on the 3 is so small it's damn near a deal breaker for me. Room for 4 in the car, but only room for two people's luggage in the trunk.
Quote from: SVT666 on August 21, 2012, 10:43:42 PM
If he's looking at gigantic cars like the Taurus then I'm guessing a 3 series is too small. The trunk on the 3 is so small it's damn near a deal breaker for me. Room for 4 in the car, but only room for two people's luggage in the trunk.
Maybe. But he also has a minivan. If he needs space, he can just take that, I would think...
You can get pretty steep discounts on the Hyundai Genesis sedan now that the Azera is the fresh new face at the Hyundai dealerships. From your impression of the Taurus, it seems like the Genesis might just be a RWD Taurus, but I think it's definitely worth a look.
Or the new Azera itself. Great looking car.
so after speaking with him yesterday night he is smitten with the audi a6. he's searching autotrader for gently used a6s.
since he's my age and my brother in law, i've decided to hold my tongue and not suggest any other ideas at this point to him. i've had over the last month or so 3 phone conversations with him about cars and i had given him my suggestions. he had initially wanted to save money and get a mainstream sedan but nothing really enthralled him until he drove a 60 grand new a6. now my feeling is like whatever dude, you gotta do what you gotta do and whatever floats your boat.
the conversation went something like this:
"so dude, what are you thinking car wise. you've tested a bunch of stuff and i know you really dug that audi but its way over your budget. you know what i think... i think you should test a genesis."
"i'm searching autotrader for audi a6s. i'm finding some which have 5000 miles and are almost 20 grand off list. this one here in manhattan is selling for 40"
"o.k... cool. later man."
personally i think its not a very wise move but whatever.
veeman,
You seem like an awesome brother-in-law! It might be for best since he cannot say that you steered him in the wrong direction.
There are times when keeping peace in the family is the best thing to do. He obviously respect respects your opinion but has caught the car bug and it has gone wild.
I've given up with giving car advice. There have been three family members in a row that told me what they wanted to buy and I strongly urged them to look at something else. I even told them how unreliable the cars they were looking at were, but they all ignored me and they all wish they had listened to me.
Quote from: SVT666 on August 22, 2012, 09:38:38 AM
I've given up with giving car advice. There have been three family members in a row that told me what they wanted to buy and I strongly urged them to look at something else. I even told them how unreliable the cars they were looking at were, but they all ignored me and they all wish they had listened to me.
So they'll want your help next time now. It's better than them taking your advice and then ending up with a lemon.
Quote from: Atomic on August 22, 2012, 04:14:49 AM
veeman,
You seem like an awesome brother-in-law! It might be for best since he cannot say that you steered him in the wrong direction.
There are times when keeping peace in the family is the best thing to do. He obviously respect respects your opinion but has caught the car bug and it has gone wild.
Thanks for the props.
Whenever I see a Taurus, I can't tell if I'm looking at a car or one of those pre-fab houses on trailers. The thing is bigger than most European countries.
The new Taurus is SO big and SO tall. It really is a shame they didn't open up the interior some more. The trunk lid is SO tall. The first time I stood next to one I was just like... :confused:
Quote from: SVT666 on August 22, 2012, 09:38:38 AM
I've given up with giving car advice. There have been three family members in a row that told me what they wanted to buy and I strongly urged them to look at something else. I even told them how unreliable the cars they were looking at were, but they all ignored me and they all wish they had listened to me.
^^ This ^^
I don't tend to give out and advice anymore to friends and family. I find that most of the time, their minds are already made up and they just want someone to agree with them. I just direct them to a dealership I know that is priced well, or help them find the car they want on autotrader.
Quote from: veeman on August 19, 2012, 09:22:47 AM
he keeps shifting between value and passion. he sold his convertible 3 series on autotrader because maintenance costs once his warranty expired were annoying him. now he just has a sienna which he drives with his wife and young kid. needs another car for himself. he's my age, 39, so not a kid but not an old dude. good job but can't blow money especially with such a young kid and no mortgage yet.
big guy and doesn't like feeling cramped. i suggested he get a vw gti and he's considering it but likely wants to go the midsize to large sedan route. then he told me he liked the jeep gc strictly on how it looks. i'm steering him away from it because the way he drives sometimes, i'm afraid he'll flip it.
i told him the problem he was facing was value vs passion. these midsize standard sedans he's test driving are boring him. that's when i suggested the ford taurus and he sounded intrigued when i showed him how it looked.
Tell him to wait and get either a next generation Fusion or Mazda 6
I think the Taurus looks pretty good; especially the rear with the retro LED tail lights; and it's a decent deal with a good power train (290 hp V6, 6sp AT, available AWD). However as a daily utilitarian car it's really not great. Packaging is poor and it's huge. The best utilitarian car for an enthusiast is the Camry V6 SE.
yesterday, his wife and him came to my place and we did some test-driving. I was in the backseat which gives me a very different perspective
new acura tl loaded with superhandling awd (black) - very sporty and sounds good. fast. not luxurious at all. cramped back seat. small trunk. exterior styling is ok since the refresh. annoying lying POS salesman who tried to tell me that 19 inch tires are more comfortable than the standard 17 inch tires and other bs. my brother in law wasn't impressed
used certified mercedes e-350 awd (silver) 2 years old. 12,000 miles on the odometer - wow. this car looks awesome both from the outside and inside. elegant and stately. feels like a bank vault. you can instantly tell you're not in a run of the mill mainstreamer. roomy backseat. crappy leatherette which feels and looks terrible compared with the real thing. i was taken aback by how good their certified warranty appears. 3 years from date of certified purchase, 100,000 miles bumper to bumper (not just powertrain). covers everything except tires and brakes and other normal wear and tear. for a little over 1,000 more you can bump it up another year and an additional 12 thousand miles. for a little over 2,000 more you can bump it up 2 more years and an additional 25,000 miles. then there's the price. 44,000. new is 60,000. my brother in law liked it. thought it was slow compared with the acura though and the steering was weird. didn't feel natural because of the steering assist which turned the car much more than the wheel turned.
next step was audi a6 but ... something happened on the way outside the dealership where he turns around and tells me and his wife "what am I doing...this is madness...camry or sonata, not this bs luxo crap which i'm going to regret" wife agrees. i'm silent.
they go to toyota and hyundai, not to test drive, just to take another look. he comes within a few minutes of buying the sonata limited with panoramic sunroof, leather, and nav for 28,500 after saleswoman originally quoted him 29,500 but then "bargained". i suggest to him to not do anything rash. he and i don't know what a good price is yet and does he need the car tomorrow? he grudgingly agrees.
we go home, drink a beer (just 1) and then him, his wife, and child go home.
today he emails me carsdirect pricing:
sonata 27500 (but one dealer offered 26500) 0.9% apr for 3 years. loaded with everything
camry v6 xle 29974 0% apr for 3 years. loaded with everything.
i told him my opinion: camry was smoother, quieter, faster, better interior, better resale. sonata had better styling, better gas mileage, better warranty. camry was more substance but more boring. i suggested that if he wanted a lexus which no one would notice get the camry. if he was willing to sacrifice some refinement and speed for more style, get the sonata. can't go wrong with either.
we'll see...
We love our Sonata SE 2.0T, except the tires are too damn loud.
An MKZ would have been interesting. Forgot about that car.
Agree on the TL critique. I had great luck with the Accord and wanted to really like the TL (SH-AWD w/6sp MT) but it was merely okay.
If he wants a good deal go with the Camry SE V6. Missing a few of the luxury items, and the leather isn't as soft and supple as the XLE, but it's a few grand cheaper.
An the SE V6 gets some nice wheels, but for value for money, and with the right tires, the Sonata is te best option. The 2.0T is a treat of an engine. I did 37.1 MPG (4.979 gallons for 184.7 miles) in it with the air on, temp of 104 degrees or so, and trough some smal mountains (Arbuckles just north of Ardmore, OK) and was extremely comfortable while doing it. The cars with 18s need quieter tires to truly be great.
The Camry is the better car by far. The Sonata has come a long way, but from my test drives, it's still not up to snuff.
he called me today and said he bought the mercedes. bargained down to 41.5 thousand for the one we test drove: silver, E350 AWD, 2011 with 12,800 miles. Clean carfax, was leased and not a demo car. comes with bumper to bumper warranty 3 yr starting now/100,000 miles. maintenance not covered.
Beautiful.
His wife told him a saying from the old country (she's an immigrant from eastern europe) - once you ride a horse, you can't ride a donkey
Good man.
Quote from: veeman on August 29, 2012, 10:02:03 PM
he called me today and said he bought the mercedes. bargained down to 41.5 thousand for the one we test drove: silver, E350 AWD, 2011 with 12,800 miles. Clean carfax, was leased and not a demo car. comes with bumper to bumper warranty 3 yr starting now/100,000 miles. maintenance not covered.
Beautiful.
His wife told him a saying from the old country (she's an immigrant from eastern europe) - once you ride a horse, you can't ride a donkey
Sounds like a good deal. And agree on the horse/donkey comment. Going from a BMW to a Taurus (as he was originally considering) just seemed odd unless there were financial limitations dictating the downgrade.