With the A4 likely to be departing our ownership as soon as we return from our vacation, I've been thinking a lot about what's going to replace it.
There's the possiblity of it ending up a decision between the '06 A4 [which my dad seems to favor due to a lower sticker price and quattro for the winter] and the E90 325i. Most of you know of my love affair with the E90 3-Series.
However, there's still the possibility that we might forgo both of those cars [in part becasue I really don't want my dad spending that much on a car for me to drive, even if it is HIS] and get something cheaper, in the low $20K range.
A 2002 Audi TT with roughly 30K to 40K miles can be had for that price. I'd defenitely go for a quattro. The TT is a bit heavy for its size, 3200lbs. and it has bad weight distribution. However, all of the numbers are very similar to my A4, which I love driving. And I need a rear seat, even if it is nearly useless. It serves as a nice storage area.
One major factor attracting me to a TT is that MOST of them are manuals. The TT is a looker inside and out... It was on the C/D 10Best for 2 years, and they said "It begs to be driven hard". It placed last in a performance-oriented comparison test, mainly because it was more of an everyday car compared to the rest, and the 180HP version they tested was a bit slow for a performance comparison. They still noted that it 'steered sharply'.
Basically, from all I'm hearing, it seems to be my A4 shrunk and reshaped into a very good-looking coupe. And I can get one for a good price.
When is the TT going to be redesigned completely?
Whaddya guys think?
It's going against some very tough competition, though...
(http://www.navidazimi.com/albums/bmw325/three_quarter.jpg)
I thought the TT was Jetta/Golf based(i think its golf).
QuoteI thought the TT was Jetta/Golf based(i think its golf).
Yep. Golf. The Jetta's also based on the Golf.
That's one thing that's discouraging me, mainly because the TT's quattro system is a Volvo-like Front-biased Haldex setup rather than the normal Torsen system in other Audis.
Insurance would be extremely expensive, especially with your driving record. Not only would a 4-door be more practical, but it would be much less expensive to insure.
QuoteInsurance would be extremely expensive, especially with your driving record. Not only would a 4-door be more practical, but it would be much less expensive to insure.
That's not necessarly true. It would depend a lot on his insurance company. My father is an agent for State Farm, for example, and he has said that they go not by the color number of doors, etc, but rather by the previous history of that vehicle. That is, cars with a history of being in mroe wrecks are more expensive to insure than cars with a better record of staying in one piece. Some other insurers are the same way.
I test drove an 02 (I believe) with the 225 hp Turbo and the 5 speed. That thing was definitely quick enough. The car handled very nicely; the steering was direct and was weighted perfectly. The brakes were powerful and the interior appointments were quite awesome.
I really enjoyed it, and might consider it in the future. Im sure you would like it too. In the right colors, it looks very sharp.
QuoteQuoteInsurance would be extremely expensive, especially with your driving record. Not only would a 4-door be more practical, but it would be much less expensive to insure.
That's not necessarly true. It would depend a lot on his insurance company. My father is an agent for State Farm, for example, and he has said that they go not by the color number of doors, etc, but rather by the previous history of that vehicle. That is, cars with a history of being in mroe wrecks are more expensive to insure than cars with a better record of staying in one piece. Some other insurers are the same way.
A TT probably wouldn't have the best record there, either, but that is a much better system.
I've heard a stigma (not saying I believe in it) that Audi TT's are mainly driven by women and gay men. That said, I would still get a 325i even without that, and most certainly a used 3er that you could pick up for the same price as a TT. It will handle better, most probably be faster, it will handle better, be a lot more practical, etc.
Well, they always place near last in comparos. Plus I don't find their styling attractive at all and pretty much think of them as gussied up Golf GTIs. However, I love calling them titties.:P
How about a Golf R32?
QuoteWell, they always place near last in comparos. Plus I don't find their styling attractive at all and pretty much think of them as gussied up Golf GTIs. However, I love calling them titties.:P
How about a Golf R32?
A gold R32 would be really cool, although I would still go for the 325i. :praise:
The vert is kind of a chick car...you're thinking about the coupe right?
Wait, you said you wanted a back seat. These are 2-seaters...
QuoteThe vert is kind of a chick car...you're thinking about the coupe right?
The coupe is also a chick car a little.
QuoteQuoteThe vert is kind of a chick car...you're thinking about the coupe right?
The coupe is also a chick car a little.
Maybe, but it's more agressive than the convertable for sure.
QuoteQuoteQuoteThe vert is kind of a chick car...you're thinking about the coupe right?
The coupe is also a chick car a little.
Maybe, but it's more agressive than the convertable for sure.
For sure.
Fo' sho'.
QuoteFo' sho'.
Fo Shizzle.
Beeach
While were offtopic.....
(http://www.clanpot.com/forky/chap/rickjames2.gif)
Lets get back on topic ;)
QuoteInsurance would be extremely expensive, especially with your driving record. Not only would a 4-door be more practical, but it would be much less expensive to insure.
That's a good point, I'll have to look into that. Note that there's actually only 1 accident on my record, and I think our insurance is done differently, I'm just an addition to the entire family. I don't know how it works.
We're with Allstate, BTW. Our Insurance agent is a family friend.
And, Ifcar, you would know... How good is TT reliability?
I'm only going to be keeping this car for 4-5 years MAXIMUM, because, again, it's going to be still my dad's, and when I graduate, I'll buy my own ride. So if I buy one now with around 30K miles, I'm thinking it'll have nearly 80 or 90K when I'm done with it. Are TTs good up to that point?
I'd also be looking for something CPO.
And sure, something with 4 doors is more practical, but I rarely ever use my A4s rear seats (95% of the time, It's either just me or me and my sister in my car), and it's going to be even used less when I'm off to college. As long as something has a back seat, it doesn't really matter whether it has 2 or 4 doors.
BTW, I'd probably prefer a 180 version over a 225. I don't need the 225s speed, and it's more thirsty.
QuoteI've heard a stigma (not saying I believe in it) that Audi TT's are mainly driven by women and gay men. That said, I would still get a 325i even without that, and most certainly a used 3er that you could pick up for the same price as a TT. It will handle better, most probably be faster, it will handle better, be a lot more practical, etc.
But at the same time, every man and his dog has a 3-Series in the State of Illinois. It doesn't matter to me, but the TTs uniqueness would be nice, as there really aren't that many around here (Surprising, considering how popular Audis are with the Chicagoan crowd). In addition, I love my A4. I love the way it drives, and I love AWD in the winter, and I just plain love Audis (My first username on C/D nearly 4 years ago was 'Audi S8 quattro'), even though I still prefer BMW. By the reviews I'm seeing, the TT shares a LOT with my A4.
QuoteWell, they always place near last in comparos. Plus I don't find their styling attractive at all and pretty much think of them as gussied up Golf GTIs. However, I love calling them titties.:P
How about a Golf R32?
I guess it's a matter of taste.
I don't need the R32s speed. And insurance... I wouldn't want to even think about how high it would be, even though I'm not paying it.
QuoteThe vert is kind of a chick car...you're thinking about the coupe right?
Wait, you said you wanted a back seat. These are 2-seaters...
Coupe.
My dad wouldn't even consider a used 3-Series convertible, a 4-seater. He has something against convertibles, believes them to be too inconvenient for the Chicago winter, even though a modern convertible isn 't really bad at all. If I was going down to 2 seats, I'd probably just get an S2000.
While the rear seats in the coupe are nearly useless, people underestimate the value of the back seat as a storage area, especially for an HS/College student. Hell, my A4s back seat rarely carries human cargo.
QuoteQuoteQuoteThe vert is kind of a chick car...you're thinking about the coupe right?
The coupe is also a chick car a little.
Maybe, but it's more agressive than the convertable for sure.
I think it's more than aggressive, especially the ones that came with the 17" Audi /S/ style wheels:
(http://www.numar.borec.cz/dok/Audi/audi%20tt%2005.jpg)
Most of the TTs in my area are decently priced, and are 5-Speeds with the 17" wheel package. B)
And BTW a lot of the time I project an Image that I always favor the sharper stiffer more track-capable car, which is why I tend to favor BMWs so much. It's only that way to a certain point. I don't need a monster performer, but personally, I HAVE to have a car that his direct and well-balanced steering and exhibits average to minimal body roll and is capable of thrills. I like the balance my A4 posesses, even if it has a little too much body roll and its weight distribution is not exactly great - It still steers excellently and is VERY tossable. That's why the TT appeals to me so much--because its very nice inside and out but is more than capable of being tossed around. That's why, for example, I'd probably never buy an M3 Convertible over a 325Ci as a daily driver. Because the latter is just more comfortable and has adequate power and would save me half the money.
Here are some Autotrader examples. Two of my uncles have incredible connections to the car marketplace here in the area and they know how to bargain [trust me], so consider anywhere from $1K to $2K off those prices.
http://autotrader.com/fyc/vdp.jsp?car_id=1...isp=y&cardist=7 (http://autotrader.com/fyc/vdp.jsp?car_id=183431300&dealer_id=82086&car_year=2002&make=AUDI&distance=25&lang=en&max_price=25000&model=TT&end_year=2006&min_price=1&certified=&address=60527&search_type=both&advanced=&start_year=2002&isp=y&cardist=7)
^VERY low mileage...
http://autotrader.com/fyc/vdp.jsp?car_id=1...rdist=18#vdptop (http://autotrader.com/fyc/vdp.jsp?car_id=182888211&dealer_id=16044545&car_year=2002&make=AUDI&distance=25&lang=en&max_price=25000&model=TT&end_year=2006&min_price=1&certified=&address=60527&search_type=both&advanced=&start_year=2002&isp=y&cardist=18#vdptop)
http://autotrader.com/fyc/vdp.jsp?car_id=1...sp=y&cardist=24 (http://autotrader.com/fyc/vdp.jsp?car_id=179651814&dealer_id=612775&car_year=2002&make=AUDI&distance=25&lang=en&max_price=25000&model=TT&end_year=2006&min_price=1&certified=&address=60527&search_type=both&advanced=&start_year=2002&isp=y&cardist=24)
http://autotrader.com/fyc/vdp.jsp?car_id=1...ardist=7#vdptop (http://autotrader.com/fyc/vdp.jsp?car_id=180457952&dealer_id=82086&car_year=2002&make=AUDI&distance=25&lang=en&max_price=25000&model=TT&end_year=2006&min_price=1&certified=&address=60527&search_type=both&advanced=&start_year=2002&isp=y&cardist=7#vdptop)
http://autotrader.com/fyc/vdp.jsp?car_id=1...sp=y&cardist=16 (http://autotrader.com/fyc/vdp.jsp?car_id=180264924&dealer_id=52304139&car_year=2002&make=AUDI&distance=25&lang=en&max_price=25000&model=TT&end_year=2006&min_price=1&certified=&address=60527&search_type=both&advanced=&start_year=2002&isp=y&cardist=16)
Just a few.
Again, one of the factors really luring me to a TT is the selection of manual-transmission cars. It's not as easy to find, say, a 3-Series coupe with a stick.
R&T seemed to like it in a recent comparo with the 350Z, Boxster, and Z4. It placed 2nd.
You know who came 1st. :lol:
QuoteR&T seemed to like it in a recent comparo with the 350Z, Boxster, and Z4. It placed 2nd.
You know who came 1st. :lol:
The 3.2 DSG is getting very positive reviews. And why not? 250HP and one of the world's most advanced and best gearboxes.
Who came 1st... the Z car?
The Z came dead last. That's fine, I don't much care for the 350Z.
However the TT beat both Zs, which is quite impressive considering it's Golf based.
Needless to say, The Porsche was first. Of course, the Porsche or Ferrari is always first, unless the Corvette is involved, but that can only win based on price.
QuoteThe Z came dead last. That's fine, I don't much care for the 350Z.
However the TT beat both Zs, which is quite impressive considering it's Golf based.
Needless to say, The Porsche was first. Of course, the Porsche or Ferrari is always first, unless the Corvette is involved, but that can only win based on price.
I don't like the 350Z too much, and I didn't think a classic Z enthusiast would, either. :lol:
That IS an impressive finish for the TT...
BTW, that comparison is exactly how I would have ranked them.
850 Have you driven a TT yet?
Quote850 Have you driven a TT yet?
Nope.
What stinks for me is that it's a bit difficult to get test-drives because of my age.
I'll be sure to drive whatever I'm going to buy though before I buy it.
Ok, i was just wondering.
Reading some of your posts it seemed like you have yet to drive one.
*double post
QuoteQuote850 Have you driven a TT yet?
Nope.
What stinks for me is that it's a bit difficult to get test-drives because of my age.
I'll be sure to drive whatever I'm going to buy though before I buy it.
Take a parent along. Show them the money and they'll jump.
QuoteQuoteQuote850 Have you driven a TT yet?
Nope.
What stinks for me is that it's a bit difficult to get test-drives because of my age.
I'll be sure to drive whatever I'm going to buy though before I buy it.
Take a parent along. Show them the money and they'll jump.
Yeah, my uncle was with me when we bought the A4. I drove an A6, the A4 I later bought, and a 528i.
QuoteOk, i was just wondering.
Reading some of your posts it seemed like you have yet to drive one.
Yeah.
But from what I'm reading about it, it's like they're describing the way my A4 feels. And my A4 weighs only about 50lbs more. So I can guess pretty well how the TT drives.
I kind of wish it was lighter, around 3000 lbs. instead of 3200. I do a lot of driving on the highway, though, so that actually might be a good thing.
QuoteQuoteOk, i was just wondering.
Reading some of your posts it seemed like you have yet to drive one.
Yeah.
But from what I'm reading about it, it's like they're describing the way my A4 feels. And my A4 weighs only about 50lbs more. So I can guess pretty well how the TT drives.
But the TT has a different drivetrain setup, and different weight distribution.
You should go drive one, as they tend to feel more like a jetta/golf then a A4.
I drove my neighbors TT around the block a few times. All I remember is that the throws were short and quick and it was very rev happy. The tires were easy to spin from takeoff too.
QuoteI drove my neighbors TT around the block a few times. All I remember is that the throws were short and quick and it was very rev happy. The tires were easy to spin from takeoff too.
Thats quite your normal spin around the block :P
QuoteQuoteQuoteOk, i was just wondering.
Reading some of your posts it seemed like you have yet to drive one.
Yeah.
But from what I'm reading about it, it's like they're describing the way my A4 feels. And my A4 weighs only about 50lbs more. So I can guess pretty well how the TT drives.
But the TT has a different drivetrain setup, and different weight distribution.
You should go drive one, as they tend to feel more like a jetta/golf then a A4.
I just went to the Audi dealership to check out the new A4, and I sat in a TT... I just didn't like it for some reason.
QuoteI just went to the Audi dealership to check out the new A4, and I sat in a TT... I just didn't like it for some reason.
Was it the seating position or what? The appearance?
Did it feel confining?
I went to the BMW and Audi dealerships and sat in a buncha cars...
E90 3-Series: I was not dissapointed. There was a Monaco Blue example with the Terra leather interior in the show room. Talk about NICE. And it's every bit as nice as it looks in the pictures. I also sat in a black interior. I think I'd like it most in Grey. Steel Grey/Grey, If I had to buy one. I also sat in the back. Headroom was the slightest bit tight, but it was overall very roomy. They're not kidding when they say it's comparable to the E39 5er in the back.
5er: There was a 530Xi Wagon in the show room. It was the first time in a long time I've been in an E60 interior. Those things are underrated from the inside, especially in black. It was pretty darn nice. Not as nice as an E, but very nice. I also noticed a good amount of AWD 5-Series models in the lot.
7er: Good lord, what an awesome place to be. Everything about it from the inside was just awesome. I could never imagine myself driving something that BIG though.
^One thing I noticed with all of the Bimmers is just HOW HQ and solid everything felt. From the door handles to thte way the doors closed to the dash materials and gauge cluster, everything felt put together so well. Especially the 3-Series.
'06 A4: Very nice in every respect. Also felt very solid, and I really like the facelift.
TT: I just don't like the interior too much for some reason. And I just realized that I like the 325Ci a lot more.
A8: Good God, I could live in there. The A8's interior is easily the nicest of any car I have ever been in. Attention to detail and materials is just remarkable, simply amazing.
QuoteQuoteI just went to the Audi dealership to check out the new A4, and I sat in a TT... I just didn't like it for some reason.
Was it the seating position or what? The appearance?
Mainly appearance. The seats were awesome, but I just don't like the way the whole design flowed and I didn't like the way the gauge cluster was done. At all.
I'm going to have to talk to my dad tonight. My scores are great, so I might just be able to convince him to go for a 325i. Problem is, I really don't feel right asking my dad to spend $35K on a car for me to drive, even though it's still 100% his car. On the other hand, I'm already driving a $38K X3 2.5i around most of the time [He's been taking the A4 a lot recently; we switch off, especially now that I'm out of school].
The way I see it, it's 2006 A4 vs. 2006 325i. I'd prefer the Bimmer, but I'm defenitely going to be leaving it up to my dad without bugging him, because I'm already asking too much. Then again, it is effectively his 2nd car and weekend toy [he uses the A4 a lot when he feels like DRIVING]. And he doesn't pretend, he's made it known that the prospect of a 6-Speed 325i in the garage is very appealing to him.
If not those two, then most likely something in the low $20K range, and I'd favor an E46 3-Series.
Anything we buy is going to be stick-shift, because my dad loves it, and so do I. And I tend to speed when driving Autos.
Quote^One thing I noticed with all of the Bimmers is just HOW HQ and solid everything felt. From the door handles to thte way the doors closed to the dash materials and gauge cluster, everything felt put together so well. Especially the 3-Series.
That's what I thought too when I looked at a friend of a friend's BMW 530i. It had nice chrome touches, tight gaps, and real leather! I also love the shape of the dash. It made our '99 Olds Intrigue w/ gray leather look like crap. :praise:
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v733/280Z_Driver/DSCN0475.jpg)
The design is so clean and modern that it will probably never look old.
I also sat in a black 3er with the sport package at a local autoshow. I loved that one too, but the 5 series is my favorite.
I like the old BMW interiors more than the new ones, even though the new ones look more upscale. The old ones had a better layout.
Actually, one of the things pulling me towards an E46 is the interior.
I hate the new shape of the dash. I like it better when the center stack flows into the center console. The new interiors look kinda busy, IMHO.
The old ones however, are simply beautiful. I love the gauges, overall shape, and attention to detail.
And if your thankin you want a TT, there's one coming home. Yee Haw!
I've driven a couple of TTs, both the coupe and the roadster, both with a real manual, both 1.8Ts, both with AWD.
It's a fun experience. You've got to work harder to get the back end to play, and the shifter is a little rubbery (but driving an Audi, you're probably used to it by now). It's not an A4 coupe, however--it's got the underpinnings of a Golf or GTI, not a Passat, which is what the A4 is based on.
I love the TT, but it's one of those cars I'd probably never buy. The coupe, in its artful glory has no sunroof, and for the money, a 350Z or Mustang GT will outperform it, and a G35 coupe will come close to its level of refinement while still running circles around it. The roadster is incredibly fun to drive, but I'd be wary of choosing one over the much cheaper and more fun to drive Toyota MR-2. Be aware that the only the more expensive Porsche Boxster will have an interior that is comparable in quality and fit and finish, and only the late models of the discontinued Box, or the new one.
As far as an involving drive is concerned, the TT will keep you on the edge of your seat, but this car, much like your A4 or my Passat, I suppose, will only reward you if you push it, nearly beyond all imagineable limits you'd think the car would have. An excerpt from my pending article on the TT roadster:
"It?s fairly simplistic?the radio controls are covered by a metallic panel with the letter TT emblazoned across?and it extends the art motif to the cockpit. There are a few oddities about the positioning of controls: the CD changer is behind the driver seat, and the trunk release is behind the passenger. So if you?re going on long trips, find six CDs that you really like if you don?t want to pull over ever few hours. The trunk isn?t large, but it?s not too small either. Golf clubs might be a tight fit, but as long as you?re not moving your armoire, you shouldn?t be in too bad shape. Another thing you?ll notice is that the steering wheel doesn?t go quite high enough, but it?s easy to become acquainted with quickly."
"With Audi?s AWD system, this roadster comes as close to a four season convertible as you can get, however a more balanced rear drive chassis would be the best for a sports car. This isn?t a sports car, though, and as soon as you come to terms with that, you?ll be able to appreciate it for the boulevardier that it really is. With 225 horsepower on tap, the TT can launch itself forward more than adequately. With the power war ever escalating, the number may not seem very impressive, but keeping the TT?s 1.8T turbocharged four-cylinder on boil with the manual transmission is a breeze?this car will surprise many with just how peppy the engine actually is. You won?t be embarrassing Nissan Z cars at your local drag strip, but it?s more than sufficient. If you stand on the gas pedal, you can hear the sweet sound of the engine revving and the turbo spooling?ah, the beautiful sound of a whistling turbo."
"It?s not a sports car?it?s the very definition of a boulevardier. It?s not as hard edged as a Nissan 350Z Roadster or Honda S2000 nor is it as expensive as the more balanced BMW Z4, Mercedes SLK, or Porsche Boxster. If that?s what you?re looking for, you may not find a better car."
Just want to point out that a Z4 2.5i starts at $1,200 less than the TT base convertible.
QuoteJust want to point out that a Z4 2.5i starts at $1,200 less than the TT base convertible.
Are you pointing that out to me?
I was comparing to the Z4 3.0 which has comparable power and acceleration times. Which is more expensive, if I recall correctly.
QuoteQuoteJust want to point out that a Z4 2.5i starts at $1,200 less than the TT base convertible.
Are you pointing that out to me?
I was comparing to the Z4 3.0 which has comparable power and acceleration times. Which is more expensive, if I recall correctly.
I believe the Z4 2.5i is quicker than the 180-hp Base TT (the only price I mentioned), and may even be as quick as the uplevel 225-hp version.
don't be pointing out anything to Raza, he'll drop the hammer on you iftruck
In short, if I'd resigned myself to a coupe with no sunroof, I'd choose a 350Z. More power, better handling, sportier looks (art isn't necessarily aggressive), and a similar trans, in my opinion. Though, I do like the lower clutch grab of the TT compared to the rather high one of the 350Z. Good for launches, but the higher catch of the 350Z makes fast shits faster and is better for performance driving.
Hell, if you want something that isn't too sporty, I'd also look at the Chrysler Crossfire, the TT's most direct competitor.
QuoteQuoteQuoteJust want to point out that a Z4 2.5i starts at $1,200 less than the TT base convertible.
Are you pointing that out to me?
I was comparing to the Z4 3.0 which has comparable power and acceleration times. Which is more expensive, if I recall correctly.
I believe the Z4 2.5i is quicker than the 180-hp Base TT (the only price I mentioned), and may even be as quick as the uplevel 225-hp version.
Stopped to 60, a 6 speed 225bhp quattro TT runs about 6.4 seconds, whereas the Z4 2.5i is a touch over 7 with a manual.
A 350Z would embarass both cars for cheaper.
QuoteQuoteQuoteQuoteJust want to point out that a Z4 2.5i starts at $1,200 less than the TT base convertible.
Are you pointing that out to me?
I was comparing to the Z4 3.0 which has comparable power and acceleration times. Which is more expensive, if I recall correctly.
I believe the Z4 2.5i is quicker than the 180-hp Base TT (the only price I mentioned), and may even be as quick as the uplevel 225-hp version.
Stopped to 60, a 6 speed 225bhp quattro TT runs about 6.4 seconds, whereas the Z4 2.5i is a touch over 7 with a manual.
A 350Z would embarass both cars for cheaper.
I'm looking at a 6.8-second run for the Z4 2.5i, from Consumer Guide of all places. <_<
And yes, the 350Z is faster. So?
QuoteQuoteQuoteQuoteQuoteJust want to point out that a Z4 2.5i starts at $1,200 less than the TT base convertible.
Are you pointing that out to me?
I was comparing to the Z4 3.0 which has comparable power and acceleration times. Which is more expensive, if I recall correctly.
I believe the Z4 2.5i is quicker than the 180-hp Base TT (the only price I mentioned), and may even be as quick as the uplevel 225-hp version.
Stopped to 60, a 6 speed 225bhp quattro TT runs about 6.4 seconds, whereas the Z4 2.5i is a touch over 7 with a manual.
A 350Z would embarass both cars for cheaper.
I'm looking at a 6.8-second run for the Z4 2.5i, from Consumer Guide of all places. <_<
And yes, the 350Z is faster. So?
When looking at a sports car (or GT, as the 350Z and TT are), acceleration is important, though by no means should it the be absolute deciding factor. If you can accelerate faster and handle nearly as well, then it is a better choice of car at a lower price. If the 350 were to cost as much as a Z4, then the Z4 would be my choice. However, the 350Z does the run very quickly, with near-equal panache and finesse, and I consider it to be a better value as a sports/GT than the Z4, though I do say that the Z4 3.0 is a better car (though I can't say for sure that it's a better car than the Boxster).
If a backseat is necessary, then a 328i 5 speed is also a good choice. Slower than the TT, but insurance would be lower since it is a sedan, and it should handle better. Used car prices on the 328 are weak, since the 330 is more desireable on the used market.
QuoteQuoteQuoteQuoteQuoteQuoteJust want to point out that a Z4 2.5i starts at $1,200 less than the TT base convertible.
Are you pointing that out to me?
I was comparing to the Z4 3.0 which has comparable power and acceleration times. Which is more expensive, if I recall correctly.
I believe the Z4 2.5i is quicker than the 180-hp Base TT (the only price I mentioned), and may even be as quick as the uplevel 225-hp version.
Stopped to 60, a 6 speed 225bhp quattro TT runs about 6.4 seconds, whereas the Z4 2.5i is a touch over 7 with a manual.
A 350Z would embarass both cars for cheaper.
I'm looking at a 6.8-second run for the Z4 2.5i, from Consumer Guide of all places. <_<
And yes, the 350Z is faster. So?
When looking at a sports car (or GT, as the 350Z and TT are), acceleration is important, though by no means should it the be absolute deciding factor. If you can accelerate faster and handle nearly as well, then it is a better choice of car at a lower price. If the 350 were to cost as much as a Z4, then the Z4 would be my choice. However, the 350Z does the run very quickly, with near-equal panache and finesse, and I consider it to be a better value as a sports/GT than the Z4, though I do say that the Z4 3.0 is a better car (though I can't say for sure that it's a better car than the Boxster).
Right, but I was only comparing the TT and Z4, and only the pricing at that.
I never thought I'd see the day when ifcar starts acting like a BMW troll :lol:
Only BMW trolls point out inaccurate information about BMWs? :rolleyes:
QuoteQuoteQuoteQuoteQuoteQuoteQuoteJust want to point out that a Z4 2.5i starts at $1,200 less than the TT base convertible.
Are you pointing that out to me?
I was comparing to the Z4 3.0 which has comparable power and acceleration times. Which is more expensive, if I recall correctly.
I believe the Z4 2.5i is quicker than the 180-hp Base TT (the only price I mentioned), and may even be as quick as the uplevel 225-hp version.
Stopped to 60, a 6 speed 225bhp quattro TT runs about 6.4 seconds, whereas the Z4 2.5i is a touch over 7 with a manual.
A 350Z would embarass both cars for cheaper.
I'm looking at a 6.8-second run for the Z4 2.5i, from Consumer Guide of all places. <_<
And yes, the 350Z is faster. So?
When looking at a sports car (or GT, as the 350Z and TT are), acceleration is important, though by no means should it the be absolute deciding factor. If you can accelerate faster and handle nearly as well, then it is a better choice of car at a lower price. If the 350 were to cost as much as a Z4, then the Z4 would be my choice. However, the 350Z does the run very quickly, with near-equal panache and finesse, and I consider it to be a better value as a sports/GT than the Z4, though I do say that the Z4 3.0 is a better car (though I can't say for sure that it's a better car than the Boxster).
Right, but I was only comparing the TT and Z4, and only the pricing at that.
He said Quattro, which unless he goes far back, is not available with the base 180bhp motor, nor was the base engine available with a stick shift. Recent TT Quattros have been 225bhp and stick, every single one. In my article, it's compared to the Z4 3.0, which is more of a competition than the 2.5 to the TT high output engine.
And while you were comparing pricing, I was comparing everything.
Okay...
I still need to go look over an older TT coupe. I really need a back seat, even if it's nearly useless.
If I had to choose my car right now, in that low $20K range, I would likely chose either a 325Ci or a 328Ci with low mileage. I'm still not sure my dad is going to be very accepting to the whole coupe idea, so this might end up turning into a battle of sedans: ~2002 325i and ~2002 A4 1.8T q.
QuoteOkay...
I still need to go look over an older TT coupe. I really need a back seat, even if it's nearly useless.
If I had to choose my car right now, in that low $20K range, I would likely chose either a 325Ci or a 328Ci with low mileage. I'm still not sure my dad is going to be very accepting to the whole coupe idea, so this might end up turning into a battle of sedans: ~2002 325i and ~2002 A4 1.8T q.
Get a 328i. The 3er sedans look just as good as the coupes, offer little to no performance penalty, cost less (though much of that price differential is evened out on the used market), and can be insured for less money. Also, they're not percieved as sporty by people, so cops won't look too much at them and a sedan is definitely a sleeper compared to the coupe. I'd also look at a C43 AMG, if you can find one.
Hell, a C32 can't cost much more than 20K nowadays.
QuoteOnly BMW trolls point out inaccurate information about BMWs? :rolleyes:
No. You were defending the Z4. :lol:
QuoteQuoteQuoteQuoteQuoteQuoteQuoteQuoteJust want to point out that a Z4 2.5i starts at $1,200 less than the TT base convertible.
Are you pointing that out to me?
I was comparing to the Z4 3.0 which has comparable power and acceleration times. Which is more expensive, if I recall correctly.
I believe the Z4 2.5i is quicker than the 180-hp Base TT (the only price I mentioned), and may even be as quick as the uplevel 225-hp version.
Stopped to 60, a 6 speed 225bhp quattro TT runs about 6.4 seconds, whereas the Z4 2.5i is a touch over 7 with a manual.
A 350Z would embarass both cars for cheaper.
I'm looking at a 6.8-second run for the Z4 2.5i, from Consumer Guide of all places. <_<
And yes, the 350Z is faster. So?
When looking at a sports car (or GT, as the 350Z and TT are), acceleration is important, though by no means should it the be absolute deciding factor. If you can accelerate faster and handle nearly as well, then it is a better choice of car at a lower price. If the 350 were to cost as much as a Z4, then the Z4 would be my choice. However, the 350Z does the run very quickly, with near-equal panache and finesse, and I consider it to be a better value as a sports/GT than the Z4, though I do say that the Z4 3.0 is a better car (though I can't say for sure that it's a better car than the Boxster).
Right, but I was only comparing the TT and Z4, and only the pricing at that.
He said Quattro, which unless he goes far back, is not available with the base 180bhp motor, nor was the base engine available with a stick shift. Recent TT Quattros have been 225bhp and stick, every single one. In my article, it's compared to the Z4 3.0, which is more of a competition than the 2.5 to the TT high output engine.
And while you were comparing pricing, I was comparing everything.
As far as TTs go, I was looking at around a 2002. A good amount of them in my area are 180HP 5-Speed quattros.
The 180bhp were dogs. I'd definitely get a 328i instead.
Have you given any thought to an A6 2.7T or S4 2.7?
Oh! A Saab 9-3 Viggen!
QuoteQuoteOnly BMW trolls point out inaccurate information about BMWs? :rolleyes:
No. You were defending the Z4. :lol:
Is it so indefensible that only BMW trolls would defend it? <_<
QuoteThe 180bhp were dogs. I'd definitely get a 328i instead.
Have you given any thought to an A6 2.7T or S4 2.7?
Oh! A Saab 9-3 Viggen!
I really don't care that much about speed. And FWD = no. :lol:
328s aren't that easy to find, and most of 'em have pretty high mileage.
I'm pretty much set on a 3-Series. That's what I'm gonna tell my dad... 3-Series, preferably a new one or an E46 coupe. Whatever one he wants to get is his choice.
In that case, I'd choose a 325i 5 speed sedan, E46.
I would definitely stick with a new 325i, if it is an option for you, why not go for it?
By the way, the E46 325i has WORSE gas mileage than the E46 330i
QuoteI would definitely stick with a new 325i, if it is an option for you, why not go for it?
By the way, the E46 325i has WORSE gas mileage than the E46 330i
I think the 3.0litre I6 fits the personality of the E90 more than the 2.5 I6 does. The E46 seems best with the 2.5.
Quote
By the way, the E46 325i has WORSE gas mileage than the E46 330i.
Isn't it the same? 20/30 IIRC...
QuoteQuote
By the way, the E46 325i has WORSE gas mileage than the E46 330i.
Isn't it the same? 20/30 IIRC...
Get an E36 M3, you dolt!
QuoteQuoteQuote
By the way, the E46 325i has WORSE gas mileage than the E46 330i.
Isn't it the same? 20/30 IIRC...
Get an E36 M3, you dolt!
I wish. Parents wouldn't agree.
QuoteQuoteQuoteQuote
By the way, the E46 325i has WORSE gas mileage than the E46 330i.
Isn't it the same? 20/30 IIRC...
Get an E36 M3, you dolt!
I wish. Parents wouldn't agree.
A sedan. Tell them it's not much faster than a 325i, and it's safer. Which it is, since only punk ass bitches buy 325s, and I KILL punk ass bitches.
QuoteQuoteQuoteQuoteQuote
By the way, the E46 325i has WORSE gas mileage than the E46 330i.
Isn't it the same? 20/30 IIRC...
Get an E36 M3, you dolt!
I wish. Parents wouldn't agree.
A sedan. Tell them it's not much faster than a 325i, and it's safer. Which it is, since only punk ass bitches buy 325s, and I KILL punk ass bitches.
lol
I talked to my dad. It's looking like an '06 325i 6-Speed.
QuoteQuoteQuoteQuoteQuoteQuote
By the way, the E46 325i has WORSE gas mileage than the E46 330i.
Isn't it the same? 20/30 IIRC...
Get an E36 M3, you dolt!
I wish. Parents wouldn't agree.
A sedan. Tell them it's not much faster than a 325i, and it's safer. Which it is, since only punk ass bitches buy 325s, and I KILL punk ass bitches.
lol
I talked to my dad. It's looking like an '06 325i 6-Speed.
Very cool! I'm very jealous :lol:
I'm jealous of my feet, hands, and adrenal glands.
The 325 will be mine most of the time except whenever my dad wants to swtich off. I'll most likely buy it off of him right after I graduate college and get a job.
Faris - I'm weighing in late, but I agree with the way things are headed - you should be pumped about that 325! Although the TT is a gorgeous car, the BMW (or A4 for that matter) would make a much better daily driver. Besides, I think it's the best looking BMW to be released since Bangle arrived. I sat in a TT and agree with your assessment (even though I actually couldn't fit in the car - I literally could barely shoehorn my 6'7" self into the car without ludicrous effort.) Once in, the cockpit felt even more restrictive than I anticipated. This was accented by the high belt line - I felt like I was sitting in a hole. Other than that, the car still seems like a weekend cruiser, not a daily driver.
BTW, nice write-up Raza! Will it find its way into the CarSPIN homepage? As far as a TT redo, here's what I found should be coming in 2006 (minor detail tweaking. Not sure when a full re-write is due):
(http://www.webwombat.com.au/motoring/news_reports/images/1augaud2.JPG)
(Not sure if anyone clarified this, but the TT is based on the Beetle/Golf/A3 paltrform. 95.4" wheelbase vs 104.3" wheelbase for the A4.)
QuoteFaris - I'm weighing in late, but I agree with the way things are headed - you should be pumped about that 325! Although the TT is a gorgeous car, the BMW (or A4 for that matter) would make a much better daily driver. Besides, I think it's the best looking BMW to be released since Bangle arrived. I sat in a TT and agree with your assessment (even though I actually couldn't fit in the car - I literally could barely shoehorn my 6'7" self into the car without ludicrous effort.) Once in, the cockpit felt even more restrictive than I anticipated. This was accented by the high belt line - I felt like I was sitting in a hole. Other than that, the car still seems like a weekend cruiser, not a daily driver.
BTW, nice write-up Raza! Will it find its way into the CarSPIN homepage? As far as a TT redo, here's what I found should be coming in 2006 (minor detail tweaking. Not sure when a full re-write is due):
(http://www.webwombat.com.au/motoring/news_reports/images/1augaud2.JPG)
(Not sure if anyone clarified this, but the TT is based on the Beetle/Golf/A3 paltrform. 95.4" wheelbase vs 104.3" wheelbase for the A4.)
Sorry, sax, it's for Automobear.
:D
And I already told him what platform it's on.
By the way, VWAG rules! I love the 2.7T A6s...best car they had for a long time.
Thanks! I'm still loving mine at 100K+ miles. Just painted the front bumper and she looks brand new again!
(BTW - ya wright good. I mean, you have a scintillating and engaging writing style :lol: . I'll have to check out Automobear - between your writing and Wimmer's pics (he's involved too, right?), should be good! No BS - I was impressed (and not just cause you complimented my car)!
QuoteThanks! I'm still loving mine at 100K+ miles. Just painted the front bumper and she looks brand new again!
(BTW - ya wright good. I mean, you have a scintillating and engaging writing style :lol: . I'll have to check out Automobear - between your writing and Wimmer's pics (he's involved too, right?), should be good! No BS - I was impressed (and not just cause you complimented my car)!
Thanks!
Wim-wim and I both have columns on Automobear, but it seems he likes to stick to writing about Mercedes, so I try to stay away from them, save for my article on the C240 4Matic. The current one on my title screen is the ever-controversial Scion xB article, so if you want to try reading some of the others first to get a feel of what it's like when I don't drive a total piece of crap. I think my personal favorite is the Boxster S or GTO. The Saab is pretty good, too.
and if your thinkin, about a TT. There's one coming hooooooome.
Faris, may I suggest a wagon? Lower insurance in theory, they look better atleast IMO, and performance is the same as a sedan.
QuoteQuoteThanks! I'm still loving mine at 100K+ miles. Just painted the front bumper and she looks brand new again!
(BTW - ya wright good. I mean, you have a scintillating and engaging writing style :lol: . I'll have to check out Automobear - between your writing and Wimmer's pics (he's involved too, right?), should be good! No BS - I was impressed (and not just cause you complimented my car)!
Thanks!
Wim-wim and I both have columns on Automobear, but it seems he likes to stick to writing about Mercedes, so I try to stay away from them, save for my article on the C240 4Matic. The current one on my title screen is the ever-controversial Scion xB article, so if you want to try reading some of the others first to get a feel of what it's like when I don't drive a total piece of crap. I think my personal favorite is the Boxster S or GTO. The Saab is pretty good, too.
Oh great, now you're going to get ifcar started again...
No, there's nothing to say to someone who gives a car a review listing no positive attributes and ignores the fact that all of his complaints about it are shared with virtually everything it competes with.
QuoteNo, there's nothing to say to someone who gives a car a review listing no positive attributes and ignores the fact that all of his complaints about it are shared with virtually everything it competes with.
You just said something, there is nothing wrong with expecting passion in a car.
Saying that a car doesn't have passion is one thing, and that's fine, especially if a car clearly doesn't.
QuoteFaris, may I suggest a wagon? Lower insurance in theory, they look better atleast IMO, and performance is the same as a sedan.
I don't need the space or practicality of a sedan, let alone a wagon.
And the E90 wagon likely won't be available for at least another year. The A4 is likely going to be replaced soon after I return from my 1-month vacation overseas.
Will you still be posting while you are away?
Faris is a Junior in HS, not a 40 year old father of three. A wagon would be the epitome of uncool.
QuoteFaris is a Junior in HS, not a 40 year old father of three. A wagon would be the epitome of uncool.
:rolleyes:
QuoteWill you still be posting while you are away?
I'll stop in every now and then.
QuoteFaris is a Junior in HS, not a 40 year old father of three. A wagon would be the epitome of uncool.
SENIOR!!!!!!!!!
QuoteQuoteFaris is a Junior in HS, not a 40 year old father of three. A wagon would be the epitome of uncool.
SENIOR!!!!!!!!!
I meant this past year....you still arent technically a senior B)
but yes, you will be a senior very soon.
QuoteQuoteWill you still be posting while you are away?
I'll stop in every now and then.
Good :)
QuoteQuoteFaris is a Junior in HS, not a 40 year old father of three. A wagon would be the epitome of uncool.
:rolleyes:
I second that :rolleyes:
I drive a Buick! Would a wagon be more uncool than that?
Depends. If it were a Buick wagon, yes. :lol:
If he were perhaps driving the wagon depicted in my signature, he'd be uncool up until he smokes some dumbass's 'stang at a stoplight.
QuoteDepends. If it were a Buick wagon, yes. :lol:
Not if it were a '94-'96 Roadmaster. Then I would be master of the road. Seriously, those cars are fast.
QuoteQuoteDepends. If it were a Buick wagon, yes. :lol:
Not if it were a '94-'96 Roadmaster. Then I would be master of the road. Seriously, those cars are fast.
You'd have to be a master of the road. It says it in the name!
QuoteQuoteDepends. If it were a Buick wagon, yes. :lol:
Not if it were a '94-'96 Roadmaster. Then I would be master of the road. Seriously, those cars are fast.
I know, what a sleeper. B)
I was thinking Century wagon though, that would be pretty "uncool". So would a minivan, probably.
QuoteQuoteQuoteDepends. If it were a Buick wagon, yes. :lol:
Not if it were a '94-'96 Roadmaster. Then I would be master of the road. Seriously, those cars are fast.
I know, what a sleeper. B)
I was thinking Century wagon though, that would be pretty "uncool". So would a minivan, probably.
Yeah, it doesn't get much worse than an old, slow wagon that says Buick on it and has sides covered in fake wood.
How about an old, slow wagon that says Oldsmobile on it and has its sides covered in fake wood? (Ciera wagon)
Faris, forget the Bimmer and look into one of these :lol: They tear up the twisties.
(http://www.outrightolds.com/images/1980-2002/1995/1995cierawagon.jpg)
sorry, I'll stop disrupting this thread now
QuoteWhile were offtopic.....
(http://www.clanpot.com/forky/chap/rickjames2.gif)
"Ghetto Life" is a good '80s song by Rick James. :rockon: