The Craigslist/eBay/AutoTrader Thread

[FoMoJo]

Look at the bids...

Looks like DebbieDowner really wants it.

Nice, but $260k?

[veeman]

It sold for $213 thousand (so a net loss for the owner who did $260 thousand worth of work on it).  By reading through the comments, and a link from the custom shop that did the final work, it cost so much because the prior shops which worked on the car did more damage to it and the last custom shop had to remove all the damage and redo everything. 

Gorgeous vehicle.  I wonder if the new owner will drive it or keep it untouched to sell it for twice that much twenty years from now. 

[Soup DeVille]

It sold for $213 thousand (so a net loss for the owner who did $260 thousand worth of work on it).  By reading through the comments, and a link from the custom shop that did the final work, it cost so much because the prior shops which worked on the car did more damage to it and the last custom shop had to remove all the damage and redo everything. 

Gorgeous vehicle.  I wonder if the new owner will drive it or keep it untouched to sell it for twice that much twenty years from now. 

Number one rule of custom cars:
Money In does not mean money Out.

They will always be a loss. The only thing that depreciates faster than a new car driving off the lot is a new custom car driving out of the garage.

[GoCougs]

Anyone seen ICON vehicles? They start at ~$200k, and some of the more wild stuff can go for $1MM+. Here's an F100 done in the same vein (Coyote V8):

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2UAnYNaLeL8

I mean, nice vehicles and all, but what's the point? Same with Stinger 911s. Though nicely done of course a fully restored version (to original spec/condition) is MUCH more interesting, all said.

[Soup DeVille]

Anyone seen ICON vehicles? They start at ~$200k, and some of the more wild stuff can go for $1MM+. Here's an F100 done in the same vein (Coyote V8):

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2UAnYNaLeL8

I mean, nice vehicles and all, but what's the point? Same with Stinger 911s. Though nicely done of course a fully restored version (to original spec/condition) is MUCH more interesting, all said.

Yeah; beautiful work they do: but the point there is that they will make the vehicle exactly to your specifications. You're not buying somebody else's project.

They don't get resold often, but when they do, they take a hell of a hit as well.

[FoMoJo]

Number one rule of custom cars:
Money In does not mean money Out.

They will always be a loss. The only thing that depreciates faster than a new car driving off the lot is a new custom car driving out of the garage.

Of the $260 invested, I wonder how much was cost of parts and cost of labour.

[shp4man]

Kevin Hart has a new show on Motor Trend about the classic car hobby. Damn funny and entertaining. Him and his buddies learn about cars.
One of them breaks the mold and drives an oval window Beetle (1956 model).

[AutobahnSHO]

Number one rule of custom cars:
Money In does not mean money Out.

They will always be a loss. The only thing that depreciates faster than a new car driving off the lot is a new custom car driving out of the garage.

Yup- same with pretty much ANY car!!   

Funny how we get so emotional over such a mundane need to get from one place to another.

I'm sure we all have the car we would overspend on just because. (For me a 1991 Taurus SHO "plus" in electric red)

[JWC]

The only time getting the money that I put into a restored vehicle was when someone backed into one of my VWs. State Farm was going to total it...saying old car, not worth but a couple of hundred dollars.  We're talking a car that still runs and drives, only the driver's door was buckled and wouldn't close right...and leaked.

I reached into the car and produced the receipts for all the parts and outside labor spent on the car in the past year. They settled immediately for a lot more money and I kept a clean title.

[CaminoRacer]

Anyone seen ICON vehicles? They start at ~$200k, and some of the more wild stuff can go for $1MM+. Here's an F100 done in the same vein (Coyote V8):

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2UAnYNaLeL8

I mean, nice vehicles and all, but what's the point? Same with Stinger 911s. Though nicely done of course a fully restored version (to original spec/condition) is MUCH more interesting, all said.

The ICON is gonna drive much much better. I don't see how an original restoration is more interesting than the craftsmanship of an ICON. I wouldn't nor can't pay that much for a car, but I definitely appreciate them

[AutobahnSHO]

https://greenville.craigslist.org/cto/d/greenville-1980-pontiac-trans-am/7334308393.html

Pretty!

[Submariner]

I know it's a Trans Am, but all the added junk on the body looks horrible.  A Camaro minus the all the cladding looks so much better.

[Payman]

I know it's a Trans Am, but all the added junk on the body looks horrible.  A Camaro minus the all the cladding looks so much better.

That was a Trans Am/Z28 from that era, and it looked great. I do like the stripped down models as well (Jim Rockford's Firebird), but the fire chicken Bandit Trans Ams were awesome in their own right. The snowflake wheels on this one are terrific as well.

[Submariner]

Yes, the wheels do look great I must say.

I know that was the factory look, but it jut reminds me of the lazy/cheap excess of later Pontiac body-clad specials. The skirts and spoiler look like they were glued on in an Autozone parking lot.

[Payman]

Yeah the later Pontiacs with their cladding are pretty bad, but the sides of the T/A and Z28 are still clean at least, and the added front air dam and rear spoiler are nicely shaped. You want hilariously bad, check out the same era Mustang King Cobra.

[CaminoRacer]

The Camaros had similar tacked-on pieces so I prefer the Trans Am of that era. I think I prefer the Trans Am for all 2nd gen years, actually. 1970-72 Camaros are great, but the Trans Am is just a little bit cooler.

[Payman]

The Camaros had similar tacked-on pieces so I prefer the Trans Am of that era. I think I prefer the Trans Am for all 2nd gen years, actually. 1970-72 Camaros are great, but the Trans Am is just a little bit cooler.

I agree.

[Soup DeVille]

Is it ever really a Pontiac if it doesn't have stupid amounts of plastic or chrome stuck to it for no good reason?

[Payman]

Is it ever really a Pontiac if it doesn't have stupid amounts of plastic or chrome stuck to it for no good reason?

No, because otherwise it's a Chevy. 

[Submariner]

Yeah the later Pontiacs with their cladding are pretty bad, but the sides of the T/A and Z28 are still clean at least, and the added front air dam and rear spoiler are nicely shaped. You want hilariously bad, check out the same era Mustang King Cobra.

Lol.  The King Cobra is the real deal.  The granddaddy of rice and stickers long before they became the punchline of tuner culture.

[Submariner]

Is it ever really a Pontiac if it doesn't have stupid amounts of plastic or chrome stuck to it for no good reason?

You need some synths and guys in leather dusters, too:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h__l_HLlN5g

[GoCougs]

The Camaros had similar tacked-on pieces so I prefer the Trans Am of that era. I think I prefer the Trans Am for all 2nd gen years, actually. 1970-72 Camaros are great, but the Trans Am is just a little bit cooler.

The Camaro (Z/28) didn't start with the tacked-on stuff till 1979 (front air dam only) and only received full Trans Am tack-onness in 1980 and '81, and then it did it with ultra cheezy graphics. Trans Am did it much better, screaming chicken and all.

The 400/455 was a better (stock) motor than either the smog Chevy 350 or Chevy big blocks for this size of car, plus Pontiac kept up with the 455 through '76 and the 400 and 403 through 1979, whereas the Camaro wheezed about with the 350 from 1973 on (had Chevy had the mind for the 383 Chevy stroker back then, that would be a better motor than all, but I digress)

Pontiac was also a bit more daring- from the Turbo 301 of 1980 and '81, to the W72 with 4WDB to offering the big motors in the non-Tran Am cars (i.e., the pretty cool Formula Firebird with the twin snorkel hood), to offering the 455 (Chevy only allowed the 396 in 2nd gen Camaro).

Styling-wise, Pontiac was much more consistent, particularly with the F/R bumper mandates of '74 onward (Camaro looks awful from '74-'77). However, the '78 Z/28 was the peak IMO, followed by the '77 Trans Am and then '70 1/2 Z/28.

Interior wise, Camaro all the way, esp. gauge cluster. Pontiac tried to be a bit too flashy, and it never quite worked.

Overall I'd have to give the edge to Pontiac as well, however, the two best variants from the era were the aforementioned Camaros.

[AutobahnSHO]

I know a lot of it is just looks, but I wonder if those side "vents" are functional?

I think cars could be kept a lot cooler if they had some sort of engine bay venting??

[FoMoJo]

Yeah the later Pontiacs with their cladding are pretty bad, but the sides of the T/A and Z28 are still clean at least, and the added front air dam and rear spoiler are nicely shaped. You want hilariously bad, check out the same era Mustang King Cobra.

From 1972 to 1981 is an automotive void as far as I'm concerned.  Just a blank period that's best forgotten.

[GoCougs]

From 1972 to 1981 is an automotive void as far as I'm concerned.  Just a blank period that's best forgotten.

Well, especially for Ford  . Ford did do well by putting the 460 into bunches of land barges such as the Mercury Colony Park and all sorts of Lincolns. Though interesting today, they're definitely not muscle or pony cars. Things were only a little better for Mopar. The e-body (Challenger, Baracudda) held on till '74 but were not replaced. Pretty much the highlight was Lil Red Express or the 440-powered sedans (which weren't sold to the public - had to get them at auction from the departments).

GM held on to a decent extent however (aforementioned Camaro and Firebird (which were actually better than the Corvette), the low volume highlights such as the Grand Am, Chevelle Laguna S-3). In fact I'd argue the 1979 W-72 Trans Am, with 4WDB, 220 hp 400 V8 and 4sp M/T, was one of the best all around performing pony cars of any year. Even with all that, the malaise era had better quality, better interiors, better handling and better features (electronic ignition, radial tires, much more widely-available power accessories, etc.).

[Soup DeVille]

From 1972 to 1981 is an automotive void as far as I'm concerned.  Just a blank period that's best forgotten.

And yet today is one of the hotter segments.

There are also a lot of interesting cars which were lighter, but still made to fit standard V8s.

[CaminoRacer]

And yet today is one of the hotter segments.

There are also a lot of interesting cars which were lighter, but still made to fit standard V8s.

It helps that we can easily swap an LS into just about anything from that period, and avoid the miserable stock engines.

[Soup DeVille]

It helps that we can easily swap an LS into just about anything from that period, and avoid the miserable stock engines.

Yep

[shp4man]

But not in the Golden State. 1975 is the last year here.

[CaminoRacer]

But not in the Golden State. 1975 is the last year here.

An LS will run cleaner and more efficiently they can be dressed up to look "stock" if needed