What say you?

[FordSVT]

On the other hand, while the Mustang is probably the least capable of the cars you've listed, I wouldn't feel uncomfortable going out on a limb and saying it's probably the most fun to drive, even in a day to day situation.  Even a standard GT is pretty thrilling just messing about in traffic. 

That's because while you might not be able to get it around a track as fast as some of the others, street driving rarely involves taking your car to more than 8/10ths in a corner. I've got friends with RX-8s and 350Zs, none of them have yet to lose me in the twisties. Again, street driving isn't track driving unless you're either stupid or insane. The Mustang has usable straight line power in spades, I wouldn't be afraid of a straight line race against any of the cars you've listed save maybe the Nismo 350Z, and maybe the EVO and the STi from a dead stop. From a roll, anything goes on that list, it's a driver's race or an ass-kicking.

I am curious to see C&D's opinion on how it handles and hopefully they'll take it around VIR. I'd like to be as pleasantly surprised with the Bullitt as I was disappointed with the Shelby.

[SVT666]

Bullitt.  One day it will be worth more then you paid for it.

[FordSVT]

Or at least, it will be worth something. If it's taken care of it might never see the junkyard, unlike most V6 and GT Stangs.

People are funny about their special edition Mustangs, they tend to treat them really well unless they're into racing them.

[Vinsanity]

I worked at an Infiniti dealership this summer and drove the G35 MANY times (even drove the new G37 a couple times).  IMO, it does not compare to the driving experience of the BMW 3 series and I am really bored with the styling from being around them all the time.

I guess I can't relate to that situation, but I can't imagine being bored with the G37's styling compared to the 1-series

I'm with Cougs...my money would be on a G37. Actually, if it really were my money, I'd look for something like a used Mercedes CLS but you get the idea.

[FlatBlackCaddy]

Are we talking NEW STi?

If so i would take that over anything on the list.

I personally don't like EVO X, i don't like the look, i don't like the new motor(i'm sure its great, but i expected a LARGE HP bump over the old), and i don't like the initial reports that they softened it up.

[deesea]

Are we talking NEW STi?

If so i would take that over anything on the list.

I personally don't like EVO X, i don't like the look, i don't like the new motor(i'm sure its great, but i expected a LARGE HP bump over the old), and i don't like the initial reports that they softened it up.

+1


Did anyone suggest a used E46 M3? I'm pretty sure you can get them pretty cheap (around 45k) in America? i don't know the market in America so excuse me if I'm wrong.

[LonghornTX]

I guess I can't relate to that situation, but I can't imagine being bored with the G37's styling compared to the 1-series

I'm with Cougs...my money would be on a G37. Actually, if it really were my money, I'd look for something like a used Mercedes CLS but you get the idea.

Eh, maybe it is just me.  I did not find the car that spectacular and it has gotten quite heavy....

[LonghornTX]

Are we talking NEW STi?

If so i would take that over anything on the list.

I personally don't like EVO X, i don't like the look, i don't like the new motor(i'm sure its great, but i expected a LARGE HP bump over the old), and i don't like the initial reports that they softened it up.

New STi.  I like it too, but I am not in love with its looks nor the body style.  Also, I was not very impressed with the WRX that I drove a little while ago.

[LonghornTX]

+1


Did anyone suggest a used E46 M3? I'm pretty sure you can get them pretty cheap (around 45k) in America? i don't know the market in America so excuse me if I'm wrong.

Probably not going to go with a used M car, way too many potential "surprises".  Maybe CPO or low mileage, but if I wanted the space of that car I would just go with the 135i (faster, newer design, more tunable, better brakes) and if I wanted the engine I would go M coupe.

[LonghornTX]

LonghornTX: Excellent posting, as have been all the postings in this entire thread so far--but r0tor and JYODER240 haven't found it yet.

Think life of the vehicle--things are pretty settled for the Nethead here at my age but they should be pretty wide open for young lads and lasses. Drop the two-passenger cars from your list--they aren't adaptable enough for the only vehicle you own unless you can afford to have a two-passenger vehicle as a second vehicle.  Pickups are an exception, but you didn't list any so I won't go there.

If I were to make a shortlist for myself from what remains of your list once you've crossed-off the two-passenger vehicles, it would be the BMW four-passenger vehicles and the Bullitt. Drive all of them, which I assume you have done for the model on which you have paid a refundable deposit.

Put a big plus beside every model that has a fold-down rear seat and a second big plus if that rear seat actually folds flat ! A young man--single or unsingle--finds thousands of uses for all the space he can get in his vehicle. The more nymphos that can squeeze tightly in around you , the safer you are in a collision--ever thought of that ? One can't be too safe on the roads today...

BMW parts are waaay expensive, and BMW aftermarket performance parts figure prominently in the national debt. But BMWs are solid performers anyway so you won't feel the need for them that you would if you had purchased a Monte Carlo SS. You may never feel the need to buy an aftermarket performance part for your BMW throughout the life of the car, except possibly some sportier tires.

Every performance part ever made exists for the Mustang, from the manufacturer or from thousands of aftermarket suppliers here and abroad. And the price differential between the Bullitt and your $45,000 limit can provide you with a monster Bullitt out in the driveway. But drive the Bullitt first, the harder the better.

Eventually, you'll trade or sell your purchase .  BMWs retain resale value like liquor at a halfway house , and the Bullitt will probably sell for multiple times its purchase price if you are agreeable to letting the auction house get its ten percent cut.

I think you should start accepting deposits now from nubile, young, eager nymphos who want to squeeze into your new wheels so you won't have to hire off-duty deputies for crowd control if you wait until the delivery date. I'll bet you haven't thought of that... 

Thanks for the advice.  The Bullitt and 135i are definately WAY more practical than the M coupe.  The 135i does in fact have fold down rear seats so it gets that point.  The Bullitt looks like a great package, especially with the nicer seats and steering wheels from the GT500. 

[SVT666]

Like I said earlier, my vote is for the Bullitt, but you will not be able to buy it for anywhere near the MSRP and you will probably be paying right around your $45,000 limit if you did buy it.  I say buy a GT Premium and spend a few extra bucks on lowering springs and a Roushcharger or Ford Racing Supercharger.  By doing that you get a good handler with monster power and it's all under warranty.

[SVT_Power]

I've driven a regular S2000 and regular Mustang GT... my advice would be that if you live in a hilly twisty road area to get the S2000.  If you live somewhere with straight roads and pretty flat, I'd get the Bullitt

I couldn't decide which one I'd want after i drove them back to back. They're both so damn appealing in their own ways

[JYODER240]

I'm not going to comment on the EVO X, STI, or 1-series because they're not for sale yet and I don't know enough about them. I wouldn't bother with the Z4 M, look at a Z4 3.0Si instead. It's plenty fast and a much better buy. I don't think they're as much fun as an S2000, though. Personaly I think the CR is hideous and unless you're planning on spending a lot of time on the track it's not worth the extra cost over an S2000. The S2000 is going to be the best backroads car here but you have to deal with its impracticality and very high insurance rates. The 350Z is another great car, it's the jack of all trades master of none. It probably won't stand out above the rest in any one catagory besides maybe laptimes but it doesn't really have any weaknesses either. The Mustang is a good car but unless you want a back seat or like Hotrod said you don't live near hilly, twisty roads I wouldn't see why to buy it.


You live down south correct? If I were you I'd probably go for the S2000 depending on what insurance rate you can get but test drive them all.

[Vinsanity]

Eh, maybe it is just me.  I did not find the car that spectacular and it has gotten quite heavy....

I guess I'm the opposite. I like the 135 because it's a little car with a monster engine, but given the same price, I'd put up with the G37's extra weight for much more appealing (to me) styling

hey, it's not like the G37 is slow or anything.

[sandertheshark]

Used 'Vette.


Out of your list, the Z4 M coupe, or the Bullitt.

Or the 135i, if you want a useable back seat.
Or a 335i, which is still in the $45,000 range.

[565]

Is this your only car?  If so I'd get either the G37 or the BMW 335i.

I used to think I can get by with just a two seater as a daily in the summer and a beater SUV when snow falls.  Thus I figured I'd replace the Supra with the Z06, but having just two seats is such an inconvenience that I ended up fixing the Supra and keeping it as well.  You don't quite appreciate how useful even tiny back seats are until you are stuffing two unlucky friends into the trunk of a Z06.

That said, I'm impressed by the G37 and BMW 335i coupe's ability to keep classic flowing coupe lines and reasonably survivable back seats.  The 1 series doesn't look nearly as elegant and doesn't have as much space either.  And I wouldn't be surprised if it's performance isn't that much better than the 335i.

The EVO/STI offerings are tempting too, but they probably wouldn't satisfy on as many broad levels as the luxury sports coupes.  For about the price of a current STI, I could get a G35x. 

As for the Mustang Bullet, I'd say if you want a Mustang just get a GT and use the 6 grand in a better way.

All in all, 35K on a G37 6 speed is a seriously good deal.

[LonghornTX]

Like I said earlier, my vote is for the Bullitt, but you will not be able to buy it for anywhere near the MSRP and you will probably be paying right around your $45,000 limit if you did buy it.  I say buy a GT Premium and spend a few extra bucks on lowering springs and a Roushcharger or Ford Racing Supercharger.  By doing that you get a good handler with monster power and it's all under warranty.

If I got the Bullitt I would expect to pay at most MSRP.  If ANY ADM is included, the Bullitt is going the way of the Dodo, on sheer principle.  I have definately contemplated buying a regular GT and doing the whole upgrade treatment, but I wonder if I will have that much time once I start work to do all the modifying.  I came up with plenty, enough to fill a spreadsheet (yea, I know).

Also, the small things that you get on the Bullitt are not available on the regular GT like the special dash, steering wheel, or seats.  I am sure you could just buy the parts and do it yourself, but again, I may not have time.

All in all, I really do love Mustangs, so it is hard to dismiss it.  This model, especially so.

[LonghornTX]

I'm not going to comment on the EVO X, STI, or 1-series because they're not for sale yet and I don't know enough about them. I wouldn't bother with the Z4 M, look at a Z4 3.0Si instead. It's plenty fast and a much better buy. I don't think they're as much fun as an S2000, though. Personaly I think the CR is hideous and unless you're planning on spending a lot of time on the track it's not worth the extra cost over an S2000. The S2000 is going to be the best backroads car here but you have to deal with its impracticality and very high insurance rates. The 350Z is another great car, it's the jack of all trades master of none. It probably won't stand out above the rest in any one catagory besides maybe laptimes but it doesn't really have any weaknesses either. The Mustang is a good car but unless you want a back seat or like Hotrod said you don't live near hilly, twisty roads I wouldn't see why to buy it.


You live down south correct? If I were you I'd probably go for the S2000 depending on what insurance rate you can get but test drive them all.

At the price I could get for the M version, it doesn't make much sense to go with the 3.0Si.  The M has an LSD, better brakes, and more powerful engine stock.  The M is some wider front tires (according to European Car at least) away from being a Cayman S killer, the 3.0Si, not so much.  However, the 3.0Si is still cheaper (just not a better buy IMO) and just as attractive.

I think I eliminated the S2000, it is just too impractical and small for me.  It is a great car to drive (the CR probably even more so), but it is also a bit on the slow side compared to the BMWs, the mustang, and the STi.  If it were a little bit bigger maybe.

The 350z is also gonna get knocked off I think.  Mainly, I don't like the sound of the engine compared to the BMW mills (same goes for the G37) and the looks are not my cup of tea.

[LonghornTX]

I guess I'm the opposite. I like the 135 because it's a little car with a monster engine, but given the same price, I'd put up with the G37's extra weight for much more appealing (to me) styling

hey, it's not like the G37 is slow or anything.

The G37 is a good car, no doubt, and an incredible value compared to the 335i.  However, having worked with both cars, it is easy to tell which company cuts corners and which does not.  The G37 is fast, but feels slow compared to the 335i (even more so with the lighter 135i) and it's engine sounds unrefined compared to the N54 (or S54).  The final reason is the packaging.  The car is big (and heavy) yet it does not offer very good interior room, especially in the back, for it's size.

[LonghornTX]

Is this your only car?  If so I'd get either the G37 or the BMW 335i.

I used to think I can get by with just a two seater as a daily in the summer and a beater SUV when snow falls.  Thus I figured I'd replace the Supra with the Z06, but having just two seats is such an inconvenience that I ended up fixing the Supra and keeping it as well.  You don't quite appreciate how useful even tiny back seats are until you are stuffing two unlucky friends into the trunk of a Z06.

That said, I'm impressed by the G37 and BMW 335i coupe's ability to keep classic flowing coupe lines and reasonably survivable back seats.  The 1 series doesn't look nearly as elegant and doesn't have as much space either.  And I wouldn't be surprised if it's performance isn't that much better than the 335i.

The EVO/STI offerings are tempting too, but they probably wouldn't satisfy on as many broad levels as the luxury sports coupes.  For about the price of a current STI, I could get a G35x. 

As for the Mustang Bullet, I'd say if you want a Mustang just get a GT and use the 6 grand in a better way.

All in all, 35K on a G37 6 speed is a seriously good deal.

Your thoughts on the 2 seater situation reflect mine for sure.  They are definately the reason I am skitish about the M coupe and S2000.

I favor the 135i over the 335i because I feel that it looks more BMW than the 335i, which looks much more bland and middle of the road in its execution.  It is "fatter" looking to me.  I own an E34 currently, and personally, the E82 (BMW speak for the 135i) is the only thing that has sparked the same reaction in me from BMW in awhile.  There is something about the 135i's taller greenhouse and upright front end that reminds me of the E30, one of my favorite BMWs ever.  It also the traditional L-shaped taillights where the 335i goes without.  Finally, I think that the 135i will make for a more capable car to tune, from the get go, considering that it is lighter (by ~200lbs according to BMW) and has better brakes.  Also, the 335i is more expensive than I want to spend for a BMW "sedan" right now.  You can probably tell my feelings about the G37/G35 from the posts above...

[JYODER240]

At the price I could get for the M version, it doesn't make much sense to go with the 3.0Si.  The M has an LSD, better brakes, and more powerful engine stock.  The M is some wider front tires (according to European Car at least) away from being a Cayman S killer, the 3.0Si, not so much.  However, the 3.0Si is still cheaper (just not a better buy IMO) and just as attractive.

I think I eliminated the S2000, it is just too impractical and small for me.  It is a great car to drive (the CR probably even more so), but it is also a bit on the slow side compared to the BMWs, the mustang, and the STi.  If it were a little bit bigger maybe.

The 350z is also gonna get knocked off I think.  Mainly, I don't like the sound of the engine compared to the BMW mills (same goes for the G37) and the looks are not my cup of tea.

Before you go knocking cars off your list, test drive them.

[LonghornTX]

Before you go knocking cars off your list, test drive them.

I've driven both the 350z and S2000 

[Minpin]

Corvette! Corvette! Corvette!

[Nethead]

Thanks for the advice.  The Bullitt and 135i are definately WAY more practical than the M coupe.  The 135i does in fact have fold down rear seats so it gets that point.  The Bullitt looks like a great package, especially with the nicer seats and steering wheels from the GT500. 

With that tidbit thrown in about the 135i's fold down rear seats, you have narrowed down my shortlist to the 135i and the Bullitt. You are correct that the Bullitt has primo upgrades--all of them contributing to the essence of the car as a whole and not just to a slice of the essence. There are valid arguments for both vehicles--and damned great it is that both cars have the quality and the features that make this choice a really tough decision!

Check the standard equipment list and the optional equipment list on both--one may have some equipment options that would really figure well into your other interests, such as the ability to tow a light trailer holding a coupla dirt bikes or ATVs. The Bullitt probably has a much shorter options list than a regular Mustang GT (such as one interior color and a choice of only two exterior colors), but it has a raft of equipment you'd want on a Mustang GT anyway. Ditto the 135i--it's a very well-equipped machine and may not need many options to be spec'd just like you'd want it to be. The Nethead here greatly respects BMWs but many/most/all in these forums surely know more about them than I.

You can't go wrong with either, so compare their features, compare their prices, compare their performances, and drive both of 'em hard. Stand back and look at 'em both from all angles and think how you'd feel cranking each of them up each morning and heading in to work.

Then play the dealers off against each other until you get the best deal you can. Buy your favorite, and start enjoying the capabilities that make each unique.

Read up on your choice, to see how others got even more capability out of them. Start attending some track days, and start sharpening your techniques at a drag strip just to get that kick you get from cutting your times--it's intoxicating, and lets you start becoming one with the car.

Good times ahead! RBRH!

[sportyaccordy]

Trust me, it would be best to spend as little as possible right now. You have to build your financial base.

I would at the most get an older Z/M3/Evo.... it will suck to be making crazy payments on something 5 years from now when it's worth half what you paid for it, and for a dude out of college the insurance is gonna be killer.

That said though, from that list I would prob. go with the Z4M, though like Cougs if the choice were mine I'd prob. get a G37 as well.

[MexicoCityM3]

I'll focus on comparing the Z4M to the 135i. If fun to drive is your priority, I'd get the Z4M. It is a much more special car than the 135i. You need to really drive that thing and it will make you happy every time. However, you must be willing to tolerate the ride and the limits of having only two seats.

The 135i according to initial reports from mags is a bit softer than expected, maybe as soft or softer than a 335i. It sure is extraordinarily capable and most likely will match or beat the Z4M in a straight line, but its just not as "special" as the Z4M. It's pluses are the rear seats, better ride and much better mileage. If you plan to track your car do consider that the 3.0 TT runs very hot and might not be as durable as the M engine (which used to blow up in pre-2004 M3s but not anymore!).

I agree with you regarding the Z4M vs Z4 3.0si logic. The M is not that much more expensive and you get a much racier engine plus better looks and the important diff.

[TBR]

First of all, I wouldn't buy an expensive car right out of college. Second, now that I have taken care of that, get a Bullitt. It looks better than the GT, has suspension mods, and will retain its value. Plus it is drastically cheaper than most of your other options. If you decide it is between the 135i and the Bullitt, I would talk to a Ford dealer about a refundable deposit.

[SVT666]

I didn't realize you are just coming out of college.  How can you afford a $45,000 car?  A guy I used to work with bought a 335i and then his parents told him he has to move out.  Now he's selling it.  Just because you can make the payments right now doesn't mean you can in 6 months or a year down the road.  I would start saving to buy a house and I would buy a used Mustang GT.

[Raza]

I'm sure he's thought his finances through thoroughly.  Hell, Dave just bought an S2000 and he's in middle school.  Some people can afford more earlier.

[Gotta-Qik-C7]

I've heard 45 grand thrown aroud and for that kind of money the C6 Vette (new or used)is a no brainer!