2010 Ford Taurus pic leaked

[SVT666]

...or the 4.6L from the Mustang GT.

[dinkeldorf]

Based on the mundane (to my eye) Edge & Fusion, I say they need less Bold American and more Kinetic Whatever. MInd you I'm not exactly the target demographic / psychographic.

[CJ]

...or the 4.6L from the Mustang GT.

Which is outdated and not very powerful.  (Don't flame me..I love the 4.6.)

[SVT666]

Which is outdated and not very powerful.

[CJ]

Like I said, I love the 4.6, but it's just not as good as it once was.

[sandertheshark]

Based on the mundane (to my eye) Edge & Fusion, I say they need less Bold American and more Kinetic Whatever. MInd you I'm not exactly the target demographic / psychographic.

They need someone who does not also design safety razors to design the grilles.

[Vinsanity]

the car looks a tad tall in the real life pic, but I like the shape and styling elements

[Middle_Path]

Looks just like a Hyundai. Now America is copycatting Korea? Jesus.

[Yawn]

Who has a pic of the next NA Mazda 6.. Looks like the same lines.

[280Z Turbo]

Like I said, I love the 4.6, but it's just not as good as it once was.

It's as good now as it ever was.

Even my old Z can outrun a Mustang from the 90's. (ask me how I know )

[Laconian]

It's as good now as it ever was.

Even my old Z can outrun a Mustang from the 90's. (ask me how I know )

I think he means "relative to the competition", but I don't think that's true. The LT1/LS1 engines were better IMO.

[Secret Chimp]

It at least looks Korean, which considering that the Sonata looks better than a lot of domestics is a compliment.
I still wish Ford Europe would just transplant itself over here.

[dinkeldorf]

It at least looks Korean, which considering that the Sonata looks better than a lot of domestics is a compliment.
I still wish Ford Europe would just transplant itself over here.

   + Ford Oz. Then we'd be sorted. But noooo siree, Billy Ford that champion owner of the Detroit Lions keep giving 8 year old Foci, the mideval Ranger, the Crown Vic...

[omicron]

If OMI promises to go take a meter-stick to the nearest Falcon, I promise to go out and measure my mom's `96 SHO.  

'08 Falcon G6E Turbo/'08 Taurus

Length - 195.5 inches/201.8
Width - 73.5/74.5
Height - 56.4/61.5
Wheelbase - 111.7/112.9

Front headroom - 39.8/39.6
Rear headroom - 38.9/38.8
Front shoulder room - 59.9/57.8
Rear shoulder room - 59.7/57.6
Front hiproom - 58.5/53.7
Rear hiproom - NA/53.6
Front legroom - 42.2/41.3
Rear legroom - 38.9/41.2

[the Teuton]

   + Ford Oz. Then we'd be sorted. But noooo siree, Billy Ford that champion owner of the Detroit Lions keep giving 8 year old Foci, the mideval Ranger, the Crown Vic...

I don't think you quite understand the magnitude of the situation.

[dinkeldorf]

I don't think you quite understand the magnitude of the situation.

Huh? The Lions or Ford?

[the Teuton]

Huh? The Lions or Ford?

Ford is having a fair amount of issues right now.  Everything they're doing right now, including keeping the older than dirt models, they are doing for a reason.

[dinkeldorf]

Ford is having a fair amount of issues right now.  Everything they're doing right now, including keeping the older than dirt models, they are doing for a reason.

I understand they're under constraints and economics. I question the product selection - they're obviously capable of making good passenger cars - it just craps me NA seems to get the worst line up. I suspect they lost focus (no pun intended) with the misguided PAG at the expense of the bread and butter models. And this 2010 Taurus looks a bit like lipstick on the pog on what should be their volume seller.

As for the Lions...

[nickdrinkwater]

Ford is either too cheap to bring them over.  Or it thinks that people in the USA prefer shit cars.

Either way, the American division is the reason why Ford is in big trouble, so they need to do something about it.

[the Teuton]

Ford is either too cheap to bring them over.  Or it thinks that people in the USA prefer shit cars.

Either way, the American division is the reason why Ford is in big trouble, so they need to do something about it.

A lot of it has to do with the weak dollar.  Your economy is screwing ours over, automotively-speaking.

As for the Ranger, I still can't figure that one out.

[dinkeldorf]

Ford is either too cheap to bring them over.  Or it thinks that people in the USA prefer shit cars.

Bingo. The latter makes me hurl.

[FoMoJo]

Ford is either too cheap to bring them over.  Or it thinks that people in the USA prefer shit cars.

Either way, the American division is the reason why Ford is in big trouble, so they need to do something about it.

Once the NA economy shrinks and people start buying smaller cars maybe they will.  Of course the NA people may have to shrink as well .

However, Ford has long had a philosphy of global engineering and centres of excellence.  EU, Germany, has been, primarily, involved in midside platform development, Japan, Mazda, has been the centre of excellence for small engines and and small platform development, Austrialia for RWD and somewhere in England for diesel, IIRC, and NA for pickups and land cruisers.  This has shifted slightly at different times but, due to different regulations and, presumed, different tastes, NA versions of, essentially, the same or similar vehicles to EU and Asian counterparts have, generally, been given different sheet-metal and different names.  An exception was the Focus.  However, NA screwed that up by not investing in a proper engineering team to oversee the regulatory changes.

As for NA shit cars, that's in the past.  Recent quality studies have indicated that the 'domestic' brands are on a par with Toyota and Honda.  Industry studies have shown a gradual improvement over recent years.

[FoMoJo]

As for the Ranger, I still can't figure that one out.

I don't think that Ford can figure this one out either.  If I were to buy a new small truck I would buy a Ranger simply because it's cheap and robust.  I've even been looking at used Rangers and was surprised at the prices they are asking.  I think that Ford is making a mistake by discontinuing it, especially if they are planning to replace it with something bigger and less rugged like the rest of the manufacturers have.

[nickdrinkwater]

A lot of it has to do with the weak dollar.  Your economy is screwing ours over, automotively-speaking.

As for the Ranger, I still can't figure that one out.

Maybe, but not totally.

- GM exports the Astra as a Saturn.
- When it came to replacing the Focus, they could have started building the C1 in Mexico.  They decided to take the cheap option and re-skin the old one.

[nickdrinkwater]

Once the NA economy shrinks and people start buying smaller cars maybe they will.  Of course the NA people may have to shrink as well .

However, Ford has long had a philosphy of global engineering and centres of excellence.  EU, Germany, has been, primarily, involved in midside platform development, Japan, Mazda, has been the centre of excellence for small engines and and small platform development, Austrialia for RWD and somewhere in England for diesel, IIRC, and NA for pickups and land cruisers.  This has shifted slightly at different times but, due to different regulations and, presumed, different tastes, NA versions of, essentially, the same or similar vehicles to EU and Asian counterparts have, generally, been given different sheet-metal and different names.  An exception was the Focus.  However, NA screwed that up by not investing in a proper engineering team to oversee the regulatory changes.

As for NA shit cars, that's in the past.  Recent quality studies have indicated that the 'domestic' brands are on a par with Toyota and Honda.  Industry studies have shown a gradual improvement over recent years.

Are the American cars really that bigger than ours, though?

Is your Focus bigger than ours?  Your Fusion can't be bigger than our Mondeo because the Mondeo is huge (bigger than a 5-Series).  Ok so the 500/Taurus/whatever it's going to called next is big, but does anyone buy it?  We have the Galaxy in Europe, but I don't think Ford have an equivalent in America, unless I'm mistaken.

I don't see any of our cars in North America with different sheetmetal.

Fair comment if the build quality/reliability is up.  But people expect that to be good, it's not really an advantage in the market. 

Bottom line is that Ford is still losing money, so they need to make desirable cars that you guys actually want to buy.  They manage it here, why not there?  Or is the business environment in the US significantly different, and it's hard to do that and turn a profit at the same time?

[Vinsanity]

- When it came to replacing the Focus, they could have started building the C1 in Mexico.  They decided to take the cheap option and re-skin the old one.

I thought they already did build them in Mexico; at least I saw one with Mexican plates this past weekend.

[nickdrinkwater]

I thought they already did build them in Mexico; at least I saw one with Mexican plates this past weekend.

I don't think it's built there.  I might be wrong though.

It wouldn't make any sense that they would build them just south of the border, but not for the USA or Canada.  Mind you, it hardly makes sense if they import the C1 for Mexico but not the rest of North America.

[akuma_supreme]

I don't think it's built there.  I might be wrong though.

It wouldn't make any sense that they would build them just south of the border, but not for the USA or Canada.  Mind you, it hardly makes sense if they import the C1 for Mexico but not the rest of North America.

I'm not positive either, but I do know that Mexico still has some pretty restrictive tariffs slapped on foreign built cars.  Because of this, all cars tend to be a little pricier south of the border than they would be otherwise (regardless of whether they are built in Mexico or in other countries).  In addition, its popular to send cars to Mexico in CKD kits, and then assemble them in Mexico, making them a "domestic" car in the process.  It might be possible that this is what Ford is doing with the Focus down there.

It seems to me that on the car side, our Mexican friends have some very interesting machinery to choose from.  In addition to the Focus, they can also choose from a plethora of small cars including the Fiesta, the IKON, the EcoSport, and even a small Fiesta-based trucklet called the Courier. 

[FoMoJo]

Are the American cars really that bigger than ours, though?

Is your Focus bigger than ours?  Your Fusion can't be bigger than our Mondeo because the Mondeo is huge (bigger than a 5-Series).  Ok so the 500/Taurus/whatever it's going to called next is big, but does anyone buy it?  We have the Galaxy in Europe, but I don't think Ford have an equivalent in America, unless I'm mistaken.

I don't see any of our cars in North America with different sheetmetal.

Fair comment if the build quality/reliability is up.  But people expect that to be good, it's not really an advantage in the market. 

Bottom line is that Ford is still losing money, so they need to make desirable cars that you guys actually want to buy.  They manage it here, why not there?  Or is the business environment in the US significantly different, and it's hard to do that and turn a profit at the same time?

Good questions.

The Focus is not any bigger.  I believe the management of that project was terrible, along with the decision to update the original platform rather than using the new one.  Perhaps that decision was made because the Focus never sold as well as expected and they didn't want to invest more money in a car that continued to lose out to Civic and Corolla.  As well, the Mazda 3 was available with the new C platform.  As for the Fusion, it was based on the Mazda 6 platform and the dimensions of it were increased.  As the Mazda 6 was based, more or less on the previous Mondeo platform, the resultant Fusion was larger that the previous Mondeo...but maybe no larger than the lastest Mondeo.  As the New Mazda 6 is based on the new Mondeo platform, perhaps the next generation Fusion will be bigger.  Ford doesn't have a Galaxy, or anything like it in NA.  The 500, etc. was another screw-up by Ford.  The underpinnings are great but the design looked like they were trying to attract geezers.  Perhaps marketing and design don't communicate very well.

As for different sheetmetal, I was thinking back to the NA Mondeo/Mystique series.  Maybe not so much sheetmetal as cosmetic differences.  As well, the new Fiesta is supposed to reflect the NA taste...whatever that is.

Bottom line, Ford was making truckloads of money in the '90s selling SUVs and Pickups.  They ignored their car line-up and are still playing catch-up.  That the competition in SUVs caught up as well as the market falling away in both SUV and Pickups cost them dearly...as well as the lack of long-term planning which can be put down to Jacques "the flash" Nasser.  Bill Ford conceded that he was not fully capable of turning Ford around and handed over to Alan Mulally who may, or may not, be setting them on a profitable course.  The new Flex and Taurus might give an indication.  However, their loses are in the truck market with their car sales, generally, improving.  That may be a good sign.

[MX793]

As for the Fusion, it was based on the Mazda 6 platform and the dimensions of it were increased.  As the Mazda 6 was based, more or less on the previous Mondeo platform, the resultant Fusion was larger that the previous Mondeo...but maybe no larger than the lastest Mondeo.  As the New Mazda 6 is based on the new Mondeo platform, perhaps the next generation Fusion will be bigger. 

The new Mondeo is every bit as large as the Fusion.

As for the Mazda6, the next gen North American Mazda6 is not based on the EUCD platform which underpins the latest Mondeo.  It will be on a second generation (or updated at least) version of the CD3 platform that it is currently on.  GG/CD3 is not really based on the previous generation Mondeo either.