Z06 vs GT500KR Edmunds

[Soup DeVille]

Headers, mid-pipe, and catback including installation.  Yes.
That is supercharger and installation.  Most shops charge as much for the installation and setup as the kit costs.  $8000 might be a bit high, but it won't be below $6000.
Shocks, struts, springs, roll bars, strut tower brace, etc plus installation.  Yes.
It is an option, and it's an option I would probably go for myself, but he asked why would someone buy a GT500 when they could just supercharge a GT and save money.  That was my answer.  It's more then just a supercharger.

The most I've seen quoted for supercharger install time is around 15 hours: even at delaership rates that no more than $1300 for installation of at most a $4000 pacckage.

Tein sells full coilover suspension conversion- with cockpit controlled damping and adjustable ride height for $1300. You would be hard pressed to find a better off the shelf system- or to claim that the GT500s is better in any way. Roll bars ar a couple hundred bucks a piece: and if you're paying more than that, you're paying the wrong people.


You can have custom fabbed exhaust headers installed by the priciest guy in town and spend less than $2500 on a full system.

[SVT666]

The most I've seen quoted for supercharger install time is around 15 hours: even at delaership rates that no more than $1300 for installation of at most a $4000 pacckage.

Actually, you're right.  I called both performance shops in town and they both claim 14 hours for installation at a rate of $100 an hour.  Supercharger kits are in the neighbourhood of $4500-5000 CDN.

Tein sells full coilover suspension conversion- with cockpit controlled damping and adjustable ride height for $1300. You would be hard pressed to find a better off the shelf system- or to claim that the GT500s is better in any way. Roll bars ar a couple hundred bucks a piece: and if you're paying more than that, you're paying the wrong people.

$1300 does not include installation.  I guarantee installation is 10 hours @ $100.

You can have custom fabbed exhaust headers installed by the priciest guy in town and spend less than $2500 on a full system.

Catback = $600
X-Pipe with high flow cat = $450
Headers = $600
INSTALLATION = 10 hours @ $100 (Header installation in a Mustang requires pulling the engine)

Total = $2650

[Soup DeVille]

Hey man, if it takes you ten hours to bolt on a new set uf COs and shocks/srings, you're in the wrong line of work; and in any case, you're still way short of the $4000 from your original estimate.

If the headers are such a pain to install, screw 'em. Doing the exhaust from the headers back and overdriving your brand new blower a tad will get the same results.

Anyways, the point was that you can have GT500KR-type performance for considerably less upfront cost using aftermarket mods.

[Soup DeVille]

Mustang GT = $28,000
Supercharger Kit and Installation = $8000
Suspension and Installation = $4000
Brake Kit and Installation = $4000
Wheel and Tire Combo = $2500
New shifter and clutch and Installation = $1100
Exhaust system and installation = $2500
Dyno Tune = $500

Total = $46,600

Your warranty is all but gone, resale value is in the toilet, and you just spent more then the MSRP of a GT500.

So, lets re-evaluate these figures a little maybe.

stock GT: $28,000 OK, not much argument there. I mean, if somebody were to start a project like this it would make more sense to start used, but thats not really fair.

Blower installed: let's say $6000 for argument's sake.
Suspension: $2500
Brakes: $4000 may be a little high, but it would get you a really nice set of binders.
Wheels/tires: again you could probably do a lot better than $2500, but you could also probably spend more too if that was your goal.

New shifter and clutch- I really doubt its necessary for a street car to go to a massive clutch setup, but  ashifter would be nice- and if you do end up smoking the clutch, well hey, I was wrong, you were right. Let's get a shnifty shifter though: $250.
Exhaust- $1000 ignoring the headers.
Dyno tune- why? any off the shelf blower kit will already have a better map setup with it in the kit than 95% of dyno ships out there can do anyways

So, that puts us at a little under $42,000. Still a chunk of change, but not quite as drastic.

[GoCougs]

I challenge anyone to show me a set of headers that requires one to pull the engine on a current-gen Mustang GT.

If one manages to find a set or two, I'll show them a set that doesn't belong a street-driven car (i.e., 2" equal length length tri-Y) and that will probably need a lot of fender and firewall work to fit.

The vast, vast majority of headers; shorties, full length, or otherwise, won't require such a cockamamie thing as pulling the engine.

To assume most or all headers will require the engine to be pulled is just not correct.

[Soup DeVille]

I challenge anyone to show me a set of headers that requires one to pull the engine on a current-gen Mustang GT.

If one manages to find a set or two, I'll show them a set that doesn't belong a street-driven car (i.e., 2" equal length length tri-Y) and that will probably need a lot of fender and firewall work to fit.

The vast, vast majority of headers; shorties, full length, or otherwise, won't require such a cockamamie thing as pulling the engine.

To assume most or all headers will require the engine to be pulled is just not correct.

Let's say for argument's sake that you do (its possible). A couple of other things on that list do too, not to mention that the supercharger installation requires you to strip the top enddown to the heads anyways.

Once you have the engine out, its a lot easier to do other things- clutch installation for instance becomes a half hour job instead of an 8 hour one. In other words- if all of these mods were to be installed at once, you'd save a mint on installation costs, instead of breaking them into individual jobs and bolting everything back together just to take them apart again.

[GoCougs]

Let's say for argument's sake that you do (its possible). A couple of other things on that list do too, not to mention that the supercharger installation requires you to strip the top enddown to the heads anyways.

Once you have the engine out, its a lot easier to do other things- clutch installation for instance becomes a half hour job instead of an 8 hour one. In other words- if all of these mods were to be installed at once, you'd save a mint on installation costs, instead of breaking them into individual jobs and bolting everything back together just to take them apart again.

Perhaps, but my strong hunch is if you took it to said hot rod shop and said, "here, do all these things" they would not pull the engine. And HEMI666 plainly coupled engine pulling to only the exhaust job, not as a holistic strategy to all upgrades performed at the same time.

I've done all those thing on a wide range of RWD vehicles (not the S/C but headers/exhaust/tranny/clutch), and not once was pulling the engine ever remotely advantageous.

Looking at pretty much all those prices, they seem out of whack. I guess if one is picking the polished/chromed/plated/coated/whateverist of everything perhaps but at some point it's spending money just to spend money.

[sportyaccordy]

No way u would spend more than the MSRP of the GT500KR. And even if u did u would have a machine that is lighter, faster & more agile than a GT500KR would ever be off the dealer's lot

(though for all that money you could just get a C6.)

[LonghornTX]

No way u would spend more than the MSRP of the GT500KR. And even if u did u would have a machine that is lighter, faster & more agile than a GT500KR would ever be off the dealer's lot

(though for all that money you could just get a C6.)

I agree, the GT500KR is kind of a joke to me for anything but a piece of "cool" history. As with all current Shelby built Mustangs (the GT and this KR in particular), this car utilizes and depends on far too much FRPP off the shelf packages. Nothing has been done to address the horrendous geometry changes undergone by the S197 chassis upon a 1.5 inch drop and it shows in the comments in this, admittadely, horribly written article (they seem to be pretty amateur drivers). Regardless, this car is a horrible indication of what is possible with that much money and the S197 chassis. What I would go for: http://gr40cars.com/models/gr40tt.php ; the Griggs GR40TT, a car that would smoke just about anything on a track for a starting MSRP of $63,900.

Of course, who knows how streetable that car is, so for a more reasonable setup, I would probably do something similar to my car, with the addition of Steeda's new Watts-link. For power, I would choose between the Heritage GT Twin Turbo System, http://www.exileturbo.com/products/item_details.asp?idProduct=51 or Saleen's super sweet Shaker Charger, http://www.saleenworld.com/2008/saleen-speedlab-introduces-all-new-supershaker-air-induction-system.html#more-53

[LonghornTX]

Perhaps, but my strong hunch is if you took it to said hot rod shop and said, "here, do all these things" they would not pull the engine. And HEMI666 plainly coupled engine pulling to only the exhaust job, not as a holistic strategy to all upgrades performed at the same time.

I've done all those thing on a wide range of RWD vehicles (not the S/C but headers/exhaust/tranny/clutch), and not once was pulling the engine ever remotely advantageous.

Looking at pretty much all those prices, they seem out of whack. I guess if one is picking the polished/chromed/plated/coated/whateverist of everything perhaps but at some point it's spending money just to spend money.

Header installs are notoriously expensive, knuckle busting affairs on the S197 as the engine bay can be pretty tight. I could see a shop lifting the engine to do a header, blower, and clutch/flywheel operation all at once...

[TBR]

Longhorn, any more mods to your 'Stang?

[LonghornTX]

Longhorn, any more mods to your 'Stang?

I recently put on a Bassani SS x-pipe with high-flow cats; it really sounds quite nice now, very beastly. Next month I will probably change out the rear end gear set for a higher ratio, install a torsen LSD, and change to RP fluids.

[TBR]

Are you DDing it or do you still have the 525i?

[LonghornTX]

Are you DDing it or do you still have the 525i?

Nope, it is a "sunny day" car now, which I enjoy since it allows me to keep it clean and in great shape (I plan to keep the car for some time, thus the mods). I sold the 525i in a bad move, to my neightbor, thinking that I would only want one car.

Well that thought changed to my mindset now, but by the time I had my epiphany, my stupid teenage girl neightbor wrecked it :-(. I am quite sad over that, because I loved that car so much and was quite nostalgic for it after the sale.

So, I have moved on and recently purchased a 1986 Volvo 240 DL, white on black leather, auto, with 140k miles on the clock. It is in great condition, but sadly I was not able to find a good 240 five speed at the time; they seem to be in demand right now.

Affectionately referred to as the "Volv" by my roommates, it is quite a stark contrast to the Mustang, but is a very solid commuter (everything works). I pretty much sit in traffic, of some form, to and from work, so a "fun" car really becomes kind of a waste in those conditions. I decided, given those considerations, to focus on ease of maintanence, reliability, and general comfort. Those led me to the 240 and thus far I have been very happy. Maybe next weekend I will clean it up and take some pics.

As a result of this new commuter machine, I can now focus on the Mustang. In the coming year, depending on EOY bonuses, I will hopefully do the rear end work, watts link, GT/CS rear bumper, WeaponX COPs (pending verified performance), the new C&L intake, and Comp Cams Stage 3 cams/springs. That should hopefully bring me to 340-350whp NA, which will probably be good enough for awhile. In the future, I might consider a stroking kit and head work, but that won't happen for awhile.

[TBR]

Glad you're keeping it N/A.

5MT 240s are pretty rare, great commuter nonetheless.