12 cylinders on a reasonable budget

[ChrisV]

Perhaps the 850CSi w/MT, but the others? They're AT-equipped sedans that on their best days probably couldn't run with a newer V6 Accord or V6 Camry of the same value.

Then you haven't driven any of them. Even my lowly V8 old sedan will hand an Accord or Camry its ass on a fun road, and FEEL better doing it. There's something about the steering feel of a real performance sedan, designed as such by folks who specialize in it, that cannot be matched by a plebian FWD people hauler.

When your purchase can't keep pace with a CamCord, will cost a mint to fix and maintain and be a reliability nightmare, yes, I think such a thing can be.

There are a million and one older cars I'd rather have, and get more enjoyment out of, than any modern CamCord, even if they cost more.. It's not all about simply getting from point A to point B with the AC running.

[Raza]

Perhaps the 850CSi w/MT, but the others? They're AT-equipped sedans that on their best days probably couldn't run with a newer V6 Accord or V6 Camry of the same value.

When your purchase can't keep pace with a CamCord, will cost a mint to fix and maintain and be a reliability nightmare, yes, I think such a thing can be.

Well, you're wrong.  Too bad.

[Raza]

There are a million and one older cars I'd rather have, and get more enjoyment out of, than any modern CamCord, even if they cost more.. It's not all about simply getting from point A to point B with the AC running.

No, it is.  All driving should be done in a straightline as well.  It should be joyless and efficient.

[Onslaught]

No, it is.  All driving should be done in a straightline as well.  It should be joyless and efficient.

I better get a muscle car then.

[Eye of the Tiger]

I better get a muscle car then.

A V6 CamCord would be just as fast, but more reliable, efficient, cheaper, comfortable, sensible, boring and make you want to chop your balls off and troll car forums about how awesome V6 CamCords are.

[Rupert]

Poor Cougs is just bitter because he drives a CamCord.

[sportyaccordy]

Perhaps the 850CSi w/MT, but the others? They're AT-equipped sedans that on their best days probably couldn't run with a newer V6 Accord or V6 Camry of the same value.

When your purchase can't keep pace with a CamCord, will cost a mint to fix and maintain and be a reliability nightmare, yes, I think such a thing can be.

So is an E30 M3 is a worse car than an Accord V6 because the Accord is faster in a straight line and more comfortable as a daily driver? Cmon bro.

I hope you don't think I'm looking at these as my next car. It's just a thread.

[Tave]

Cougs has owned some boss rides, if I remember correctly. I think he's speaking more to the idea of owning V12 exotics on a "budget."

[GoCougs]

How is it you guys get yourselves so vested in diversion?

Tave, for like the 127th time, has shown yet again to be the smartest guy in the thread.

[Raza]

How is it you guys get yourselves so vested in diversion?

Tave, for like the 127th time, has shown yet again to be the smartest guy in the thread.

Yes, ownership experience and subjective feel are trumped by shitty Japanese boxes' V6 acceleration. 

Why are you even on a car forum if you don't like cars?

[CALL_911]

Cougs has owned some boss rides

Is this true, Cougs?

Please give us more information.

[GoCougs]

Is this true, Cougs?

Please give us more information.

I think Tave was a bit generous in calling them "boss" but they were cool enough to me.

But here are my top 3:

1972 Dodge Demon. Mildly built 360 V8, 727 TF A/T and 3.23 Sure Grip (limited slip) differential. I bought this restored and didn't do a dang thing to it but race it and waste a set of rear tires:



1979 Chevy Camaro. I did plenty of work on this, including a moderately modified 350 and Turbo 400 AT w/high stall converter:



1982 Dodge Ramcharger. I did plenty of work on this, including a moderately modified 318 with fuel injected heads. I can't find a good picture, but it was lifted a bit with 33" mudders on alloys:



I find it moderately ironic the charge I don't like cars. I've got more experience owning, driving and modifying/working on them than most on here.

[Eye of the Tiger]

A reasonable Dodge Demon, but two other nutless vehicles that could barely take on the Swift. I see a guy who was just waiting for his CamCord to be built so he could be happy forever and never have to like real cars again.

[GoCougs]

No, the point being that college, career, girl friend(s), other hobbies, etc., make owning those types of vehicles a real chore. Though the Demon and Camaro were fairly quick (I estimate low 14 sec 1/4 mile) they were absolutely atrocious in braking, handling, reliability, safety, MPG, etc. They were fun, but it is highly unlikely I'll ever own one again, as I've alluded to previously, an Accord V6 Coupe is a vastly superior vehicle in all objective regards, even if it doesn't have a V8 rumble or legendary nameplate.

To carry the tit-for-tat analogy to the thread, the quasi ego boost of driving a has-been luxury sedan means a lot to some. I don't discount that; my point is that I call it out for what it is - swapping that ego boost for a lesser performing and all-around inferior vehicle. Further, you'll not ever convince me that driving a 15 year old 4,300 lb land yacht such as a 740i or S500 is objectively more pleasurable than driving an '08 Accord V6 sedan. Further, it is easily objectively proven that the 740i/S500 will be the lesser performing vehicle in all regards.

(Wow, guys - this call-out didn't exactly go your way, did it?)

[Raza]

You don't have to be convinced.  I don't care anymore.  If you don't like cars, you don't like cars. 

[Eye of the Tiger]

No, the point being that college, career, girl friend(s), other hobbies, etc., make owning those types of vehicles a real chore. Though the Demon and Camaro were fairly quick (I estimate low 14 sec 1/4 mile) they were absolutely atrocious in braking, handling, reliability, safety, MPG, etc. They were fun, but it is highly unlikely I'll ever own one again, as I've alluded to previously, an Accord V6 Coupe is a vastly superior vehicle in all objective regards, even if it doesn't have a V8 rumble or legendary nameplate.

To carry the tit-for-tat analogy to the thread, the quasi ego boost of driving a has-been luxury sedan means a lot to some. I don't discount that; my point is that I call it out for what it is - swapping that ego boost for a lesser performing and all-around inferior vehicle. Further, you'll not ever convince me that driving a 15 year old 4,300 lb land yacht such as a 740i or S500 is objectively more pleasurable than driving an '08 Accord V6 sedan. Further, it is easily objectively proven that the 740i/S500 will be the lesser performing vehicle in all regards.

(Wow, guys - this call-out didn't exactly go your way, did it?)

[ChrisV]

Sorry, cougs, I've driven exotics on the track, I've driven homebuilt race cars on the track, both cheap ass wannabe drag cars like yours and sports cars. Saying "ooh, I built a cheap old Camaro, and now drive an Accord, so I know how a top of the line BMW sport sedan drives" is fucking bullshit of the highest order. You really don't know shit. And I say that in the nicest possible way.

Lesser performing is ONLY in a fucking straight line and even then it's marginal at best. The relentless pull that a V12 car gives under acceleration cannot be matched by some Accord or Camry with a 4 or V6, no matter HOW much hp it makes. And the driving dynamics of a RWD sedan with suspension tuned specifically for handling is WORLDS different than a fucking every-man FWD shitbox.

Fuck off and get the fuck out of these threads until you actually have a goddamn clue.

[cawimmer430]

Fuck off and get the fuck out of these threads until you actually have a goddamn clue.

Another contender for Great Automotive Quotes In History.   

[Vinsanity]

Further, you'll not ever convince me that driving a 15 year old 4,300 lb land yacht such as a 740i or S500 is objectively more pleasurable than driving an '08 Accord V6 sedan.

Hell, you'll never convince me that driving an '08 Accord V6 is "objectively" better than driving a 20-years-older 560SEL, let alone one from earlier this decade.

[ChrisV]

Further, you'll not ever convince me that driving a 15 year old 4,300 lb land yacht such as a 740i or S500 is objectively more pleasurable than driving an '08 Accord V6 sedan.

You really don't know a thing about vehicle dynamics, steering feel, feedback, etc, do you? Apparently your Duster was a little short on educational experience.

But yeah, after building an old Duster, old Camaro, and old Dodge pickup truck, I'd guess you thought an Accord was the greatest fucking car on earth, the newer the better.

You know, I'm starting to not feel so angry towards you, merely sorry for you that your life is so fucking pathetic (measuring everything by a few "objective numbers" like net worth instead of actually feeling anything).

You don't have much real experience. You don't have much knowledge, and all you have are some numbers to comfort you. You are the epitome of "made of fail."

[Rupert]

Don't be so harsh on old Cougsy. He's an engineer, after all. It's no wonder he's such an Objectivist whore.

[Raza]

Don't be so harsh on old Cougsy. He's an engineer, after all. It's no wonder he's such an Objectivist whore.

Most engineers I know are really into cars. 




His posts read more like an accountant's, honestly. 

[Rupert]

Most engineers I know are really into cars. 




His posts read more like an accountant's, honestly. 

Haha, same basic thing.

[Tave]

Most engineers I know are really into cars. 

Most engineers I know are into full-size trucks and couldn't care less about sports and/or luxury cars.

[Rupert]

Most engineers I know are into full-size trucks and couldn't care less about sports and/or luxury cars.

Well, you are from Wyoming...

Most engineers that I know are into bicycling and cool technology in cars.

[Raza]

Most engineers I know are into full-size trucks and couldn't care less about sports and/or luxury cars.

I guess they run the gamut.  One of my closest friends is an engineer, and he is trying to build his MX-5 into a race car.  He does all the work on all of his cars (three total, including his girl's).  He is an ME though.

[sportyaccordy]

Don't be so harsh on old Cougsy. He's an engineer, after all. It's no wonder he's such an Objectivist whore.

I'm an engineer too bro

I do think people are being needlessly harsh. I'm sure Cougs gets buns and lives a decent life, and in any case that's all ad hominem

But I do agree that the completely objective analysis of the ownership of said cars is ridiculous. Obviously an 04 Accord V6 w/no options will make for a much more practical and probably objectively higher performing ownership experience (doubtful it will be better in anything but straight line performance though). But that the idea of vehicle dynamics and the driving experience are totally lost on dude are def reflective of someone who doesn't "get it". I would never choose any of these cars as daily drivers or anything I'd have to depend on... but I would def love to have them just cause. Life is too short to resign one's self to automatic V6 black boxes

[Tave]

I'd imagine an Accord would wallop some of those old luxo-barges on a road course too.

[2o6]

I'd imagine an Accord would wallop some of those old luxo-barges on a road course too.

I don't think so.



Not a Seven. Maybe an S class, or an XJ, but definitely not a Seven.

[Tave]