Solstice gives Pontiac?and GM?a much needed boost

Started by BMWDave, August 29, 2005, 06:54:03 AM

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What a Concept: Solstice gives Pontiac?and GM?a much needed shot in the arm
ROGER HART
Published Date: 8/29/05
2006 PONTIAC SOLSTICE
ON SALE: Now
BASE PRICE: $19,995
POWERTRAIN: 2.4-liter, 177-hp, 166-lb-ft I4; rwd, five-speed manual
CURB WEIGHT: 2860 lbs
0 TO 60 MPH: 7.2 seconds (est.)
FUEL MILEAGE (EPA COMBINED): 23.6 mpg

Ever since it was revealed at the 2002 Detroit show, the Pontiac Solstice has been more than just a car for General Motors. Brainchild of GM?s then-new product czar Bob Lutz, the two-seater became an experiment for how quickly the automotive giant could conceive a car that would ignite the public?s interest, and then bring it to market.

Shortly after the show car was given the green light for production, the Solstice became the project everyone within GM was looking at. To everyone?s best recollection?and despite a well-publicized delay late in the process? this is the quickest GM has moved from approval to production.

In concept form Solstice promised a lot of fun and sportiness. With a Lutz-mandated, etched-in-stone, read-my-lips base price of $19,995, well, many doubted the promise could be delivered for the price. More than one GM engineer noted the ?F-word,? meaning Fiero, still echoed in the halls at GM. The budget two-seat Pontiac Fiero of the 1980s had a sporty shape that promised a spirited ride, but it didn?t deliver until after the car had been killed by the company.

But Fiero didn?t have Lutz? the Solstice team?s trump card and spiritual father.

?There were a lot of times the accountants would look at something I wanted in this car and tell me I could get a similar piece cheaper,? says vehicle line director Darren Post. ?I?d tell them we tried that and the cheaper one wasn?t as good, and if they wanted to call Bob [Lutz] I had his number on my cellphone speed dial. I always got the parts I wanted.?

While Lutz, now GM?s vice chairman for global product development, has had a hand in several other GM cars since his arrival at the company, Solstice is really the first car developed entirely under his watch.

?It?s been a lifelong dream of mine to build an affordable two-seat roadster,? Lutz said.

In September 2001, just 15 weeks before the auto show, Lutz wanted a show car for Pontiac, and he staged a sketch-off among GM stylists that was won by designer Franz von Holzhausen from GM?s California studio (von Holzhausen has since left
GM for Mazda). Solstice has been a fast-track project from the outset.

?Our goal here was not to duplicate an [Honda] S2000 or [BMW] Z3,? says Lutz. ?Little would be gained in making another $30,000-to-$40,000 roadster.?

But that didn?t mean the Solstice couldn?t ride and handle like those more expensive cars.

?While everyone will compare the Solstice with the Miata,? says chassis engineer Steve Padilla, the man who has logged more miles behind the wheel of Solstices than anyone else, ?the ride dynamics we were shooting for were more like the S2000, only a bit less twitchy.?


Delivering on the car?s sporty looks has been the target of everyone working on the project. Solstice is the first car built on GM?s Kappa small-car rear-drive platform, and because it is being done in relatively small volume (the Saturn Sky, Solstice?s platform sister, will debut next year), the chassis is mostly hand-welded.

Engineers raided the corporate parts bin to speed up the gestation period. Everything from SUVs to midsize sedans contributed components, and while the end result could have been a nightmare, it works.

Solstice?s heart is a 2.4-liter four-cylinder Ecotec positioned north-south for the first time. The aluminum engine with overhead cams and four valves per cylinder?mounted transversely in front-drive cars such as the 2006 Chevy HHR?makes 177 hp at 6600 rpm and 166 lb-ft at 4800 rpm in the Solstice. Down low, the engine has good pull?a couple of 4500-rpm drop-the-clutch launches proved that, as well as producing some tire smoke?and the exhaust note is tuned for a throaty growl. We will always take more power, especially in a car that looks like this, but we are not disappointed with the Solstice?s performance.

GM officials are tight-lipped about offering a Solstice with more punch, but insiders confirm a more potent, turbo?charged or supercharged model will be offered later.

The Ecotec mates to a five-speed manual gearbox that operates with nice short throws. Its action is not lightning-quick, like that on the S2000 for example, but it is tight, and engagement is crisp. The clutch takeup on the cars we drove was just perfect, and the brake and throttle pedals are position?ed for heel-and-toe downshifts. An automatic will be offered early next year.


Unlike Mazda, which offers a six-speed manual on the Miata, GM makes only a five-speed manual for Solstice.

?A six-speed looks good on paper,? says Post, ?but in this car it would just be overkill. We tried it, and it made no difference to the performance of the car. In fact, it just made you shift more, and it wasn?t any quicker 0 to 60.?

We did notice some mild driveline lash, which Post says his team is working to correct.

Our test drive included some city driving, freeway stints and long stretches of tight, twisty two-lane roads under sunny skies?perfect roadster weather. While there are a lot of things we like about the Solstice? its looks and price at the top of the list?after several hours in the saddle we came away most impressed with the car?s ride and handling. We were left wanting just one thing: more seat time.

Solstice rides on standard 18-inch aluminum wheels fitted with P245/45 Goodyear Eagle all-season tires. With four-wheel independent short/long-arm suspension, the ride is firmer than that in the new Miata we sampled about a week later. Yet at no point did we perceive the Pontiac?s ride as harsh. The chassis feels rock-solid, with no unwanted vibrations or cowl shake. At freeway speeds the car has a solid, boulevard-cruiser feel, but spot an opening in traffic and you can slot into it with go-kart quickness. The steering action is quick, but not so darty as to change lanes on you if you sneeze. In a car full of pluses, the responsive steering is a delight.


On a closed stretch of hilly switchback road we pushed the car as hard as we would have on a racetrack, and its road manners impressed. The balance is far more neutral than we expected, with the rear end only wanting to step out when you near the limit. That can be credited some to the car?s 52/48 front/rear weight balance, and the big tires gripping the road. The four-wheel disc brakes?11.7 inches up front, 10.9 inches in the rear?did everything we asked of them without complaint. Several hard runs couldn?t bring about any sense of fade. After a couple of runs up and down the hill, there were grins all around, especially on the face of Lutz.

We started our test with the car?s top down. Without a doubt, the Solstice looks much better with the roof stored below the rear deck so its clean, rounded lines are undisturbed by the manually folding cloth top. At freeway speeds, top down, there is a bit of wind buffeting, but you can still easily carry on a conversation with the passenger.

As the day wore on and the temperatures rose toward triple-digits, we gave up style for comfort, raised the top and switched on the air conditioning. The top, fitted with a glass window with standard rear defroster, can easily be handled by one person. It is not as simple as a Miata top, because you need to get out of the car and open the decklid to operate it.


Top up, there?s enough cargo space to hold a couple of pieces of luggage, enough for two people for a long weekend. But with the top stowed, storage space is at a premium. And whatever is stored had better be soft-sided in order to conform to the cramped space. Pontiac officials boasted about getting two sets of golf clubs in there, and they did, but they were the smallest golf bags we ever saw. If you?re planning a golf trip, we?d suggest shipping your clubs?and maybe some luggage?to your destination.

The cockpit is simple and functional. All controls are straightforward. Materials look and feel nice, and the panels fit well. The manual seats are supportive and have decent side bolstering. There is enough leg-room, even for drivers taller than six feet.

At 2860 pounds, Solstice is 300 pounds heavier than the Miata, but it has a bigger interior and a bit more horsepower. Pontiac is said to be working on what might be dubbed a track model, stripped of all sound-deadening, air conditioning and other weight additives.


Lutz also hinted a removable hardtop for the roadster could be available soon and a coupe version is being considered (both roadster and coupe concepts were shown at the car?s 2002 debut), in part because there are some racing classes in which the Solstice could compete that require an enclosed cockpit.

At 20,000 or 30,000 cars annually, Solstice won?t do a tremendous amount for GM?s bottom line. But with 10,000 orders in hand before the first production car rolled off the Wilmington, Delaware, assembly line, the Solstice seems to signal an attitude shift not only inside the company, but also by its customers. A production car nearly identical to its concept that hits the market just a few years after inception at the announced price. What a concept indeed.

2007 Honda S2000
OEM Hardtop, Rick's Ti Shift Knob, 17" Volk LE37ts coming soon...

Raghavan

damn it's heavy, otherwise, it's ok. The sky and miata are better though.

SJ_GTI

Quotedamn it's heavy, otherwise, it's ok. The sky and miata are better though.
Its lighter than the Z4 2.5i and about the same weight as an S2000 or Porsche Boxster.

Admittedly it doesn't have the same HP, but then its way cheaper than any of those cars. And from experience I used to drive a 170 HP Z3 that weighed just a hair over 3,000 lbs and it never felt heavy.

Aside from that it sounds like the car will be at a minimum competitive for the class, but I am more interested in seeing head-to-head comparison's since these first drives are almost always positive (except when the car is a total dud).

Champ


ifcar

Quote
Quotedamn it's heavy, otherwise, it's ok. The sky and miata are better though.
Its lighter than the Z4 2.5i and about the same weight as an S2000 or Porsche Boxster.

Admittedly it doesn't have the same HP, but then its way cheaper than any of those cars. And from experience I used to drive a 170 HP Z3 that weighed just a hair over 3,000 lbs and it never felt heavy.

Aside from that it sounds like the car will be at a minimum competitive for the class, but I am more interested in seeing head-to-head comparison's since these first drives are almost always positive (except when the car is a total dud).
I worry that comparisons will essentially come down to image, calling the MX-5 a "girl's car" and whatnot.  

bobwill

Quote
Quotedamn it's heavy, otherwise, it's ok. The sky and miata are better though.
Its lighter than the Z4 2.5i and about the same weight as an S2000 or Porsche Boxster.

Admittedly it doesn't have the same HP, but then its way cheaper than any of those cars. And from experience I used to drive a 170 HP Z3 that weighed just a hair over 3,000 lbs and it never felt heavy.

Aside from that it sounds like the car will be at a minimum competitive for the class, but I am more interested in seeing head-to-head comparison's since these first drives are almost always positive (except when the car is a total dud).
But, I wanted to comment on how heavy the S2000 is.  :)
Think about it, the S2000 and Solstice are actually almost as heavy as a Corvette Coupe.

SJ_GTI

QuoteThink about it, the S2000 and Solstice are actually almost as heavy as a Corvette Coupe.
The Solstice is about 319 lbs lighter than the Vette hatchback, the S2000 is about 344 lbs lighter.

The Vette convertible is a bit heavier (~20 lbs) but since it was designed as a Vert it isn't much difference.


Raza

Quote
Think about it, the S2000 and Solstice are actually almost as heavy as a Corvette Coupe.
That's a materials issue.  The Corvette is made of fiberglass, and I hear that doesn't hold up too well in accidents.  
Quis custodiet ipsos custodes?
If you can read this, you're too close


2006 BMW Z4 3.0i
http://accelerationtherapy.squarespace.com/   @accelerationdoc
Quote from: the Teuton on October 05, 2009, 03:53:18 PMIt's impossible to argue with Raza. He wins. Period. End of discussion.

JYODER240

QuoteTo everyone?s best recollection?and despite a well-publicized delay late in the process? this is the quickest GM has moved from approval to production.

Didn't the Corvette move from concept to production in just 6-weeks, thats why they used fiberglass for the body. <_<  
/////////////////////////
Quit living as if the purpose of life is to arrive safely at death


*President of the "I survived the Volvo S80 thread" club*

ifcar

Quote
Quote
Think about it, the S2000 and Solstice are actually almost as heavy as a Corvette Coupe.
That's a materials issue.  The Corvette is made of fiberglass, and I hear that doesn't hold up too well in accidents.
Just the skin is fiberglass, it's the same way Saturn safety isn't compromised by having exterior plastic body panels.  

Raza

Quote
Quote
Quote
Think about it, the S2000 and Solstice are actually almost as heavy as a Corvette Coupe.
That's a materials issue.  The Corvette is made of fiberglass, and I hear that doesn't hold up too well in accidents.
Just the skin is fiberglass, it's the same way Saturn safety isn't compromised by having exterior plastic body panels.
I didn't mean it was entirely made of fiberglass, but it does save a lot of weight.  And from what I'm told, there's no fixing body panels on a Corvette--they have to be replaced.
Quis custodiet ipsos custodes?
If you can read this, you're too close


2006 BMW Z4 3.0i
http://accelerationtherapy.squarespace.com/   @accelerationdoc
Quote from: the Teuton on October 05, 2009, 03:53:18 PMIt's impossible to argue with Raza. He wins. Period. End of discussion.

Tom

At 2860 pounds, Solstice is 300 pounds heavier than the Miata, but it has a bigger interior and a bit more horsepower. Pontiac is said to be working on what might be dubbed a track model, stripped of all sound-deadening, air conditioning and other weight additives.

Boo Ya.

thewizard16

I don't think the Solstice is all that beautiful, but it's certainly not ugly. The interior pictures I've seen, on the other hand, aren't as pleasant. Looks like acres of black plastic. I really prefer the Sky.
92 Camry XLE V6(Murdered)
99 ES 300 (Sold)
2008 Volkswagen Passat(Did not survive the winter)
2015 Lexus GS350 F-Sport


Quote from: Raza  link=topic=27909.msg1787179#msg1787179 date=1349117110
You're my age.  We're getting old.  Plus, now that you're married, your life expectancy has gone way down, since you're more likely to be poisoned by your wife.

Raza

Motor Trend hit 60 in 7 seconds with the Solstice.  Not too shabby--faster than the new MX-5.
Quis custodiet ipsos custodes?
If you can read this, you're too close


2006 BMW Z4 3.0i
http://accelerationtherapy.squarespace.com/   @accelerationdoc
Quote from: the Teuton on October 05, 2009, 03:53:18 PMIt's impossible to argue with Raza. He wins. Period. End of discussion.

MX793

QuoteMotor Trend hit 60 in 7 seconds with the Solstice.  Not too shabby--faster than the new MX-5.
R&T got 7.0 flat in the new MX-5 (they got 7.5 with the Solstice) and C&D got 6.5 with the new MX-5 (vs 7.2 for the Solstice).  I'm going to say that the Mazda is the quicker of the two.
Needs more Jiggawatts

2016 Ford Mustang GTPP / 2011 Toyota Rav4 Base AWD / 2014 Kawasaki Ninja 1000 ABS
1992 Nissan 240SX Fastback / 2004 Mazda Mazda3s / 2011 Ford Mustang V6 Premium / 2007 Suzuki GSF1250SA Bandit / 2006 VW Jetta 2.5

Tom

Quote
QuoteMotor Trend hit 60 in 7 seconds with the Solstice.  Not too shabby--faster than the new MX-5.
R&T got 7.0 flat in the new MX-5 (they got 7.5 with the Solstice) and C&D got 6.5 with the new MX-5 (vs 7.2 for the Solstice).  I'm going to say that the Mazda is the quicker of the two.
If you keep going to the 1/4, I'll bet the times would even out.  If anything, the Solstice would have the MX5 beat (5sp vs 5sp).

MX793

Quote
Quote
QuoteMotor Trend hit 60 in 7 seconds with the Solstice.  Not too shabby--faster than the new MX-5.
R&T got 7.0 flat in the new MX-5 (they got 7.5 with the Solstice) and C&D got 6.5 with the new MX-5 (vs 7.2 for the Solstice).  I'm going to say that the Mazda is the quicker of the two.
If you keep going to the 1/4, I'll bet the times would even out.  If anything, the Solstice would have the MX5 beat (5sp vs 5sp).
Actually, such is not the case.  C&D got a 15.0 with the MX5 and 15.8 with the Solstice.  The Miata has a power/weight advantage here, plus a 6 speed gearbox to keep the power closer to peak.  GM claims that they looked into using a 6 speed in the Solstice but that it didn't improve performance any.  I have to wonder if they didn't just grab a 6 spd from their parts bin which wasn't geared specifically for a car like the Solstice (fairly broad gear spacing with a super tall 6th gear for highway like the Corvette and GTO).
Needs more Jiggawatts

2016 Ford Mustang GTPP / 2011 Toyota Rav4 Base AWD / 2014 Kawasaki Ninja 1000 ABS
1992 Nissan 240SX Fastback / 2004 Mazda Mazda3s / 2011 Ford Mustang V6 Premium / 2007 Suzuki GSF1250SA Bandit / 2006 VW Jetta 2.5

Raza

Motor Trend got 15.6 seconds....

it does seem that the MX-5 is the faster car.
Quis custodiet ipsos custodes?
If you can read this, you're too close


2006 BMW Z4 3.0i
http://accelerationtherapy.squarespace.com/   @accelerationdoc
Quote from: the Teuton on October 05, 2009, 03:53:18 PMIt's impossible to argue with Raza. He wins. Period. End of discussion.

SJ_GTI

QuoteMotor Trend got 15.6 seconds....

it does seem that the MX-5 is the faster car.
I think on average that will be the case, but for most driving scenarios (when RPM's are under 6k) the power is going to feel about the same. The 2.4L ecotech has the extra oomph down low needed to move along the extra weight.

Raza

Quote
QuoteMotor Trend got 15.6 seconds....

it does seem that the MX-5 is the faster car.
I think on average that will be the case, but for most driving scenarios (when RPM's are under 6k) the power is going to feel about the same. The 2.4L ecotech has the extra oomph down low needed to move along the extra weight.
This information is very disconcerting.  The Solstice needed something extra special to pull out MX-5 key fobs, but heavier and slower is not what I mean by extra.  

Quis custodiet ipsos custodes?
If you can read this, you're too close


2006 BMW Z4 3.0i
http://accelerationtherapy.squarespace.com/   @accelerationdoc
Quote from: the Teuton on October 05, 2009, 03:53:18 PMIt's impossible to argue with Raza. He wins. Period. End of discussion.

Tom

Quote
Quote
Quote
QuoteMotor Trend hit 60 in 7 seconds with the Solstice.? Not too shabby--faster than the new MX-5.
R&T got 7.0 flat in the new MX-5 (they got 7.5 with the Solstice) and C&D got 6.5 with the new MX-5 (vs 7.2 for the Solstice).  I'm going to say that the Mazda is the quicker of the two.
If you keep going to the 1/4, I'll bet the times would even out.  If anything, the Solstice would have the MX5 beat (5sp vs 5sp).
Actually, such is not the case.  C&D got a 15.0 with the MX5 and 15.8 with the Solstice.  The Miata has a power/weight advantage here, plus a 6 speed gearbox to keep the power closer to peak.  GM claims that they looked into using a 6 speed in the Solstice but that it didn't improve performance any.  I have to wonder if they didn't just grab a 6 spd from their parts bin which wasn't geared specifically for a car like the Solstice (fairly broad gear spacing with a super tall 6th gear for highway like the Corvette and GTO).
I figured the 6sp MX5 would win, but I put "5sp vs 5sp" in parenthesis to make it a fair comparison.  Not only is the 6sp MX5 more expensive in comparison to a Solstice, but from what I read the 5sp MX is better to drive.