MazdaSpeed6 ?

[giant_mtb]

So, basically you like the way the only good handling FWD car you have driven drives?

Yeah, i like the GS-R. I like everything about it except that it's FWD, so i'm willing to over look that it's FWD.

You don't make any sense.  You're pointless.

How does that not make sense? I like it's looks, it's engine, its handling, its practicality, that i'm willing to overlook it's FWD. But they like to be stolen. :angry: Especially where i live.

So basically you're saying FWD only sucks on cars that suck...which isn't a valid arguement.

Ignorant.

[TBR]

If you like its handling why is it a bad thing that it is FWD? Is it just because of the notoriety RWD gives you? That is definitely what it sounds like.

[Raghavan]

For small cars, the packaging advantages of FWD cannot be overlooked.  The center tunnel can be minimized, which makes rear seating more comfortable for 3 across.  Try sitting three abreast in a BMW 3 series and then compare it to a Honda Civic or other FWD compact sedan.  Or try sitting 3 in the back of a Lincoln LS and then compare that to a FWD midsize.  For people haulers, FWD makes a lot of sense.

FWD is also more stable (too stable, IMO) and provides much better traction in the snow.  Having done almost all of my winter driving in a RWD car, I never thought of RWD as being that terrible in the snow despite many people I know stating that RWD is practically undriveable in the winter.  Then I got a FWD and the traction difference is very apparent.  I understand now why people who learn to drive in the snow in a FWD vehicle are so afraid of RWD in the snow.  Going from a vehicle that wants above all else to continue in a straight line when too much throttle is applied to a vehicle that is more than happy to swap ends under a heavy right foot is pretty intimidating.

I've driven RWD cars in the snow. All you need are some good snow tires, and traction control helps too, but this 'RWD sucks in snow' thing is crap. The Corolla GT-S i drove was in snow, and that doesn't even have traction control...

[Raghavan]

If you like its handling why is it a bad thing that it is FWD? Is it just because of the notoriety RWD gives you? That is definitely what it sounds like.

I just like RWD, but i said that i was willing to get a GS-R, didn't i?

[giant_mtb]

For small cars, the packaging advantages of FWD cannot be overlooked.  The center tunnel can be minimized, which makes rear seating more comfortable for 3 across.  Try sitting three abreast in a BMW 3 series and then compare it to a Honda Civic or other FWD compact sedan.  Or try sitting 3 in the back of a Lincoln LS and then compare that to a FWD midsize.  For people haulers, FWD makes a lot of sense.

FWD is also more stable (too stable, IMO) and provides much better traction in the snow.  Having done almost all of my winter driving in a RWD car, I never thought of RWD as being that terrible in the snow despite many people I know stating that RWD is practically undriveable in the winter.  Then I got a FWD and the traction difference is very apparent.  I understand now why people who learn to drive in the snow in a FWD vehicle are so afraid of RWD in the snow.  Going from a vehicle that wants above all else to continue in a straight line when too much throttle is applied to a vehicle that is more than happy to swap ends under a heavy right foot is pretty intimidating.

I've driven RWD cars in the snow. All you need are some good snow tires, and traction control helps too, but this 'RWD sucks in snow' thing is crap. The Corolla GT-S i drove was in snow, and that doesn't even have traction control...

Come here.  See how you like that damn thing in the winter with no traction control and RWD.  I dare you.

[Raghavan]

So, basically you like the way the only good handling FWD car you have driven drives?

Yeah, i like the GS-R. I like everything about it except that it's FWD, so i'm willing to over look that it's FWD.

You don't make any sense.  You're pointless.

How does that not make sense? I like it's looks, it's engine, its handling, its practicality, that i'm willing to overlook it's FWD. But they like to be stolen. :angry: Especially where i live.

So basically you're saying FWD only sucks on cars that suck...which isn't a valid arguement.

Ignorant.

ACtually, i'm saying FWDsucks on all cars.

[TBR]

Why do you like it? Apparantly it isn't because of the handling advantage.

[Raghavan]

For small cars, the packaging advantages of FWD cannot be overlooked.? The center tunnel can be minimized, which makes rear seating more comfortable for 3 across.? Try sitting three abreast in a BMW 3 series and then compare it to a Honda Civic or other FWD compact sedan.? Or try sitting 3 in the back of a Lincoln LS and then compare that to a FWD midsize.? For people haulers, FWD makes a lot of sense.

FWD is also more stable (too stable, IMO) and provides much better traction in the snow.? Having done almost all of my winter driving in a RWD car, I never thought of RWD as being that terrible in the snow despite many people I know stating that RWD is practically undriveable in the winter.? Then I got a FWD and the traction difference is very apparent.? I understand now why people who learn to drive in the snow in a FWD vehicle are so afraid of RWD in the snow.? Going from a vehicle that wants above all else to continue in a straight line when too much throttle is applied to a vehicle that is more than happy to swap ends under a heavy right foot is pretty intimidating.

I've driven RWD cars in the snow. All you need are some good snow tires, and traction control helps too, but this 'RWD sucks in snow' thing is crap. The Corolla GT-S i drove was in snow, and that doesn't even have traction control...

Come here.  See how you like that damn thing in the winter with no traction control and RWD.  I dare you.

I drove it in Denver, Colorado, which gets as much or more snow than you guys. That's the main reason we moved outta there. <_<  

[Raghavan]

Why do you like it? Apparantly it isn't because of the handling advantage.

Because it handles good. I still don't like the fact that it's FWD, but if it handles good, then i don't really care.

[giant_mtb]

For small cars, the packaging advantages of FWD cannot be overlooked.  The center tunnel can be minimized, which makes rear seating more comfortable for 3 across.  Try sitting three abreast in a BMW 3 series and then compare it to a Honda Civic or other FWD compact sedan.  Or try sitting 3 in the back of a Lincoln LS and then compare that to a FWD midsize.  For people haulers, FWD makes a lot of sense.

FWD is also more stable (too stable, IMO) and provides much better traction in the snow.  Having done almost all of my winter driving in a RWD car, I never thought of RWD as being that terrible in the snow despite many people I know stating that RWD is practically undriveable in the winter.  Then I got a FWD and the traction difference is very apparent.  I understand now why people who learn to drive in the snow in a FWD vehicle are so afraid of RWD in the snow.  Going from a vehicle that wants above all else to continue in a straight line when too much throttle is applied to a vehicle that is more than happy to swap ends under a heavy right foot is pretty intimidating.

I've driven RWD cars in the snow. All you need are some good snow tires, and traction control helps too, but this 'RWD sucks in snow' thing is crap. The Corolla GT-S i drove was in snow, and that doesn't even have traction control...

Come here.  See how you like that damn thing in the winter with no traction control and RWD.  I dare you.

I drove it in Denver, Colorado, which gets as much or more snow than you guys. That's the main reason we moved outta there. <_<

How much snow were you driving in?  Snow covered road?  

Nah...you need 2 and a half foot drifts of powder on ice covered roads with a substantial (one foot) depth of normal precipitatory snow in order to realize how bad a RWD car with no TC is in the winter...which you obviously were not.

Based on your little experience, you can't say that RWD isn't a problem in the winter.

Do you not understand the meaning of the word ignorant or do I have to keep repeating myself here?

[giant_mtb]

Why do you like it? Apparantly it isn't because of the handling advantage.

Because it handles good. I still don't like the fact that it's FWD, but if it handles good, then i don't really care.

English class, maybe?

[TBR]

Okay, so basically you don't like bad handling cars and are then making a broad stereotype despite the fact that, even with your limited experience, you have found two exceptions (SHO and GS-R). Explain to me how you aren't being ignorant?

[giant_mtb]

Okay, so basically you don't like bad handling cars and are then making a broad stereotype despite the fact that, even with your limited experience, you have found two exceptions (SHO and GS-R). Explain to me how you aren't being ignorant?

Exactly what I'm trying to figure out...

[Raghavan]

So, why are you guys flaming on me just because i don't like FWD?

[Raghavan]

For small cars, the packaging advantages of FWD cannot be overlooked.? The center tunnel can be minimized, which makes rear seating more comfortable for 3 across.? Try sitting three abreast in a BMW 3 series and then compare it to a Honda Civic or other FWD compact sedan.? Or try sitting 3 in the back of a Lincoln LS and then compare that to a FWD midsize.? For people haulers, FWD makes a lot of sense.

FWD is also more stable (too stable, IMO) and provides much better traction in the snow.? Having done almost all of my winter driving in a RWD car, I never thought of RWD as being that terrible in the snow despite many people I know stating that RWD is practically undriveable in the winter.? Then I got a FWD and the traction difference is very apparent.? I understand now why people who learn to drive in the snow in a FWD vehicle are so afraid of RWD in the snow.? Going from a vehicle that wants above all else to continue in a straight line when too much throttle is applied to a vehicle that is more than happy to swap ends under a heavy right foot is pretty intimidating.

I've driven RWD cars in the snow. All you need are some good snow tires, and traction control helps too, but this 'RWD sucks in snow' thing is crap. The Corolla GT-S i drove was in snow, and that doesn't even have traction control...

Come here.  See how you like that damn thing in the winter with no traction control and RWD.  I dare you.

I drove it in Denver, Colorado, which gets as much or more snow than you guys. That's the main reason we moved outta there. <_<

How much snow were you driving in?  Snow covered road?  

Nah...you need 2 and a half foot drifts of powder on ice covered roads with a substantial (one foot) depth of normal precipitatory snow in order to realize how bad a RWD car with no TC is in the winter...which you obviously were not.

Based on your little experience, you can't say that RWD isn't a problem in the winter.

Do you not understand the meaning of the word ignorant or do I have to keep repeating myself here?

There was some ice and TONS of snow. We kept getting stuck, but you'd get stuck in any car that doesn't have much ground clearance. It was fun though, and there were studded tires on the car.

[giant_mtb]

Are you serious?

Your arguement for "RWD is best, FWD sucks" is a COMPLETELY ignorant arguement...you might as well just not even speak because, quite frankly, you're words are useless.  You're ignorant, get over it.

[TBR]

So, why are you guys flaming on me just because i don't like FWD?

We are flaming you because you have no reason to not like FWD.

[Raghavan]

Are you serious?

Your arguement for "RWD is best, FWD sucks" is a COMPLETELY ignorant arguement...you might as well just not even speak because, quite frankly, you're words are useless.  You're ignorant, get over it.

It's my opinion, get over it. Learn to respect people's opinions. You're saying i'm ignorant and stupid for liking RWD. AT the same time, i could call you stupid for liking FWD, but i'm not. It's your opinion.  YOu need to learn that.

[Raghavan]

So, why are you guys flaming on me just because i don't like FWD?

We are flaming you because you have no reason to not like FWD.

I don't like FWD because i don't see any advantages it provides over RWD.

[giant_mtb]

Are you serious?

Your arguement for "RWD is best, FWD sucks" is a COMPLETELY ignorant arguement...you might as well just not even speak because, quite frankly, you're words are useless.  You're ignorant, get over it.

It's my opinion, get over it. Learn to respect people's opinions. You're saying i'm ignorant and stupid for liking RWD. AT the same time, i could call you stupid for liking FWD, but i'm not. It's your opinion.  YOu need to learn that.

You need a reading comprehension class, Rag.  I'm saying you're ignorant, yeah, it's your opinion, but it's a very ignorant one and you have no arguement for it.

Why would you call me stupid for liking FWD when I never said such a thing?

[giant_mtb]

So, why are you guys flaming on me just because i don't like FWD?

We are flaming you because you have no reason to not like FWD.

I don't like FWD because i don't see any advantages it provides over RWD.

That's because you're ignorant...

[Raghavan]

Are you serious?

Your arguement for "RWD is best, FWD sucks" is a COMPLETELY ignorant arguement...you might as well just not even speak because, quite frankly, you're words are useless.? You're ignorant, get over it.

It's my opinion, get over it. Learn to respect people's opinions. You're saying i'm ignorant and stupid for liking RWD. AT the same time, i could call you stupid for liking FWD, but i'm not. It's your opinion.  YOu need to learn that.

You need a reading comprehension class, Rag.  I'm saying you're ignorant, yeah, it's your opinion, but it's a very ignorant one and you have no arguement for it.

Why would you call me stupid for liking FWD when I never said such a thing?

I could call you stupid for not hating FWD then.

[Raghavan]

So, why are you guys flaming on me just because i don't like FWD?

We are flaming you because you have no reason to not like FWD.

I don't like FWD because i don't see any advantages it provides over RWD.

That's because you're ignorant...

And you're such a loser that you just call people names.

[giant_mtb]

Are you serious?

Your arguement for "RWD is best, FWD sucks" is a COMPLETELY ignorant arguement...you might as well just not even speak because, quite frankly, you're words are useless.  You're ignorant, get over it.

It's my opinion, get over it. Learn to respect people's opinions. You're saying i'm ignorant and stupid for liking RWD. AT the same time, i could call you stupid for liking FWD, but i'm not. It's your opinion.  YOu need to learn that.

You need a reading comprehension class, Rag.  I'm saying you're ignorant, yeah, it's your opinion, but it's a very ignorant one and you have no arguement for it.

Why would you call me stupid for liking FWD when I never said such a thing?

I could call you stupid for not hating FWD then.

Why?  Because you're ignorant?  Yes...do you have a valid arguement to back opinion up?  Of course not.

[giant_mtb]

So, why are you guys flaming on me just because i don't like FWD?

We are flaming you because you have no reason to not like FWD.

I don't like FWD because i don't see any advantages it provides over RWD.

That's because you're ignorant...

And you're such a loser that you just call people names.

Sorry for stating the truth that you desperately need to realize.

[MX793]

For small cars, the packaging advantages of FWD cannot be overlooked.  The center tunnel can be minimized, which makes rear seating more comfortable for 3 across.  Try sitting three abreast in a BMW 3 series and then compare it to a Honda Civic or other FWD compact sedan.  Or try sitting 3 in the back of a Lincoln LS and then compare that to a FWD midsize.  For people haulers, FWD makes a lot of sense.

FWD is also more stable (too stable, IMO) and provides much better traction in the snow.  Having done almost all of my winter driving in a RWD car, I never thought of RWD as being that terrible in the snow despite many people I know stating that RWD is practically undriveable in the winter.  Then I got a FWD and the traction difference is very apparent.  I understand now why people who learn to drive in the snow in a FWD vehicle are so afraid of RWD in the snow.  Going from a vehicle that wants above all else to continue in a straight line when too much throttle is applied to a vehicle that is more than happy to swap ends under a heavy right foot is pretty intimidating.

I've driven RWD cars in the snow. All you need are some good snow tires, and traction control helps too, but this 'RWD sucks in snow' thing is crap. The Corolla GT-S i drove was in snow, and that doesn't even have traction control...

Mine had no TCS, no ABS, and no snow tires and I live in one of the snowiest cities in the US.  While vastly trickier to drive that FWD, RWD is plenty useable in the snow.  I wouldn't hesitate to buy another RWD.

That said, how many times have you really driven RWD in the snow?  Ever tried running through a lake effect snow squal where it was coming down so heavily that you couldn't see more than 2 car lengths ahead?  Ever driven RWD in an ice storm?  Ever run on hilly, winding, poorly plowed backroads or on roads with random deep snow drifts deposited around curves of otherwise clear roads?  Driving a RWD on a relatively fair winter's day isn't a true representation of what it's like to have to use RWD day in and day out in the winter.  

[Raghavan]

Are you serious?

Your arguement for "RWD is best, FWD sucks" is a COMPLETELY ignorant arguement...you might as well just not even speak because, quite frankly, you're words are useless.? You're ignorant, get over it.

It's my opinion, get over it. Learn to respect people's opinions. You're saying i'm ignorant and stupid for liking RWD. AT the same time, i could call you stupid for liking FWD, but i'm not. It's your opinion.  YOu need to learn that.

You need a reading comprehension class, Rag.  I'm saying you're ignorant, yeah, it's your opinion, but it's a very ignorant one and you have no arguement for it.

Why would you call me stupid for liking FWD when I never said such a thing?

I could call you stupid for not hating FWD then.

Why?  Because you're ignorant?  Yes...do you have a valid arguement to back opinion up?  Of course not.

I do.

[giant_mtb]

Are you serious?

Your arguement for "RWD is best, FWD sucks" is a COMPLETELY ignorant arguement...you might as well just not even speak because, quite frankly, you're words are useless.  You're ignorant, get over it.

It's my opinion, get over it. Learn to respect people's opinions. You're saying i'm ignorant and stupid for liking RWD. AT the same time, i could call you stupid for liking FWD, but i'm not. It's your opinion.  YOu need to learn that.

You need a reading comprehension class, Rag.  I'm saying you're ignorant, yeah, it's your opinion, but it's a very ignorant one and you have no arguement for it.

Why would you call me stupid for liking FWD when I never said such a thing?

I could call you stupid for not hating FWD then.

Why?  Because you're ignorant?  Yes...do you have a valid arguement to back opinion up?  Of course not.

I do.

Prove it.  I would love to see it.

[giant_mtb]

For small cars, the packaging advantages of FWD cannot be overlooked.  The center tunnel can be minimized, which makes rear seating more comfortable for 3 across.  Try sitting three abreast in a BMW 3 series and then compare it to a Honda Civic or other FWD compact sedan.  Or try sitting 3 in the back of a Lincoln LS and then compare that to a FWD midsize.  For people haulers, FWD makes a lot of sense.

FWD is also more stable (too stable, IMO) and provides much better traction in the snow.  Having done almost all of my winter driving in a RWD car, I never thought of RWD as being that terrible in the snow despite many people I know stating that RWD is practically undriveable in the winter.  Then I got a FWD and the traction difference is very apparent.  I understand now why people who learn to drive in the snow in a FWD vehicle are so afraid of RWD in the snow.  Going from a vehicle that wants above all else to continue in a straight line when too much throttle is applied to a vehicle that is more than happy to swap ends under a heavy right foot is pretty intimidating.

I've driven RWD cars in the snow. All you need are some good snow tires, and traction control helps too, but this 'RWD sucks in snow' thing is crap. The Corolla GT-S i drove was in snow, and that doesn't even have traction control...

Mine had no TCS, no ABS, and no snow tires and I live in one of the snowiest cities in the US.  While vastly trickier to drive that FWD, RWD is plenty useable in the snow.  I wouldn't hesitate to buy another RWD.

That said, how many times have you really driven RWD in the snow?  Ever tried running through a lake effect snow squal where it was coming down so heavily that you couldn't see more than 2 car lengths ahead?  Ever driven RWD in an ice storm?  Ever run on hilly, winding, poorly plowed backroads or on roads with random deep snow drifts deposited around curves of otherwise clear roads?  Driving a RWD on a relatively fair winter's day isn't a true representation of what it's like to have to use RWD day in and day out in the winter.

Thank you Lord...

[TBR]

So, why are you guys flaming on me just because i don't like FWD?

We are flaming you because you have no reason to not like FWD.

I don't like FWD because i don't see any advantages it provides over RWD.

FWD cars have better gas mileage, more room, better all weather traction, and are cheaper than RWD cars.