Buick Regal GS

[Vinsanity]

The Maxima is ugly, and the VW CC IMO isn't quite as pretty.

I'll concede the Maxima, but the Regal looks simply bland compared to the CC.

[Vinsanity]

That's NOT true - even if their vehicles were equal in terms of "excitement" (which only applies to the LF-H and IS-F) Mercedes' history, especially in motor sports, is infinitely more interesting (due in large part to Lexus being a 20 or so year old brand)

I just can't imagine why H&H? would play such an important role in deciding whether to buy say, an IS250 or C300.

[Xer0]

I love Mercedes and don't really care for Lexus honestly but its threads like these that make me want to absolutely hate Mercedes and worship at the alter of Lexus just because a blind fanboy is worked up that Lexus is a viable alternative.  It?s unsightly and when the topic of the thread is a Buick that neither company has a competitor to, its down right retarded.

[Vinsanity]

I love Mercedes and don't really care for Lexus honestly but its threads like these that make me want to absolutely hate Mercedes and worship at the alter of Lexus just because a blind fanboy is worked up that Lexus is a viable alternative.  It’s unsightly and when the topic of the thread is a Buick that neither company has a competitor to, its down right retarded.

+ eleventy

[ChrisV]

Hmm. As far as quickness, my SVT Contour was masively fun with 200 hp and a similar 0-60 sprint. That you can get that with a manual transmission in a Buick (and with an engine that has prove to be easily upgradeable to well over 300 reliable horsepower, including one upgrade kit from GM itself) is a great thing.

All the manual transmission nazis that say ANY car is more fun and worthwhile with a manual transmission are finding new ways to crap all over this car just to find new things to bitch about, instead of rejoicing that Buick (BUISK, of all companies) is moving in the direction the enthusiasts have asked them to and coming out with a sportier version of one if it's car with ONLY a manual trans available. Here I thought adding a manual trans made a car instantly delivered directly from God ,and can do no wrong because it's the SHIFTING that makes a car fun, nothing else...       

[cawimmer430]

I love Mercedes and don't really care for Lexus honestly but its threads like these that make me want to absolutely hate Mercedes and worship at the alter of Lexus just because a blind fanboy is worked up that Lexus is a viable alternative.  It?s unsightly and when the topic of the thread is a Buick that neither company has a competitor to, its down right retarded.

Yeah. 

[Xer0]

Yeah. 

In just about every other topic you?re generally pretty mellow and I respect your opinion and enjoy reading your posts.  However, in any mater that has to do with Lexus/Toyota you just become a rapid fanboy pretty quickly. 

[Cookie Monster]

Hmm. As far as quickness, my SVT Contour was masively fun with 200 hp and a similar 0-60 sprint. That you can get that with a manual transmission in a Buick (and with an engine that has prove to be easily upgradeable to well over 300 reliable horsepower, including one upgrade kit from GM itself) is a great thing.

All the manual transmission nazis that say ANY car is more fun and worthwhile with a manual transmission are finding new ways to crap all over this car just to find new things to bitch about, instead of rejoicing that Buick (BUISK, of all companies) is moving in the direction the enthusiasts have asked them to and coming out with a sportier version of one if it's car with ONLY a manual trans available. Here I thought adding a manual trans made a car instantly delivered directly from God ,and can do no wrong because it's the SHIFTING that makes a car fun, nothing else...       

For the price it's pretty down on power.

[cawimmer430]

In just about every other topic you?re generally pretty mellow and I respect your opinion and enjoy reading your posts.  However, in any mater that has to do with Lexus/Toyota you just become a rapid fanboy pretty quickly. 

To me Lexus is overrated. Plain and simple.

I represent the type of buyer to whom a brand has to mean something. Lexus means nothing to me. Their lack of history or emotional appeal makes them clinically dead to me. They're a brand I'll easily overlook if I were shopping for a luxury car. I don't care if they're fully-loaded etc. The brand and their cars just don't appeal to me for my own reasons.

[Xer0]

To me Lexus is overrated. Plain and simple.

I represent the type of buyer to whom a brand has to mean something. Lexus means nothing to me. Their lack of history or emotional appeal makes them clinically dead to me. They're a brand I'll easily overlook if I were shopping for a luxury car. I don't care if they're fully-loaded etc. The brand and their cars just don't appeal to me for my own reasons.

Thats all well and good but your constant ramble on and on about Lexus is tiring.  At the end of the day Lexus is a viable and completely recomendable alternative to Mercedes and there is no debate on that ground at all.  You try and discredit the brand on fluffy grounds like history, heritage, and Toyota underpinnings yet pay very little attention to the actual car itself. 

[Vinsanity]

I also find it funny that for a guy who never gets tired taking the same jab at the relative excess of power we Americans enjoy in our cars, he sure does put a lot of stock into a company's racing heritage.

[cawimmer430]

You try and discredit the brand on fluffy grounds like history, heritage, and Toyota underpinnings yet pay very little attention to the actual car itself. 

Well, compare the Lexus history to that of other luxury brands. Compared to them, Lexus just pales. There's no passion behind the brand.

Look at this way. Most Americans expect a 3409340343940439340032098323290329320-hp V6 or a 99999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999-hp V8 in their luxury cars - Most Europeans expect a luxury brand to stand for something and have meaning. Here Lexus means nothing. Hell, most car enthusiasts I talk to here will ask "Lexus? You mean those expensive Toyotas?" The Toyota-association isn't doing Lexus any good here - and the lack of heritage when compared to ALL European luxury brands just kills them over here (and elsewhere where buyers expect luxury brands to have this). That's one major reason why Lexus fails here. The other reasons are lack of different trims, diesels etc.

[cawimmer430]

I also find it funny that for a guy who never gets tired taking the same jab at the relative excess of power we Americans enjoy in our cars, he sure does put a lot of stock into a company's racing heritage.

Racing heritage helps sell cars in Europe. Has so in the early days of the automobile and still does today. Racing heritage is part of many European brands, mainstream or luxury and it helps shape the perception of the brands.

The racing heritage of Toyota isn't as well known here and the racing heritage of Lexus is...wait...WHAT LEXUS RACING HERITAGE? Rolex Series and GT500? That's about it and that's NOTHING compared to the motorsport heritage of Mercedes, BMW, Audi, Jaguar, Bentley even, hell throw in Fiat, Renault, Lancia etc. in there.

[giant_mtb]

Racing heritage helps sell cars in Europe. Has so in the early days of the automobile and still does today. Racing heritage is part of many European brands, mainstream or luxury and it helps shape the perception of the brands.

The racing heritage of Toyota isn't as well known here and the racing heritage of Lexus is...wait...WHAT LEXUS RACING HERITAGE? Rolex Series and GT500? That's about it and that's NOTHING compared to the motorsport heritage of Mercedes, BMW, Audi, Jaguar, Bentley even, hell throw in Fiat, Renault, Lancia etc. in there.

P.S. Nobody gives a shit.

[Cookie Monster]

ITT: Wimmer trollin' and making up excuses as to why Lexus isn't a legitimate automaker.

Moving on...

[cawimmer430]

P.S. Nobody gives a shit.

Tons of people give a shit.

I'm meeting a lot of car fanatics through my photoshoots and I've not met a single one that has shown any appreciation for Lexus. Not one. These are guys who have all sorts of exotic cars in their garage but can appreciate a simple Fiat 127 or Renault 5, but Lexus? Doesn't interest them at all.

Why? There's nothing, absolutely nothing to get excited about in a Lexus from an enthusiast perspective. Only the IS-F and LF-A stand out but that's it. And how many supercars or performance cars have European brands produced over the century or decades? Lexus = LAME from the perspective of these people.

[Vinsanity]

Racing heritage helps sell cars in Europe. Has so in the early days of the automobile and still does today. Racing heritage is part of many European brands, mainstream or luxury and it helps shape the perception of the brands.

The racing heritage of Toyota isn't as well known here and the racing heritage of Lexus is...wait...WHAT LEXUS RACING HERITAGE? Rolex Series and GT500? That's about it and that's NOTHING compared to the motorsport heritage of Mercedes, BMW, Audi, Jaguar, Bentley even, hell throw in Fiat, Renault, Lancia etc. in there.

my point was, how important can racing heritage be to a buyer considering a C180 CDI or a BMW 316d? Or someone who feels that V6 sedans in America are overpowered?