Ford Explorer Ecoboost = SUV fail

[GoCougs]

Don't know what to tell you guys - Ford blows at brand management, and has since it dropped the ball on the Escort, Ranger, Explorer and Taurus.

[sparkplug]

Don't know what to tell you guys - Ford blows at brand management, and has since it dropped the ball on the Escort, Ranger, Explorer and Taurus.

they don't sell the escort

[GoCougs]

Except that the Fiesta is not a North American market only car.  It's a bona fide world car (and sells in very large numbers globally).  The development money for a car in that segment had to be spent to maintain competitiveness in world markets, they may as well sell it as many places as they can.  Plus, with the Focus moving up in price, it gives Ford something to offer at a lower price point.  I see quite a few of them out on the road, I suspect they are selling reasonably well.  The money saved by not selling it in North America would not be sufficient to move four other models onto 5-years development cycles.  Although I would point out that the Focus has been on a ~5-6 year development cycle all along.  We didn't see it in America because Ford opted not to give us the C1-based generation, but the car is in its third generation now and has only been around for 13 model years.  But then, you seem to have your blinders on to the fact that Ford (and GM) are global companies and that the US auto market, while significant, is not the only car market in the world.

Development $$$ had to be spent to consider the emissions and safety regs of the US market. True probably not enough to solely keep the other four platforms on proper five-year development cycles but every little bit counts.

Ha, ha. The "second generation" Focus was a warmed over first gen, and when the car started jumping the shark. The market saw through the smoke and mirrors of the "all new" moniker. Remember, the Focus was selling over 200k units/year at one point.

Actually, Ford and GM are much closer to multi-national corporations; the demarcation being that each market more or less has its own division and product. Global companies market the same product in all markets, which Detroit plainly does not do.

[GoCougs]

they don't sell the escort

EXACTLY.

[2o6]

Even so, the Escort was a pretty good car. The Focus came out and ate everyone's lunch....better than the horrid Cavalier and the dated Saturns.

[MX793]

Development $$$ had to be spent to consider the emissions and safety regs of the US market. True probably not enough to solely keep the other four platforms on proper five-year development cycles but every little bit counts.

Ha, ha. The "second generation" Focus was a warmed over first gen, and when the car started jumping the shark. The market saw through the smoke and mirrors of the "all new" moniker. Remember, the Focus was selling over 200k units/year at one point.

Actually, Ford and GM are much closer to multi-national corporations; the demarcation being that each market more or less has its own division and product. Global companies market the same product in all markets, which Detroit plainly does not do.

The true 2nd generation Focus was based on an entirely different platform as the first.  The one Ford sold in the US was not a second generation car, it was a heavily facelifted version of the 1st generation.  Honestly, Ford was stupid to try to warm over the 1st generation instead of giving us the 2nd generation car.

And both Ford and GM are attempting to sell products worldwide rather than having unique markets with unique lineups.  True, there will be some inherent, subtle differences between, say, a Focus sold in the US vs one sold in Mexico or Europe, but it's ultimately cheaper to have one fundamental platform and then make small tweaks than it is to independently develop completely different cars in isolation from other divisions in other markets.

[ifcar]

Ha, ha. The "second generation" Focus was a warmed over first gen, and when the car started jumping the shark. The market saw through the smoke and mirrors of the "all new" moniker. Remember, the Focus was selling over 200k units/year at one point.

Remember, the "jumping the shark" "warmed over" model hit 195k in 2008.

[Colonel Cadillac]

Honestly, Ford was stupid to try to warm over the 1st generation instead of giving us the 2nd generation car.

I believe it had a lot to do with the fact that the European model would have come to the US as a considerably more expensive car than the existing Focus at that time.

[2o6]

I believe it had a lot to do with the fact that the European model would have come to the US as a considerably more expensive car than the existing Focus at that time.

I don't buy that excuse, either. The S40 and Mazda 3 are on the same platform.

[ifcar]

I don't buy that excuse, either. The S40 and Mazda 3 are on the same platform.

Which were both considerably more expensive than the existing Focus at that time. It didn't work for Ford to have an expensive Focus until it had the Fiesta to slot below it.

[Raza]

Hideous, inefficient, and horrible to drive.  Winning combination.

[sparkplug]

it'll sell in the millions.

[GoCougs]

Remember, the "jumping the shark" "warmed over" model hit 195k in 2008.

And then it crashed.

[ifcar]

And then it crashed.

Every car's sales went down at that time, and it has stayed above 150k. (Unlike the Cobalt, which went down and stayed down.)

[hotrodalex]

Ford simply has too many SUV thingies. Of the Explorer, Edge, and Flex, two have to go.

So between the Equinox, Traverse, Tahoe, Suburban, Acadia, Yukon, Terrain, Escalade and SRX, which have to go?

[Atomic]

So between the Equinox, Traverse, Tahoe, Suburban, Acadia, Yukon, Terrain, and SRX, which have to go?

wow, have things changed at GM. it wasn't that long ago the tahoe/yukon were to be replaced by the traverse/acadia and the cadillac escalade version of this popular duo. each of the separate GM platforms seem quite difference than ford's group of crossovers. it's not so much SUVs, rather the edge/MKX, flex/MKT, explore/lincoln version TBA. i wouldn't count the truck-based escape, expedition/navigator in the mix, as they are not tradition SUVs. same with the GM crossovers vs. their "true" SUVs.

[ifcar]

wow, have things changed at GM. it wasn't that long ago the tahoe/yukon were to be replaced by the traverse/acadia and the cadillac escalade version of this popular duo. each of the separate GM platforms seem quite difference than ford's group of crossovers. it's not so much SUVs, rather the edge/MKX, flex/MKT, explore/lincoln version TBA. i wouldn't count the truck-based escape, expedition/navigator in the mix, as they are not tradition SUVs. same with the GM crossovers vs. their "true" SUVs.

Escape isn't truck-based.

[Atomic]

visited my local ford dealership yesterday and sat in a loaded '12 explorer. i was amazed how tight the cabin felt compared to the size of the vehicle. i was impressed with the two tone leather seats. i MYFORD system was frustrating to operate and i was going anywhere. the first BMW i-drive seemed easier. i prefer a car or truck that is simple, straightforward. i cannot imagine trying to make adjustments with a car load of children 

[SVT666]

I hate all the new computerized entertainment systems that are in cars and trucks these days.  Whatever happened to knobs?

[Xer0]

I hate all the new computerized entertainment systems that are in cars and trucks these days.  Whatever happened to knobs?

This is what happened to buttons and knobs

[ifcar]

He said knobs; that's just one knob and a big button that looks like a knob, then ten thousand little buttons.

The officially Correct Dash Design includes five knobs: Stereo volume, stereo tuning, HVAC temperature, HVAC mode and HVAC fan speed. An acceptable variant would include two HVAC temperature knobs for dual-zone climate control.

[Atomic]

good points, above, men. still, the simplicity of knobs that direct airflow, temperature (whether a thermostat or even easier blue-to-read dials) are the easiest for the average joe to understand, imo. yet, as iffy points out, there are other "buttons" that when not so many aren't too difficult to use. the touch screens and other computer controls, even some voice activated ones can be too confusing. some screens that wash out with sunlight and other glares can be dangerous. the vw tiguan i inspected a few weeks ago was stellar to operate.

[SVT666]

I'm not digging the look of the 2016 Explorer at all.

[Payman]

Like I said, I'd rather a real SUV like the Everest, with the 3.2 diesel.

[68_427]

I though it was going to be a total redesign.  This needs a new platform asap.  The interior dimensions are bad mkay

[SVT666]

I though it was going to be a total redesign.  This needs a new platform asap.  The interior dimensions are bad mkay

I heard it was supposed to be a complete redesign and going back to RWD. Rumors were wrong I guess.

[MX793]

I heard it was supposed to be a complete redesign and going back to RWD. Rumors were wrong I guess.

Unless they plan to put it on the F150 chassis, or somehow convert the Mustang platform into a large SUV, they have no RWD platform to base an Explorer on.

[SVT666]

Unless they plan to put it on the F150 chassis, or somehow convert the Mustang platform into a large SUV, they have no RWD platform to base an Explorer on.

For a vehicle that sells as good as the Explorer, a unique platform is not out of the equation.

[2o6]

For a vehicle that sells as good as the Explorer, a unique platform is not out of the equation.

It sells good, but not that damn good.



And idk why anyone would expect a new platform and entirely new car when the current one is selling well, and was only introduced like three years ago

[SVT666]

It sells good, but not that damn good.

North American Sales:
2011 = 145,110
2012 = 174,634
2013 = 203,169
2014 (through October) = 186,067

There are plenty of cars with fewer sales that are on unique or heavy modified platforms that just share a floor pan.

And idk why anyone would expect a new platform and entirely new car when the current one is selling well, and was only introduced like three years ago

2016 would be 5 years.