UPDATE: Return of the Minivan?

[Atomic]

after seeing the shape of the C700 minivan concept that debuted in detroit, i have to agree with mr. kranz...

Soft Now, but the Minivan Market is Going to Boom Again

The Chrysler C700, which was just revealed at the Detroit auto show last week, was a striking example of the unconventional thinking about minivans in Chrysler's studio.

BY:RICK KRANZ

FOR: AUTOMOTIVE NEWS

January 20, 2012 - 3:34 pm ET

The U.S. minivan market is soft today, but I think in a few years it will take off.

First, here's a short recap of 2011.

Last year 524,158 minivans were sold, a modest 4 percent increase from the previous year in an overall market that improved 10 percent. Sales were a far cry from the minivan record set in 2000: 1,371,234.

The battle for minivan supremacy ended last year with a new winner being crowned. A mere 567 vehicles separated the first place and second place finishers. When the dust settled and the sales were tabulated, the Toyota Sienna captured the crown.

Sienna's total, 111,429, is a 13 percent increase over its 2010 pace when Toyota's minivan finished No. 4. Last year's winner, the Chrysler's Town & Country, tumbled to fourth place with 94,320 sales.

The Dodge Grand Caravan ended 2011 in second place with 110,862 sales, followed by the Honda Odyssey at 107,068.

Enough about the past. As for the future, I expect a significant increase in minivan sales this decade -- maybe not a million-plus market, but certainly a few hundred thousand stronger.

Taking chances

That's because automakers will take chances to break away from the traditional, decades-old styling pattern -- and consumers will bite.

Take a look at Honda. Honda took a big a risk with the lightning-bolt beltline of the redesigned Odyssey, and it panned out in aces. The only reason Odyssey wasn't No. 1 last year was likely due to the shortage of parts caused by the March 11 earthquake and tsunami in Japan.

Over at Chrysler, Sergio Marchionne has made it very clear that the next-generation Town & Country will not be confused with minivans of the past. The C700, which was just revealed at the Detroit auto show last week, was a striking example of the unconventional thinking in Chrysler's studio.

Designers have options with roof designs, too. For example, one way to distinguish a minivan might be to adopt a version of the roof featured on the Oldsmobile Vista Cruiser, a popular wagon design from the mid-1960s to 1977.

The Olds' roof was raised several inches over the third-seat area and glass windows were added, giving passengers in the third row a panoramic view of the scenery. The roof was inspired by the 1950s buses General Motors created for Greyhound.

For a minivan, raising the roof above the second and third passenger seats would increase headroom, a common complaint in some minivans today, plus improve exit and entry into the second seat. The seat heights could be raised a little, improving comfort.

That elevated roof would distinguish a minivan plus provide some extra comfort.

This decade, expect the dreaded soccer mom image to fade away as minivan design is reinvented.

[Atomic]

actually, those sales figures above (^) are not bad, especially with the addition of more segment busters and crossovers drawing potential minivan buyers into a different type people mover, i.e., crossover, wagon, SUV. i really like the honda odyssey's new look.

honda took a huge gamble and it is paying off. many bloggers seems to think the company should have taken a more aggressive stance with the 2013 honda accord coupe... well, that is another topic covered in its own post... but connecting the two is two sides:

a do not mess with success attitude or a let's get radical approach. for chrysler, it could be a win-win, especially with the next generation of chrysler T&C and dodge GC taking on their own unique body styles -- a more tradition van for chrysler and a greater departure for the beloved dodge grand caravan (DGC) in the form of a new variation of the ever popular crossover.

[TurboDan]

It could pan out, but it might not. I personally don't see younger mothers wanting the minivan look. Just my .02.

[Atomic]

It could pan out, but it might not. I personally don't see younger mothers wanting the minivan look. Just my .02.

i think the chrysler 700C concept shows the style direction of the next T&C. looking mighty glam (minus the attention seeking window shapes), i bet this vehicle will lure some away from soon to be too crowded crossover choices. well, maybe not a fad, but extremely popular, IMO. the chrysler is something i can see parked at the country club, yacht club, NYCs plaza hotel and the met.

[TurboDan]

i think the chrysler 700C concept shows the style direction of the next T&C. looking mighty glam (minus the attention seeking window shapes), i bet this vehicle will lure some away from soon to be too crowded crossover choices. well, maybe not a fad, but extremely popular, IMO. the chrysler is something i can see parked at the country club, yacht club, NYCs plaza hotel and the met.

Maybe, but it kind of just looks like an R-Class to me. And I always thought the R-Class was kinda ugly.

[ifcar]

Not really related to this thread, but not worth its own: a Washington Post columnist's reflection on minivan ownership.

As I prepare to consign its old and battered body to the grave ? well, to charity ? I?d like to remember my minivan as it once was: young and handsome. But frankly, it wasn?t handsome for very long.

We bought our silver Mazda MPV on the 4th of July, 2000, and just two weeks later, My Lovely Wife spilled a purple Slurpee on the floor between the two front seats, indelibly staining the putty-colored carpet and rudely baptizing the vehicle into the role it would play in our family: as rolling crumb-catcher, juice-box repository, ant-magnet.

Kid carrier.

When you drive a minivan, you announce to the world that you are no longer carefree and cool. And when you drive a Mazda MPV, you announce to the world that you were too cheap to get the Honda Odyssey.

But the minivan was useful. It hauled mulch and dogs and drum sets. It carried countless Girl Scouts. Countless Girl Scout cookies, too.

Continued at link:
http://www.washingtonpost.com/local/an-ode-to-the-banged-up-indelibly-stained-family-minivan/2012/01/20/gIQAHKRHJQ_story.html

[AutobahnSHO]

The minivan sold like crazy cuz there was nothing out there that could compete at the time.

Since, they have become "uncool"- and there are plenty of "alternatives" out there (which can't compete with fuel economy and interior space....)  I don't see it coming back anytime soon.

[CJ]

The minivan sold like crazy cuz there was nothing out there that could compete at the time.

Since, they have become "uncool"- and there are plenty of "alternatives" out there (which can't compete with fuel economy and interior space....)  I don't see it coming back anytime soon.

I don't know...the current crop of vans is pretty cool.  The Quest has an incredible interior, the Odyssey looks strange and is pretty good to drive, the Sienna has a decent interior that is very versatile, and the Grand Caravan and Town & Country have great engines and pretty good interiors, while coming in at a lower cost than the competition.  I know I'd buy a Town & Country if I were in the market for something like that.

[CALL_911]

Return? Seeing how many fucking Siennas clog up the left lane driven by soccer moms on their phones, I wasn't aware they had ever left. That too, if they ever did leave, I wouldn't want to see them return.

[CALL_911]

But I won't dispute their practicality and versatility.

[giant_mtb]

Vans that are used to haul small children around are a PITA to detail.  All the little candies and wrappers and gummy shit gets stuck in the hinges/clasps/etc. that attach the rear seats to the floor. 

[hounddog]

I have never understood how anyone, parent or not, can allow their $40,000+ vehicle to become disgusting and trashy like that.

[cawimmer430]

For those performance-minded folks here who spend so much time at the track...



^It's RWD and is available with an M/T (except in 3.5-l V6 form)!^

Tune it and have fun!

[CJ]

RWD sacrifices practicality compared to the others listed. 

[TurboDan]

RWD sacrifices practicality compared to the others listed. 

An RWD minivan has to be horrible if you live in an area that gets snow.

[2o6]

An RWD minivan has to be horrible if you live in an area that gets snow.

It's probably great when loaded, but crap when unloaded.






Most modern minivans are based upon FWD midsize sedans, and a RWD minivan would defeat the purpose (space).

[giant_mtb]

I have never understood how anyone, parent or not, can allow their $40,000+ vehicle to become disgusting and trashy like that.

Can't say I've detailed a $40,000+ minivan.  Mostly just older, more basic Ford Windstars and Caravans. But yes, I agree...I don't see how anyone can let almost any vehicle get trashed.  But that's just me.

[SVT666]

An RWD minivan has to be horrible if you live in an area that gets snow.

Aerostar was RWD.

[SVT666]

Minivans need to look different before they make a comeback.  Ralph Gilles (styled the Chrysler 300) was tasked with making the minivan sexy and to shed the stigma that has been attached to them, but he was moved to President and CEO of SRT before he got too far along.  The new Quest looks terrible, the Odyssey is a little strange looking, and the Chrysler twins have a downmarket look to them, although the interiors are pretty awesome with the Stow'n Go, backseat table, and multiple screens.  The Sienna would be my pick though with the reclining 2nd row captain's chairs.

[cawimmer430]

RWD sacrifices practicality compared to the others listed. 

Not necessarily in such a big car like a minivan. The driveshaft in this case is well below the interior floor pan. It's not in the way in other words. Have a look. 






The predecessor of the Viano, the V-Class, was FWD.

[ifcar]

But the cargo floor is probably higher than it would have to be in a front-driver.

[CJ]

Not necessarily in such a big car like a minivan. The driveshaft in this case is well below the interior floor pan. It's not in the way in other words. Have a look. 


The predecessor of the Viano, the V-Class, was FWD.

For one, there's no underfloor storage, or any other real storage.  That's absolutely crucial in the minivan market. 

[cawimmer430]

But the cargo floor is probably higher than it would have to be in a front-driver.

For one, there's no underfloor storage, or any other real storage.  That's absolutely crucial in the minivan market. 

FWD V-Class interior:

[ifcar]

Does it have one of these:

[cawimmer430]

Does it have one of these:

I am not sure. My searches came up empty. I don't think the V-Class had that nor did the Viano, but they might have small pouches and storage enclaves in the back on the side IIRC.


Viano

[ifcar]

The extra space, plus not having to remove the seats, is a huge plus for the vans we get.

[cawimmer430]

The extra space, plus not having to remove the seats, is a huge plus for the vans we get.

Now I found some images. Google functions in weird ways.  


Viano





Looks like they don't have that. IIRC there were some storage enclaves in the seats and in the side walls though. Need to check in person.

But hey, who cares about this trivial crap when the important thing is that the Viano is RWD and you can drift on a racetrack with it!!!  

[SVT32V]

Minivans need to look different before they make a comeback.  Ralph Gilles (styled the Chrysler 300) was tasked with making the minivan sexy and to shed the stigma that has been attached to them, but he was moved to President and CEO of SRT before he got too far along.  The new Quest looks terrible, the Odyssey is a little strange looking, and the Chrysler twins have a downmarket look to them, although the interiors are pretty awesome with the Stow'n Go, backseat table, and multiple screens.  The Sienna would be my pick though with the reclining 2nd row captain's chairs.

Lucky for him he was moved, that is an impossible task.

[AutobahnSHO]

Love how they "hide" the adults' legs so it looks like they all fit there..

IMHO they need to stop trying to "HIDE" the minivan shape but capitalize on the space available. Make them look more spacious on the outside. Make them look more sleek.

[Laconian]

That's how high powered business gets done in Europe. In the back of a minivan.