Brought home a Volt.

[Morris Minor]

Where do you guys think the future lies, between plugin hybrids (Volt, Prius etc) and Tesla/Leaf-type pure electrics?

[CALL_911]

I don't know if I see EVs taking over, but if they were to, I'd put my money on plug-in hybrids.

[Cookie Monster]

If Tesla can get a good system of Superchargers going I can see that taking over.

[NomisR]

Inductive charging is quite inefficient however.

Better yet, just make the road inductive.. so you don't even have to have a big battery... assuming the it can recharge at a rate faster than you can use

[NomisR]

Sadly, I thought about it a few times, and my choice would be the Camry hybrid. It almost seems like a "what blunt object would you choose to kill yourself with?" type of question, but to be honest, if I weren't a car guy, I'd probably be driving a Camry hybrid...

MKZ Hybrid with spinners would fit your style more though. 

[NomisR]

If Tesla can get a good system of Superchargers going I can see that taking over.

Charging still takes too long, I can't see myself sitting around for an hour in a long road trip waiting for my car to charge.

And if electric becomes standards, something like a trip from LA to Vegas, the charging stations would be so packed, it would not be funny. 

[Raza]

Where do you guys think the future lies, between plugin hybrids (Volt, Prius etc) and Tesla/Leaf-type pure electrics?

The future is fuel cell.  Until then, plug-in hybrids, or as I will from now on call them GEVs are a much better solution for people who live in the real world.

[veeman]

electric mass transit including buses with only the very rich being able to afford personal electric cars and the high tolls associated with their use on public roads

i predict this scenario two generations from now. 

global climate change and associated food and fresh water shortages will force drastic reductions in our carbon footprint.

[Raza]

electric mass transit including buses with only the very rich being able to afford personal electric cars and the high tolls associated with their use on public roads

i predict this scenario two generations from now. 

global climate change and associated food and fresh water shortages will force drastic reductions in our carbon footprint.

Wow, that's very pessimistic.  You think that'll happen in 40 years?  Mass transit throughout the entire US?  Not unless our population quadruples at the very least. 

[GoCougs]

Better yet, just make the road inductive.. so you don't even have to have a big battery... assuming the it can recharge at a rate faster than you can use

Imagine how much copper that would be though...

[SVT666]

electric mass transit including buses with only the very rich being able to afford personal electric cars and the high tolls associated with their use on public roads

i predict this scenario two generations from now. 

global climate change and associated food and fresh water shortages will force drastic reductions in our carbon footprint.

I don't think you are too far off.  But I think people will be forced into working from home and nobody will ever see daylight or speak to people.  I also think it will be 3 generations and not 2.

[hotrodalex]

Best version I can see is pure EVs that have easy-change batteries. Battery stations would replace gas stations, and they would have attendants change out your battery in about the same time it takes to fill a gas tank. The station could then recharge the used batteries.

If our power grid can be converted to nuclear and renewable resources (solar, wind, hydro) then the system would be 100% green. Just need technology advances in the battery sector and of course make renewable-resource power plants more viable. (nuclear fusion would be great)

[MrH]

The point is, it has a gas engine so how far do you go on the gas you're using in the gas engine? That's how far. It's not disingenuous at all. It's simply a measure of how far you went and how much gasoline you used to do it. You won't see that sort of readout on a pure EV as they don't have gas engines that run occasionally. Yesterday, because I put it in hold mode to hit the highway, I was running the gas engine quite a bit and the readout said 89 mpg. Because that's what I got for that trip.

If you put it in pure EV mode and compare cost of a KWH to gallons of gas, then, at present rates, you're going 40 miles on 80 cents worth of electricity, giving the equivalent of 120-150 mpg as far as costs go for the EV portion of the use. But since it can't know how much electricity costs, it can't calculate that out and give it to you. Only how far you went and how much gas you used doing it.


Possibly. I calcualted it out, if I ONLY commuted in the car daily, I'd only run on EV mode and the gas engine would only run to keep things warm and use up the fuel in the tank (it's programmed to run throough a tank of gas per year in order to keep the fuel from going bad). Doing so would net me the equivalent of 1200 mpg. the readout would never show that, however, so maybe a version of the software that would read actual calculated equivalencies would be popular with the hypermilers and geeks on the Volt forums. I dunno. I don't really care, as long as I'm barely using gasoline (especially as gas prices rise this summer).

So give me two readouts: miles/kwh and miles/gallon. When you're running full on electricity, you should have great gas mileage, but a decrease in miles/kwh.

You can't completely dismiss the electricity you're using.  But they're not even just dismissing the electricity, they're counting it towards the MPG calculation.  That's some BS marketing.

[Cookie Monster]

So give me two readouts: miles/kwh and miles/gallon. When you're running full on electricity, you should have great gas mileage, but a decrease in miles/kwh.

You can't completely dismiss the electricity you're using.  But they're not even just dismissing the electricity, they're counting it towards the MPG calculation.  That's some BS marketing.

I think they should only count the miles driven when the gas engine is on towards the MPG. Don't count the miles driven on pure electric power.

[Laconian]

It's disingenuous because people naively use MPGs as a proxy for energy efficiency, and the Volt plays upon this misunderstanding by applying a very glib interpretation of "this is how much sloshy liquid I consume per mile". It's technically correct, but the nerd in me feels that the stat is taking your average Joe for a ride.

[MrH]

I think even plain gas engines have a long way to go.  When you get cars driving autonomously and communicating with each other, intersections will just become precise criss crossing of cars all over the place.  Cars will be able to "train" together to reduce drag significantly.

These are the big changes coming.  Everything starts falling in line.  When cars can park themselves, is size and shape of a car as big of a concern?  More aerodynamic shapes.  If everything is autonomous, do you need all the crash worthiness if cars aren't crashing?  You're going to get super light, living rooms on wheels, shaped like tear drops.

All of a sudden, 50 mpg city, 80-90 mpg highway will be realistic, easily.  I wouldn't be surprised if 100 mpg is cracked pretty easily.  As weight decreases more and more, energy density of your fuel and power density become incredibly important.  Do you really need these heavy, nature harming, complex batteries and powertrains anymore?

[Laconian]

Autonomous cars will unlock massive gains by themselves. Our traffic grid functions by people's ability to brake to a complete stop. Autonomous cars mean a smooth continuous flow of cars, with much less unnecessary braking.

[hotrodalex]

That's some BS marketing.

Does it really matter?

[hotrodalex]

I think even plain gas engines have a long way to go.  When you get cars driving autonomously and communicating with each other, intersections will just become precise criss crossing of cars all over the place.  Cars will be able to "train" together to reduce drag significantly.

These are the big changes coming.  Everything starts falling in line.  When cars can park themselves, is size and shape of a car as big of a concern?  More aerodynamic shapes.  If everything is autonomous, do you need all the crash worthiness if cars aren't crashing?  You're going to get super light, living rooms on wheels, shaped like tear drops.

All of a sudden, 50 mpg city, 80-90 mpg highway will be realistic, easily.  I wouldn't be surprised if 100 mpg is cracked pretty easily.  As weight decreases more and more, energy density of your fuel and power density become incredibly important.  Do you really need these heavy, nature harming, complex batteries and powertrains anymore?

Absolutely gas cars have a lot of potential for improvement. Still use gas, though.

I guess that isn't much of a problem if we can bio-engineer those bacteria or microbes to produce ethanol. I believe that's still green, too, since it would just be cycling the carbon from the air to the microbe to fuel and then back to the air.

[Cookie Monster]

I think even plain gas engines have a long way to go.  When you get cars driving autonomously and communicating with each other, intersections will just become precise criss crossing of cars all over the place.  Cars will be able to "train" together to reduce drag significantly.

These are the big changes coming.  Everything starts falling in line.  When cars can park themselves, is size and shape of a car as big of a concern?  More aerodynamic shapes.  If everything is autonomous, do you need all the crash worthiness if cars aren't crashing?  You're going to get super light, living rooms on wheels, shaped like tear drops.

All of a sudden, 50 mpg city, 80-90 mpg highway will be realistic, easily.  I wouldn't be surprised if 100 mpg is cracked pretty easily.  As weight decreases more and more, energy density of your fuel and power density become incredibly important.  Do you really need these heavy, nature harming, complex batteries and powertrains anymore?

I would be scared that a hacker could somehow control all these cars and cause a mass killing spree or something.

[Laconian]

Does it really matter?

Kind of. My worry is that this type of stuff will create a marketing arms race where everybody will strive to compete with the meangingless buzzwords and metrics because they are showier, and the stuff that actually matters loses out (maybe miles per gigajoule? )

This totally happened with the word "cloud". Everything's fucking cloud this cloud that now. Marketers have watered it down to absolutely nothing.

[Laconian]

I would be scared that a hackersenior citizen could somehow control all these cars and cause a mass killing spree at a farmer's market or something.

[MrH]

Absolutely gas cars have a lot of potential for improvement. Still use gas, though.

I guess that isn't much of a problem if we can bio-engineer those bacteria or microbes to produce ethanol. I believe that's still green, too, since it would just be cycling the carbon from the air to the microbe to fuel and then back to the air.

What's wrong with using gas?  Most energy sources today are fossil fuels:huh:  Sure, decreasing the use is great, but this idea that we need to get completely away from fossil fuels is not realistic.

[hotrodalex]

Kind of. My worry is that this type of stuff will create a marketing arms race where everybody will strive to compete with the meangingless buzzwords and metrics because they are showier, and the stuff that actually matters loses out (maybe miles per gigajoule? )

This totally happened with the word "cloud". Everything's fucking cloud this cloud that now. Marketers have watered it down to absolutely nothing.

In the en, it might be mildly annoying, but nothing more.

[hotrodalex]

What's wrong with using gas?  Most energy sources today are fossil fuels:huh:  Sure, decreasing the use is great, but this idea that we need to get completely away from fossil fuels is not realistic.

If we're gonna talk future tech, the current fossil fuel situation isn't ideal. Prices are constantly going up, oil is a big factor in international politics, and of course there's that whole global warming thing. I love gasoline, but continuing to drill it out of the earth isn't the best long term solution. The bacteria solution is cool, since it would mean I can still have a big gas/ethanol V8.

[NomisR]

electric mass transit including buses with only the very rich being able to afford personal electric cars and the high tolls associated with their use on public roads

i predict this scenario two generations from now. 

global climate change and associated food and fresh water shortages will force drastic reductions in our carbon footprint.

Before that happens, there would likely be a war for supplies that would kill off tons of people to help curb the overpopulation problem, and hence resulting in lower "carbon footprint".  And the fact that solar activities is suppose to die down should lower global temperatures too.

[NomisR]

Imagine how much copper that would be though...

not to mention the effects of the electromagnetic radiation on the human body if this ever happens.

[Vinsanity]

MKZ Hybrid with spinners would fit your style more though. 

I won't lie; I'd probably rock a donked out Prius just for the lulz. And I'd be enjoying every minute of it

Actually, I remember seeing a murdered-out Prius in the Micro Center parking lot one day and thought that it was the coolest Prius I'd ever seen.

[NomisR]

The future is fuel cell.  Until then, plug-in hybrids, or as I will from now on call them GEVs are a much better solution for people who live in the real world.

I'm so tempted in leasing myself a FCX Clarity if it's still available since I live close enough to Honda HQ and Hydrogen stations around.   This seems really appealing though

http://reviews.cnet.com/8301-13746_7-57406767-48/hondas-fcx-clarity-can-power-a-home-for-6-days/

You can use the car to power your home for 6 days if there's ever a power outage.  And an at home hydrogen generating station can generate enough hydrogen to take you 90 miles and is really renewable considering the only input is the sun and water.. and until the sun dies or water runs out, this seems like a really good idea. 

Yet, there's really no talk about this at all.... and our stupid government is trying to push electric?  This makes 100% more sense.

[veeman]

Wow, that's very pessimistic.  You think that'll happen in 40 years?  Mass transit throughout the entire US?  Not unless our population quadruples at the very least. 

a generation is usually defined as 30 years, so yes 60 years from now i see this happening.  in the u.s. there is no money for basic infrastructure maintenance much less improvement.  it takes them months these days to make an extra onramp/offramp and years to make an extra lane.  forget about actually constructing a new highway or bridge.  the resulting gridlock will only get worse every year making it in 1 decade unsustainable.  easy solution is to make it too expensive for people to drive and be forced to take mass transit in major population hubs.  electric vehicle technology will be advanced enough that i see no reason for mass transit vehicles to run on gas. 

60 years is a long long time.  20 years ago very few people had a cell phone.  and no one thought the weather was getting warmer.