Lebowski's New Car Thread

[Lebowski]

How do you get the 325 at only $34-$35k, 850?  I optioned it out earlier today and it came out more like $39k.  I think that included the sport package and metallic paint, though.

[TBR]

It will let me build a IS250 6MT with nav, but the sticker comes to $38,895, hardly a roaring value especially considering its relatively low hp numbers (granted, the A4 2.0t has less power, but its numbers far exceed what you would think considering its specifications, even a Quattro model should be able to outrun an IS250).

I think you're looking at an IS350.

EDIT:  Maybe not, if it's got all that Mark Levinson crap that drives the price up.

Nope, it was definitely an IS250.

[850CSi]

How do you get the 325 at only $34-$35k, 850?  I optioned it out earlier today and it came out more like $39k.  I think that included the sport package and metallic paint, though.

With sport package, metallic paint, and i-Drive (but no premium package) it came out to  around $35K.

But you really don't need the sport package in the Bimmer (unless you really want the bigger rims). So I guess you could substitute that for Premium package.


I don't know about other manufacturers, but BMW is dealing on these things. I got $1500 off of MSRP and mine's a base model.

Audi has incredible lease deals, BTW...

I was able to get something like $360/month with no down payment for a 2.0T worth around $33.5K.




Honestly, it sounds like you want value and the G35 is probably your best bet. It really is amazing how expensive the Bimmer gets with options...
I feel really good about paying under $31K for the 325i.

And honestly, I have yet to drive anything that I really feel matches my 325i in its balance of drive, luxury (the interior in black with wood trim is really audi-esque... it's that impressive), and engine. But that's me, and I am biased.

[850CSi]

I just loaded a 325i with every option on the list... $48K.

Yikes!

[thewizard16]

Toyota has the most screwed up options and packaging by region ever.  Trying to get a new Tacoma when they first came out for my dad with everything he wanted was a nightmare.  Took a few hours with the dealership just trying to make sense of it all.  I think we actually got one from another region in the end.

So what about the Mazdaspeed6, Lebowski?

Agreed. I ordered my Camry from another region to get the features I wanted, and my uncle had his Tacoma shipped in from Utah or some such place to Iowa to get a specific configuration.  

[thewizard16]

It will let me build a IS250 6MT with nav, but the sticker comes to $38,895, hardly a roaring value especially considering its relatively low hp numbers (granted, the A4 2.0t has less power, but its numbers far exceed what you would think considering its specifications, even a Quattro model should be able to outrun an IS250).

I think you're looking at an IS350.

EDIT:  Maybe not, if it's got all that Mark Levinson crap that drives the price up.

Nope, it was definitely an IS250.

I just built a 250 RWD Manual with the NAV/premium package combo, and it's $34,420.  

[TBR]

Different packages I guess.  

[SJ_GTI]

From what you have said so far it sounds like the G35 is your best bet. Its definitely the best value for your $$$ if you want RWD/AWD.

That being said I have to ask if you really need the Nav system...? Its a big downside for the A4 IMHO, otherwise I would say an A4 2.0T would be a nice car for you.

I built an A4 2.0T with sunroof/leather package, premium package, tech package,  plus sport suspension and headlight washers for 36,360. You should be able to negotiate that to 35k even I would think.

Couple things to keep in mind:

A4 comes standard with 6-disc CD changer (in-dash), 10 speakers + 1 subwoofer, and satellite radio pre-wired. The sound package is a waste of money, and if you get the nav system you lose the in-dash 6-disc CD player anyway.

If you absolutely want a Nav system I would suggest writing the A4 and 3-er (and maybe even the IS) off your list automatically. They will just be bad deals for the money. The G35, TL, and 9-3 are going to be your value leaders in this class.

PS. The above is basically how my car came equipped, nd I didn't order it or anything. Its probably a standard configuration for the A4 2.0T.

[850CSi]

If you're gonna get the A4, you gotta get the sport package. Compared to even my ex-'99, the non-sportpackage '06 A4 was very soft and had too much body roll.

I still think the 325i is the car to buy, but if you're looking for NAV and power for a good value, go for the G35.

[SJ_GTI]

If you're gonna get the A4, you gotta get the sport package. Compared to even my ex-'99, the non-sportpackage '06 A4 was very soft and had too much body roll.

I still think the 325i is the car to buy, but if you're looking for NAV and power for a good value, go for the G35.

A4 doesn't have a sport package anymore. The 17's come with the premium package and the sport suspension is a stand-alone option (250  bucks!). I agree its a "must buy" option...at 250 its really a no-brainer unless you like a floaty ride.

[850CSi]

Wow, that's cheap...

What kind of confused me is that we drove a manual version without sport package... I'm thinking that's a combination few would like. If you want a manual A4 you're obviously going for sport.

And I don't know why, but black just doesn't work with Audi interiors.

[Lebowski]

Wow, that's cheap...

What kind of confused me is that we drove a manual version without sport package... I'm thinking that's a combination few would like. If you want a manual A4 you're obviously going for sport.

And I don't know why, but black just doesn't work with Audi interiors.

The sport package on its own is cheap, but they nail you with all the other options.  Either way, I could have sworn I priced an '05 a couple months ago and got it loaded for ~$37k, now a comparably equipped A4 is more like $39k.  If you don't care about the gadgety stuff like bluetooth and nav you can probably get away at a reasonably low price, though.  

Also, they still sort of have a sport package.  It's called the "s-line" package and includes 18 inch wheels, I think everything else is trim related.  It's nice, but a ripoff at $3k.

[SJ_GTI]

Wow, that's cheap...

What kind of confused me is that we drove a manual version without sport package... I'm thinking that's a combination few would like. If you want a manual A4 you're obviously going for sport.

And I don't know why, but black just doesn't work with Audi interiors.

The sport package on its own is cheap, but they nail you with all the other options.  Either way, I could have sworn I priced an '05 a couple months ago and got it loaded for ~$37k, now a comparably equipped A4 is more like $39k.  If you don't care about the gadgety stuff like bluetooth and nav you can probably get away at a reasonably low price, though.  

Also, they still sort of have a sport package.  It's called the "s-line" package and includes 18 inch wheels, I think everything else is trim related.  It's nice, but a ripoff at $3k.

The S-line package isn't new or anyhing. They had it for my model as well. Its basically just an S4 bodykit with larger wheels and firmer suspension. Whether its "worth it" or not is up to any person, but I agree I wouldn't get it.

The "sport package" that I got on my car was larger wheels and a lower/firmer suspension, which is still available, but you would have to get the premium package to get the larger wheels. Personally I think the premium package is worth it. Like I said before the only options I would skip on an A4 would be the Nav and Sound package.

You should be able to get an A4 3.2 6MT for ~38-39k after negotiation IMHO, but again you would have to skip the Nav system.

[Raza]

RX-8 fully loaded with Nav is like 35K.  

[NomisR]

RX-8 fully loaded with Nav is like 35K.

Well, mine fully loaded with all the factory body kit parts, etc was actually less than that out of the door.  But drive it first... once you go rotary, you'll forget about the other cars.  Piston engines are just too crude!    

[Raza]

RX-8 fully loaded with Nav is like 35K.

Well, mine fully loaded with all the factory body kit parts, etc was actually less than that out of the door.  But drive it first... once you go rotary, you'll forget about the other cars.  Piston engines are just too crude!  

The one at the dealership that I drove was 32K, and they were letting me have it for 26K.  Not bad at all, if you ask me.  No better car out there for 26K.

[Lebowski]

Well I just got back from my second full day of test driving.  Comments:

Acura TSX:  Didn't get to drive it - the dealership didn't have a single TSX on the lot.   :angry:

Acura TL:  Drove it, and it was pretty much as expected (as a side note, I test drove both the TL and TSX about a year ago so I had an idea what to expect).  They only had an auto model, so that's what I got stuck driving.  I like the interior alot, there's good interior space, a big trunk, and the fit and finish is pretty good.  But, I could definately feel the drawbacks of FWD.  The bottom line is, I didn't like the way it drives as well as the G35, 3-series, or IS.

As a side note, the only Acura dealership in the area is pretty far away, and it's in the opposite direction from where I work.  It's also in a pretty crappy area with lots of traffic.  So that is a definate negative, I definately wouldn't want to ever take my car there for service on a morning before work, that would be a huge pain.

Lexus IS250:  I could unfortunately only drive the IS250 w/ an auto.  The only IS350 on the lot that wasn't sold was "going to a car show" (whatever that means), the guy showing me the car tried to finagle the keys but his boss wouldn't let us take the 350 for a drive.  That said, I liked the way it (the IS250) drives, it was a little on the slow side compared to the G35 or 3-series but that problem of course would be fixed with the IS350.  The paddle shifters weren't bad - definately not as good as a stick, but not bad.  The interior quality is pretty good with a few exceptions like plastic painted to look like metal (which BTW is something I HATE, I hate the addition of anything fake inside a car, including fake wood, but I particularly hate fake metal.  How much does aluminum cost?  $.90 a lb, that's how much.  Wow I'm really glad you saved that $2.50 on a $39k car, Lexus!   :angry: ).  The front seat is comfortable and has enough room, the back seat is a little on the small side but it's not that bad (I'd say comparable to the A4).  The trunk was surprsingly small.  One other detail is that the visability out the back isn't very good - the mirrors provide pretty good visability but every time I turned my head to check the blind spot I couldn't see shit.  All in all, I'd like to drive the IS350 before making a decision, but so far it's still in the running, I'd say it's about neck and neck with the G35 assuming I decide to go the "practical" route (see below for more on that).

G35 Coupe Manual:  The reason I drove this was more to get a feel for the transmission than for the coupe (recall I could only drive the sedan in auto form).  I liked the manual, although not as much as the manual in the A4.  Driving the car definately reminded me that I like the feel of the G35.  Also, since I drove it right after the IS250 auto, it also reminded me how much I like driving a manual.  As I said before, the lack of a manual isn't necessarily a deal breaker for the IS, but it's a definate handicap.  When I got back to the dealership, the salesman (didn't get the same woman as last time) was a douchebag and tried to talk me into buying a car today even though I told him up front I wasn't going to and then he tried to explain to me why leasing is better than buying even though I told him I don't need any personal finance advice from a fucking car salesman (I was slightly more polite than that, but not much   ).  Anyway, that's besides the point - the point is the G35 manual is definately still a major contendor.

Vette Coupe:  I had to do it.  After testing the G35, I told myself "just go home now, Lebowski", but my truck grew a mind of its own and drove itself over to the Chevy dealership.  Honestly, I couldn't stop it.  I test drove an '05 silver vette coupe w/ an auto (they didn't have any manuals  :angry:  Does nobody drive manuals anymore?).  I definately liked  the vette.  It almost made me forget how much I liked the G35 and the IS.  The truth is, I should get a 4-door, and the vette is more than I should spend, but I don't absolutely need 4 doors and it's not more than I can spend.  It really comes down to how much self control I have.  I actually spoke to my dad about it earlier this week and, given that he's usually the voice of reason, I totally expected him to tell me not to consider it, but even he was like "you're only 25 and single once, this is the time to do it".  So, it's something to think about.  If I did end up getting one, it would probably be a black manual coupe Z51 w/ the competition gray wheels, I'm not sure what options I'd add (nav wouldn't be a must, I'd still probably like a good sound system and satellite radio).

So the bottom line is, the decision at this point is pretty much between the G35 sedan w/ a manual and the IS350, with the vette sort of lingering in the back of my mind wrestling to overcome my self control (and it just might win).  Truthfully, my bonus would have to surprise on the upside to seriously consider the vette, and if that happens I may also take a look at the M35/M45.  So the thread at this point should primarily focus on the attributes between the G35 vs. the IS350, but any comments attempting to either talk me in or out of getting a vette are also welcome.

[SaltyDog]

Vette   Just do it.  Don't feel bad.  Go with your heart.  You only live once.  

[Secret Chimp]

Just forget about practicality and buy whatever is going to get you the most ya-ya's without being too encumbering otherwise. Borrow a friend's wagon if you need to take home a new microwave or something =P

[giant_mtb]

If you can afford a Vette now...do it now...because what if you never have the chance to get one again?  :o    

[Secret Chimp]

How do you get the 325 at only $34-$35k, 850?  I optioned it out earlier today and it came out more like $39k.  I think that included the sport package and metallic paint, though.

I configured one the way I'd like (frugally) and came out at $32,665. Alpine white/beige leatherette/walnut trim (no extra cost there), cold weather package for $1000 (need that pass-through), and a $70 rubber trunk mat. The sport package is mostly just wheels and seats, the latter I could get for cheaper via aftermarket if I wanted to, and the former I don't need that badly.

[Lebowski]

How do you get the 325 at only $34-$35k, 850?  I optioned it out earlier today and it came out more like $39k.  I think that included the sport package and metallic paint, though.

I configured one the way I'd like (frugally) and came out at $32,665. Alpine white/beige leatherette/walnut trim (no extra cost there), cold weather package for $1000 (need that pass-through), and a $70 rubber trunk mat. The sport package is mostly just wheels and seats, the latter I could get for cheaper via aftermarket if I wanted to, and the former I don't need that badly.

Yeah, I can see that you can get away with a 325 for a reasonable price.  My beef with the 3-series is that, IMO a luxury car should have things like leather seats and a good sound system.  Plus, since I can have all those things and still have a more powerful engine in a G35, why should I go without them?  IMO, the 3-series isn't that much better than a G35 to warrant either 1) a huge price premium or 2) foregoing all the extras for comparable price.

[Secret Chimp]

You might want to give a Legacy 2.5 GT Limited a try. You can option it pretty well and have it come  in below a G35.

[850CSi]

How do you get the 325 at only $34-$35k, 850?  I optioned it out earlier today and it came out more like $39k.  I think that included the sport package and metallic paint, though.

I configured one the way I'd like (frugally) and came out at $32,665. Alpine white/beige leatherette/walnut trim (no extra cost there), cold weather package for $1000 (need that pass-through), and a $70 rubber trunk mat. The sport package is mostly just wheels and seats, the latter I could get for cheaper via aftermarket if I wanted to, and the former I don't need that badly.

Yeah, I can see that you can get away with a 325 for a reasonable price.  My beef with the 3-series is that, IMO a luxury car should have things like leather seats and a good sound system.  Plus, since I can have all those things and still have a more powerful engine in a G35, why should I go without them?  IMO, the 3-series isn't that much better than a G35 to warrant either 1) a huge price premium or 2) foregoing all the extras for comparable price.

The stock sound system in the 3-Series has 2 subwoofers (Mine sounds better than the Bose Premium in my ex-A4), and the Logic7 is absolutely insane.

BMW Leatherette is nearly identical to BMW leather.

The 3-Series is going to hold its value a lot better than any other car in its class. Look what 2004s are selling for... It's ridiculous.


And it handles better than any other car in its class without the Sport Package.





Of course, if you really want a 0-60 time less than a second faster to 60 (but with 200 more lbs to move), go for the G35.



Just a few opinions from a resident BMW troll who really thinks his 325i was a bargain.




But, of course, there are certain cars that somehow just appeal to us differently (Kind of like how I really would take my 325i over a lot of 'better' cars... I just feel there's nothing I would like more)

[TBR]

Like to note that G35s have very good resale value as well.

[mazda6er]

My turn to be the voice of reason, I guess. IMO, don't go for the Vette...not right now at least. Obviously a four-door, five-seat car is going to be more practical for you than a two-seater, but that's a given. You've got to consider: what if you want to go somewhere with more than one person? You've got to ride in someone else's car. What if you all the sudden get married and decide you want kids? You've got to sell the Vette. What if you end up moving up north? I doubt you'd want to drive it in the winter. You know, all the usual arguments against a sports car...etc. But really, these situations could very possibly come into play. If it was me, I'd save the sports car for retirement and go with the luxury sedan for right now. You sound like you're a successful businessman, so it's not as though you won't have the means to buy one later in your life. Additionaly, it sounds like you'd be stretching your budget a bit if you were to buy the Vette now. It's never good to have to rely on a surprisingly good bonus to justify/cover a purchase. You shouldn't cut it that close.

Obviously you know your situation better than me, but that's just my 2 cents.  Good luck with the decision. :)

[850CSi]

Like to note that G35s have very good resale value as well.

Kind of.. But nothing like the 3er's.


I just looked up auction sales on 2004 G35s and 2004 325i's, as an example.

For cars with similar mileage, the 325s were getting an average of around $2K-$3K more than the G35s. (G35s around the $22K range, 325i's around the $24.5K range)

That's a good 8-10% difference on average out of the original MSRP (Let's say $33K for both) over just two years..


It's not that the G35 doesn't have good resale... It's that the 3-Series' resale value is ridiculous...

Think about it... I bought my car for $5K more (rand-new and a new bodystyle ) than a 2-year old used 325i (Old bodystyle and a car that isn't as good as the new one in any way). That's absolutely ridiculous. That means I can drive my car for over 2 years and sell it for $3K less than I bought it (private party) if I keep it in good condition and average mileage.

[Lebowski]

My turn to be the voice of reason, I guess. IMO, don't go for the Vette...not right now at least. Obviously a four-door, five-seat car is going to be more practical for you than a two-seater, but that's a given. You've got to consider: what if you want to go somewhere with more than one person? You've got to ride in someone else's car. What if you all the sudden get married and decide you want kids? You've got to sell the Vette. What if you end up moving up north? I doubt you'd want to drive it in the winter. You know, all the usual arguments against a sports car...etc. But really, these situations could very possibly come into play. If it was me, I'd save the sports car for retirement and go with the luxury sedan for right now. You sound like you're a successful businessman, so it's not as though you won't have the means to buy one later in your life. Additionaly, it sounds like you'd be stretching your budget a bit if you were to buy the Vette now. It's never good to have to rely on a surprisingly good bonus to justify/cover a purchase. You shouldn't cut it that close.

Obviously you know your situation better than me, but that's just my 2 cents.? Good luck with the decision. :)

Thanks, good to know someone around here is the voice of reason  

Now, for my rebuttal:

Getting married and having kids?  Not going to happen any time even remotely soon, so not a concern.  If it did happen, let's say 3 years out, I could always get something like a TSX and keep the vette as a second car.

Going somewhere with multiple people:  I don't really mind if someone else drives.  Besides, half the time when I'm going out w/ more than one person it's going out drinking, and I certainly don't mind having an excuse not to be the DD  

Moving up north?  1) highly unlikely and 2) if I did move up north it would most likely be to NYC, in which case I'd probably have to sell my car regardless of what it is.

Your other points are valid though, and I've considered them.  It is true that I'll probably be able to afford a car like this as a second car at some point in the future.  And, it is stretching my budget in the sense that it's more than I originally planned on spending for a new car.

[ifcar]

Furthermore, if you do get married and have kids, what are the odds that your wife wouldn't bring a 5-passenger vehicle into your household?

[mazda6er]

Furthermore, if you do get married and have kids, what are the odds that your wife wouldn't bring a 5-passenger vehicle into your household?

If you think about it, both parents should really have a passenger car if they have a little kid.

But that's a moot point because he says that won't happen soon anyway.  :)