need suggests for new truck or SUV

[Tave]

As much as I love the idea of a Land Rover, I haven't personally met anyone who had a positive ownership experience in a used Disco.

[AutobahnSHO]

This is just as reliable:
http://columbia.craigslist.org/cto/4817037924.html
Best part is the spare tire

I like my timing belts covered, thank you

[Rupert]

What is the newest model you've driven? The old ones were punishing and uncomfortable on-road, the new ones are light years ahead and could even be called comfortable (the body roll does take a little getting used to).

2007 or 08.

Good relative to the older models is a pretty low benchmark.

[Tave]

2007 or 08.

Good relative to the older models is a pretty low benchmark.

I didn't say "good relative to" I said "light years ahead of."

They ride just like any other modern SUV minus the body roll. Turn-in and steering feel is better than any.

The cheap interior is a legit criticism. Other than that I think your problem is more with the Jeepbros and less with the actual vehicle.

[Rupert]

broJeepers are a bonus.

"Minus the body roll" is a pretty big handling trait to just shrug off like that. They also respond to larger bumps at speed in a marginally scary way. Finally, not only is the interior bad  quality to interact with, but there is a ton of wind noise and road noise. It's a pretty marginally tolerable place to be.

[Tave]

broJeepers are a bonus.

"Minus the body roll" is a pretty big handling trait to just shrug off like that.

It doesn't affect the handling; it's just a motion that you don't come across much nowadays so it takes a little bit to get used to.

They also respond to larger bumps at speed in a marginally scary way. Finally, not only is the interior bad  quality to interact with, but there is a ton of wind noise and road noise. It's a pretty marginally tolerable place to be.

I haven't noticed any bump steer, and don't think the NVH is as bad as you do, both objectively speaking and considering the tradeoff (you get a removeable top).

I get a big shit-eating grin on my face every time I drive one. Never would have taken you for such an interior-snob given your penchant for 30+ year old vehicles. 

Also, could anything possibly be more masochistic (for a tall guy) than your Exploder?

[Rupert]

It doesn't affect the handling; it's just a motion that you don't come across much nowadays so it takes a little bit to get used to.

I haven't noticed any bump steer, and don't think the NVH is as bad as you do, both objectively speaking and considering the tradeoff (you get a removeable top).

I get a big shit-eating grin on my face every time I drive one. Never would have taken you for such an interior-snob given your penchant for 30+ year old vehicles. 

If you want to lump massive body roll in with ride instead of handling, fine, but this is a minor distinction.

Not bump steer, bump-a-wump-wump like a '90s Buick. The roof is a major offender of NVH, but so are the doors and just about everything else.

Being that I like old cars, the fact I hate this new car for NVH and handling issues should tell you something about it, right there.

I will grant you two points: 1) It's the best thing there is for low-speed off-pavement driving; 2) The roof is pretty cool. If all you want to do it drive it around town/the beach and 45 minutes to the woods (where for some reason a Jeep is necessary? sure, why not), alright. If you want to take it on longer drives, use it to haul stuff, use it on higher-speed gravel roads, or anything else, tres horrible.

[Rupert]

Explorer fits me fine, certainly better than a Jeep!

It's also 15 years old, cheap, and has a number of other high points in its favor (ride, OK NVH, tons of space, AC and cruise, I can sleep in the back). I fully admit it's shortcomings (mileage, pretty terrible interior, engine from a tractor, red).

[Tave]

If you want to lump massive body roll in with ride instead of handling, fine, but this is a minor distinction.

No, what I'm saying is any other vehicle with that much body roll would handle like absolute crap. The Jeep actually handles really well, best in class even. The body roll is a function of the uncompromised platform and suspension.

[Rupert]

No, what I'm saying is any other vehicle with that much body roll would handle like absolute crap. The Jeep actually handles really well, best in class even. The body roll is a function of the uncompromised platform and suspension.

What class?

The Jeep handles like shit, with or without body roll.

[Tave]

What class?

The Jeep handles like shit, with or without body roll.

Nah that's bull. It has great steering feel for a truck and maybe the best turn-in on a production car period. Does exactly what you tell it to do. It's like a giant lifted go-kart.

[Rupert]

Are we driving the same thing? Are you sure you didn't mean to post in The Fast Lane? Who even said those were handling aspects you'd want in a truck?

[2o6]

Two solid axles with balloon tires and hella suspension travel and off road tread don't make for a good handling vehicle for any stretch of the imagination


The limits of the Wrangler are extremely low on road, and it feels like death in certain situations that a car (or even something like a Tahoe) would sail through with ease

[hotrodalex]

It's basically the same as my car before I modified it, plus knobby tires. I don't mind it.

[MX793]

It's basically the same as my car before I modified it, plus knobby tires. I don't mind it.

Your car has over 20" more wheelbase.  That lends itself to a bit more stability.

[SVT666]

Just get a Ford Explorer and call it a day.

Best. Advice. Ever.

[hotrodalex]

Your car has over 20" more wheelbase.  That lends itself to a bit more stability.

To be fair I've only driven a 4 door version.

[Tave]

Maxpower, if you have any interest at all in a Wrangler, do yourself a favor and give it a test-drive before you write it off completely based on the comments in this thread. It is easily one of the best driving live-axle trucks ever made, it holds onto its value, it's enormously capable, and it puts a giant grin on your face every time you fire it up.

[Madman]

It is easily one of the best driving live-axle trucks ever made,

Isn't that sort of like being the healthiest person in the intensive care ward?

[Tave]

Isn't that sort of like being the healthiest person in the intensive care ward?

More like the only man in a roomful of women talking about tulips.

[Soup DeVille]

More like the only man in a roomful of women talking about tulips.

[MaxPower]

Maxpower, if you have any interest at all in a Wrangler, do yourself a favor and give it a test-drive before you write it off completely based on the comments in this thread. It is easily one of the best driving live-axle trucks ever made, it holds onto its value, it's enormously capable, and it puts a giant grin on your face every time you fire it up.

Honestly I haven't read most of the wrangler posts in this thread. I'm not sure the back seat is big enough. I haven't been in a wrangler since high school. I should look.

[MaxPower]

So my focus is on a 2004 Discovery SE.  5 or 7 seat, doesn't matter. One good one slipped through my fingers and there are not many available. Lots of 2003s though.    Looking in New England and Seattle.

[SVT666]

I would love a Land Rover, but their reliability worries me.

[Rupert]

I was considering Range Rovers in 2009, but their gas mileage put me off V8 SUVs completely. :P

[MaxPower]

The gas mileage sucks, no question about that. I'm willing to sacrifice that for a fun vehicle and my commute is only 6 miles.

On reliability, I think it's more important to do the preventative maintenance and make sure you get a good car. The 2003's had all sorts of problems that they fixed for 2004.  A good 04 with updated maintenance should be ok.