Tesla

[CaminoRacer]

The actual time includes 1 foot rollout, which means it's a 5-60 time. The real 0-60 time is still slightly over 2.0 seconds

This video was posted a month ago before the test times came out:

https://youtu.be/i7yigpPSu_o

[GoCougs]

Oh right... precooling the battery pack is completely different then icing down an intercooler.  Or something like the dodge demon where you get to swap ecu's and front wheels or s GT500 that has a special full power key.  Or the GTR that had the legendary launch control counter or Porsche that logs over rev events.  A Veyron that could only reach full speed in an aero mode that prevents you from turning and requiring you to x-ray your tires to ensure they won't blow up...

Yawn

Not quite . Battery pack has to be heated and the motors have to be cooled (an effort to mitigate to some extent the damage from launch control).

[r0tor]

Not quite . Battery pack has to be heated and the motors have to be cooled (an effort to mitigate to some extent the damage from launch control).

   

Yes, if the car is idle in the middle of winter and you decide to take it to the drag strip - it will heat the battery pack up to ~70 deg F.  Otherwise is cools it.

[CaminoRacer]

Lots of autocrossers do a lot of heat management before & in between runs. Letting cars idle to warm up fully before running, and spraying intercoolers, radiators, and tires to keep them in the right temp range. That's not a big deal for insane performance.

The bigger issue is the rollout (making it 5-60 not 0-60) & track prep IMO.

[afty]

Lots of autocrossers do a lot of heat management before & in between runs. Letting cars idle to warm up fully before running, and spraying intercoolers, radiators, and tires to keep them in the right temp range. That's not a big deal for insane performance.

The bigger issue is the rollout (making it 5-60 not 0-60) & track prep IMO.

Car magazines have historically subtracted rollout from published 0-60 times, so the numbers here are consistent with industry standard testing practices and with previously published 0-60 times.

[r0tor]

Car magazines have historically subtracted rollout from published 0-60 times, so the numbers here are consistent with industry standard testing practices and with previously published 0-60 times.

as well as established practices at drag strips since timing has been invented

[CaminoRacer]

Car magazines have historically subtracted rollout from published 0-60 times, so the numbers here are consistent with industry standard testing practices and with previously published 0-60 times.

Rollout is acceptable for 1/4 mile times but not for 0-60 IMO. And that's why Motortrend provided the non-rollout number.

Once ready and in its cheetah stance, the Model S Plaid's launch is drama-free, even without the added advantage of VHT. The electric car accelerates from 0 to 60 mph in just 2.07 seconds, more than 0.2 second quicker than our previous record holder. Eliminate the customary one-foot of rollout and the Plaid accelerates from 0-60 mph in 2.28 seconds, matching the previous record holder with rollout.

So it needs a lot of VHT and rollout to actually get under 2 seconds.

This section puts things into perspective a bit too:

The biggest differentiators we found between quicker and slower runs were mostly environmental, like rolling over a tar snake at the wrong time or, as the day dragged on, the hot afternoon sun making it slightly more challenging for the Plaid to keep its batteries and motors at their ideal temperatures. The brakes were the car's sole wart, overheating after our last run of the day.

Tesla's stated rationale for its stance with us regarding VHT launches is that "most customers" will run the Model S Plaid at dragstrips. But despite its speed, we'd be shocked if this were true. For starters, the NHRA—drag racing's sanctioning body—will ban any vehicle quicker than 9.99 seconds or faster than 135 mph in the quarter from running at any of its tracks if said vehicle does not have the necessary safety equipment (as it famously did to the Dodge Challenger Demon). This includes a full roll cage, window net, driver restraint system, driveshaft loop (obviously not applicable in this situation), and master cutoff switch, not to mention a full race suit and helmet for the driver. Tesla is aware of this; its personnel joked with the track staff about being thrown off the strip for being too quick after our runs. Tesla says it has no plans to offer any of the necessary safety gear to make the Model S Plaid NHRA-legal.

Even with the necessary safety gear, the Plaid isn't suited for bracket racing when using launch control. Without a friendly dragstrip Christmas tree operator, you're likely to still be standing at the staging line when the lights turn green: Remember, the car needs nearly 10 seconds just to get into its cheetah stance.

I view this car as similar to the Demon. Pretty cool for a production car, but there are limitations to the track performance compared to an actual built drag car and the street performance is a bit different. If you're just showing off to your buddies, you're not gonna get under 2 seconds.

[r0tor]

Ford and Dodge both rented out specially prepped drag strips for their press launches and official timing of their cars.  There is nothing out of the ordinary here

[r0tor]

I'll add the most popular instrument out there for DIY 0-60 and 1/4 mile times (the Draggy) reports with rollout like every other publication

[CaminoRacer]

I'll add the most popular instrument out there for DIY 0-60 and 1/4 mile times (the Draggy) reports with rollout like every other publication

Just means that they're wrong too.

Using rollout turns it into a 5-60 number.

[r0tor]

A true 5-60 number is a rolling start (car just rolling from an idle and then gunning in) and slower than a 0-60 number

[Soup DeVille]

Ok, so the prep isn't the same as other super high performance cars, but pretty much all of them require some sort  of prep, and the amount of effort for the Tesla is actually less than many. I don't see this as any sort of thing requiring an asterix.

[GoCougs]

Non-princess numbers aren't terrible for Model S (as they are for the Demon, GT500, etc.), so I don't see the big deal about the actual stats themselves. No, it's not a legit sub 2.0 sec car but meh.

[GoCougs]

M/T posted more info today:  https://www.motortrend.com/news/tesla-model-s-plaid-test-data-analysis-milestones-records/

Real-world 0-60 is 2.45 sec.

[CaminoRacer]

Non-princess numbers aren't terrible for Model S (as they are for the Demon, GT500, etc.), so I don't see the big deal about the actual stats themselves. No, it's not a legit sub 2.0 sec car but meh.

Yeah, Tesla shouldn't be ashamed of the real world numbers. They're still insanely quick, just not the sub-2 that their marketing team wants.

[MrH]

Tesla overpromises and underdelivers every time.  It's the opposite of the Porsche method.

[r0tor]

So the fastest production car in history is under delivering?  Lol...

[Submariner]

Tesla overpromises and underdelivers every time.  It's the opposite of the Porsche method.

I mean, it's technically true, but Tesla is the only legit EV maker out there by leaps and bounds.  They have numerous successful models.  They have more in the pipeline.  They've done it from the ground up.  Tesla is far from some hack company like you make them out to be. 

Would I get an S over a Tycan?  Probably not, unless real world range on the S turns out tons a lot better than the Tycan.  Then again, a comparable Turbo S model starts at $173k, so...

[afty]

Tesla overpromises and underdelivers every time.  It's the opposite of the Porsche method.

Barely faster than a Chiron, what an embarrassment.

[Laconian]

Barely faster than a Chiron, what an embarrassment.

[Morris Minor]

Wow it's Tesla City in San Jose - if any more Federal EV handouts are forthcoming, the average Joe Envirocruncher here will be spending them on adding a second or third to his stable.

[MrH]

Barely faster than a Chiron, what an embarrassment.

Exactly!  So why lie?

[12,000 RPM]

I'm still trying to figure out what a 1.xx 0-60 time adds to the driving experience that a 2.xx time can't.

[CaminoRacer]

I'm still trying to figure out what a 1.xx 0-60 time adds to the driving experience that a 2.xx time can't.

Discomfort.

[Submariner]

I'm still trying to figure out what a 1.xx 0-60 time adds to the driving experience that a 2.xx time can't.

Internet points

[afty]

An interesting article about the theoretical limit to 0-60 times: https://www.motorbiscuit.com/whats-the-fastest-0-60-time-possible-in-a-road-car/

TL;DR: it's equivalent to 60-0 braking times, which are similarly traction limited, so about 2 seconds on street tires and regular asphalt.  Motor Trend noted this in their Plaid review: "Interestingly, on regular asphalt, the car needs 104 feet and 2.38 seconds to stop from 60 mph, averaging 1.16 g in the opposite direction. We don't dive into detail like this often, but this might be another first: a car that accelerates from 0-60 mph in a shorter time and distance than it achieves 60-0 mph."

[GoCougs]

Thing is, the Plaid's numbers suffer extremely (shockingly) little by not being on a prepped surface. To me though, boosting power 50+% didn't yield the improvement I would have predicted. In the case of the 2 sec limit I think part of what is going WRT the Plaid model is polar moment of inertia. Take an electric motor, keep its torque vs. rpm profile (i.e., power) the same but increase its inertia, and acceleration decreases. Tesla had to add a new (and big) drive unit (motor) as part of the plan to boost power, which increased drive train polar moment of inertia.   

[12,000 RPM]

I feel like that rotational inertia still pales in comparison to the rest of the car. I suppose those kinds of differences might matter to get from 2.01s to 1.99s but I'd need to see some math

[AutobahnSHO]

Cuz this whole debate really matters in real world driving.

[GoCougs]

I feel like that rotational inertia still pales in comparison to the rest of the car. I suppose those kinds of differences might matter to get from 2.01s to 1.99s but I'd need to see some math

It probably does, but we also know just a heavier clutch, driveshaft or wheels will slow a vehicle down. Could also be there's some torque management going on.